Official Thread for Recluses Victory: PvP Zone

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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There's an easy way around this, of course: Stay away from the opposing base.

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Sensible people keep saying this and the sublime ease of the solution still makes me chuckle.

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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There's an easy way around this, of course: Stay away from the opposing base.

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/signed

I don't go close enough to get TP'ed into drones and on my toons that can Starless Step and Wormhole... if you're that close... well... droned you are!

so what are people supposed to do when they have driven the other side into their base? go pick flowers?

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so what are people supposed to do when they have driven the other side into their base? go pick flowers?

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hrmn, maybe go after the other villians in the zone?
Take over pillboxes?
Run missions?
Back off?


Or you can span camp and get drone tped and whine like a baby because you can't press an "I win, You Lose" button and keep the opposing faction firmly under heel.
Because fun is in never giving the other side a chance, right?

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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There's an easy way around this, of course: Stay away from the opposing base.

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Sensible people keep saying this and the sublime ease of the solution still makes me chuckle.

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Just to be an @!# I once had 3 friends, each of us with tport foe, yank someone halfway across the zone to the drone. Took several tries before we got it to work and it was quite fun. Even the target was amused.

As I said before, I give all the props in the world to LotD. The times I've played with them (and with just them being around) have been great fun. But I don't think it really proves anything about overall hero vs. villain balance. The fact of the matter is, it still took a full team from a dedicated PvP VG to beat back a bunch of soloists, PuGs, and scrubs.

A group of dedicated yet underpowered characters should be able to do that...especially if they can catch their opponent by surprise. And let's face it, putting up any kind of resistance at all as a villain in RV right now is bound to take many of the folks on the hero side by surprise.

Again, granted, LotD kicks much [censored], but I don't think it really proves anything. I'd imagine that had there been a dedicated hero PvP SG in the zone at the same time with 50s and APPs, they would have had little trouble beating LotD right back inside the villain base.

Now that's playtesting.

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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As opposed to folks like you who TP villains out of the base and into the 15 hero strong gank squad waiting just outside drone range? Funny how every night I log into RV I can expect to see some version of Sal's character huddled nice and tight in his PFF until it's time to TP gank some villain who's just trying to get into the zone. Hypocrites make the best whiners.

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regarding the pillboxes and recall, Heroes did not do this- it is a bug; currently, when someone controlling the pillbox dies the turrets sometimes follow them to the reclamator.
We have fixed this, and it will be uploaded soon.

A_V

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Hey, That was ME!

I was in a Pillbox minding my own business when a swarm of Villians came down on me. I died and when I went to the hospital one of the Turrets came with me. Now that's a Loyal Defense Turret!!

I like my solution the best. Solo in PvE and never have to be annoyed by anyone's BS in PvP... or in PUGS... or in broadcast... it's good to be an MMO hermit.

I'm with Jdos on this one LOTD.
You had an organized pvp sg vs disorganized heroes.
That doesn't seem like an equal comparison.
Tell us when you can do well vs organized hero teams in RV.
I really want to believe you, but my own experience tells me different.

I really hope the devs look at ppp's and high end pvp balance.

A_V - thanks for the update. Glad to know it was a bug and is being fixed.

The only reason we couldn't take the zone last night was that we had client stability problems and we ran into that bugged pillbox (and wasted some time trying to figure out what was going on.) We were within 10 seconds of taking the zone at one point and were edging ever closer.

We learned quite a few lessons about zone strategy that we used tonight when we captured the zone with a similar team build and against similar odds. More importantly, we saw more villains out and about - there was a second villain group working on pillboxes this time.

Remember, this was our first serious foray into the zone; we originally came in to just do straight PvP as a diversion from levelling and to maybe teach some base camping heroes a lesson about laziness. We were figuring out on the fly what to do and how to prioritize.

The team we ran in RV is pretty much one of the same ones we run in the other zones against the other top end PvP SG and VGs on Freedom. We have a lot of experience and practice running it in open zone PvP. While we were late to get into Arena and are still kinda working on our builds and tactics for it, I feel LotD is the best open zone PvP group (hero or villain) in the game.

There are also quite a number of other good PvP villain groups on Freedom that we've fought with and against that will most definitely be in the zone with us. With 2 or 3 guilds in the zone simultaneously (a very real possibility on Freedom), I'm looking forward to some truly epic battles.

I have no fear for the villains ability to take RV on Freedom. It'll be a hell of a fight, no doubt about it, but it's gonna be mega fun.

As far as EPPs versus PPPs, I'll admit I was (and still am) dissapointed with the patron power pools but they honestly have made next to no difference in PvP that I can see so far. We've seen scrappers/tanks with FA, blasters with PFF or force of nature, trollers with hibernate, yada yada yada. Against cross-buffed corruptors and domination they just die (or they run.)

Remember we're all running with level 40 corruptors and doms without all the slotting and extra powers from 41-50. Even if we don't take any PPP's at all (which some of us are seriously considering) I don't see it as a major balance issue.

it's not a big balance issue (other than FA), it's just disappointing that our patron powers are so crappy many people aren't going to take any of them

we can't dip into a 5th power pool instead of the patron powers, can we? ugh

Really the only issue with FA is the resistance to toHitDebuffs. If that wasn't there, you could have /Rad and /Dark at least mess up the FA but as it stands, it cannot be affected.

you'd still need like 3 /rads to equal fa's buff

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But I don't think it really proves anything about overall hero vs. villain balance. The fact of the matter is, it still took a full team from a dedicated PvP VG to beat back a bunch of soloists, PuGs, and scrubs.


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/signed

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Really the only issue with FA is the resistance to toHitDebuffs. If that wasn't there, you could have /Rad and /Dark at least mess up the FA but as it stands, it cannot be affected.

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...and /signed

Quickest way to stop people from capturing pillboxes is where they begin. If that is at the mouth of the base then well so be it.

People whine about FA but I am gonna whine about bodyguard. I dunno if the MM had his armors but I hit him for maybe 10, if that with a block of ice while he was in EF. Yeah I know EF kinda sucks in PvP if they have resists. I think he might have been on a tar patch too, not positive though cause there were a lot of debuffs. I am not really whining about Bodyguard, just trying to bring it to attention that it is pretty powerful in the right hands

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A_V - thanks for the update. Glad to know it was a bug and is being fixed.

The only reason we couldn't take the zone last night was that we had client stability problems and we ran into that bugged pillbox (and wasted some time trying to figure out what was going on.) We were within 10 seconds of taking the zone at one point and were edging ever closer.

We learned quite a few lessons about zone strategy that we used tonight when we captured the zone with a similar team build and against similar odds. More importantly, we saw more villains out and about - there was a second villain group working on pillboxes this time.

Remember, this was our first serious foray into the zone; we originally came in to just do straight PvP as a diversion from levelling and to maybe teach some base camping heroes a lesson about laziness. We were figuring out on the fly what to do and how to prioritize.

The team we ran in RV is pretty much one of the same ones we run in the other zones against the other top end PvP SG and VGs on Freedom. We have a lot of experience and practice running it in open zone PvP. While we were late to get into Arena and are still kinda working on our builds and tactics for it, I feel LotD is the best open zone PvP group (hero or villain) in the game.

There are also quite a number of other good PvP villain groups on Freedom that we've fought with and against that will most definitely be in the zone with us. With 2 or 3 guilds in the zone simultaneously (a very real possibility on Freedom), I'm looking forward to some truly epic battles.

I have no fear for the villains ability to take RV on Freedom. It'll be a hell of a fight, no doubt about it, but it's gonna be mega fun.

As far as EPPs versus PPPs, I'll admit I was (and still am) dissapointed with the patron power pools but they honestly have made next to no difference in PvP that I can see so far. We've seen scrappers/tanks with FA, blasters with PFF or force of nature, trollers with hibernate, yada yada yada. Against cross-buffed corruptors and domination they just die (or they run.)

Remember we're all running with level 40 corruptors and doms without all the slotting and extra powers from 41-50. Even if we don't take any PPP's at all (which some of us are seriously considering) I don't see it as a major balance issue.

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All well and good but your rolling with a full team of corrupters - currently one of the 2 AT's that have a functioning inherent villain side - and who can also debuff/buff/heal.

Please - do *not* take this as an attack on your VG LoTD - because its not.
Im sure you guys have your schtick down and are great players.

As others have mentioned - a group of VG members who know eachother's tactics well should have no problems taking out a few groups of scrubs.

Also - if you couldnt heal, buff or debuff you'd most likely be dead in the water.

It really doesnt say anything about villain/hero balance at all -other than buffing and debuffing and healing are overly relevant in CoX.

And the heroes out-gun the villains by lightyears in that respect with 2 debuffing/buffing/healing AT's - who basically enable the heroes to surpass the villains in the offense department as well.

Id like to see the same experiment with less corrupters against an organized hero group.

Having a dev chime in and give the nod to a predominantly corrupter team with a uber-buffed dom who are all in the same VG and pvp regularily going up against some unorganized base-campers and scrubs and say "good work - the zone is all about strategy" just illuminates the hero/villain imbalance even more imo.

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As others have mentioned - a group of VG members who know eachother's tactics well should have no problems taking out a few groups of scrubs.

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Phantom,
Have you ever found yourself on a PUG that worked out really well? Why did it work out? Group of oldie players that all had above mediocre skill and builds? A leader that actually lead, actually took and used tactics and ideas from the group?

Same thing can happen in a PvP zone. All it takes is one meeting inside the villain base to check out each other's powersets and determine who needs to cover who's backside.

But I do agree that I'd like to hear about more diverse groups of villains and how they do. Replace some of the corrupters with a brute or 3. Get a couple of MMs in there. Now how do you do?

I mean, we all know that a team of illusion/rad controllers can make a mockery of everything in this game, why wouldn't a team of corrupters be the same?

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I'm with Jdos on this one LOTD.
You had an organized pvp sg vs disorganized heroes.
That doesn't seem like an equal comparison.


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There is certainly some truth to this, over the last few days we have run into members and small groups of some of the PvP SG's/VG's but we haven't seen a full team AFAIK, we certainly ran into full teams of heroes but its hard to recognize everyone since many haven't set up SG's on test. I want to see what happens when the competition level increases, but I think we can safely say that whatever differences exit between the factions balance wise can be overcome. I do think there are some areas where Heroes > Villains, but they can be overcome with tactics. When both sides have equally good tactics then even small differences have an impact.

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I really hope the devs look at ppp's and high end pvp balance.


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The PPP's, on paper, are worse than the hero APP's and that will have an impact. I hope we see some level boosts on test so we can look at every thing on equal ground and see how the various PPP's work in action.


The current state looks like more of a tuning situation than large changes. The buffs to MM's and Dom's has made a big difference in overall factional balance. BTW, our team make up was 7 Cor's and 1 Dom. Last night we ran 6 Cors and 2 Dom's with the same level of effectiveness. We'd like to test the MM's more, but the people with high level MM's play Cor roles we need

Yo, I was just in RV for 1.5 + hrs. The AV's are nearly impossible! Its gotta be toned down some, we couldnt even drop Scorpion under 72k, his hp was about 76k. Jeez.

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Remember, this was our first serious foray into the zone; we originally came in to just do straight PvP as a diversion from levelling and to maybe teach some base camping heroes a lesson about laziness. We were figuring out on the fly what to do and how to prioritize.
The team we ran in RV is pretty much one of the same ones we run in the other zones against the other top end PvP SG and VGs on Freedom. We have a lot of experience and practice running it in open zone PvP. While we were late to get into Arena and are still kinda working on our builds and tactics for it, I feel LotD is the best open zone PvP group (hero or villain) in the game.
There are also quite a number of other good PvP villain groups on Freedom that we've fought with and against that will most definitely be in the zone with us. With 2 or 3 guilds in the zone simultaneously (a very real possibility on Freedom), I'm looking forward to some truly epic battles.
I have no fear for the villains ability to take RV on Freedom. It'll be a hell of a fight, no doubt about it, but it's gonna be mega fun.


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Grats to LoTD for a great job. Thorizdin gives great advice in the corr forums and now I understand how. I have been going on and on about corr teams for a while. Unfortunately, I have to agree that it speaks more about your teamwork and the power of the corr AT than it does about any balance between heroes and villains as a whole.

Corrs are, without question the most effective villain AT. The only villain team more powerful than a corr team is probably a corr team with 2 FF masterminds.

I wish you guys had level 50 HO'd heroes with APPs. I would like to see if you thought it was easier to take the zone with that group.

Personally, I am underwhelmed by the PPPs and think that villains will come to rely on corrs as the core of any team (at least 4 if not 5) in order to be successful at high level pvp. The success of your corr team only reinforces that.

I'm trying to keep an open mind and plan on spending more time in RV.

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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There's an easy way around this, of course: Stay away from the opposing base.

[/ QUOTE ]
Sensible people keep saying this and the sublime ease of the solution still makes me chuckle.

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Just to be an @!# I once had 3 friends, each of us with tport foe, yank someone halfway across the zone to the drone. Took several tries before we got it to work and it was quite fun. Even the target was amused.

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And, of course, long ago it was declared that absolutely no behavior in a PvP zone could ever be "griefing".

This is why, no matter how smashingly amazing and beautiful RV is, you won't see me there except at 4 am EST on a weekday, to avoid the PvP brats, just long enough to take a look around, get the badges.

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Yo, I was just in RV for 1.5 + hrs. The AV's are nearly impossible! Its gotta be toned down some, we couldnt even drop Scorpion under 72k, his hp was about 76k. Jeez.

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I thought that until I saw LR/BS get taken out in about 2 minutes. Once people started focusing on one instead of splitting up between 5 (LR/BS and those stupid mega-bosses that came with them) it went very quickly.

HOWEVER... test server in regards to things like this is NOT a good test-bed. The # of players in the test server version of RV is probably not a good/accurate representation of how many will be in live... unless TEST is like the forums and it actually only represents a small percentage of the gaming population.

However it's IMO still a lot more active and has a lot more players than we're going to see regularly in live RV once the novelty wears off the and Non-PvP'ing badge get their badges.

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Yep, well once the children that Drone teleport for 2 hours straight leave the zone it actually becomes fun..

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There's an easy way around this, of course: Stay away from the opposing base.

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Kali speaks the truth once more. Of course with red names saying crap like:

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Somebody also did the recall friend thing on one of the hero pillboxes, making it impossible for villains to take (a very <censored> thing to do IMHO.)

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What do you expect from the playerbase?

Might as well say, "Hey, you suck for using our crap programming!" Very constructive.

Quick, someone mod me.