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Posts
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I think I heard somewhere that more -res actually increases the effect of -dam. Or maybe it was vice versa. Is anything like that true?
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Quote:Kind of an annoying argument, to be honest...even if it does have some semblance of truth.You can also solo a wet noodle if you are masochistic enough. There has been a vocal group here that has been discussing this matter for years.
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They basically played fairly similarly to human form. You *can* solo them, it is not fun.
"I soloed fine with mine."
--"Of course it's *possible*, but you must've HATED it!"
"...um, no, it went fairly normally..." -
Quote:Slot hungry isn't the same as power-choice hungry. Khelds are slot hungry, yes, but not really power-choice hungry.Note that taking Stealth is kind of silly. You got a stealth power already in your secondary. And they don't stack. Since a tri-form is very slot hungry, do you really want two powers that your slotting Luck of the Gamblers in?
Stealth Pool has Stealth, Grant Invis, and Invis which all can hold LotG's - that's where it's use lies, in using a single pool to hold 3 of those uniques - all using only the first slot. That leaves slots for more important powers. -
Farming warshades kill your cat when you were a kid or something? Everyone knows that fire/kin and ele/shield are going to be far better, but an IO'd 'shade can do a decent job. What's wrong with having a thread where people that do happen to have shades can see it and say, "Hm, I've never even given this a try! I thought only the fotm builds could farm."?
To quote Crick:
Quote:If you`re looking to solo-farm, warshade is just a bad choise. You can do it, but you`lll never feel like 100% because you need to a) tank for the pets b) watch the scatter c) watch for mez. If you`re going to farm in a team, it doesn`t really make any difference what AT you are, consider warshade as more DPS, even though more self reliant than most.. It will not give you that much control considering that the stun aura only affects minions and the rest of your control is either 1) situational like Unchain 2) Knockbacky like Gravimetric Emination 3) Single target like Gravity Well, and Dwarf is that bit slow to defeat mobs when considering farming in its purest form.
I have had much fun farming with my warshade, it is just not where my triform shines.
Eclipse is plenty of protection. You don't have to worry about mez because when farming, you pick the type of enemies you fight -> don't pick ones with mez. You automatically tank for your pets when you're the first in the spawn and doing the most damage. Scatter isn't bad if you fire from above. Nova's AoE does great damage when buffed with the Mire - you can Mire, finish a spawn, then start work on the next one before it wears off.
Go Human/Nova even, and the people who love their second "nuke" aka Unchain can also slot that.
But basically, I balk when claims are made that human-only is better for farming. Nova's AoE >>> Human's AoE. -
The build you're planning for doesn't have Grav. Emanation...my usual knee-jerk reaction is to scream and shout until someone understands just how trivial that power makes soloing. It's permable even without any IO bonuses...with some amount of +recharge, it's extremely easy to perma. Stupefy's a nice set anyway, and the purple stun set is fairly cheap. But if you don't want a perma mag 3 AoE stun and understand what the potential for it is, go ahead.
But anyway...
As was said, Eclipse first. Not sure how your Acc for it is - shouldn't be too bad, but your mentioned build uses only IO bonuses and Tactics to help its Acc, and you don't have Tactics yet.
Grav Em first as well, if you feel like it. If the Acc in it is good, you can face the alpha after you've capped your resistance with Eclipse.
Why no Quasar? It'll clear a spawn (or get really close) after you Mire, and all you have to do is pop a blue + Stygian to return.
Meh, don't have much more to say...when I was leveling mine, all I had to do was Grav Em once then go into Nova, and that pretty much took care of a spawn. You've got to deal with surviving for longer since you don't have that amount of damage available.
*Oh, and Khelds (Warshades in particular) play radically different than any other AT, especially the more static melee AT's like scrappers. And it takes a bit to learn to reign in on them - my tactics and strategies seemed to change with every new power I got. So don't take Debt's comment too badly. -
Quote:*I've never used Essence Drain. Fully enhanced, I think it's still only a 20% heal. Not that handy, IMO. Just kill a couple minions and use Stygian to fill up.Hi everyone
Im working on a build for the Tri-Form Warshade I am leveling (just hit lvl 22!) and had some questions which I was hoping those with more experience with Warshades could answer:
* Is Essence Drain worth it. I got it at 18 as at that point I had no heal what-so-ever so thought it would be useful. But now I have my Dwarf and Stygian Circle will is it worth dropping because I have found dropping to human to use it not very effective.
* How much endurance reduction is worth slotting in the Nova and Dwarf forms?
* Is it worth slotting the Gaussian's Build Up proc in Nova, and if so what lvl is it worth it slotting it?
* I am going to take the Leadership pool so I can slot two LotG: +recharge and a Rectified Recticle: +Perception. Plus Vengence is always useful. Is this a good idea?
Thanks in advance!
*Nova and Dwarf forms can take both End Redux and End Mod. If you find yourself struggling for endurance in them, first look at the form attacks - lowering endurance in those will help the most. Next, you can add both End Redux and Mod into the forms. I wouldn't go for a large amount though, considering Stygian again. +recovery from IO's helps quite a bit, if you go for an IO build later on.
*Gaussian's will have a chance to proc every 10 seconds you are in Nova form. It's a 5% chance...so it'll basically happen fairly randomly, and leave you with a nice buff lasting only 5.25 seconds. Meh, I'd slot other powers, and look into it only when you're fine everywhere else and have a slot to spare. You'll get very slot hungry on a tri-form, until slots flow in when you hit the 40's.
*Recharge is always good on a 'shade. So LotG's is nice in whatever shape they come in. That said, the 40's was a time of picking random powers that don't require slots for my WS, so I devote those slots elsewhere. I even have Hurdle and Swift but no Health or Stamina. So sure, leadership pool sounds good. I think I have it on mine, for the same purpose. Just never got around to getting the LotG's. -
*Points to the guides at the top of the kheld subforum. They might be old, but they'll answer your general questions.
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Here are some posts in this Kheld subforum within a couple pages that contain some builds and ideas.
One
Two
Three
Four
Five
Six
Seven
Eight
All those were on the first 3 pages here in the kheld subforum. That about does it for potential builds. Some of those will be IO builds, but a few should be leveling builds.
As for guides and strategy, some of those threads have quite a bit. Also look at the guides posted at the top of the forum - they're old, but still very valuable and applicable. -
Quote:I'd also like to ask how your Eclipse is slotted. And whether or not you have Grav Em/Grav Well, and whether/how you use Stygian Circle.You are assuming that the reason I can't tell the difference is that I survive. The opposite is true. With eclipse, if I jump into a spawn blindly, I die. Without it, if I jump into a spawn blindly, I die. Again, no difference.
What is your usual way to go about a group of enemies? I do want to know, because the above statement just boggles me. -
Quote:Well, you were one of the best MM's I'd gone up against, so take that for what it's worth.*cough*
My zombies would like a word with you.(Though I have no idea how that would work now, pretty sure our "for fun" runs were pre-I13. Sheesh, been that long... must be, you weren't purpled before.)
Have to agree you'll mostly be using Nova. Dwarf's nice in the bit of mez protection (and buffing) - but if you have to get away, thanks to what PVP travel suppression does to TP, you won't be getting away. (Then again - mez protection post-I13... yeah.)
Did have a WS vs WS match with a friend of mine, though. Me, triform, him, human-only. Stay at range, he couldn't touch me. Drop to human (both shadow cloaked, etc.) and it was a question of whose stun took hold first. It was an... odd fight, with very little recharging being done. -
Quote:Capped Resistance.Everyone says eclipse is "godlike" and "ZOMGawesomesause!!!111!"
Honestly, I can't tell the difference when it is working and when it isn't. If I hit three or 8 or none. Can't tell a dang thing is different.
Mire, I can see bigger numbers. Not big enough that it reduces the number of attacks to kill a minion, but I can see bigger numbers.
Eclipse? Nothing. I don't run out of endurance all that fast without it, so with it I don't see how I'm supposed to tell. Damage coming in is only an issue with spikes and spikes hurt even with capped regeneration. So overall, the power is just "meh" to me.
Eclipse lets me run up to an AV spawn (with no shields, no super speed, no stealth), jump in, activate one power and then survive without coming close to dying.
If you can't tell a difference between either 0% resistance or ~30% resistance (depending on if you have shields) to most types and a whopping 85% resistance to all types, then I'd say that you can probably up your difficulty. Mind you, I rarely use Eclipse solo (perma Grav Em means that there's really not any incoming damage), but it lets me run off during an ITF and solo some rooftops. Or as I mentioned earlier, freak people out by running ahead of the tank and jumping into AV spawns. -
Nova form does really well in zone PvP. It's IMO the best and only option. That being said, Warshades don't really have much to enhance Nova form with.
The human Buff powers are only situational in the Zones - they need bodies to hit. You can basically only find big lower level spawns to Eclipse off of in Warburg, so you have to find players quickly. If you do while the buff is up - well let's say I don't think I've ever been killed with capped resistance while protecting myself with the dual cannons of Nova Bolt and Blast. Without it, you've got to be able to use the fast flight to your advantage. And even then, messing with actual pvp toons is not going to get you many kills at all.
Dwarf is okay, the slowness is debilitating, however. Attacks themselves aren't that bad.
(The above coming from a purpled shade's experience. PvPing was a LOT easier for him before the last change, where I could quickly Grav Em a MM's pets or throw out a quick animating hold that also does some nice damage. MM's have always been the easiest, thanks to the TP Foe power we get, plus Grav Em and buffs from enemies. Stalkers and Squishies in general were easier before, so long as you got the jump on the stalk.)
Now for a PB, who can actually enhance Nova with self +buff like Build Up and +HP powers, and with a self poppable tier nine, they do a lot better. -
Quote:Super Speed + Shadow Cloak + one of the prestige sprints turns your toon bright glowing blue while running, it's looks pretty sweet imo. And fairly unique, haven't ever seen another toon glow like it.OK, time to port this change to WS's Shadow Cloak.
That and letting us have any level of customization.
...fyi. -
The -dmg from Darkest Night should still be fairly high even on AV's, unless I'm mistaken. I've always heard that Kin's should keep Siphon Power - if only to use on AV's, for that purpose.
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If you're using Divine Avalanche, it will cap you to Melee by itself. Also Lethal, so building towards both Smashing/Lethal (as they're bonuses usually come together) would still be only half as effective.
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Um, you do use the pets, right? If not, that would be #1 - they are the most damaging pets blueside, and will do their work in whatever form you're in, and even if you're dead.
Quasar is grand fun. Human Mire -> Dwarf Mire -> Quasar -> blue -> Stygian and you're back, with buff time to spare from human mire to go into Nova to mop up any mobs missed.
Gravitic Emanation might help. It can be perma'd easily (just use some triple IO's and 5/6 slot it), so you can run up to a group, stun them all...and then switch to Nova to blast in safety. When stun is about to wear off, back to human to use it again. Yeah, I suppose that really doesn't help much, considering you'll be back to Nova in no time. :P
Gravity Well, Inky, and Emanation go together well when you're up against the really tough/annoying bosses/mobs. Up against, say, Vanguard, who's nasty debuffs will easily rip a Dwarf apart? (Well, the bosses at least) Grav Em, run in with Inky, then start layering holds with Well (will need some Rech and Hold enhancement for that though). It also does nice ST damage to boot. -
...Why?
Gravitic Emanation is a mag 3 AoE stun made perma with simple Acc/Rech/Stun IO's. (Well, 4 Acc/Stun/Rech, a Stun, and a Rech. But still. A permable mag 3 AoE before you factor in any set bonuses is better than any controller has.)
Essence Drain is a 20% heal at best. -
Not that I know of...later on, if you still need help with endurance while in forms, make sure to split slotting between end mod and redux - that might be best.
If you ever get IO sets and have some +recovery lying around from bonuses and some end redux in the form powers, slotting the forms themselves for end mod or redux isn't that important. (More important on Dwarf than Nova, IMO). I've got a single Fly/End Redux IO in Nova, but that's on my 'shade, where end problems are cured by Stygian. Dwarf still has some Res and End Redux, if I remember right. -
Quote:Do Void's actually give you trouble when you have capped resists and can mez them, or was that a joke at the end?Pretty much do the same, but as pure dwarf, same tactic as yours but switching to dwarf and have 30 seconds of spamming dwarf mire etc. Stygian/unchained/extraction when availible.
Capped res, tons of mez, who needs a tanker when your invincible...ruh roh a Void Hunter...I'm dead. Hit Stygian return and flee...
Rince and repeat. -
*Walks in talking about how awesome Drain Psyche is on his Dom, and how he doesn't need Stamina.*
*Gets clubbed in the head, and then dragged off into some lower dungeon.* -
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Quote:Yep, until the buff wears out - which is 30 seconds for the human mire.So, if you have Orbiting up and then you use Mire, the next few "ticks" of Orbiting damage will be increased?
Oh, for SOs, I'd go Acc/Acc/Rech/Rech...maybe replace an Acc with a Dam, but I like to reliably hit things moreso than damage on a buff power. With IO's, there's more options of course. Acc/Rech, Acc/Dam/Rech, Acc/Dam, Dam/Rech - some kind of mix of those. Maybe 2 Acc/Rech, Acc/Dam/Rech and a Dam?
I have three-slotted Hasten and ~88% global recharge, and I have a few seconds of leeway. (With Eclipse slotted 2 Acc/Rech and 2 Res/Rech) So yes, it's possible. Easy depends on how much inf you are willing to spend. 88% isn't a whole lot, relatively speaking.
I use that on a lot of my toons since I enjoy Hasten most the time anyway. Other "Stealth" powers don't stack, but Super Speed will with one. I think a stealth IO will also stack with Stealth or Super Speed as well to give full invis.
Quote:I'm just unsure which ones are up to date.
What date did they buff the Khelds?
I checked out the 12th page of posts, and found a post discussing the change to the WS Dwarf Mire and how to better slot it. So there's plenty of info that is up to date, since that was part of the improvements.
It was awhile back. I can't remember the date, but the buffs to khelds mainly involved:
1) Khelds now get the inherent bonuses even while in forms.
2) Dwarf form can be activated like a break-free. aka, if you are mezed, you can go into Dwarf regardless.
3) Warshade Dwarf Mire was changed to shorter recharge, shorter duration and more damage(?) - works kind of like an AoE Follow-up, which is pretty nice. Can't do double miring + Nova as well because of the shorter duration, but can still do double mire + Nuke.
4) Can't remember if damage was increased for some powers...maybe someone else can chime in if they remember any more important changes or the specific patch notes. -
Yes, Orbiting is a toggle that will stay on, so long as you do not switch out of human. And yes, it's damage will be buffed by either human or dwarf mire.
The old guides are still useful - not much as changed powers wise for quite a while. I'm not sure if the older guides talk about IO's though. If they do, then they're basically up to date. As for strategy/powers, go, I'll offer some tips if you want to go tri-form, lemme see if I can order them into coherent thoughts.
Damage:
Slot Nova's AoE's and Blast. The Bolt can be slotted once/if you have slots elsewhere. (I've never slotted the bolt on mine, and probably will only do so if I change to a more PvP-enabled build, or am going for specific set bonuses) Slot them like any normal ranged/AoE attack.
Dwarf's single attacks and Mire needs some slots - just enough to make them effective. When you get into the 40's and have a lot more slots, you can spend time getting them built up more. Mire when slotted well can crank out some damage.
Quasar - standard nuke. I enjoy it, just for the sake of double miring and then unloading it. (Human Mire (lasts 30 secs) -> Dwarf Mire (lasts 10? secs) -> immediately into Human to nuke)
Unchain Essence is there if you want it, you might need the slots to beef up the forms though. Some people like it even on Tri builds, but I still think firing the two AoE's in Nova will be more effective.
Shadow Blast isn't too bad for tagging stragglers if you happen to be in human at the moment.
Orbiting is not something I'd suggest for a tri-former. It's a standard PBAoE damage toggle, but does less damage than most, and will be toggled off as soon as you change forms.
Control/Buff/Debuff:
Gravitic Emanation is amazing. I'd recommend 5 or 6 slotting it quickly with dual or tri IO's. It can be perma'd if you use some Acc/Rech/Stun IO's. More on this with strategies.
Gravity Well - mag 3 hold and really nice damage (belongs in both categories, really). Slot it with mez first, then later add damage once you find yourself generally more safe as you play/get used to the 'shade again.
Human Mire, doesn't have to be extensively slotted, but you'll want it working well as mainly a buff power. Other words, focus on Acc/Recharge first, damage later.
Stygian Circle - can also be slotted minimally. I've always used 1 End Mod IO, I think. You can add another or a recharge if you prefer.
Starless Step - useful for taking on low level Q's and V's. And MM's in PvP. :P
Inky Aspect can also be used with a tri-form, just not so much as all-human. Minimal enhancement needed - Acc and Stun I guess. I've only used it a few times, but it's helped during those times.
Eclipse - take immediately. Mine's slottedd 2 Acc/Rech 2 Res/Rech, but you might need another slot or two without any IO bonuses. Use it, love it. It will cap your resistance and stay even when you switch forms. Resistance-capped Nova is sweet.
Dwarf heal needs slotting also - it is very end hungry. Acc/Heal/End I'd say at first, the damage is definitely secondary to the heal.
Others:
Dark Extraction is awesome. You'll want it fairly heavily slotted with Rech/Acc/Damage...those buggers are the most damaging pets available blueside, at least that's what I've always heard.
Hasten is really nice, since Eclipse, Mire, Pets, Quasar are all clicks on timers. And hasten's buff carries over to the forms to help the attack chains there. Also, Super Speed + Shadow Cloak = Stealth, which is nice for landing an Eclipse or just stealthing when needed. (Since we also get a free TP Ally power)
Strategy:
Hm...at 39, you'll have all of your tools available. Which is really nice, to say the least. Most of the guilds should have better strategy, and it will still be fine to use.
Emanation + Nova. Approach a spawn. Grav Emanation -> Nova. Can easily kill all or most before they're out of the stun.
Nova in general...try to attack spawn from air, directly above - at least when teaming. This will cause the KB to become KD, and help reduce scatter.
Eh...trying to think of other strategies, I thought I'd have more...just learn to be aware of what's available. Hard boss ahead? Grav Em + Inky until you can stack Gravity Wells to hold him. Or just use Dwarf. Or Nova, then when low on health use Stygian, while using the occasional KB as protection. Choices are up to you. Eclipse when needed/can, and you're basically indestructible. At least while it's up. :P
Stygian allows you to skip Stamina, which is nice. Use it after every fight, and you'll be full health/end for the next one.
If you need build help, there's several threads on the 1/2/3rd pages of this kheld section that have good tri-form builds, try checking those out and see what you think. -
This looks like an awesome combo for damage reduction/resistance. Sonic provides resistance, and Ice provides -recharge/slows, which effectively mean resistance (Bad guys attacking only 25% of the time = 75% resistance basically).
Neato. -
Quote:Well, there will be a BotZ nerf shortly. Ranged going down to 1.25, AoE going down to 1.875Wait.... There's been a BotZ nerf? That ruins like every toon's build I currently have.
Thanks Devs!
"Alien"
So much for my ranged defense capped, perma Eclipse tri-former build...