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/em wonders when the devs are gonna realize that Force Bubble has the same "problem" that convinced em to zap Hurricane.
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I honestly felt the nerf to hurricane wasn't necessary. The worst parts about getting debuffed by hurricane was the nasty to-hit debuff and its -range. The -tohit was easily countered at the higher levels(FA, AIM, BU, etc). The -range was the only form of mitigation against ranged toons for the Storm summoning set. It made only since that storm should be able to keep melee out when they are so vulnerable to everything else.
I feel that the change to the repel ticker on hurricane wasnt necessary considering the small radius hurricane has. With the patch melee can easily run in and get their swings in before the repel kicks in. From what I've tested the -tohit and -range only affect the enemy when they get hit by the repel so alot of the times melee can get their hit in before the repel, -tohit and -range take affect. This defeats the purpose of what hurricane was meant to do for the set. My opinion is that the repel ticker should have been increased on force bubble not hurricane. Not because it's overpowered but because forcebubbles radius is so much larger. Melee literally had no chance of getting through force bubble and a decent chance with their ranged epic attacks.
I feel they should restore hurricane to the way it was before the 3/31 patch. Melee AT's get plenty of options later on to counter almost every effect hurricane does. Melee AT's get a ranged attack or hold which counters the hurricanes small radius. Melee AT's in CoH get Focused Accuracy which easily counters the tohit debuff in hurricane. Hurricane shouldn't be able to permanently pin someone but it should atleast keep melee toons away. That was the definable power for the set that made them survivable in pvp and pve.
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wurd.
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I agree with this, and it is very nice that Castle and QA are working to fix Hurricane to nicer status in PvE, but in PvP where the change was focused at, coupled with the tohit debuff alteration; the power is badly hurt. ANYONE can get through it, the repel might as well be non-existant unless you're standing 1 ft away from the Hurricane person and trying to use an interruptable power. Even then, RI is probably doing more. I think Repels are a very unique and powerful mez effect, but since IIRC there are only 3: Telekenesis, Force Bubble and Hurricane, I feel that these powers should be somewhat nearer back to where they were. If not, then I'd say give hurricane a menial compensation like a base tohit debuff increase or tone up it's Repel a tad in PvP while decreasing the radius of FB by 5-10 ft and making TK only require a user to use 3 BFs to escape.
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days. 
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That would make me SO very happy! 
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I feel they should restore hurricane to the way it was before the 3/31 patch. Melee AT's get plenty of options later on to counter almost every effect hurricane does. Melee AT's get a ranged attack or hold which counters the hurricanes small radius. Melee AT's in CoH get Focused Accuracy which easily counters the tohit debuff in hurricane. Hurricane shouldn't be able to permanently pin someone but it should atleast keep melee toons away. That was the definable power for the set that made them survivable in pvp and pve.
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silly goose....squishes are not suposed to survive in PvP.
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I feel they should restore hurricane to the way it was before the 3/31 patch. Melee AT's get plenty of options later on to counter almost every effect hurricane does. Melee AT's get a ranged attack or hold which counters the hurricanes small radius. Melee AT's in CoH get Focused Accuracy which easily counters the tohit debuff in hurricane. Hurricane shouldn't be able to permanently pin someone but it should atleast keep melee toons away. That was the definable power for the set that made them survivable in pvp and pve.
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silly goose....squishes are not suposed to survive in PvP.
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Thats too funny,and seems to be the intention of the devs. What sux is,I used to play tanks,then they got tinkered with,and then tinkered with again,and again. It got to the point where tanks werent fun anymore,so then I began playing a controller,thankfully I got that one up to 50 before he got screwed with too much,the acc check to hotfeet wasnt as bad as I thought it would be. I had so much fun with him that I thought I'd make a whole new controller and all of a sudden my power choice gets not one,but two nerfs at the same time! I'm afraid where this may lead to,cuz as it stands,I have a whole lot of trouble now in pvp zones,where as before I didnt have to worry about all the melee's,only the smart ones,but now instead of having to worry about dominators and corruptors and MM's the most I gotta worry about all this added melee agro too. Bad enough I had to worry about en brutes and stalkers,and invulns with a build up power,but now I gotta worry about everyone who I was able to protect my team from,why even team with me?
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Wow. That's an impressive statement. 
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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/em wonders when the devs are gonna realize that Force Bubble has the same "problem" that convinced em to zap Hurricane.
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and TK, talking about being pinned against a wall for 2 hours if the guy wants to do it to you
or other powers which are worse than getting pinned to a wall, how about powers like sonic cage and detention field that prevent a player from playing indefinitely as long as the cager wants to follow them around
this is where I lost faith in the devs. They seem to be oblivious to the facts that there are just as broken or more broken than certain powers, but let those others go unscathed until a wave of noobs complains about it. PvP will never be balanced in this game the way the devs are going with it.
it's only a matter of time before devs nerf enough viable but not overpowered builds that all you'll be seeing is ice/nrg blasters and their empath pets. oh wait, it's like that already. my bad.
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or other powers which are worse than getting pinned to a wall, how about powers like sonic cage and detention field that prevent a player from playing indefinitely as long as the cager wants to follow them around
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If Hurricane fell victim to the nerf bat, what makes you think SC and DF are safe? Or even FB and TK?
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or other powers which are worse than getting pinned to a wall, how about powers like sonic cage and detention field that prevent a player from playing indefinitely as long as the cager wants to follow them around
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If Hurricane fell victim to the nerf bat, what makes you think SC and DF are safe? Or even FB and TK?
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because you dont have 50 or so noobs saying z0mg nerf FB! I just bought this game yesterday and know nothing about this powerset but it beat me so nerf it!!!!
My two cents on it then and now.
I have a friend with an ill/storm controller and before the nerf/fix, there was no way for me to touch her with my 50 MA/SR scrapper.
After the patch we went to the arena for a friendly match. Hurricane for sure is NOTHING like it was before in the PvP game. Good thing she still has solid pvp skills, but I was able to defeat her 2 to 1. Which in my opinion or anyone elses is in no way a blow out, I think it forced her to have to use some more of her primary and other secondary powers and not rely totally on hurricane in order to survive against a melee toon. Which IMO is a good thing.
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I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Did I ever tell you you're my heeeeeeroooooo....
_Castle_: Thanks very, very much. This stormer appreciates it!
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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I hope very much to see this get "green lighted" and happen. I personally give a rat's [censored] about the PvP aspect of the game (yes, even as somsone with both CoV as well as CoH), and things like this that change something fundamental about a core power in a set I dearly love that remove FUN from it due to PvP concerns for PvE play just quite frankly piss me off.
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/em signed
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or other powers which are worse than getting pinned to a wall, how about powers like sonic cage and detention field that prevent a player from playing indefinitely as long as the cager wants to follow them around
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If Hurricane fell victim to the nerf bat, what makes you think SC and DF are safe? Or even FB and TK?
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because you dont have 50 or so noobs saying z0mg nerf FB! I just bought this game yesterday and know nothing about this powerset but it beat me so nerf it!!!!
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This is it EXACTLY! The Dev's do listen but not to the voice of reason. They listen to the masses of goofball non-pvpers who try their hand at PVP for a week then complain.
So sick of hearing how this scrapper or that scrapper couldn't hit through hurricane with little to no effort. I knew plenty of Broadsword, Katana, etc.. scrappers that could take my hurricane troller out in 10 seconds.
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Thank you, Castle. I can't imagine why QA would want to venture outside the mantra that was assured to us months ago: that powers that needed to be changed for PvP could adjust while remaining unchanged for PvE. It's nice to know someone still remembers.
Or was this an accident?
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I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Wow, excellent news.
Castle, thank you for continuing to listen to community concerns and making changes!
Another very happy stormer here
Zapping, 50 storm/elec
Rain King, 50 ice/storm
Ard, 50 NB/SR
The rest of my lineup
Justice, Freedom and Virtue Servers
www.repeat-offenders.net
Avatar by Altoholic_Monkey!
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If Hurricane fell victim to the nerf bat, what makes you think SC and DF are safe? Or even FB and TK?
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FB is safe cause you cant find it in Sirens Call. All casual PvP'rs only PvP in SC, and since their the majority of players who cry for nerfs in PvP, you wont find any of them complaining about Force Bubble.
-- Currently Playing --
Dexter Labrynth (SS/FA Brute)
Former member of Tribute and Victory Reborn
Thank the Hero Gods!!!!
Herd-canning was a difficult skill to master and something that separated us from other defenders. I'd hate see us nerfed into conformity because one of our powers was slightly overpowered in PvP.
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My two cents on it then and now.
I have a friend with an ill/storm controller and before the nerf/fix, there was no way for me to touch her with my 50 MA/SR scrapper.
After the patch we went to the arena for a friendly match. Hurricane for sure is NOTHING like it was before in the PvP game. Good thing she still has solid pvp skills, but I was able to defeat her 2 to 1. Which in my opinion or anyone elses is in no way a blow out, I think it forced her to have to use some more of her primary and other secondary powers and not rely totally on hurricane in order to survive against a melee toon. Which IMO is a good thing.
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The exact same thing happened with me and my real life brother. His storm defender against my Invul tank, both level 50.
Score: 2 to 1.
He told me that stormies will now have to rely on more than 1 power to beat melee characters.
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or other powers which are worse than getting pinned to a wall, how about powers like sonic cage and detention field that prevent a player from playing indefinitely as long as the cager wants to follow them around
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If Hurricane fell victim to the nerf bat, what makes you think SC and DF are safe? Or even FB and TK?
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because you dont have 50 or so noobs saying z0mg nerf FB! I just bought this game yesterday and know nothing about this powerset but it beat me so nerf it!!!!
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i PMed cuppa about this a few days ago.
although my wording of the problem was a bit different, the idea was the same.
the idea is that less experience players seem to be more inclined to complain about hurricane because 1) it's effective, 2) it's a debuff that they feel affect them (as opposed to a buff to an opponant which they can't directly feel) and 3) it's a showy power that calls attention to itself (like a bullseye, some would argue). because of these factors, i think hurricane may have gotten more attention than it deserved.
i think it'd do the game well if the devs were made aware of this phenomenon.
Excellent summation Stormbringer....Storm defenders and controllers MUST have great melee protection because they must be up close and personal for any of their powers to function.....They have NO ranged protection and with powers like Focused Accuracy, the debuff from Hurricane was negligible as it was......now, it is just flat out useless.
I hope Castle takes this into account and boosts the effectiveness of Hurricane to offset the nerf of to hit debuff enhancements...If Storms can't get in the thick of things, we are useless.
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Uh, just a question here.
Will the Endurance cost be the same when used in PvP as in PvE? And if so, will it be the original cost of the power, or the 1/4 cost that matches the slower PvP pulses?
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/em wonders when the devs are gonna realize that Force Bubble has the same "problem" that convinced em to zap Hurricane.
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I honestly felt the nerf to hurricane wasn't necessary. The worst parts about getting debuffed by hurricane was the nasty to-hit debuff and its -range. The -tohit was easily countered at the higher levels(FA, AIM, BU, etc). The -range was the only form of mitigation against ranged toons for the Storm summoning set. It made only since that storm should be able to keep melee out when they are so vulnerable to everything else.
I feel that the change to the repel ticker on hurricane wasnt necessary considering the small radius hurricane has. With the patch melee can easily run in and get their swings in before the repel kicks in. From what I've tested the -tohit and -range only affect the enemy when they get hit by the repel so alot of the times melee can get their hit in before the repel, -tohit and -range take affect. This defeats the purpose of what hurricane was meant to do for the set. My opinion is that the repel ticker should have been increased on force bubble not hurricane. Not because it's overpowered but because forcebubbles radius is so much larger. Melee literally had no chance of getting through force bubble and a decent chance with their ranged epic attacks.
I feel they should restore hurricane to the way it was before the 3/31 patch. Melee AT's get plenty of options later on to counter almost every effect hurricane does. Melee AT's get a ranged attack or hold which counters the hurricanes small radius. Melee AT's in CoH get Focused Accuracy which easily counters the tohit debuff in hurricane. Hurricane shouldn't be able to permanently pin someone but it should atleast keep melee toons away. That was the definable power for the set that made them survivable in pvp and pve.
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Nice post Mormon. You are absolutely correct that in the later stages of the game there are innumerous ways to get through the -to hit debuff of Hurricane...and this was before the 03/31 patch. In fact, in the 40+ game, I don't even use Hurricane for that anymore since everyone and their brother has FA, BU, AIM, etc. Quite honestly, this change to Hurricane is going to kill the Storm Summoning set.
We have to be able to get in the thick of battle...we have no self heal and do not have the ability to use debuffs from range. If anything, I think that Hurricane should INCREASE with level to offset the melee capability to pick-up accuracy enhancing powers like the ones I mentioned above.
An EM tank with FA drops your Hurricane toggle and you are as good as dead, and that EM tank with FA will hit you 9/10 with Hurricane on at the higher levels. Hurricane most definitely did not need a nerf, if anything it needed a scaleable boost as the stormer gains in level to make it still effective at the higher levels.
I hope this change that Castle proposes takes this into account. His comments were rather ambigious, so hard to say.....
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I hope Castle takes this into account and boosts the effectiveness of Hurricane to offset the nerf of to hit debuff enhancements...If Storms can't get in the thick of things, we are useless.
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The reduction in Tohit Debuff enhancements was not supposed to happen until I7 when the new formula for determining probability to hit is released. The old enhancement schedule made tohit debuffs ungodly with the new formula so they had to be toned down. The tohit debuff enhancers accidentally got changed too early.
In other words, the debuff effectiveness gets a buff in I7.
A substantial buff based on the numbers _Castle_ released earlier.
M'Teru couldn't get the job done. So she sent Mot to Astoria. Bad call.
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I haven't had time to get on test, but I was wondering what people are reporting about the changes to hurricane. Anyone have any stories?
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This is as good a place to put this, as any:
I checked in a few Hurricane changes today that QA is going to look at. In Theory, these changes should mean that for PvE, Hurricane acts Exactly as it did before the previous change, while in PvP, it should act exactly as it does currently. Hopefully this change will get a green light from QA -- I've spent quite a bit of time on it over the last few days.
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Castle, thanks for replying to my thread. This makes a lot of sense to me, assuming the devs feel that hurricane is over powered in pvp in more ways than just wall pinning, and not over powered in pve. I hope this sort of "functions one way in pvp, and one way in pve" will continue. I like this trend. I can think of one other recent change that needs this kind of love too, but i don't think this thread is the place for it.