GOTerpsPvP

Thanks for the posting tip buddy. I'll keep that and your opinions under careful consideration moving forward.

I don't actually think you're an idiot but you do use some pretty twisted logic that makes you come across as such sometimes. From reading many of your posts over the years, I know that's not your typical M.O. though. Your first response to me in this thread was an attempt at an insult, I think. Over the years, I've noticed that insults in internet forums often lead to more insults. Maybe you haven't caught on to that yet. I don't generally toss around insults, but I can make an exception for folks who say stupid stuff and attempt to attack me rather than the issue under discussion.

On one hand, you typically discredit the opinion of "notoriously bad players" as being worthless, but this time they agree with you so that's your evidence the idea is bad. Which is it bud?

Well said, smart guy.

As I said, you're obviously incapable of distinguishing the difference. See previous sarcastic "smart guy" comment.

Are you "all worked up"? You appear to be, but I can't really tell. I think the idea is good and I'll defend it, and I certainly don't care if every idiot on the street agrees with me or not.

As for do I ever pvp? Yes, I do. Are folks supposed to send you a tell every time they login to the zone? If so, I missed the memo.

Can you see why some people who like fast paced pvp with non-stop action would think a 30-second timeout power makes the game worse?

Why don't you start your own "these are all of the changes needed to fix pvp" thread? You appear to understand that pvp is composed of many aspects that impact the overall game but can't comprehend the logic behind making any singular changes that don't completely fix the system.

I'm not trying to change anything. I think it would be good for pvp if it where changed and I'm sharing my thoughts on the power. You are obviously incapable of distinguishing the difference.

Well, if you define "escape" as running away, then I agree with you. If you're talking about "escaping death," then it most certainly is an escape power.

They slowed the game down, so why even bother suggesting they speed it back up? Is that the argument? If so, why continue to go on and on about the suppression changes that you think would improve the game? I'd say the devs are far more unlikely to reverse the suppression changes than make a change to a single power like hibernate.

Not true at all.

True. So dumb. "Let's stop pvp'ing for 30 seconds and start over, OK?" Sounds like a ton of fun. Hahahhahaha.

Try explaining the way Hibernate works to someone who likes pvp games but doesn't play CoX and let me know what they think.

Only folks who have grown attached to the current system and can't "think outside the box" could possibly think Hibernate is good for pvp.

That's very shortsighted but I guess it's correct in the sense that a player doesn't "have to" do anything. However, a good player will use any powers/tactics he can to gain an advantage and sometimes that does include using hibernate or phase offensively, even in situations such as those described in this thread.

Hey hey! Great to see you're still around man!

I don’t know about not being “all that great” as an escape power. As a stalker, it’s the #1 escape power by far when used with phase. And the chance to recharge and return to 100% health greatly improves the survival rate of any AT.

How could anyone even argue that it’s not that good as an escape power?

I’m glad you respect everyone’s right to have an opinion. Very kind of you.

I’m sure you’re referring to me saying something along the lines of stalkers being poorly designed and hurting pvp overall. It’s true that I think their poor design has aided in deterring many players from pvp over the years. That’s just an educated opinion based on years of observing stalker hate. And yes, I’ve even made suggestions in related discussions about how stalkers could have been designed better.

I don’t think they ruin the game. Like you, I’ve had a lot of fun fighting stalkers over the years, but that doesn’t mean I think the devs implementation of the AT was flawless. It certainly wasn’t.

Even in this thread, about Hibernate, we have someone crying about stalkers. So upset about stalkers he doesn't think folks should discuss anything else until the stalker issue is addressed and resolved.

Hilarious.

If you think players sitting around encased in a block of ice for 30 seconds makes the game more fun to play, we’ll just never agree on what makes this game better. My preference is for fast paced pvp so my opinions will conflict with folks who like to slow the game down with 30 second timeouts.

Increasing the activation time would just mean that you need to click it sooner than you currently do, but it would still be used in the same way. I prefer the interruptible idea because it makes it more difficult (skillful) to use in battle. In conjunction with making it interruptible, they could also reduce the recharge time so it comes back faster.

Anyway, I'm not insistent about a change. In fact, I really couldn't care less if Hibernate is ever changed. I'll leave that fight to folks who care more than I do, but I would welcome a change if one is ever made. I agree with others in this thread about other problems existing in the world of pvp, but my comments have basically been limited to discussion of Hibernate since that's the topic of the thread.

That being said, I don't think we need to worry about devs monitoring the pvp forums and making power changes based on suggestions found in here.

Your team was able to kill a single opponent, and you think that proves something.

I see.

Tough to argue with “logic” like that.

It still took your team longer to kill those targets than it should have.

You might have to slot it with interrupt reducers, and it might not always save you when you’re under fire from a bunch of enemies, but it could still be used in battle.

I hate explaining myself to the willfully ignorant, but I do occasionally feel compelled to respond to blatantly false statements about what I believe. You've certainly never heard me say that stalkers ruin the game (because I've never said that and don't feel that way) and I've been anti-fightclub since Day 1 of the pvp zones. While I'm not sure how any intelligent person could interpret anything I've said in this thread (or in the past) the way you apparently have, I know that I often overestimate the intelligence of others.

I adapt to the game the devs give me to play and I've never had any problem dealing with stalkers, players using hibernate or anything else.

Does that mean I think pvp is perfect and I'm incapable of seeing ways it could be improved? No.

I'm sorry if my thinking that Hibernate isn't perfect offends you in some way.


Thanks for the great feedback. What is that you don't like about making the power interruptible? You previously said that you use hibernate regularly and feel it's overpowered, and even suggested your own change. I like the idea you mentioned of giving the ice a health bar that would allow a attackers to break through, but think that would be more difficult to design and implement effectively. That idea would potentially be a bigger nerf to the power than making the power interruptible.

Are you backing off what you said about Hibernate being overpowered, or do you just prefer the (bigger) nerf you suggested over the change that I mentioned?

Wow. I guess you're right then and I stand corrected. Clicking the power before it's too late must be tremendously skillful.

One time, in I-4, I saw a scrapper use Instant Healing and get killed, but they still changed IH. Can you F'n believe that??? It used to take so much skill to keep the IH toggle on (endurance management is a tough skill to master) and they dumbed it down so it's a click power.

Yeah, obviously a change to the power to make it interruptible would impact the situations when it would be useful and significantly reduce its effectiveness as a "battle rest" power. That is exactly what the suggested change is intended to accomplish.

Whatever you say fella. Good stuff. I realize that you think the Dev's are infallible, so it's tough for you to imagine that everything in pvp is not 100% perfect as is. Because of that, I have to think that you're either new to the game or just plain dumb. And I know you're not new to the game

I'm not trying to fix pvp in this thread, just throwing in my two cents on the hibernate power. (you're right that "throwing sharks" for stalkers is also stupid)

If you think that clicking hibernate = leet evasion skills, then I understand why we disagree about the skill required to evade an enemy.

Oh well, whatever. People supporting hibernate admit that it's "broken" and an "automatic" escape, but get all buthurt at the mear mention of making a change to the power. Hilarious. Deep breaths guys.

I’m not against evasion. I just laugh when people talk about evasion as some great skill.

I’m not against phase shift. I just thought a counter to the power should have been made available years before it finally was. The ability of a phased player to attack another phased player was a great change, but I’m sure it upset some folks who were accustomed to phase being their “get out of jail” free card. With the change to phase, I think phase is finally working the way it should have been all along.

You said in one of your posts that for a stalker Hibernate is basically an automatic free getaway. Granted there are exceptions to the rule, but for the most part that is true. I like the idea to make it interruptible, about the same as “Heal Self” from the medicine pool. With that type of change, the power could still be used in battle but it wouldn’t be as automatic as it is now. That’d be a good change even if it causes someone’s leet evasion skill score to go down a few points.

There's not much about hibernate that I do like. It's the "rest in the middle of battle" part that I don't care for, I guess. I think it would be better (for pvp) if it were interruptable.

Yes, I know folks like to toot their own horn, and will claim that they were the best eva at evasion. People like to overstate the amount of "skill" involved with running away from an opponent because it makes them feel good. In reality, you could teach noob23 the ins-and-outs of skillful evasion in about 20 seconds.

Are some folks better at evasion than others? Sure. Definitely. It's still not rocket science, c'mon.

You're clearly trying to simplify things a bit too much. Simply adding the ability to retreat at will does not = good pvp. I'm pretty confident that you know there's more to it than that. Otherwise, adding a perma-insta-phase power with no recharge would be the only thing standing between what we have now and good pvp.

Agreed. However, I think that was the wrong move for trying to achieve "good pvp" and think pvp would be better as a whole without Hibernate.

Well, considering you think that evasion is some elite skill and running away from your enemy makes for good pvp, I'm not surprised we disagree.

All of the running/phasing/hibernating has always been pretty stupid. The change to allow phased players to attack phased players was a great change, and should have been in place years ago. Hibernate was a stupid power to proliferate across powersets/AT's and has had a negative effect on pvp.