City of Heroes: Live Forum Archive

Blood Widows suck

Arcanaville

By Arcanaville,
Posted on: 2006-02-02 18:55 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion

 

Posted

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I have dropped rain of fire on a night widow and watched not a single damage number pop-up over her head.

Considering how many ticks are in Rain of Fire, I would say that is pretty good statistical evidence.

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Yeah, if that's going on, something is messed up.

I've attacked groups of three of them (LT version) in St. Martial with my Stalker and haven't had something like this happen, but my Stalker also typically disables one or two opponents straight off, and they get no chance to use their ranged tactics. Plus, maybe the LTs aren't broken.

Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

Posted

Curious if anyone even saw what I posted earlier about acc slotted rain of fire missing...

Anyways. I tested this out right now.

I'm a level 39 Fire/Dark corruptor. I found a level 35 Lt. Night Widow to beat on.

I hit tar patch on her to keep her in the Rain of Fire as long as possible, I hit Rain and she consistantly dodged all exept 5 ticks on average. She dodged most all of Rain of Fire at -4 levels to me! Consistantly. And my rain is slotted for acc at about 130% acc if my calculations are right. Rain is also a pet that cannot be debuffed via smoke grenade, so that's not an issue.

I have a demorecord of this small little battle. I beleive they have *massive* def to AoEs like a Stalker does. I was able to hit her at -4 with single target attacks okay, but my AoEs would just whiff. This is not typical defense. This is not just a "hard to hit mob." This is not fair. A defense level that high combined with hide abilities is not a fair fight at all. And this is at -4! Without the aid of aim or buildup or a tray of insps, I cannot fathom fighting them at all.

_Castle_, I like the other Widows. I like the Night Widows too. Please look into this level of def.

--Suichiro

http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Massacre_Melanie -the original Fire/Dark Corruptor -
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=115217
The Guide to BURN

 

Posted

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Curious if anyone even saw what I posted earlier about acc slotted rain of fire missing...

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Yes.

I believe Concern had a similar experience. By "similar" I mean "identical."

[ QUOTE ]
Anyways. I tested this out right now.

I'm a level 39 Fire/Dark corruptor. I found a level 35 Lt. Night Widow to beat on.

I hit tar patch on her to keep her in the Rain of Fire as long as possible, I hit Rain and she consistantly dodged all exept 5 ticks on average. She dodged most all of Rain of Fire at -4 levels to me! Consistantly. And my rain is slotted for acc at about 130% acc if my calculations are right. Rain is also a pet that cannot be debuffed via smoke grenade, so that's not an issue.

I have a demorecord of this small little battle. I beleive they have *massive* def to AoEs like a Stalker does. I was able to hit her at -4 with single target attacks okay, but my AoEs would just whiff. This is not typical defense. This is not just a "hard to hit mob." This is not fair. A defense level that high combined with hide abilities is not a fair fight at all. And this is at -4! Without the aid of aim or buildup or a tray of insps, I cannot fathom fighting them at all.

_Castle_, I like the other Widows. I like the Night Widows too. Please look into this level of def.

--Suichiro

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Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

 

Posted

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Never had too much trouble with Blood Widows. Night Widows on the other hand... pretty sure it's Night Widows that pop smoke. Hate that.

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Echo that. Never had anything vaguely resembling a problem on lowest or highest difficulty setting. Is there some BW boss I'm missin?

 

Posted

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Never had too much trouble with Blood Widows. Night Widows on the other hand... pretty sure it's Night Widows that pop smoke. Hate that.

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Echo that. Never had anything vaguely resembling a problem on lowest or highest difficulty setting. Is there some BW boss I'm missin?

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To clarify the topic:

This happened the same day I posted, about 6-8 hours before the post. Later, I asked if anyone knew the name of the really tough Widow bosses, and someone told me it was "Blood Widows," so I went with that.

The thread is really about Night Widows, though.

Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

 

Posted

Night Widows have evasion, the SR's massive boost to AE defense...

Well I think that solves that :P

 

Posted

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Night Widows have evasion, the SR's massive boost to AE defense...

Well I think that solves that :P

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Solves which?

That the night widows have something like 400% defense or to-hit debuff going on?

Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

 

Posted

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Night Widows have evasion, the SR's massive boost to AE defense...

Well I think that solves that :P

[/ QUOTE ]

Solves which?

That the night widows have something like 400% defense or to-hit debuff going on?

Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

 

Posted

So you're telling me that 35% def to AoEs is making -4s dodge 30 some odd ticks of 130%acc ?

--Suichiro

http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Massacre_Melanie -the original Fire/Dark Corruptor -
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=115217
The Guide to BURN

 

Posted

I believe it's 45% aoe.

Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

 

Posted

In my experience a small insight lowers your accuracy about 50%

 

Posted

Also, I notice that some people are commenting on LTs. I personaly have not ran into any LTs as far as I know, or if I did, I didn't have any problems with them.

With the bosses however, I whiff with entire attack chains that include rain of fire. The bosses I know without a doubt have something wonky with their defense. Even SR scrappers in PvP and stalkers in PvP get hit by Rain of Fire.

 

Posted

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Also, I notice that some people are commenting on LTs. I personaly have not ran into any LTs as far as I know, or if I did, I didn't have any problems with them.

With the bosses however, I whiff with entire attack chains that include rain of fire. The bosses I know without a doubt have something wonky with their defense. Even SR scrappers in PvP and stalkers in PvP get hit by Rain of Fire.

[/ QUOTE ]

The LT versions are level 30+, or maybe level 35+. It's one of those transitions where a mob gets downgraded in rank and becomes a more common spawn. Like how Crey "agent" LTs become minions later on, and Lost Anethemas go from Bosses to LTs.

Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA

 

Posted

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I believe it's 45% aoe.

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I see it listed as 22.5% def to AoE, with 3 SOs being 35%. Regardless, we know something's wrong.

--Suichiro

http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Massacre_Melanie -the original Fire/Dark Corruptor -
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=115217
The Guide to BURN

 

Posted

And while we're on the subject of Widows suckage... let me touch on Smoke Grenade. Aside from the potentialy screwy debuff numbers, why is it that attacking doesn't reveal them? I know on the player side, attacking an enemy pretty much negates any stealth SG might be providing.

If you absolutley MUST keep them hidden, can you at least make them targettable (once they've attacked.) Nothing says "fun" like standing around getting beat on by enemies that aren't there.

 

Posted

However it's calculated, Night Widows probably just have +90% Defense and Smoke Grenade.

What's the big deal?

I take Night Widows down solo all the time with my Level 22 Psi/Mind Corruptor.

Granted, I usually faceplant about 3 times in the process.

Story Arcs I created:

Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!

Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!

Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!

 

Posted

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Night Widows are probably my favorite creations, with the possible exception of Jack in Irons. geko designed them, and I built their powers. (Jack was a big team effort, I just love the way he looks.)

The majority of their defense come from their Precognitive abilities. The Stealth doesn't add anymore than three slotted Stealth would for a player. The Smoke Grenade, on the other hand, is brutal if you are lower level than they are.

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Their smoke grenades are freaking overpowered no matter what level you are and need a serious nerf. They're not fun, they're frustrating.

"Timid men prefer the calm of despotism to the tempestuous sea of liberty."

"Nothing is unchangeable but the inherent and unalienable rights of man."

- Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

Heh, i like the new enemies... when i first saw a Night Widow disappear before my eyes while i was waiting to AS her with my Stalker i was like "Whoa!!! That's so awesome" watching her reappear a few seconds later to smack my team mates around was even funnier

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Posted

I ran into 2 night widows over the weekend, exemped down into Missions in Sirens Call one was even con one was +1.

I missed one attack versus each of them - this is with 2 accs in the attacks and the unenhanced buff from follow-up.

They didn't fire their grenades off onto me due to chained knockdown.

Is there a melee/ranged difference for them ?


@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617

 

Posted

They seem to act like SuperReflex Stalkers, in that they have a much higher evasion to certain sets than others. I don't know if there's a difference between melee and ranged for them, but I do know that I can hit them with single target ranged attacks pretty well. Once I start throwing AoEs at them, even Aim doesn't help Firebreath hit them at -4 to me. That's without being debuffed from Smoke Grenade.

--Suichiro

http://www.virtueverse.net/wiki/Massacre_Melanie -the original Fire/Dark Corruptor -
http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=115217
The Guide to BURN

 

Posted

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Night Widows are probably my favorite creations, with the possible exception of Jack in Irons. geko designed them, and I built their powers. (Jack was a big team effort, I just love the way he looks.)



[/ QUOTE ]

I saw the Jack In Irons fighting another big baddie and it was really cool. I have a screen shot as my wallpaper.

 

Posted

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So you're telling me that 35% def to AoEs is making -4s dodge 30 some odd ticks of 130%acc ?

--Suichiro

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As I recall it, the Defense first lowers from your to-hit chance, and therefore could potentially floor it. Then you get to add in Inspirations and Enhancements, but it may be too late if it's floored already.

And it's possible that, just as NPC Brawl does a ridiculously higher level of damage than PC Brawl, NPC Evasion is much stronger than PC evasion. Remember that their Unstoppable doesn't crash, that MoG is about 90% resists, etc. They didn't suffer the Global Defense Nerf, we did.

 

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Sample size is too small to draw such a conclusion. Short run statistics lie, once again:

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Sorry, I'm going to stick with my intuition here.

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Yeah, wouldn't want the FACTS to cloud your judgement...LOL

 

Posted

*cough*

Well, considering there is a decimal error in their AoE Defense (250% instead of 25%), I'm not surprised the Rain of Arrows missed a ton. I'll fix it today.

 

Posted

Error

Admitted

Fixed

Thanks.
Durn decimals get you everytime.


@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617