Draft: PvP Community Wish List
By
Acanous_Quietus,
Posted on: 2007-11-14 18:29 in Everything about PvP
Upcoming adds/edits:
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*Add TK falling bug
*Clarify that TK tp bug happens with both real and temp tp
*Add TP is not viable as a solo travel power. A few possible options for fixes.
*Refine description of placate bug
*Add MMs being able to spawn pets during post death OAS[/list]
Things we as a community need to do:
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*test and isolate tp after /ai bug
*get /loc of map holes in Eden
*test dom building teamed/unteamed in PvP and attempt to replicate teaming in duels bug[/list]
And sorry for posting like 5 times in a row. 
My perspective regarding the OAS normalization wasn't an attempt to reward luck over skill, it was an attempt to further the quite obvious goal of OAS in the first place.. protecting the player who just respawned and preventing matches from becoming regular farms of the same one un-saveable player.
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What if MM's were allowed to summon pets during the set up timer? 10 seconds isn't much, but its better than a stick in the eye. But it also doesn't give them all the time in the world to set up all their pets and buff them.
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What if all classes were set at various times based on the need/prep time to be fully functional.
I know some classes should be up for killing again right away, others need a 10-15 second prep time, and being able to opt out of prep time would also be a fairly cool feature.
Anyway just saw this portion and was intrigued enough to comment.
Ex
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What about something like that red square at the entrance/exit of outdoor instanced missions? When you enter, you could be in the square and unable to be attacked or to attack. You can leave the square at any time and it vanishes after 15 seconds.
I will not rest until we have in-game throwable pies!
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Further, I bet a million spacebucks the kill:death of villains vs. heroes VASTLY favors villains in BB/SC. If I'm wrong on that I'll shave my head and give out bananas at the airport while banging a tambourine. So just keep in mind the whole dynamics of PvP, including imbalances, shift quite dramatically as the levels go up.
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Even IF that was the case, then it's not from villains in general being more powerful. It's that same frikkin Dead horse of all the Heroes being nothing but Scrappers and n00b Blasters all coming in to compete for that 1 kill on the only Dom or Corruptor who was brave enough to wander in... while not being able to see all the Stalkers b/c none of these Brainiac heroes thought to ever roll a Sonic or Empath defender and actually TEAM UP.
We "villains" on Freedom don't have that problem. Freedom villains will team up in PvP at the drop of a hat and bring a good mix of Doms, MM's, and Corrs whenever possible. There isn't as much of this "nothing but Stalkers" bull that always happens in lower populated servers. The only time Heroes ever wise up and do the same, is when their Organized PvP SG's walk in and utterly decimate the entire zone b/c Hero buff-bots always trump Villain teams. ...Hell, I saw someone who was still in TRIBUTE yesterday in the middle of the day there. ...WTH is up with that? Who cares, cuz the point is the Heroes are all Team-Support characters and they get what's coming to them [u]on the datamining[u] against mass-Stalkers when they fail to recognize "their place" in a---> BALANCED Team.
Villains need an equal buff to AB, Powerboost, and Hibernate to be contend with heroes.
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...Hell, I saw someone who was still in TRIBUTE yesterday in the middle of the day there. ...WTH is up with that?
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lol.
That was Myk. Lab (who actually is in Tribute) is back and gave Myk a temp sgi since VR doesn't have a centralized SG on Freedom.
But yeah, that was a VR team.
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Why do all the damage dealers have such ridiculously-high Status, Defense, and -KB-protection Caps? They're the same as Tankers. ...So why ever take Tankers/MM's or Brutes into PvP then if the Blappers & Stalkers can be buffed INTO tankers??? This is the stupidest thing I've ever seen in a PvP game seriously. Don't nerf the Buffs and Buff-Stacking... just assign more Reasonable and THEMATIC buff-Caps to the Proper AT's so that there will actually be some Diversity in the Arena.
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I agree with this 110%. I always thought it was extremely lopsided that with epics and a buff or two blasters could equal tanker defenses, but a tanker can't get close to blaster damage no matter how many red inspirations he has.
50s: Inv/SS PB Emp/Dark Grav/FF DM/Regen TA/A Sonic/Elec MA/Regen Fire/Kin Sonic/Rad Ice/Kin Crab Fire/Cold NW Merc/Dark Emp/Sonic Rad/Psy Emp/Ice WP/DB FA/SM
Overlord of Dream Team and Nightmare Squad
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Why do all the damage dealers have such ridiculously-high Status, Defense, and -KB-protection Caps? They're the same as Tankers. ...So why ever take Tankers/MM's or Brutes into PvP then if the Blappers & Stalkers can be buffed INTO tankers??? This is the stupidest thing I've ever seen in a PvP game seriously. Don't nerf the Buffs and Buff-Stacking... just assign more Reasonable and THEMATIC buff-Caps to the Proper AT's so that there will actually be some Diversity in the Arena.
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I agree with this 110%. I always thought it was extremely lopsided that with epics and a buff or two blasters could equal tanker defenses, but a tanker can't get close to blaster damage no matter how many red inspirations he has.
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I actually didn't know about the resist caps being the same. I also agree, that's pretty messed up.
Former King of PWNZ
Franziska Von Karma says you will listen to every word I say.
well tanks/brutes cap at 90% res, and 3200 hp
squishies cap at 75% res and 1600 hp
Now i'm very tempted to agree that squishies shouldn't cap at 75%, considering scrappers cap there too.
60% res cap for squishies would proly be good imo.
Resist caps aren't the same. Neither are HP caps.
If you add a status resist cap, you need to add a status cap as well.
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well tanks/brutes cap at 90% res, and 3200 hp
squishies cap at 75% res and 1600 hp
Now i'm very tempted to agree that squishies shouldn't cap at 75%, considering scrappers cap there too.
60% res cap for squishies would proly be good imo.
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Wasn't sure on the exact numbers. And yea I know about the HP cap.
Former King of PWNZ
Franziska Von Karma says you will listen to every word I say.
Another I don't know offhand is what is the Defense caps?
Former King of PWNZ
Franziska Von Karma says you will listen to every word I say.
A better question is whether defense caps exist. None of the messing around in Mids that I've done has ever produced a cap... if there is one, it's insanely high to the point where it's probably almost unreachable.
Just speculation on my part, but, yeah. Also, two cents, I don't think there should be status and status resist caps.
EDIT: If anything would produce a defense cap, it'd probably be 7-stack Vengeance. Wonder what the numbers on that, are? 
I don't know how reliable this is, but it looks like there is a max cap of +175% with an innate +75% for players (different for PvP tho) for squishies. There is still the 5%~95% range.
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My perspective regarding the OAS normalization wasn't an attempt to reward luck over skill, it was an attempt to further the quite obvious goal of OAS in the first place.. protecting the player who just respawned and preventing matches from becoming regular farms of the same one un-saveable player.
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A reference to clarify this point... a simple look in the direction of game theory shows predictability to be the absolute worst possible trait when someone's "out to get you," which is exactly the case in duels and team matches alike.
Viewed in that light, unpredictability seems to be the only "actual" protection OAS can offer... if you take that away, then any time a player dies, they're a guaranteed unbuffed sitting duck 10 seconds (or whatever it's "normalized" to) after their respawn.
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My perspective regarding the OAS normalization wasn't an attempt to reward luck over skill, it was an attempt to further the quite obvious goal of OAS in the first place.. protecting the player who just respawned and preventing matches from becoming regular farms of the same one un-saveable player.
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A reference to clarify this point... a simple look in the direction of game theory shows predictability to be the absolute worst possible trait when someone's "out to get you," which is exactly the case in duels and team matches alike.
Viewed in that light, unpredictability seems to be the only "actual" protection OAS can offer... if you take that away, then any time a player dies, they're a guaranteed unbuffed sitting duck 10 seconds (or whatever it's "normalized" to) after their respawn.
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What would you think of changing the OAS 0-20 seconds random luck to anything normalized is better (moving things from luck to skill ftw), but what would you think of switching the current OAS mechanic to the PvP enabled mechanic that happens in zones? This would allow MMs set up time, let people get buffed, and happen at a regular rate so people don't get screwed by a string of bad OAS timers.
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My perspective regarding the OAS normalization wasn't an attempt to reward luck over skill, it was an attempt to further the quite obvious goal of OAS in the first place.. protecting the player who just respawned and preventing matches from becoming regular farms of the same one un-saveable player.
[/ QUOTE ]
A reference to clarify this point... a simple look in the direction of game theory shows predictability to be the absolute worst possible trait when someone's "out to get you," which is exactly the case in duels and team matches alike.
Viewed in that light, unpredictability seems to be the only "actual" protection OAS can offer... if you take that away, then any time a player dies, they're a guaranteed unbuffed sitting duck 10 seconds (or whatever it's "normalized" to) after their respawn.
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What would you think of changing the OAS 0-20 seconds random luck to anything normalized is better (moving things from luck to skill ftw), but what would you think of switching the current OAS mechanic to the PvP enabled mechanic that happens in zones? This would allow MMs set up time, let people get buffed, and happen at a regular rate so people don't get screwed by a string of bad OAS timers.
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Eh. I'm pretty much indifferent toward that, objectively. I can see the benefits of a change like that, or rather, I can see how it would make some people happy.
Subjectively speaking, I'd say it actually results in an overprotection... some degree of unpredictability seems fitting, if nothing else, to keep things from becoming 100% mechanical.
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My perspective regarding the OAS normalization wasn't an attempt to reward luck over skill, it was an attempt to further the quite obvious goal of OAS in the first place.. protecting the player who just respawned and preventing matches from becoming regular farms of the same one un-saveable player.
[/ QUOTE ]
A reference to clarify this point... a simple look in the direction of game theory shows predictability to be the absolute worst possible trait when someone's "out to get you," which is exactly the case in duels and team matches alike.
Viewed in that light, unpredictability seems to be the only "actual" protection OAS can offer... if you take that away, then any time a player dies, they're a guaranteed unbuffed sitting duck 10 seconds (or whatever it's "normalized" to) after their respawn.
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What would you think of changing the OAS 0-20 seconds random luck to anything normalized is better (moving things from luck to skill ftw), but what would you think of switching the current OAS mechanic to the PvP enabled mechanic that happens in zones? This would allow MMs set up time, let people get buffed, and happen at a regular rate so people don't get screwed by a string of bad OAS timers.
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I had thought about putting that down, but decided against it, as this would help mostly masterminds setup... But it would let empaths, buffers and such who only run a few toggles just to turn on the toggle and have a good ammount of un-interupted buff time.
I would be FOR it if the timers were set differently for different classes. Or even just a 10 second global time, not 20 seconds.
Former King of PWNZ
Franziska Von Karma says you will listen to every word I say.
Yeah, it'd skew fights that typically involve attacking key targets by allowing the empaths and other buffers to hyperbuff those key targets after a death. Seems like it'd slow down gameplay and lower scores.
Not saying that's good or bad, but... sounds like an unnecessary change.
not if a placate effect prevented targeting.
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One thing we want to do is create a top ten list of things wed most like to see fixed or added. That way we can still have an inclusive list, but still prioritize the things that matter most. Select a few things that matter most to you and post them.
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The discussion of individual issues thus far in this thread is benefical, but IMO the more people we can get to post up which issues and changes should take priority, the better and more useful the final list will be.
Okey dokey. My top ten
- Lessen fly suppression and add a fly timer reduction based upon number of fly pool powers the character has.
- Fix placate bug.
- Fix fury bug.
- Make clarity available to villains in Sirens Call. Switch it with repulsion.
- Allow arena map selection.
- Masterminds automatically start with tier one pets out.
- Give newcomers to pvp zones debt immunity and +perception. Base it on pvp zone hours per account.
- Force fields should give immunity to cage powers.
- Defense based sets need resistance to accuracy spikes.
- Add the bounty system (or at least the target tracking) to all pvp zones except Recluses Victory.
SparrowhawkHummingbirdDungeon MasterCapricornHour WomanQueen NefariaJunkyard GirlDoll FaceStitchbladeRed MinstrelMimic
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- Give newcomers to pvp zones debt immunity and +perception. Base it on pvp zone hours per account.
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I like this but I think in general they just need to reduce the amount of PvE npcs in the zones, especially RV. they really, really ruin fights.
I dunno, on my brute the only alternative to the RI toggle is to dive into a spawn of Arachnos when they decide to chase...
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7. The difficulty of leveling and equipping toons decreases the number of people who can get involved in competitive PvP. Make a paid PvP expansion where you can auto level to 50 and get unlimited loot for a toon, but can only play in the arena and PvP zones.
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This already exists to some extent, with players paying for toon PL's. Maybe my response is biased since I'm a poor college student who winces every time I pay my $13 or so per month, but giving rewards to those who pay more seems pretty elitist to me.
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Well, they've already broken the "rewards for people who pay more" barrier several times, such as with renames, transfers, GvE pack and the various VIP boxes.
To me it makes perfect sense as an expansion pack. It's requires a decent bit of tech involvement in terms of figuring out how to make toons that aren't allowed in PvE zones and has been highly and widely requested, but it's a feature that only a minority of people would use. To me it sounds very similar to server transfers in that regard: excellent and highly desirable, but something that only the people who use should pay for.