Discussion: Changes to Task/Strike Force Missions
By
Acid_Reign,
Posted on: 2008-02-14 15:00 in News, Events and Announcement Discussion
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What happens when you begin with the bare minimum and then several team mates need to quit?
This change prevents casual players from organzing Task forces and strike forces, especially Villainside where subscriptions are dwindling and reducing the player pool already.
The late explanation is superficial and hardly persuasive. Villainside Cap Au Diable SF was farmed because the redside market is anemic compared to the blueside market. This change will only increase this large gap. Clearly NCSoft is making changes to keep the game interesting by preventing easy recipes, but what will you do when the market has so few?
I'm tempted to think that NCSoft is attemtping to manage serversize by making CoV uninhabitable.
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QFT
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Quoted for Extreme Hyberbolic Ignorance
Most of the people I see complaining here are the ones that used soft loading to then run Multi Cap SFs.
This is just like the Katie nerf it just adds about 10 more minutes onto the SF run.
You all need to change your pampers.
~MR
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If this was a change JUST to the Cap SF, then fine. This change is GLOBAL to ALL TF's. HUGE difference.
Plus it flies completely in the face of the devs "risk vs reward" mantra. (If you have a 6 person TF, and lose 3, your risk is now greater than your reward)
It also severely penalizes PUG's, and the fact that some TF's were DESIGNED to be multiple-session events.
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if you have a 6 man tf and you finish with 3 people, each person should get the rewards dictated by the spawns..2 recipes each.
Lots of 50's yada yada. still finding fun things to do.
Cthulhu loves you, better start running
I�! I�! Gg�gorsch�a�bha egurtsa�ar�ug d� Dalhor! Cthluhu fthagn! Cthluhu fthagn!
You are in a maze of twisty little passages
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Because you MUST be IO'd out... and soley with Pool C Drops... True Story
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So then, these drops shouldn't be in demand now, right?
Also, weren't you the "never gonna happen" guy when someone suggested a team-recall power?
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Guys, we need to figure out a way to exploit the game that involves the RSF tech, toggle debuffs, vill patrons, other QoL issues, and anything else we feel needs to be fixed, then people need to complain about how they relate to RMT, THEN they might get fixed.
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QFT!!
Ooo my...... I luvies you, Doyler 
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What happens when you begin with the bare minimum and then several team mates need to quit?
This change prevents casual players from organzing Task forces and strike forces, especially Villainside where subscriptions are dwindling and reducing the player pool already.
The late explanation is superficial and hardly persuasive. Villainside Cap Au Diable SF was farmed because the redside market is anemic compared to the blueside market. This change will only increase this large gap. Clearly NCSoft is making changes to keep the game interesting by preventing easy recipes, but what will you do when the market has so few?
I'm tempted to think that NCSoft is attemtping to manage serversize by making CoV uninhabitable.
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QFT
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Quoted for Extreme Hyberbolic Ignorance
Most of the people I see complaining here are the ones that used soft loading to then run Multi Cap SFs.
This is just like the Katie nerf it just adds about 10 more minutes onto the SF run.
You all need to change your pampers.
~MR
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If this was a change JUST to the Cap SF, then fine. This change is GLOBAL to ALL TF's. HUGE difference.
Plus it flies completely in the face of the devs "risk vs reward" mantra. (If you have a 6 person TF, and lose 3, your risk is now greater than your reward)
It also severely penalizes PUG's, and the fact that some TF's were DESIGNED to be multiple-session events.
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if you have a 6 man tf and you finish with 3 people, each person should get the rewards dictated by the spawns..2 recipes each.
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You know I actually agree with you here, but it won't happen because its to griefable. The TF leader could have every one stay till the last mission then kick 3 people so he gets that extra recipe.
~MR
AE Arc: 305214 Blood Diamonds (Villainous)
Unleashed/Unchained/B.O.S.S.
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Because you MUST be IO'd out... and soley with Pool C Drops... True Story
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So then, these drops shouldn't be in demand now, right?
Also, weren't you the "never gonna happen" guy when someone suggested a team-recall power?
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And how many of those Pool C Drops are in high demand?
Please specify which exactly.
And yep that was me... a Repeatable Craftable version which is what they were asking for... still hasnt happened 
The only version in the game right now is a 42 month vet reward, quite acceptable.
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Not to mention they wouldn't have to deal with bosses anyway on a TF set for 4. So what if they aren't lvl 50 mobs. They're still getting inf (double inf btw since they're exemped) and ARCANE SALVAGE. Farmable? Um....DUH! Of course!
What farmer wouldn't want the ability to farm large mobs without having to have fillers?
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I repeat:
Ok case in point... farming that single mish of Ice Minstral.
That'll cap them at lvl 40, spawned for a 4 man team, no Purples, no lvl 50 Recipies, and since they arent completing a TF, no Pool C Drops. The ONLY benefit is taht they wont have to pad their mish temporarily
Compare that to what they are doing now:
They have to pad, the single down side. They get Purple Drops, they get lvl 50 Recipies, they can spawn a map for 6 man spawn size. But BEST of all... they can freely choose who they wish to face. So they can continue to fight the week pathetic Family if they wish.
They WILL NOT FARM TASK FORCES ppl!!!
I just spelled it out for all of you... the ONLY thing that they gain is the lack of needing to pad, but they ultimately loose out on sooo much more.
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[ You think Rmt farmers are so dumb they dont know how to sell salvage,Tremere? Especially given the various farming missions decreases the game received over all to balance the xp curve that really isnt a boost at all 
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I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs btw.
And um, Salvage is going to drop regardless of what mish a person is running *sigh*
Strongly opposed to this change. TF Commander for PVP is too time consuming at present, this makes it worse, and I don't see the move solving RMT problems in any way.
While we're on the subject, an improvement to the quality of the TF drop pool would be welcome as well.
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[ You think Rmt farmers are so dumb they dont know how to sell salvage,Tremere? Especially given the various farming missions decreases the game received over all to balance the xp curve that really isnt a boost at all
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I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs btw.
And um, Salvage is going to drop regardless of what mish a person is running *sigh*
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But don't you think MORE of it will drop if your killing MORE enemies, WITHOUT having to pad?
Seriously.....who cares about purples if you can have Pangeans and Hami Goos and Prophecy's and all sorts of other rare salvage dropping reliably.
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[ You think Rmt farmers are so dumb they dont know how to sell salvage,Tremere? Especially given the various farming missions decreases the game received over all to balance the xp curve that really isnt a boost at all
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I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs btw.
And um, Salvage is going to drop regardless of what mish a person is running *sigh*
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But don't you think MORE of it will drop if your killing MORE enemies, WITHOUT having to pad?
Seriously.....who cares about purples if you can have Pangeans and Hami Goos and Prophecy's and all sorts of other rare salvage dropping reliably.
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Um, that TF (ice Minstral) caps at lvl 40. So unless you want to up the difficulty to spawn lvl 41 & 42s...
Guess what, now you are back into the Bosses Issues
Wow, you guys havent thought your counter-arguments through very well have ya?!?
Oh, and I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs
Oh, and while you are at it... which TF on Hero side shall Farmers start farming... just so I can shoot that down too
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You know an RMT farmer that has six accounts and haven't reported him?
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Where in my post did I say that?
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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[ You think Rmt farmers are so dumb they dont know how to sell salvage,Tremere? Especially given the various farming missions decreases the game received over all to balance the xp curve that really isnt a boost at all
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I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs btw.
And um, Salvage is going to drop regardless of what mish a person is running *sigh*
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But don't you think MORE of it will drop if your killing MORE enemies, WITHOUT having to pad?
Seriously.....who cares about purples if you can have Pangeans and Hami Goos and Prophecy's and all sorts of other rare salvage dropping reliably.
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You can do this just as reliably with newspaper/scanner missions or through certian arc via Ouro, and get the mission complete bonuses.
The only real boon is lack of padders needed.
This change isn't going to be rolled back because some people think farmers will exploit this.
I don't think it will be as common place as some are suggesting.
If I want to get some rare arcane salvage to drop on my charecters. I just go run newspaper/scanner mission vs CoT or Carnies. I get that mission completion bonus and every once in awhile will get that rare mission completion recipe thats useful.
~MR
AE Arc: 305214 Blood Diamonds (Villainous)
Unleashed/Unchained/B.O.S.S.
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You know an RMT farmer that has six accounts and haven't reported him?
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Where in my post did I say that?
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Per my previous quote, you said;
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Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them have at least three accounts? I know of one with six.
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I read that as;
Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them (RMT Farmers) have at least three accounts? I know of one (RMT Farmer) with six.
That's how that looks worded to me. I didn't think that you might have been just talking about regular farmers when I read it. Looking back, I might not have understood what you were getting at.
Badging in a PvP zone?
If you are treasure hunting on a battlefield wearing an enemy uniform, there is a high probability that you will be attacked.
This is an enjoy-the-ride game. "50" is only a number, not the goal of the game. - Noxilicious
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We know that finding out about this change after the patch is already live is not the ideal way to go about it. It was never our intent to hide or stealth this change out, it was simply lost in the volume of other changes spanning many months.
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Given that this is the third such instance this update alone, and all three are changes that would obviously upset a large percentage of the player base, I find this statement absolutely lacking in credibility.
ps. Enjoy the bug tickets now that the first mission of the RSF can't be soft-spawned. I don't suppose fixing escort AI ever came up for consideration?
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You know an RMT farmer that has six accounts and haven't reported him?
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Where in my post did I say that?
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Per my previous quote, you said;
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Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them have at least three accounts? I know of one with six.
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I read that as;
Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them (RMT Farmers) have at least three accounts? I know of one (RMT Farmer) with six.
That's how that looks worded to me. I didn't think that you might have been just talking about regular farmers when I read it. Looking back, I might not have understood what you were getting at.
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What I'm questioning is how you drew any conclusion at all about whether or not he was reported.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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You know an RMT farmer that has six accounts and haven't reported him?
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Where in my post did I say that?
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Per my previous quote, you said;
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Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them have at least three accounts? I know of one with six.
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I read that as;
Since you're the one focusing on RMT, do you realize that most of them (RMT Farmers) have at least three accounts? I know of one (RMT Farmer) with six.
That's how that looks worded to me. I didn't think that you might have been just talking about regular farmers when I read it. Looking back, I might not have understood what you were getting at.
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What I'm questioning is how you drew any conclusion at all about whether or not he was reported.
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I took the
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I know of one with six
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as them still being around. Where "knew" of one, past tense and no longer in the game, would seem to me more appropriate.
It's a conclusion, I like jumping to them. No harm intended, just a misunderstanding.
Badging in a PvP zone?
If you are treasure hunting on a battlefield wearing an enemy uniform, there is a high probability that you will be attacked.
This is an enjoy-the-ride game. "50" is only a number, not the goal of the game. - Noxilicious
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[ You think Rmt farmers are so dumb they dont know how to sell salvage,Tremere? Especially given the various farming missions decreases the game received over all to balance the xp curve that really isnt a boost at all
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I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs btw.
And um, Salvage is going to drop regardless of what mish a person is running *sigh*
[/ QUOTE ]
But don't you think MORE of it will drop if your killing MORE enemies, WITHOUT having to pad?
Seriously.....who cares about purples if you can have Pangeans and Hami Goos and Prophecy's and all sorts of other rare salvage dropping reliably.
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Um, that TF (ice Minstral) caps at lvl 40. So unless you want to up the difficulty to spawn lvl 41 & 42s...
Guess what, now you are back into the Bosses Issues
Wow, you guys havent thought your counter-arguments through very well have ya?!?
Oh, and I'm still waiting for those 3 TFs
Oh, and while you are at it... which TF on Hero side shall Farmers start farming... just so I can shoot that down too
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Fire/Psi is one of the major farming builds on villainside. With permadom, fire imps, and mind probe, I don't see bosses being much of an issue for that particular build. Spam PSW while focusing your ST firepower on the boss and I could see that being very profitable.
Hell, I'm not a farmer in the least, but I'm thinking of testing with my fire/psi to see how it goes.
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...
If fewer people run he tf's, there will be fewer dops. Fewer drops = higher prices. Higher prices encourages people to buy inf. RMT's win.
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Yep. The RMTs don't need to use this mechanic to their advantage. They can laugh all the way to the bank as pool c prices skyrocket.
meh, Katie can still be done in 20-25 mins.
Infinity and Victory mostly
dUmb, etc.
lolz PvP anymore, Market PvP for fun and profit
The farming potential isn't really the main point of contention in the change -- for me, anyway.
My concern, as others have also pointed out, is that TFs and SFs that have higher minimum player requirements are going to be that much harder to complete with pick-up groups because the missions will no longer adjust to the attrition that might happen.
I can't think of how that is a good thing.
Yes, TFs are team content. I have no problem with that. But of all the TFs I've done the only ones that have never had players drop are ones I've down with my SG. Nearly all of the PuGs have lost players. These TFs will now be tougher for those groups, with no commensurate reward to go along with the increased risk.
It also shows just how much impact inventions (loot) are having on the game now. So much for just ignoring them if you want to.
This isn't ED or the GDN but it is a rather graceless solution to an alleged problem.
Please fix the TF spawns. Many of us enjoy doing smaller two or three man TFs.
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The farming potential isn't really the main point of contention in the change -- for me, anyway.
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Good, thought I was going to have to argue counter-point again.
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My concern, as others have also pointed out, is that TFs and SFs that have higher minimum player requirements are going to be that much harder to complete with pick-up groups because the missions will no longer adjust to the attrition that might happen.
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I would be amazed if changes to the TFs werent already in the pipeline (as I noted earlier it could be as early as I12). Yes many of them need a rehash & some need their team size requirements altered. I cant for one minute believe that the devs would make this change without knowing that a few adjustments would have to be made "Soon".
Fix the god damn tech bug in the RSF (and every elevator/door in the game)
Give villains a katie equivalent, so that they can get recipes in half an hour like the heroes.
If this change is not reverted, please rescind the "only one reward every 24 hours" penalty for TF rewards. If me and my friends want to do nothing all day long but run TFs permanently set at 8 man spawns, at least let us be rewarded for each one without having to needlessly and stupidly swap characters.
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I congratulate you on this clever and timely change.
There is of course another exploit. And note that I'm using the word exploit, so this is clearly top priority.
Sometimes a person will invite people to a TF / SF, and then kick them later. And this is, um, griefing. Yeah, that's it, griefing! Terrible terrible griefing. It must be stopped.
So what you must do to fix this exploit, is make it so that one person alone can start a TF, but it still spawns for 3-8 like it otherwise would.
You know. To stop the griefing exploit RMT terrorist farmer conspiracy.
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Ooh, while we're fixing exploits, fix the one where my team mates steal all my drops!!! Like, when we're teamed up, and one of my team mates gets a really nice recipe... thief! Should've been mine! I mean, if he hadn't been there, I would've gotten that recipe! So fix that stealing ASAP! I should get all my recipes no matter who is on my team. I don't want to have to share them!