_Tundra_

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The other reason is I have been teaming regularly with more than 7 people and if they are all on I would like to get them all into the final mission if possible...

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Well, if we're pulling that sort of trick I might have to bring Late and Monkey...

I should be around tonight, so I'll certainly be planning to join you!

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im not sure i follow you on this comment, no tank can protect against a pbaoe of any type, its point blank, anything in that pointblank radius is going to get a hit check on them, taunting said av doesnt make a pbaoe any less pbaoeish.


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Actually they can, and it's one of the main advantages Taunt has over relying on Gauntlet and auras to hold aggro. If you can hold their aggro whilst staying out of range of their PBAoE attacks, the AV in question won't use it and will target you with their ranged attacks instead, making things much safer for anyone near the AV. Particularly good for those big Footstomp attacks from Shadowhunter and the like.

Stamina and DC do different things - it's well worth having both of them. Stamina makes it easier to have a bunch of toggles running conctantly, but DC will fill your blue bar right up when you need it most, which is invaluable.

Personally I've found Siphon Life to be extremely valuable. A self heal is really useful for SR and it helps to fill out the attack chain at low levels as well - it has a bad name because it doesn't help most secondaries much, but it's great for SR. I went the opposite way to many and didn't pick up Shadow Punch until very late, but I find it fleshes out single target DPS very nicely. End use is also helped by not having to use Shadow Maul as a single target attack all the time. Late is lvl45 at the moment and I'm happy with how this build is performing, but some of the slotting will probably change at some point. :

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Exported from Ver: 1.7.5.0 of the CoH_CoV Character Builder - (http://home.comcast.net/~SherkSilver/index.html)
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Name: The Late
Level: 50
Archetype: Scrapper
Primary: Dark Melee
Secondary: Super Reflexes
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01) --> Smite==> Acc(1) Acc(3) Dmg(5) Dmg(15) Dmg(17) EndRdx(46)
01) --> Focused Fighting==> DefBuf(1) DefBuf(3) DefBuf(7) EndRdx(7)
02) --> Shadow Maul==> Acc(2) Acc(5) Dmg(13) Dmg(15) Dmg(21) EndRdx(40)
04) --> Agile==> DefBuf(4) DefBuf(9) DefBuf(31)
06) --> Touch of Fear==> Acc(6) Acc(46)
08) --> Siphon Life==> Acc(8) Acc(9) Heal(13) Heal(17) Heal(25) EndRdx(39)
10) --> Hasten==> Rechg(10) Rechg(11) Rechg(11)
12) --> Practiced Brawler==> Rechg(12)
14) --> Super Speed==> EndRdx(14)
16) --> Focused Senses==> DefBuf(16) DefBuf(21) DefBuf(23) EndRdx(23)
18) --> Dark Consumption==> Acc(18) Rechg(19) Rechg(19) Rechg(25) EndMod(37) EndMod(37)
20) --> Quickness==> Run(20) Run(48) Run(50)
22) --> Hurdle==> Jump(22)
24) --> Health==> Heal(24) Heal(40) Heal(40)
26) --> Soul Drain==> Acc(26) Acc(27) Rechg(27) Rechg(34) Rechg(34)
28) --> Stamina==> EndMod(28) EndMod(29) EndMod(29)
30) --> Dodge==> DefBuf(30) DefBuf(31) DefBuf(31)
32) --> Midnight Grasp==> Acc(32) Acc(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(33) Dmg(34) EndRdx(37)
35) --> Evasion==> DefBuf(35) DefBuf(36) DefBuf(36) EndRdx(36)
38) --> Elude==> Rechg(38) Rechg(39) Rechg(39) DefBuf(43)
41) --> Focused Accuracy==> EndRdx(41) EndRdx(42) EndRdx(42) TH_Buf(42) TH_Buf(43) TH_Buf(43)
44) --> Shadow Punch==> Acc(44) Acc(45) Dmg(45) Dmg(45) Dmg(46)
47) --> Lucky==> DefBuf(47) DefBuf(48) DefBuf(48)
49) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg(49) Rechg(50) Rechg(50)
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Sprint==> Empty(1)
01) --> Brawl==> Empty(1)
01) --> Critical Hit==> Empty(1)
02) --> Rest==> Empty(2)
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Debuffs are applied to To Hit, not Accuracy. So, a 30% To Hit Debuff on an AV would result in the AV having (50% - 30%) * 1.5 [Their Accuracy Modifier] or 30% chance to hit someone with no Defense. If you have 5% Defense on top of the Debuff, that would be cut down to 22.5% chance to hit. If you have 20% Defense on top of the Debuff, then the AV's chance to hit would be 7.5%. A Defender with Darkest Night with 3 even level To Hit Debuff Enhancements has a 30% To Hit Debuff.

Lastly, To Hit Debuffs essentially fulfill the function of Defense for everyone the Debuffed target attacks.

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(Don't have the original source I'm afraid but it dates back to the first announcements about the I7 defence changes.)

[/ QUOTE ]That quote clearly shows that AV's have accuracy modifier of 1.5, which means their accuracy is higher than minion's. Also, see the numbers by States here, they clearly show that enemies of higher rank and level have higer accuracy.

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Yes, and the Accuracy multiplier is applied after DEF/ToHit have already been summed and capped. So whilst the higher Accuracy modifier for higher ranks and levels certainly exist and will make them more accurate, Defense doesn't work to counteract that once the first part of the ToHit calculation has been floored at 5%. Since everything in PvE will have a base ToHit of 50% in I7 that means that DEF >45% will only be useful against enemies with ToHit buffs (as mentioned) or in PvP where there are many more ToHit buffs about.

They're still a Tanker. Check their info window.

Does this topic really need going over again? The Tanks' job is to control aggro. They have a number of tools for doing this. Taunt is one of those tools and a useful one, but as long as they're controlling aggro they're Tanking. Taunt or no Taunt.

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Surely CE isn't that bad when teamed with a tank?

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Indeed - it's rather good. Its -Dam debuff is also the only direct damage mitigation you get access to before the Epics and stacking that with the -Dam from a Tank's CE as well should make you both a good bit safer.

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Point I was making was that +5 mobs will continue to hit you more often than +0 mobs however it pans out.

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Yes they will, which I'm sure is intended. They'll hit you less than they do at the moment though, under most circumstances.

I'm afraid you're a bit mistaken about the nature of the ToHit calculation, but fortunately we do know quite a bit about it from Dev posts - one example being

this post from Statesman as reposted on our boards by Bridger.

The probability ToHit is:
[[(Base To Hit + To Hit Buffs - (To Hit Debuffs * Combat Mod) – Defense) capped at 5% or 95%] * Accuracy] (capped at 5% or 95%, again)

Currently (I6 and previously) enemies had a Base To Hit that was modified by their level and rank. Those modifiers are now being applied to Accuracy instead.

This will have a few effects and should indeed make the likes of SR (out of Elude), Ice Tanks and those who like to Parry or similar somewhat better off against more powerful enemies.

How it works out in practice, of course, we'll have to wait and see. But Defence is still being subtracted from Base ToHit, just as it was before.

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Your comments hurt me

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Everything hurts you - you're a Blaster

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Chilling Embrace is clearly better though, it seems to enrage them more.

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Not surprising though, really. It's a double debuff, and debuffs always pull a lot of aggro - ask any Rad or Dark Defender.

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A taunt has a maximum cap of 5 foes, right? That's kinda sucky.

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Indeed. There's also practically nothing (other than in game experience) to tell a player that, or to let them know that there's a cap on how many enemies they can hold the aggro of at a time. So it's hardly surprising that some people don't know.

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Mud Pots, this is an auto-hit taunt/slow and a rolled to hit damage.

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Also an auto-hit Immobilise against minions, which a lot of people don't seem to realise.

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Is the fighting pools shileds any good for blappers to take?
Do they really need them?
And which is best, tough or weave?

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No, no and none of them in that order.

I'd go so far as to say that every single other power pool you could pick offers more utility to a Blapper than Fighting does.

I'm around again this Sunday, so should be along with Tundra as it's the only one he doesn't have the badge for.

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Wanted something different in PvP and it will still be useful in PvE too. Every blaster and his mother slots the nuke for damage, but I'd rather be able to take advantage of the -end recovery of it and see what happens.

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Conventional wisdom isn't always wrong, you know... I'll be interested to hear how you get on with that slotting, but I suspect the activation times on the only two Electric Blast powers with decent End drain (TB and SC) would make chaining them together in PvP all but impossible. Personally, I've never even tried to activate either in a PvP zone, but DVM doesn't go there much.

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By problems I mean how low level tanks can't really tank and how to stop seemingly a large majority of tanks becoming scrankers?

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The thing is, I would see both of these as problems with the players rather than problems with the AT. They're not even Tankers specific problems - the game also has plenty of Defenders who want to load themselves up with attack powers,controllers who want to concentrate on damage and fragile/trigger happy Blasters and Scrappers. There is (and always has been) a large number of players who don't care about much other than producing lots of big orange numbers and staying alive whilst doing so. They're never doing to make defensively minded team Tanks and no amount of tweaking the AT will change that, but they'll still keep rolling Tanker toons partly because of the comicbook archtypes which can be a bit misleading and partly because being that hard to kill seems apealling.

Tanks can still Tank for a team at low levels - I've teamed extensively with two different low-ish level tanks over the past few weeks (one Stone, one Ice) both of whom were more than capable of holding aggro. So that's one problem out of the way. Surviving the aggro needs some team support, yes, and progressively more support as the size of the team increases. I completely fail to see why this should be either surprising or unwelcome, though. Other ATs also need support in teams - fortunately in all such cases there is a team there to provide it. As a Tank you need to be a bit more proactive about asking for the sort of support you need - be it as simple as "don't attack until I've pulled them around the corner" or asking for specific buffs to plug defensive holes. But say you find yourself on an all Blaster team - that's still support. Things will die amazingly fast and safely as long as people don't get trigger happy. If they do, explain (and demonstrate) the benefits of letting you take the aggro. If they still don't want to listen or wait - leave and find another team, it's not so hard to do.

Also, Stamina at 20 isn't that much of a golden rule if you want to primarly tank - at least not in all builds. Of course it will be useful when you can fit it in, but given that you need, when tanking for a team, to attack very little your End usage doesn't need to be any more than running the necessary subset of your toggles - Taunt being a Zero End cost power (another reason why it's far better than relying on Gauntlet...). There is, for instance, no way on Earth I'd put Ice Patch off until 22 to allow for picking Stamina at 20.

Hmmm... a bit more of a rank than I'd intended - but I'd still maintain that most of the perceived problems lie with the players rather than the AT at this point - the ones who want to Tank still can, for a team that wants a Tank.

My slotting on Neutrino Ghost:
Radiant Aura: 3x Heal / 3x Recharge Red.
Radiation Infection: 3x TH debuff / 3x DEF debuff (this may be why I find CC more useable)
Ennervating Field: 3x End reduction
Mutation: 1x Recharge
Acc Metab: 3x Recharge / 3x EndMod
Choking Cloud: 3x Hold / 3x End Redux (I run this constantly - it's a substantial component of my defense since the reduction of TH debuff enhancements)
Lingering Rad: 1x Acc / 1x Recharge (could do with more, but I don't use it all that heavily)

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What's the best way to slot Thunderous Blast according to you?



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Personally, three damage and after that, Recharges as and when you have slots to spare.

It's a rather unusual nuke, though, and a couple of other options are viable. Unlike most nukes its End cost is proportional to the number of targets it hits, rather than simply wiping out your End bar (hitting three targets will empty your End) so slotting for End Reduction can make it a surprisingly good single target attack. As already mentioned, Range can also be useful. It also has a high base End drain (comparable to Short Circuit) but anything that survives being hit by it probably has too much End to be drainable anyway.

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grr u dont get the point

i have a lvl 36 granite/fire tanker

it doesnt need aid self! why would it!

and another point

its hardly the ultimate stone tanker if it needs to have aid self tbh

my granite/fire herds +3 +4 freakshow/nems doesnt need aid self lol oh no

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The main reason the Medicine Pool has tempted me has been to have Aid Other and/or Stimulant - Aid Other would just be gravy and no doubt mostly unused.

It's never tempted me enough to make me drop Provoke, though.

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It's AT LEAST under 75%, because that's the scrapper cap.

I'd suspect something like 50-60%.

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Last I heard it was 65%.

That was a long time ago though, havent tested it recently.

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It's 75%, tested by stacking FoN and TI - definately a 75% RES to S/L. So yes, it's the same as the Scrapper cap just much harder to reach.

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so far i know, acrobatic has mag1 resist hold. A ice/ blaster can already overrule this, once with epics more AT can do a mag2+ hold on you.

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It's certainly very easy to overpower. Still worth having for the KB resist if you're in the Leaping pool anyway, though.

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I do gonna test that FoN mezz resist, so far i ever noticed it never gave me any mezz resist. Then again, i hit 50 with him long time ago.


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I can save you the debt and confirm that you get mezzed straight through it. It's still a great power, but I've been disorientated through it by Black Swan's Oppressive Gloom aura (very low-Mag power, normally). On the plus side, as it's a click power you won't lose the resists from it even when you're mezzed.
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For PvP i would say, get a tray of breakfree's safes you alot of extra powers to get and focus on your element (blaster = dmg dmg dmg).

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True for PvE, too.

If your playing style has been enough to get you to lvl40 without Stamina, then I don't see why you should need to spend 3 of your last 4 picks to get it - Dark Consumption is a very nice End booster, especially as you'll be in the middle of a group of enemies a lot of the time. Opressive Gloom is great - does a similar job to Choking Cloud but is cheaper. Also, you can stack Cosmic burst with it to easily Disorient bosses. Soul Drain also suits you down to the ground - again as you're in the middle of groups of enemies a lot. Oddly, the armor is probably the most skippable of them - partly because you're already pretty well defended and partly because it needs slotting and I'd prioritise slotting the other powers from the Dark pool first.

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I didn't even know you had to go through the Academy to get in... I must be special.

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Shhh... don't tell anyone, but I never joined the academy either

Great job on the site Enz, will supply a DVM screenshot ASAP.

I'll be along with whoever's needed. Tundra hasn't got this badge, though, so should be able to fill one of the Tanker slots.