These are very exciting changes and I'm looking forward to seeing what their final form will be.
I don't think Scrappers are in any danger from this autobuff thing. Even if Tankers get buffed to be Scrapper damage range, the Tanker has to buff up to there while the Scrapper starts there. So that is some number -- 3? 5? 7? whatever -- that the Tanker is doing lesser damage. Therefore, the Scrapper will still have a bigger alpha strike and a better DPS over time (though as the fight duration increases, the Tanker DPS will approach asymptotically). For dealing damage, there will still be no reason to prefer a Tanker over a Scrapper.
The auto-Provoke melee thing is a great idea. I think, though, that the area will either have to be reasonably large to work for rooted Tankers. What I am wondering about is if you are fighting a spread out group of mobs with ranged weapons, you can only control aggro if you are mobile, or use Taunt (or the inherent Taunt in a Tanker ranged attack). But time you spend Taunting or attacking at range is time not spent doing melee attacks to maintain aggro. Perhaps what would work is to have Taunt not only cause the mob to attack the Tanker, but also to want to close to melee. Then, a rooted Tanker can use Taunt to collect mobs into the auto-Provoke area. Is this even a problem at higher levels? I know I have issues controlling groups spread out groups now, but maybe it solves itself later on (in a way that doesn't require Provoke at range)?
I do have one concern about auto-Provoke that I hope will be worked out in playtesting: if you are using an attack power instead of Provoke to get the same effect, it will affect the endurance use curve. Without either giving the auto-Provoke quite a long duration, or adjusting the End use on attacks, it could still be necessary to take Provoke in order to retain enough End to hold the mobs through a long combat.
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Tankers single target attacks do about as much as Scrappers do. The upside for Scrappers realy is the crits against bosses. But if the bonus from this change is larger then the 15% crit chance against a boss, then more then just boss killing will be a problem.
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Actually, the upside for scrappers isn't just crits--though that's nice. The upside is that they get way more AOE's that do damage. Consider the power sets:
Tankers:
Axe: 2
Energy: 1
Fire: 3
Ice: 1
Stone: 1
Super Strength: 1
War Mace: 2
Average: 1.57
Scrapper:
Broadsword: 3
Claws: 3
Dark Melee: 3
Katana: 3
Martial Arts: 1
Spines: 4
Average: 2.83
Right now, AOE damage is king in this game. In a typical permahastened 5 attack combo, the average scrapper can AOE 57% of the time. The average tanker can AOE 31% of the time, about half as often. Combine this with crits and higher base damage, and tanks don't come anywhere close to scrapper damage output.
You have to look at everything a scrapper can do, not just crits. AOE matters, Znail. In CoH as it currently stands, it matters more than any other factor.
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You are counting powers that are very poor for damage purpose like Dark Consumption and Souldrain, those have 2min and 3 min recharge times. Their total damage over time is less then even one Tanker pbae! Alot of the Scrapper AE attacks are also tiny melee cones. Here is a more complete list wich doesnt show nearly the same proportion.
Tankers got 24 AE powers, of those are 15 primarily for damage and 11 of those are PBAE.
Scrappers got 22 AE powers, of those are 16 primarily for damage and 9 of those are PBAE (I counted Throw Spines and Shockwave due to large cone here).
Tankers PBAE damage powers:
Burn
Blazing Aura
Icicles
Mudpots
Whirling Axe
Whirling Hands
Combustion
Fire Sword Circle
Tremor
Foot Stomp
Whirling Mace
Scrappers PBAE damage powers:
Dark Embrace
Whirling Sword
Whirling Sword -Katana (dont know new name offhand)
Spin
Shockwave (included due to large cone)
Spine Burst
Quills
Throw Spines (included due to large cone)
Dragon's Tail
Tankers Cone damage powers:
Pendelum
Breath of Fire
Frost
Crowd Controll
Scrappers Cone damage powers:
Slice
Slice -Katana
Headsplitter
Headsplitter -Katana
Eviscerate
Ripper
Shadow Maul
Tankers mostly utility AE powers.
Consume
Rise of the Phoenix
Chill Embrace
Energy Absorbation
Invincibility
Icepatch
Frozen Aura
Handclap
Fault
Scrappers mostly utility AE powers.
Dark Regeneration
Cloak of Fear
Opressive Gloom
Invincibility
Dark Comsumption
Soul Drain
I'm sorry maybe im just burned out on Tankers but while this sounds exciting I'm really going to have to see it in action to judge. As it stands I still want to see a SS powerset for scrappers. Why? Once the initial giddiness wears off I'm still going to have that sheild next to my name, and I'm still going to be a meatshield. But in all fairness when these new changes come down that pipeline ill dut Warbringer off and give him a run thru.
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2. As a Tanker lands more and more blows, he'll start doing more and more damage. The longer the fight, the more powerful the Tanker becomes. I can't say that the Tanker will do as much damage as a Scrapper - but it'll certainly be more than he does now. This ability really gets to the core of a comic book Tanker. He's extremely powerful - but at the start of a fight, he holds himself back some. As the battle progresses, he lets loose....I prefer this system to a power because this way it's inherent. It's simply the nature of the Archetype. And it also sets the Tanker apart from the Scrapper's criticals.
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So... sort of like the claw scrapper's Follow-Up power effect, but added to each attack, and stackable? This will make +ACC enhancements, if so, VERY VERY VERY popular with tanks.
By the way, tell that 45th claw scrapper fellow I said hello and thank you again for the save in Steel Canyon. 
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I think it'll be something long the lines of the BS/Katana Parry attacks. Parry has a short-term Def buff that can be stacked with itself if the next Parry lands quickly enough. Give our damage buff a little longer duration, and several quick blows can stack several damage buffs, but you sacrifice a potential rebuff by throwing a big slow attack (KO Blow, Haymaker, etc). Since the mechanic already has precident and exists in the game, this is how I foresee it going in.
Even if I'm WAY off on this, when we hit the 400% cap, hell yeah our damage is gonna be scraey... but not as scarey as a scrapper hitting their 400% cap.
For those folks worried about herding, and us edging out scrappers for that "role", who would you rather have? A scrapper that can whack 50 guys in less than 30 seconds, or a tanker than can whack 100 guys in two minutes? DPS/XP ADHD min/maxers will still go for the quicker kills rather than wait for a tanker to crank to full power.... which is fine by me. Herding is boring as hell.
Having stood in the face of more than a few AV's (being my SG's sole tanker means I get sidekicked against every freakin' AV under the sun), THANK YOU! Yes! Finally! I can start rolling on an AV, and as the fight goes on, turn into a veritable Engine of Destruction. Does this mean I'm gonna be soloing AVs? Good god, not if I can help it. Even with a tray full of heals AVs, even those that do just smash/lethal (rare, but there's one or two that do just that) still sneak alot through defences. Attrition is not your friend as a tanker. However, being in a team doesn't mean my sole task against a boss or AV is "stand there and shout Yo' Momma while the REAL ATs kill things". I can actually contribute, instead of locking down, setting Provoke to auto-spam, and going AFK till the fight is over! w00t!
... I said w00t. I swore I would never say that again after EQ. I feel dirty.
Now... all we have to do to REALLY fix the game is get those damn FF defenders to heal. What's up with that anyhow?
(I was joking GL! JOKE! Not the face! NOT THE FACE!)
Are you planning to add the taunt/provoke effect to power pool attacks? It only seems fair, since scrappers have criticals added to theirs.
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This concept goes against the tankers schtick - which is to land a few big blows. This will really favor the tanker who foregoes tradition and piles on lots of small attacks which will invariably come from the power pools.
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I think this problem would be simply avoided by making only Tanker powers (and not pools) build up damage buff. I actually assumed that would be the case, since my understanding is that only Tanker attacks and not pools or brawling has the Tanker inherent taunt.
Something more to think about, and I don't think it has been mention. This is concerning the "More hits = bigger hits" part of the proposed solution.
I am going to talk about upcoming PvP here, so it may or may not apply to standard PvE, and I realize that PvP may be a totally different animal, but this is all the info I have, so I will go on this. With the proposed solution, the tanker in a PvP format is not much, if any, greater threat than they are currently. Any good defence (bubbles, SR scrapper, Phase Shift, ACC Debuff) would effectively negate the increasing damage from a tanker. ie The tanker would not hit often enough to make a signifigant increase in damage, and thus remain a non-threat. This prevents the tanker from taking advantage of his "inate" abilities. I am also pretty sure that the AoE provoke on a melee hit will not be the same, if it even exists in PvP. So there we have 2 of our new "inate" abilities, that may as well not even exist. The same cannot be said for Scrapper crits. It doesn't matter how often they hit, they keep the same percentage of getting a crit, and thus massivly increasing their damage one time.
This is why I would have still prefered a system that allowed the tanker to have slow, but massive damage (bigger than any other AT on average). And have the aggro system base it decisions on who puts the biggest numbers up over the heads of the villians. It would be harder to balance with scrappers and blasters, but I think it could be done. And, if done to the extent that a superior or extreme damage single target attack from a tanker could one-shot a blaster/controller/defender in PvP, then the tanker would naturally draw the attention first, as is their job.
Just something to ponder, while we all make wild guess at exactly how the current proposal will take shape.
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Tankers single target attacks do about as much as Scrappers do.
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Golly, nearly fell off my chair laughing at that. You DO know that generally, all secondaries are capped at 75% effectiveness of the same primary, right? And that tankers generally slot primary damage-mitigating powers, while scrappers tend to slot primary damage-dealing powers?
Man, I've met biased people trying to defend their over-powered class (relative to another) by pulling fictitious statements and facts out of their a**, but you, sir, take the cake.
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I am also aware that Scrapper primaries and Tanker secondaries does not share even a single set. The ones Tanker got is slow and harder hitting relative to Scrappers. This is why the actual single target damage per hit is nearly the same. I think you should do some comparison before you draw hasty conclusions. Maybe take a look at the most damaging melee attack in the game, Energy Transfer.
As for slotting, at higher levels Scrappers will most of the time have more slots in defence as they need more to get less.
Maybe you should consider thinking more and being rude less?
Good direction, Statesman. This kind of thing could convince me to bring my Tank out of retirement.
It could be a pain if the blasters have leveled everything in 5 seconds, but ... at least it's a plan for improving damage while making Tanks distinctive.
Thanks for listening.
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But time you spend Taunting or attacking at range is time not spent doing melee attacks to maintain aggro.
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But doesn't Taunt maintain aggro? 
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2. The Tanker's defense stats can be matched by a properly slotted Scrapper - but the Tanker can not approach the Scrapper in damage.
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With the exception of a few particular Tanker secondaries, which I agree are "broken", this is not an accurate statement.
Can a Scrapper have the same defenses as a Tanker? Not unless there are hackers out there upping Scrapper abilities. The CLOSEST they can come is a SPECIFICALLY BUILT Invulnerable Scrapper, but even then they don't have the hit points, and must invest more enhancement slots in their defenses, and thus they must sacrifice offenive and other powers.
But to say a Tanker cannot approach the damage of a Scrapper is an utter falsehood as well. A Fire secondary Tanker, for example, does more single-target and AoE damage than a Spines Scrapper. Yeah, their powers take more endurace, but that changes with issue 2. Their powers take longer to recharge, but that is moot with Hasten.
Again, in both cases, SPECIFIC examples, properly built, are required to show the exceptions, but in fairness, only pointing out one side while ignoring the other is just dishonest.
If, as planned, a Fire Tanker's damage will increase even further with every attack, since they already do more damage than a Scrapper, how, then, are you going to keep them from doing more damage than a Scrapper when they've already got that?
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As promised, I've been looking into the issues facing Tankers; I thought I'd explain the direction we're going. As we analyed it, Tankers have three very valid concerns (aside from the issues with specific power sets):
1. Without Provoke, they are not a real Tanker. Those people who enjoy the MMP role of "meat shield" have trouble holding aggro properly.
2. The Tanker's defense stats can be matched by a properly slotted Scrapper - but the Tanker can not approach the Scrapper in damage.
3. The Tanker doesn't "feel" like a comic book Tanker should. And frankly, this one really, really bothered me. Because our game is a comic book MMP.
So - here's the solution we're going to try internally. We went through a ton of possible solutions, and we weighed each one against how well they answered the three points above as well as how long it would take to get done.
1. Tankers will get a "provoke" like AOE effect on their melee attacks. The more a Tanker lands his blows, the more and more mobs he'll attract. The bonus here is that it's not exactly like Provoke (it's not ranged) - but it makes a lot of sense. Some huge monstrosity is bashing the heads of a villain group - they're going to get more and more concerned about taking him/her out....
2. As a Tanker lands more and more blows, he'll start doing more and more damage. The longer the fight, the more powerful the Tanker becomes. I can't say that the Tanker will do as much damage as a Scrapper - but it'll certainly be more than he does now. This ability really gets to the core of a comic book Tanker. He's extremely powerful - but at the start of a fight, he holds himself back some. As the battle progresses, he lets loose....I prefer this system to a power because this way it's inherent. It's simply the nature of the Archetype. And it also sets the Tanker apart from the Scrapper's criticals.
Of course, the thought in your minds must be....WHEN?...I'm afraid I don't know. First, we need some code for this. Then we've got to test it thoroughly. Finally, it'll go on the Test Server for awhile to gather data and impressions. This is going to take some time; but I thought you'd like to know at least where we're going, even though we don't know when we'll get there.
Feel free to comment!
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This is just great 
Of course the AoE hitting taunts will increase with lvl, so I dont think we should be worried about Vazils and the rest (all heroes have it hard at the beginning anyway).
Put it on test server as soon as possible states, there are hundreds willing to test it!
Muchas gracias from a happy customer!
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With the exception of a few particular Tanker secondaries, which I agree are "broken", this is not an accurate statement.
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Hummm no? In game, I see Scrappers with enough defense to tank +2/3, while tankers most of the time can't even kill white con mobs.
Yeah, I know, Burn tankers. But like you said, specific build. You take any scrapper secondary (except DA, which is about to change anyway), put a dozen slots and you have your tanker. Tankers have more secondary options... so the random chance that a player picked one, hummm... inferior secondary is greater.
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But time you spend Taunting or attacking at range is time not spent doing melee attacks to maintain aggro.
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But doesn't Taunt maintain aggro?
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Taunting someone "over there" doesn't maintain aggro on someone standing "over here." To maintain aggro on the guy standing next to you so that he doesn't run over and attack the Blaster shooting him from across the room, you have to be Taunting him, hitting him, or Provoking him. If the guy standing next to you and the guy "over there" are covered by a Provoke AE, then you only need to do 1 Provoke to maintain aggro on both of them. Having to use Taunt for the guy "over there" and an attack for the guy "over here" means you have to choose between the two. On the plus side, with a melee Provoke, you won't have to choose which of the melee guys you need to hang onto, and hitting any of them will do. So, it is still an improvement. I am just not sure how much of one, considering how rare it is that I am able to get mobs with ranged attacks into a tight clump around me if they didn't start out that way.
Wow. I may actually start playing my tankers again. This would be real cool since that, in comic book form, is my favorite AT.
May I just say that, as a scrapper, I am very glad of the change. Hopefully this will bring tankers up to the point where they are both wanted and needed again. Hopefully this will make them as useful as scrappers, in general, even though their defenses are still a bit better, and their offense will still be a bit worse.
This seems like an excellent change to me. Thanks Statesman.
Infinity:
Ellen, 50 MA/Inv Scr
February Night, 14 Ice/Ice Blstr
Guardian:
SilverSwordmaid, 29 Kat/Rgn Scr
Vicious Killer, 33 Emp/Enrgy Def
Electromagness, 40 Rad/Rad Def
Sense of Humor, 50 Fire/En Tank
Virtue:
Kickfest, 50 MA/SR Scr
Freedom:
Glorious Ending, 29 EM/DA Bru
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3. The Tanker doesn't "feel" like a comic book Tanker should. And frankly, this one really, really bothered me. Because our game is a comic book MMP.
Feel free to comment!
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statesman logic for the REASON to improve Tankers fails. The longer someone fights the more damage they do? That's very anti-comic book (and I've been a collector for over 30 years). A single BURST of offensive power just before the hero gives out is comic book. But that's already built in to most every AT (albeit after we die, so again, not comic book like so fix the 9th power not the AT).
How would I have fixed it? Tanker is down to his last boss whom he just can't coup de grace. Let him toggle a final (pre-death) power than does massive damage but leaves him disoreinted and drains all endurance for X amount of time. That's classic comic book. If he toggles too early in the fight, he's dead. But then the 5 minute (seems like an hour) battle with bosses is eliminated. That's the comic book feel (of course in the comic books the hero usually toggles at the right time, exceptions of Supergirl and Karate Kid come to mind)
CoH exists because there's a little hero in all of us.
Ridolfo 50 DM DA.
& far too many alts
Throw Spines and Shockwave are both Cones.
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Hummm no? In game, I see Scrappers with enough defense to tank +2/3, while tankers most of the time can't even kill white con mobs.
Yeah, I know, Burn tankers. But like you said, specific build. You take any scrapper secondary (except DA, which is about to change anyway), put a dozen slots and you have your tanker. Tankers have more secondary options... so the random chance that a player picked one, hummm... inferior secondary is greater.
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Can't kill an even con? Let's return to reality here, and quit with the pathetic exaggerations.
As Statesman has been pointing out time and again, the post-30 game is too easy. Tankers have, IN FACT, not in opinion, better defenses than a Scrapper. The problem is because, as I and Statesman have said, the post-30 game being too easy, foes don't do enough damage to make the difference in defense matter. Post-30 foes can't overcome Scrapper secondaries, so who cares if the Tanker primaries are better?
Like I said, one SPECIFICALLY BUILT Scrapper secondary can APPROACH Tanker defenses, but NOT equal it. That is a fact, whether you like it or not.
But, then, like I also said, you can build a Tanker with better offensive capabilities than many (most when you take into account the uberness of AoEs) Scrappers, and that is WITHOUT Burn.
Again, on both sides we are talking about SPECIFICALLY built heros to make these exceptions, and in BOTH cases, they are indeed exceptions, NOT the rule.
The #1 reason why Tanks are not what they should be (other than some powersets being broken) is because the late game does not allow the strengths of a Tanker to be useful. That will soon change, though (both the broken powersets and the ease of the late game).
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Like I said, one SPECIFICALLY BUILT Scrapper secondary can APPROACH Tanker defenses, but NOT equal it. That is a fact, whether you like it or not.
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3 out of 4 Scrapper secondaries can supercede Tanker Secondaries.
Tanker Invul > Scrapper Invul/Regen/DA > Tanker Ice And Stone > Fire
That's the way it works.
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But, then, like I also said, you can build a Tanker with better offensive capabilities than many (most when you take into account the uberness of AoEs) Scrappers, and that is WITHOUT Burn.
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Uhh no. Show me a Tanker without Burn who is better than a non-gimped Scrapper. I've played both AT's more than you have and I can say that this is utter crap.
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The #1 reason why Tanks are not what they should be (other than some powersets being broken) is because the late game does not allow the strengths of a Tanker to be useful. That will soon change, though (both the broken powersets and the ease of the late game).
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No ... no it won't. I don't care what changes they do my Regen Scrapper will always be more desirable in a group then my Tank. There is no way around this. It's an unfortunate truth.
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Throw Spines and Shockwave are both Cones.
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I am aware of that. If you reread my post you see that I included them due to that they got such a large area. Anyway, why are you complaining about something that makes Scrappers look better? I did this to avoid arguments about them, but I guess its hard to please everyone.
Nope just wanted to correct you. Don't care about your arguement.
Number of AoE's are unimportant to me. Quality of AoE's are important to me.
For example I don't see why you even bothered listing 'Utility AoEs'
They do not improve kill rate and they don't help offense. They can 'help' defense but you and I both know Offense is King in this game. Anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding himself.
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3 out of 4 Scrapper secondaries can supercede Tanker Secondaries.
Tanker Invul > Scrapper Invul/Regen/DA > Tanker Ice And Stone > Fire
That's the way it works.
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Um, no. I am DM DA scrapper and I have NO DEFENSES from DA except toward a specifc type of damage at any given time. So ANY TANKER has better defense than DA scrappers because at higher levels nearly all mobs do more than 1 type of damage. IF mobs only did psychic damage, or only did smashing damage, etc. then your statement (about DA anyway) would be closer to the truth.
CoH exists because there's a little hero in all of us.
Ridolfo 50 DM DA.
& far too many alts
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As promised, I've been looking into the issues facing Tankers; I thought I'd explain the direction we're going. As we analyed it, Tankers have three very valid concerns (aside from the issues with specific power sets):
1. Without Provoke, they are not a real Tanker. Those people who enjoy the MMP role of "meat shield" have trouble holding aggro properly.
2. The Tanker's defense stats can be matched by a properly slotted Scrapper - but the Tanker can not approach the Scrapper in damage.
3. The Tanker doesn't "feel" like a comic book Tanker should. And frankly, this one really, really bothered me. Because our game is a comic book MMP.
So - here's the solution we're going to try internally. We went through a ton of possible solutions, and we weighed each one against how well they answered the three points above as well as how long it would take to get done.
1. Tankers will get a "provoke" like AOE effect on their melee attacks. The more a Tanker lands his blows, the more and more mobs he'll attract. The bonus here is that it's not exactly like Provoke (it's not ranged) - but it makes a lot of sense. Some huge monstrosity is bashing the heads of a villain group - they're going to get more and more concerned about taking him/her out....
2. As a Tanker lands more and more blows, he'll start doing more and more damage. The longer the fight, the more powerful the Tanker becomes. I can't say that the Tanker will do as much damage as a Scrapper - but it'll certainly be more than he does now. This ability really gets to the core of a comic book Tanker. He's extremely powerful - but at the start of a fight, he holds himself back some. As the battle progresses, he lets loose....I prefer this system to a power because this way it's inherent. It's simply the nature of the Archetype. And it also sets the Tanker apart from the Scrapper's criticals.
Of course, the thought in your minds must be....WHEN?...I'm afraid I don't know. First, we need some code for this. Then we've got to test it thoroughly. Finally, it'll go on the Test Server for awhile to gather data and impressions. This is going to take some time; but I thought you'd like to know at least where we're going, even though we don't know when we'll get there.
Feel free to comment!
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Statesman, could I buy you a case of beer????? NO A KEG, screw it, just take my 2000 Transam with the vette engine,
I love you man.
View the story of W.A.R.F.A.C.E. and Septimus Bane here: http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6785073/1/Meus_Profiteor#
my email chrismfears99@yahoo.com
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That change will not do much good in a group setting at higher levels. The combats don't last all that long.
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That will also be changing soon.
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I've got to say that these repeated hints at increasing teh difficulty of leveling vs. higher level MOBs makes me rather nervous. I'm a solo tanker who doesn't have a great deal of AoE powers. Most of my leveling is street sweeping, and right now its taking me roughly 45 minutes to earn a bubble (1/10th of a level). I find it most efficent to level off of L+2 and L+3 minions and Lts. (i.e. reds and low purples). If these changes Stateman is hinting at ends up reducing my leveling speed, I'm outta here.
Whatever changes that come along need should focus on AoE, and not hurt those of us who level more slowly.