Discussion: Changes to Task/Strike Force Missions
By
Acid_Reign,
Posted on: 2008-02-14 15:00 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
All I can say is it wont be none of this well lets get just the minimum to start the tf crap, I am going in with 8 or we dont do the tf at all. I want to make sure we still have enough folks if folks quit.
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Their PR department said "that won't go over well... just blame it on the RMTers"
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In the 80's, the bad word was Communist.
Eventually it became Terrorist.
Now it's RMTers.
Seriously though, this seems like it would be easier to exploit for farming.
@Rylas
Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.
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Funny, all this complaining, and all I really see in this change is "TFs will be played as they were supposed to be played"
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Spoken like a true Hero side player.
This was to address CAP RUNS. It's meant to stop people from farming recipes on VILLIAN side. And while yes... SF's might be running more like they're intended... the pool C recipes on villian side won't be runnin at all.
I feel like this is a really bad change. I mean, what if people have to leave part way through the tf/sf or their power goes out or who knows what and people just drop and you go below the number needed to start. Doesn't that screw over the remaining members of the tf/sf? That isn't very fair to them now is it?
OK, sure, fine. That makes sense, they are intended for teams. That should stop the whole lowering vine count on the villain respec too shouldn't it? Not to mention single spawning the STF/LRSF missions. That always pissed me off and seemed really pansy.
Could we get all the 8 person TFs lowered please? 8 is tough to find, especially on certain servers in certain time blocks. I'd prefer 4, but 5-6 is less annoying than 8.
You may have inadvertently actually helped the farmers though. Now, assuming they have a character built to farm 8 person missions...they don't need 7 indefinitely - just for enough time to start th tf.
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The Quarterfield Task Force [u]NEEDS[u] to be reduced to 4 players then. There is no reason for the required number of people needed.
While you are at that change, might I suggest removing the redundant missions?
Removal of missions 11, 12, 13, 14, 18, 21, 22, 23 should stongly be considered.
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Yes all the most recent changes to the game have converted it to City of Farmers,
1) purple recipes tied to mob defeats = best way to get them = farm or PL
2) XP smoothing = reduced the number of drops per level = farm oro to get stuff.
3) XP smoothing = sweeping hazard zones are the best place to level (again, we've come full circle on this one) and while you are sweeping you get to farm.
Lotta really bad ideas here that all point to skipping content and merely farming as the "most efficient way to play the game"
-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson
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What happens when you begin with the bare minimum and then several team mates need to quit?
This change prevents casual players from organzing Task forces and strike forces, especially Villainside where subscriptions are dwindling and reducing the player pool already.
The late explanation is superficial and hardly persuasive. Villainside Cap Au Diable SF was farmed because the redside market is anemic compared to the blueside market. This change will only increase this large gap. Clearly NCSoft is making changes to keep the game interesting by preventing easy recipes, but what will you do when the market has so few?
I'm tempted to think that NCSoft is attemtping to manage serversize by making CoV uninhabitable.
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QFT
What part of phnglui mglw'nafl Cthulhu r'lyeh w'gah nagl fhtagn don't you understand?
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I feel like this is a really bad change. I mean, what if people have to leave part way through the tf/sf or their power goes out or who knows what and people just drop and you go below the number needed to start. Doesn't that screw over the remaining members of the tf/sf? That isn't very fair to them now is it?
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You better hope you have some people that know whats up on your team.
The reason this change is absolutely ludicrous is that it doesn't stop the people that farm tf's for recipes. This change is like an annoying mosquito to that player base.
It does hurt a casual player experiencing a tf for the fist time.
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Funny, all this complaining, and all I really see in this change is "TFs will be played as they were supposed to be played"
[/ QUOTE ] Spoken like a true Hero side player.
This was to address CAP RUNS. It's meant to stop people from farming recipes on VILLIAN side. And while yes... SF's might be running more like they're intended... the pool C recipes on villian side won't be runnin at all.
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I won't pretend that I'm in favor of some change that will negatively effect my market, but I still think its funny how people are so outraged when devs do something to prevent exploits. Even if I participate in said exploits, its still quite lulz to me that players respond with no degree of subtlety that "devs are idiots" because they try to run their game more as they intended.
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It does hurt a casual player experiencing a tf for the fist time.
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I do hope that's enough of a sticking point to make them change their minds...
What part of phnglui mglw'nafl Cthulhu r'lyeh w'gah nagl fhtagn don't you understand?
Devs,
I know this will probably be lost in a sea of invective not seen since the ED days, but please seriously consider rescinding this. It will have precisely the opposite effect of what you hope to do by making it *easier* to farm influence. All a farmer needs to do is spawn the first mission of their chosen SF or TF for eight, have the other seven alt accounts log off, and have a permanent farm all to themselves.
On the other hand, it will be actively harmful to people who try to do TFs and SFs in the correct way by making it progressively harder on teams who lose members to attrition. And frankly, almost all TF teams lose one or more members somewhere along the way.
In short, please ditch this change until it can be replaced with something more appropriate.
This change is really obnoxious. The villain market is already crap and now that it will be more difficult to run Cap SFs, its only going to get worse. also, this REALLY sucks for Posi Task force. I really hope you guys reconsider this change. Softloading didn't prevent teams from running TFs it just allowed Soloers to do it.
TAKE THAT SOLOERS!
Please please please reconsider this. don't make changes that force people to play a certain way, it just doesn't make sense.
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We know that finding out about this change after the patch is already live is not the ideal way to go about it. It was never our intent to hide or stealth this change out, it was simply lost in the volume of other changes spanning many months.
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This part I am not buying even for a second. It has happened way too much since the begining of the game, it even happens after Jack left the game. Lighthouse this is a pretty huge change that we should have known about in the patch notes, there is absolutely no excuse that something this big gets missed in the patch notes. I can understand not posting a patch note due to the exploits like the Ouroboros powerlevel exploit but this isnt even on that level and should not have been missed period. This has been a constant thing with us the players having to figure it out whether it was a bug or "Working As Intended". You guys need to do better because this is inexcuseable due to the size of the change.
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LAWL sauce.
It's spelled "inexcusable". If you're going to use rhetoric, at least spell it correctly.
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This was to address CAP RUNS.
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You believe they changed every single TF and SF in the game just to address Cap runs?
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This change is really obnoxious. The villain market is already crap and now that it will be more difficult to run Cap SFs, its only going to get worse. also, this REALLY sucks for Posi Task force. I really hope you guys reconsider this change. Softloading didn't prevent teams from running TFs it just allowed Soloers to do it.
TAKE THAT SOLOERS!
Please please please reconsider this. don't make changes that force people to play a certain way, it just doesn't make sense.
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The minimum for Posi is three though, which is the ideal team size the last few time I've run it.
This is all well and good, but... When is Positron's TF going to be shortened?
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don't make changes that force people to play a certain way
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no change was made, TFs have required a certain number of players since i0.
Good to have some official documentation on what this should be doing. Thanks.
Now, I'm not so sure it's doing that. Define "drop". Because I don't think it's reducing spawn size if people log out, it seem to only do it if they're off the TF. Which is problematic if people get disconnected - you can't remove them from the team if they're not online yet they still increase your spawn size. I will test a bit more.
oh, and IMHO, at some point a few TFs should have their starting requirements re-examined. Manticore is too high. The Shard ones are too high. Katie is too low.
FIX THE TECH IN LRSF AND IT WOULD NOT HAVE TO BE SOFT LOADED NOW I'LL NEVER RUN IT OR ANY SF/TF IN THIS GAME TIL THE DEVS GET OFF THERE A S S E S AND FIX THE LRSF'S TECH WAY TO PISS OFF PEOPLE
Task and Strike Forces are due for a major revamp, anyway. Instead of just trying to plug supposed exploits, how about the developers put some time on the schedule to:
1. Address the disparity in TFs between the hero and villain sides. Namely, give the villain side more SFs to balance the two sides.
2. Reduce the minimum number of players required for a TF or SF to a maximum of six. Only exception: STF and LRSF, since they are meant to be endgame challenges and "hardcore".
3. Rework most of the original TFs in CoH. Simply put, the majority are way too long. It would be one thing if each mission was unique and exciting but they are literally nothing more than door missions strung together, something you do throughout regular gameplay. Tacking an AV to the end of the last one doesn't make a TF special. When a player gets the reward at the end of a TF or SF, it should feel like something they truly earned, not just a gift for slogging through a bunch of stock door missions and AV. Some TFs are like this now. Most aren't. The Positron TF is rather embarrassing as the introduction to TFs in general. Bland and overlong. The Shadow Shard TFs are bursting with filler missions that do nothing but extend the length needlessly.
4. Consider allowing a TF or SF to recruit new players if they drop below the minimum number of players. Adjust rewards accordingly (ie. don't let a player that joins for just the last mission qualify for the end of TF reward).
5. Merge the markets. Two other major MMOs, EQ2 and WoW, both allow the opposing factions to sell to the other. There's no reason to keep an artificial separation in CoH/V, especially since the entire process in this game is blind -- you wouldn't know you were buying from a villain or hero, anyway.
I don't object to them trying to fix softloading but I think we are way past due on getting other just as important changes made to TFs. These should be the premier content of the game and as often as not, they are really nothing special at all.
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This was to address CAP RUNS.
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You believe they changed every single TF and SF in the game just to address Cap runs?
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Lulz forum stalkers.
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Yes all the most recent changes to the game have converted it to City of Farmers,
1) purple recipes tied to mob defeats = best way to get them = farm or PL
2) XP smoothing = reduced the number of drops per level = farm oro to get stuff.
3) XP smoothing = sweeping hazard zones are the best place to level (again, we've come full circle on this one) and while you are sweeping you get to farm.
Lotta really bad ideas here that all point to skipping content and merely farming as the "most efficient way to play the game"
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And still the most boring.
I'm going to love this change because it's going to give me what I want for once. I get to have cranked up spawns, not for farming, not for drops, but for the joy of the carnage.
All at my own pace with minimal harassment of other players.
Right on.
Be well, people of CoH.
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On the other hand, it will be actively harmful to people who try to do TFs and SFs in the correct way by making it progressively harder on teams who lose members to attrition. And frankly, almost all TF teams lose one or more members somewhere along the way.
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If you're worried your TF team will drop below the minimum requirement and will face too hard a challenge, then perhaps you should start the TF with a few extra people to provide a buffer for that.
If you have a TF that you CAN'T bring more people then it's likely the type of thing you'd have a hard time beating with fewer than 8 even before this change. For example, one person quitting the Statesman TF is probably going to ruin your fun even without this latest change.
WOOT! It's carnage time! My brutes and scrappers thank you!!!!
Hmmm... crank up my ancient second account or just use my brother's to pad that one necessary spot?
Be well, people of CoH.