Suggestion for *How to fix the Rating System*
By
Aggelakis,
Posted on: 2009-05-03 24:09 in Suggestions and Ideas
So basically, your idea is to either rate it as 'I like this' or not at all?
Quite to my surprise, I could see that fly. Total rating requirements for certain badges would have to be adjusted down, but a binary solution ('good' or 'no comment') sounds fine.
Not sure how I feel on the genre thing. Superheroes kind of is its own genre, and the system is not flexible enough to do non-superhero non-violent missions anyhow. Even if you manage to properly present a mystery or documentary, it's still about shooting people in the face.
"If you're going through hell, keep going."
Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill
I agree that there needs to be some sort of way to sort out all the different styles.
Dark, funny, dramatic... something.
I also agree, the stars are just broken, mostly because there's too many different ways/reasons to rate and arc up or down: The author is my friend? 5 stars! There are typos? 1 star! I want clickies so I can work on my badge? 5 stars for tons of clickies! I want a mission I can stealth? 1 star because it's defeat all!
All which means the stars convey nothing useful at all.
I support the idea of an "all or nothing" rating system.
I'd keep stars, but add a simple 'Recommend for Hall of Fame' checkbox. You get 1000 HoF recommends and it becomes and stays HoF.
Hopefully i15 sorts out genre stuff, but more important than genre is intended audience: Story, challenge, humor, max rewards, badging, 0-21, 22-32, 50 and such. That's the bigger disconnect in terms of what people mean with their ratings. But even this can be somewhat addressed by an infomative description.
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I'd keep stars, but add a simple 'Recommend for Hall of Fame' checkbox. You get 1000 HoF recommends and it becomes and stays HoF.
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Easy to exploit, epsically by those with multiple accounts and large wings of SG's. You get one cult of personailty (and we have many, don't kid yourself :P) and each one instantly has a HOF for no good reason o.o
I like the way your thinking though...
-C.A.
I don't think the star system is a failure. What I do think is that the AVERAGE start calculation - and making value judgments based on that metric - is flawed.
Take Footsteps - still the only (intermittent) Hall of Fame arc. One it achieves HoF status, inevitably a flood of zero star ratings bring it down below HoF threshold.
The solution? Once HoF, always HoF. You don't remove The Beatles from the rock and roll HoF simply because they aren't on the charts anymore. Likewise, a story's accomplishment should reflect its high water mark performance.
Second, default the rating to 3 stars, not zero stars.
No one arc is going to please everyone who rates it. However, artificially inflating or deflating ratings should be difficult.
I also agree with "Only allow those who complete the arc to rate it", although spawning an arc at level 1 and running it with 50s would make this restriction almost worthless. Perhaps all team members should be auto exemped to the level of the spawner/team lead?
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I'd keep stars, but add a simple 'Recommend for Hall of Fame' checkbox. You get 1000 HoF recommends and it becomes and stays HoF.
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Easy to exploit, epsically by those with multiple accounts and large wings of SG's. You get one cult of personailty (and we have many, don't kid yourself :P) and each one instantly has a HOF for no good reason o.o
I like the way your thinking though...
-C.A.
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That can be applied to anything. If you've got a large group of friends willing to go even a bit out of your way for you, then you can exploit a metric f-ton of things in this world.
I can't say I like any of the suggestions in the OP.
Though, I guess I could see a change from a star system to smiley face system 
Ranging from 
and maybe a 
for the best farms and a 
for a "WTH was that all about?" arc.
QR
I agree with removing the stars. I would have three ratings:
[*] Recommend
[*] Neutral
[*] Do Not Recommend
Once you have 1000 recommends, you hit HoF status. The Do Not Recommends don't count but are reported. Like Do Not Recommends, Neutrals are reported but don't count against your 1000 recommends.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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also agree with "Only allow those who complete the arc to rate it"
[/ QUOTE ] Why? What good reason is there for a change like that? Are you telling me it takes you until the very end of a movie or TV show to realize if it is crap or not?
I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
I think an eBay style rating system would work. You could see comments left and ratings.. that one if a mission is highly rated but all the ratings are by 3 people, you know it MAY not really be accurate. A five star with over 200 users saying such is more likely to be good.
just my two cents. Opening bid with no reserve.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
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Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
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I was posting from my iPod, leave my grammar alone! And which part of Geko's suggestion mentioned having to play the entire arc before rating? Or was that supposed to be an unrelated point you wished to address to the thread as a whole?
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
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Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
[/ QUOTE ] You seem to misunderstand who the ratings are for. They are not for the creator, they are for other poeple. If an arc sucks it doesn't usually take the entire thing to figure out.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
[/ QUOTE ]
Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
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Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
[/ QUOTE ] You seem to misunderstand who the ratings are for. They are not for the creator, they are for other poeple. If an arc sucks it doesn't usually take the entire thing to figure out.
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You are missing the point, and being difficult just to be difficult.
There is "It Sucks" and there is "Oh I dont like the girl who made this arc so I am going to rate it low just to piss her off"
This is NOT a good way to help determine which arcs the devs will play. I want the badges, I wont lie. But I am sick to death of people low scoring peoples and my arcs for some BS reason.
An incomplete arc with no story SURE 1 star it.
A complete arc with a story, with some effort and not filling it with punctuation and spelling errors, and trying to be original if that is even possible, NO MATTER WHAT does NOT deserve a 1 star rating.
This is EXACTLY why the rating system is SOOOOOOOOOO SCREWED UP. And it should be fixed now, that it is still the beginning... rather than 3 years from now.
I'm not being difficult just to do it. I think making people complete the arc to rate it is probably the stupidest idea I've heard relating to AE. Does griefing happen? Sure it does. But this isn't the solution. Sometimes something just stinks and I don't want to finish it, that doesn't mean I haven't played enough of it to decide it deserves a poor rating.
Content creators need to have thicker skin than your average person. Not everybody is going to like your creations, the fact that you spent a lot of time on it and it means a lot to you is completely irrelevant. If somebody doesn't like it, that is all that the player should take into account. Content creators have to accept that.
And the griefers are idiots, I'm not sure how to handle them. One thing I do know is, if you're having a large problem with them maybe you shouldn't piss off so many people.
p.s. I was using 'you' and 'your' as general terms, and not talking about you directly Perfect_Pain.
<QR>
Very simply, as others have suggested, ratings from those who complete an arc should have more weight than those that don't. Perhaps one "completion" rating could be worth two "non-completed" ratings. The smiley face idea, IMHO, is awful. It doesn't give me an idea of what arcs are better/ worse than others.
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A complete arc with a story, with some effort and not filling it with punctuation and spelling errors, and trying to be original if that is even possible, NO MATTER WHAT does NOT deserve a 1 star rating.
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Actually it can deserve 1 star. Not saying that yours does, I haven't played it. I'm just saying that people can make all kinds of effort and spell perfectly and be ever so original, but it can still deserve 1 star for being plain bad.
Farms don't get 1 star, they get zero stars and reported. Click 1 star twice. If I had to finish a farm in order to zero-star it - no, I don't want to imagine that.
Winner of Players' Choice Best Villainous Arc 2010: Fear and Loathing on Striga; ID #350522
(QR)
I do not support allowing rating only if one finishes an arc. If I'm scrunching up my nose within the first mission and going "Ick," I want to be able to quit and rate it. I don't think it's my responsibility as a player to suffer through an unfun experience in order to provide feedback, of which rating is a type. "So bad I didn't want to complete it" seems like a fine reason to one-star something.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
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Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
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Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
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Which is why my suggestion works as it does. In my suggestion, a "Do Not Recommend" is just information. It has no negative effect on the author, other than it might encourage people not to play your arc. But every person you get to "Recommend" your arc gets you one step closer to HoF status.
No more griefing, no quasi-objective, but not really numeric system. In such a situation, it no longer matters if you played the whole arc or not.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
[/ QUOTE ]
Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
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Which is why my suggestion works as it does. In my suggestion, a "Do Not Recommend" is just information. It has no negative effect on the author, other than it might encourage people not to play your arc. But every person you get to "Recommend" your arc gets you one step closer to HoF status.
No more griefing, no quasi-objective, but not really numeric system. In such a situation, it no longer matters if you played the whole arc or not.
[/ QUOTE ] Your proposal seems like it would reward mediocrity. Why would we want to do that?
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I like your suggested idea, Geko. It covers a nice area for ratings.
[/ QUOTE ]
Geko's suggestion.
And NO, for the last time, you should not be forced to play an entire arc to be able to rate it.
[/ QUOTE ]
Look, if you dont like an arc DONT PLAY it. But don't 1 star someone who put EFFORT into their arc and its NOT on a damn BOAT, and its NOT a FARM.
[/ QUOTE ]
Which is why my suggestion works as it does. In my suggestion, a "Do Not Recommend" is just information. It has no negative effect on the author, other than it might encourage people not to play your arc. But every person you get to "Recommend" your arc gets you one step closer to HoF status.
No more griefing, no quasi-objective, but not really numeric system. In such a situation, it no longer matters if you played the whole arc or not.
[/ QUOTE ] Your proposal seems like it would reward mediocrity. Why would we want to do that?
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How? Mediocre arcs would have a lot of neutrals, maybe a few recommends and a few do not recommends. The point of the rating system should be to provide information.
The way I would see it is every arc would have a report that looked like this:
(X) people recommended this arc
(X) people were neutral on this arc
(X) people did not recommend this arc
This is different than the rating system we have now in that it doesn't average the scores. In addition, it doesn't ask people to assign a numeral (i.e. 1 to 5) to a qualitative measure. For some people, a three is average. For some it's "pretty good". In the rating system I would create, that person has a better descriptor. Would they recommend it or not or are they on the fence. This provides more information than now. However since the scores aren't averaged, there's no other way to get you to HoF status than to only count the recommends. And really, if 1000 recommend your arc, then except in cases of extreme marketing, it probably deserves it.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
Remove Stars, I think its still early enough that we could look at stars as a failed expirement.
First, people who do not complete your story arc, do not get to "rate" your story. Period. They can send you feedback, but won't effect your stories overall status.
Second, Allow the person or persons rating the arc to chose up to 2 genres for the story. So like multiple choice.
Choices being like: Sci-Fi, Drama, Mystery, Horror, Comedy, Family Oriented, Farm, Action, Documentary, Fantasy, For Kids, Mature Audience, etc
Finally, have a simple Smiley Face. If you click the smiley you are giving the signal to other users "This is a fun arc".
On the status page, You can see how many people have played through your entire arc, How many people started it but haven't completed it, and How many Smileys you have.
You can also see which genres people are sticking your story into.