Official Thread for Recluses Victory: PvP Zone
By
Adam7,
Posted on: 2006-05-01 24:15 in Developers' Corner
FA renders every defense power and acc debuff useless EXCEPT the few lvl 38 super defense powers, and even then it still makes a big dent in their effectiveness
that's crazy overpowered, not to mention any scrapper or tank can get it, while villains can not
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FA renders every defense power and acc debuff useless EXCEPT the few lvl 38 super defense powers, and even then it still makes a big dent in their effectiveness
that's crazy overpowered, not to mention any scrapper or tank can get it, while villains can not
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You're exaggerating by a lot.
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Well Just got done doing some pvping with my Villain-lvl 40 dominator-and man....talk about pretty pointless for villains at this time. Essentially the heroes camped every pill box and the villain base the entire time--I'd wager it took less than 5 minutes for the heroes to win, over and over again. Now I understand that on the individual servers there won't be quite this big of an Imbalance of populations. But still I could see a large oranized supergroup completely owning the zone and wracking in unfathomable amounts of prestige and even XP from fighting the signature villains over and over again that this could be exploitable. All in all a great idea, but hopefully Villains will get a buff to make it at least a competitive zone.
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The only reason the Villains have been getting PWND in Recluse's Victory is sheer numbers. For some reason, the ratio of Heroes to Villains is about 5:1. The lack of Villain PPPs (as of yet) plays a small role, but once all you Villains level up to 50 and the numbers even out, there's no reason why one side should have an advantage.
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Oh really. Then explain why a Brute can not realistically expect to defeat a tanker. PVP in this game is ridiculously stupidly unbalanced, IMO
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I am wondering if anyone else felt the 1 hp and 1 end when you go to the hospital is a bit much. My dislike of it is for the following reasons:
1. It gives griefers more power. They kill you as you are coming out of the base and you have to go back in for a long time... until your rest recharges or you gain your hp + end back.
2. Often when you are going to the hospital more is when your side is heavily outnumbered and so it is more important that you get back in the battle sooner. The low end and hp means that players are going to get back in the game slower and this hurts the outnumbered side more than the one with big mobs.
3. The wait has the opposite effect I think the devs wanted... or at least I hope that the devs wanted to make it harder for big groups to dominate. Currently as things stand it makes it much easier for the big groups to dominate the field and makes it near impossible for the side with fewer to recoup and be able to mount some resistence
4. Not sure if this was a bug or not but in Warburg I was fighting a NPC and died... went to the hospital and was hit several times by the delayed attacks and died. I got double debt for dying.
5. The change is going to make it heaven for the base campers who sit outside the hospital in the PvP zones and snipe away at everyone leaving the hospital... as they straggle out one by one it is basically going to be a shooting gallery... and not fun at all if you are on the recieving end.
6. Come on! What is a hospital for but to heal you? What is the point of going to the hospital and being practically dead.
All in all I think it is a horrible idea and seems quite unpopular from what many were saying. It introduces a level of annoyance that is really not needed. Just think of the squishies who end up in the hospital a lot. It makes most of their game time being waiting to heal because they can only use rest every once in a while.
In practice the 1 hp and 1 end points is a terrible idea and I really hope the devs kill it. It only makes it easier for one group to dominate the field and makes some of the more difficult to play ATs practically impossible to play in PvP. ATs with regen and Fitness are harder to kill but they also can get back in the game quicker. MMs, Doms, Corrs especially are effected.
When playing my ice/dark corr I spent more time in the hospital waiting to heal than I did playing while the heroes camped outside the base and killed us as we left. They controlled all the turrents and there was no hope of the villians recapturing them as they all were lingering inside the hospital. To me it was the only real drawback to RV. It does suck that hide is worthless but that is really another topic. (since hide is no good they should give the stalkers at least some more hp or something to make up for it and make them more viable. I just do not see how sniper attacks are going to even things out)
Maybe a good fix for this would be to make the side with more players on the map have the low hp and end when they go to the hospital and the side with fewer players come out of the hosp fully charged. This would allow the side with fewer players to mount a better resistence and would make it more difficult for the side with the huge mobs to dominate so easily.
Other than this I thought RV was a lot of fun and can't wait to get to 50 to see what it is like then.
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Well Just got done doing some pvping with my Villain-lvl 40 dominator-and man....talk about pretty pointless for villains at this time. Essentially the heroes camped every pill box and the villain base the entire time--I'd wager it took less than 5 minutes for the heroes to win, over and over again. Now I understand that on the individual servers there won't be quite this big of an Imbalance of populations. But still I could see a large oranized supergroup completely owning the zone and wracking in unfathomable amounts of prestige and even XP from fighting the signature villains over and over again that this could be exploitable. All in all a great idea, but hopefully Villains will get a buff to make it at least a competitive zone.
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The only reason the Villains have been getting PWND in Recluse's Victory is sheer numbers. For some reason, the ratio of Heroes to Villains is about 5:1. The lack of Villain PPPs (as of yet) plays a small role, but once all you Villains level up to 50 and the numbers even out, there's no reason why one side should have an advantage.
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Oh really. Then explain why a Brute can not realistically expect to defeat a tanker. PVP in this game is ridiculously stupidly unbalanced, IMO
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Not many hero archetypes can, either. A scrapper has a chance, so does a blaster, but neither is guaranteed. Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Recluses Victory new high level PvP zone, open to players level 40 and up.
All off topic posts will be removed. Please do not post bugs/feedback/balance issues before testing this content. All bugs/feedback/balance issues should be posted AFTER Recluses Victory has been explored.
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In my own opinion, I foresee this PvP zone to be like all other PvP zones in every other game. If you are a villain, don't bother going in till you are 50 and have at least 10 Hami-Os. In addition, make sure that you have a guaranteed, co-ordinated group of 8 members who know how to stick together and know when to pull back.
Otherwise, this zone will be nothing but an area where the heros farm prestige for their bases for hours on end.
Bar none, this is the biggest eyesore in PvP misbalancing I have ever seen. Even with Cackle as the leader, shouting out commands, we were ripped apart by 3 heroes. Our full group of 8, sitting at one pillbox.
Good luck getting a heavy, they were camped about 50% of the time I was there. I got killed so quickly.. didn't mater if I was fighting back or just repeatedly clicking on the glowy with Overload up. All it takes is one tap, you won't get it.
If you don't feel like lining the pockets of heroes, stick to Siren's Call. This zone, in all it's "cool featureness" is really just a place to keep the villains disenchanted with poor base defenses trapped behind a line of 5 heroes with Confuse, invulnerable undispellable pets, hurricanes, long range-one-shot snipes, ice patches, and all the others with no chance of a CM or resistance.
Good job.
I despise this zone. It has left such a sour taste in my mouth for the whole experience. Is this really what you want? A playground for the CoH bullies?
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Not many hero archetypes can, either. A scrapper has a chance, so does a blaster, but neither is guaranteed. Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Uh, until they patch it, BRUTES don't even have the benefit of fury.
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Not many hero archetypes can, either. A scrapper has a chance, so does a blaster, but neither is guaranteed. Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Uh, until they patch it, BRUTES don't even have the benefit of fury.
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That's tragic, but it doesn't really have anything to do with my question.
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Not many hero archetypes can, either. A scrapper has a chance, so does a blaster, but neither is guaranteed. Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Uh, until they patch it, BRUTES don't even have the benefit of fury.
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That's tragic, but it doesn't really have anything to do with my question.
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The answer is yes, a Tank can defeat a brute. I've fought Fire/Fire, Ice/Ice, Invuln/SS, Earth/Fire and every combination contained therein. Just keep Dull Pain/Earth's Embrace/Fiery Embrace on two recharge enhancements, and you will whittle them down.
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How can you guys even call for a nerf when you don't have your FPO's yet and aren't level 50... level out, get your enhancements, then if you still feel its needed cry nerf. But don't cry because you get owned when your fighting peopel that have had a longer time to get to where you will be soon enough.
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They don't want to admit how good Elude, etc is for them, which can and does offset FA's accuracy bonus...and for some reason, they think "Hide" = "Should never ever be spotted."
I don't think the "FA renders Stalkers useless" argument has yet been demonstrated to be true.
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How often does a stalker have elude running, and how long does he not? Thats the problem. 1/3 of the time he cant be hit, 2/3 of the time he cant be missed.
i thought heavies are supposed to be OMGBBQHAX. and they only have about 5khp. the other day about 5 villains came at my heavy and [censored] it up pretty bad. and any signature hero or av in the zone can take one out in a matter of a few hits. id say they are good where they are at.and also "I think that players should be limited to one at a time" is a good idea as well. noone likes a hog
I believe in quality, not quantity. also i have a short attention span...
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Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Tanker base damage is more than brute base damage, and their defense a helluva lot better. My tanker has never lost to a brute in single combat. Brutes are not a challenge, anymore. Like you said, Scrappers have a decent chance, As do Blasters... but Brutes?
Brutes in their current PVP incarnation are quite pathetic compared to the other melee archetypes. Fury *needs* to be fixed. Badly.
Dawnslayer on Virtue.
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Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Tanker base damage is more than brute base damage, and their defense a helluva lot better. My tanker has never lost to a brute in single combat. Brutes are not a challenge, anymore. Like you said, Scrappers have a decent chance, As do Blasters... but Brutes?
Brutes in their current PVP incarnation are quite pathetic compared to the other melee archetypes. Fury *needs* to be fixed. Badly.
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Well put. A Brute fighting a Tanker is usually a long drawn out fight, but due to the way Fury functions in PvP the Tanker will usually come out on top.
If a Brute could get their Fury building, though, that would be a very enjoyable fight.
I hope it didn't appear that I was saying the heavies needed to be nerfed. No, I think they got that part right. What I do see as a problem though is the virtually free exp. Yes I realize there is the potential of danger, but if you have a heavy and stay away from the combat spots I think most peeps are gonna leave you alone.
Why bother the guy thats keeping the BFG busy mowing the lawn?
And yes, against the Villians it wasn't so survivable. But mobs posed no real threat.
And its not to hard to keep one away from the AVs when your just there to get exp.
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Not many hero archetypes can, either. A scrapper has a chance, so does a blaster, but neither is guaranteed. Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Uh, until they patch it, BRUTES don't even have the benefit of fury.
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That's tragic, but it doesn't really have anything to do with my question.
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You're question doesn't make sense - tankers don't do "weak damage."
For the record, though, I did finish off a brute or two with my ice/stone in RV earlier.
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I hope it didn't appear that I was saying the heavies needed to be nerfed. No, I think they got that part right.
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I don't know. I mean, a heavy hit my tanker for 1700 points in one shot today. I definitely felt the pain of playing a defense-oriented set when heavies were around.
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I hope it didn't appear that I was saying the heavies needed to be nerfed. No, I think they got that part right.
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I don't know. I mean, a heavy hit my tanker for 1700 points in one shot today. I definitely felt the pain of playing a defense-oriented set when heavies were around.
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I believe that hevies, even though they are pets, will be treated as critters for the purpose of "accuracy scaling"...but this is non-confirmed, and should be looked into.
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Also, can a Tank defeat a Brute? Tanker damage is weak, and they don't have the benefit of Fury.
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Tanker base damage is more than brute base damage, and their defense a helluva lot better. My tanker has never lost to a brute in single combat. Brutes are not a challenge, anymore. Like you said, Scrappers have a decent chance, As do Blasters... but Brutes?
Brutes in their current PVP incarnation are quite pathetic compared to the other melee archetypes. Fury *needs* to be fixed. Badly.
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Well put. A Brute fighting a Tanker is usually a long drawn out fight, but due to the way Fury functions in PvP the Tanker will usually come out on top.
If a Brute could get their Fury building, though, that would be a very enjoyable fight.
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And you're not wrong, either. I've seen what happens when a Brute with a Fury bar (say, from fighting at a hotspot) suddenly engages a tanker. Usually, the Tanker thinks he's fine (especially since the Brute is likley a tad low on HP at the time)...until he suddenly realizes that the Brute just walloped him for something akin to 8 times the damage he normally does! Now as soon as they fix Fury, those 1v1s will be much more interesting...
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I hope it didn't appear that I was saying the heavies needed to be nerfed. No, I think they got that part right.
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I don't know. I mean, a heavy hit my tanker for 1700 points in one shot today. I definitely felt the pain of playing a defense-oriented set when heavies were around.
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I believe that hevies, even though they are pets, will be treated as critters for the purpose of "accuracy scaling"...but this is non-confirmed, and should be looked into.
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"pain of defense-oriented set" = getting hit for full damage when hit at all
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Further Impressions on RV:
The day of the scrapper has truly arrived.
Blasters are always a threat, but they mostly just hit up pff and run away when a couple people show up. But, my god scrappers are insane at this stage. Incredible damage (nearly blaster level) and so much survivability it is scary. Especially teh regin.
One of the members from the Freaks SG was kind enough to engage me for some testing with his BS/regin. By the way, he is definitely one of the best scrappers I have seen in action and used fear very well. FA is what truly makes them click, he simply did not miss me nor did I miss him because I used rad infection to 'paint' him.
I used all my best kiting techniques, but ultimately even the almighty ice/ roots you for a second and that is all a BS scrapper needs to put you in a world of hurt. Just to clarify, he basically owned me in RV no matter what I did (but this may change once I get my ppps and another 18slots so it is all good). In the arena set at level 40 the match was much more even and we split 1to1 (jerk two shotted me right off the bat lol). In sirens call the match swung in my favor mostly because of the early blooming nature of /rad which makes my lvl 32-38 powers unnecessary.
In the arena I used webnade + Lingering rad and he stated that it would be a killer combo, as even his superspeed was at a crawl. So I am looking forward to Black Scorp as my ppp.
I also had a 5min match against a kat/regin in one of the corners. I used hasten + AM 3 times over the duration of the fight. Again they simply do not miss with FA, it gives them as much or more accuracy then my 3defdebuff slotted Rad infect does, but with out the 4 second animation and the consequences of trying to run a tog debuff in zone pvp (i.e. mass npc aggro and it only working around the one target).
The kat/regin was much more manageable as I could heal up his damage much easier than the BS scrapper, but I eventually lost when a longbow warden wandered by and decided to put the hurt on me.
In case anyone is interested it takes 4 stacked freezerays (or non dom/troller holds) to overcome their mez in RV as opposed to 3 in sirens and warburg (not 100% sure on WB though). As a result one of my strategies that involves mezzing the scrapper has disappeared, though it may come back depending on how well the holds from the ppp's perform.
Overall I feel that my corruptor stacks up fairly well in the zone. Using /rad (cold or kin too) which I feel is the designed counter to regin seems to potentially perform well (depending how the ppp's turn out for corrs). The matches between an optimum corruptor and regin scrapper will be very interesting. I feel that the favor may actually be for the corruptor if the jump from Black Scorp works as well as the webnades available in the arena. Of course this is under optimal circumstances, more often than not the scrapper will just 2-3 shot pretty much any squishy. But in teams the counter that a corruptor can bring against the scrapper seems to be well thought out.
Had some wicked fun fights and look forward to leveling up and showing people just how nasty a corruptor that doesn't let you move can be.
Also I am now leveling up a scrapper (currently lvl 16) because I was amazed at their power in RV. In previous zones they are strong, but blasters always shone brighter. NOT ANYMORE lol.
Frosticus
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Recluses Victory new high level PvP zone, open to players level 40 and up.
All off topic posts will be removed. Please do not post bugs/feedback/balance issues before testing this content. All bugs/feedback/balance issues should be posted AFTER Recluses Victory has been explored.
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In my own opinion, I foresee this PvP zone to be like all other PvP zones in every other game. If you are a villain, don't bother going in till you are 50 and have at least 10 Hami-Os. In addition, make sure that you have a guaranteed, co-ordinated group of 8 members who know how to stick together and know when to pull back.
Otherwise, this zone will be nothing but an area where the heros farm prestige for their bases for hours on end.
Bar none, this is the biggest eyesore in PvP misbalancing I have ever seen. Even with Cackle as the leader, shouting out commands, we were ripped apart by 3 heroes. Our full group of 8, sitting at one pillbox.
Good luck getting a heavy, they were camped about 50% of the time I was there. I got killed so quickly.. didn't mater if I was fighting back or just repeatedly clicking on the glowy with Overload up. All it takes is one tap, you won't get it.
If you don't feel like lining the pockets of heroes, stick to Siren's Call. This zone, in all it's "cool featureness" is really just a place to keep the villains disenchanted with poor base defenses trapped behind a line of 5 heroes with Confuse, invulnerable undispellable pets, hurricanes, long range-one-shot snipes, ice patches, and all the others with no chance of a CM or resistance.
Good job.
I despise this zone. It has left such a sour taste in my mouth for the whole experience. Is this really what you want? A playground for the CoH bullies?
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QFT
QFE
Like we've been saying since CoV Beta:
The heroes are more powerful - its that simple.
They can over-buff, over heal and over status-jack and out-damage with fewer numbers.
The "villains are more offensive" arguement holds no water - since heroes can crank thier damage output substantially and escape the "more offensive" villains with 2 buffing AT's, APP's and opponents who have 2 inherents that function effectively out of 5 in PvP: Assassination and Scourge.
Like many ive left this zone in disgust repeatedly after attempting to enjoy it and test it with an open mind.
You have some serious power discrepencies at work between villains and heroes, devs.
And it isnt new news.
This zone makes it even more glaringly obvious and disenchanting.
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One thing that always turns me off to going to Warburg in CoH when Im leaving a toon in the 40-50 range...it takes so long to get there from pi. And my 50 is parked in the Hive, so thats a long hike too. This is one thing that was well done about CoV...all the gates to the PvP zones are in the according PvE zone.
Is there anyway we could do one of the following...
1. Make an enterance to RV in pi
2. Make a gate that takes us to atlas from pi
3. Move the RV enterance alltogether
Another complaint about having it in Atlas is lag, especially near the statue. Its like putting it in Talos.
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Ever try Base Teleporter Pads?
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ok to defend the OP on this... I'm not sure how you have a level 50 tank and not know that the Telepads in COH are crap compared to the Pads in COV. We have way more zones then they do, and our telepads only go to zones that are really crappy. Yeh you can TP to the hollows to get to Atlas, but what about the return trip? Villians can use thier pads to go to every non PVP zone. I think heroes should be able to as well.
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Base --> Crey's Folly --> Crash Site --> PI
...doesn't take that long
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Blue 50s: 4 controllers, 3 defenders, 2 blasters, 2 scrappers, 1 tanker
Red 50s: 4 corruptors, 2 brutes, 1 dominator, 1 VEAT
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The only reason the Villains have been getting PWND in Recluse's Victory is sheer numbers.
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Yeah why don't all the heros go test all their new stuff!
OH WAIT!
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lol
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
Question for the heroes: when you get Defeat Villains for Extra Prestige popping up, what sort of prestige reward are you getting, and is it for player villains only, or players and villain mobs?
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How can you guys even call for a nerf when you don't have your FPO's yet and aren't level 50... level out, get your enhancements, then if you still feel its needed cry nerf. But don't cry because you get owned when your fighting peopel that have had a longer time to get to where you will be soon enough.
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They don't want to admit how good Elude, etc is for them, which can and does offset FA's accuracy bonus...and for some reason, they think "Hide" = "Should never ever be spotted."
I don't think the "FA renders Stalkers useless" argument has yet been demonstrated to be true.
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