Can a melee build really solo an AV? Really?

I'm serious. Saw the end of a conversation in game and I had to know if it was true.

I mean everyone knows an Ill/rad can, but a melee? Really?

It's definitely possible. People have been doing it for some time.

Back in the days before Inventions, there was at least one person who posted about doing it with, I think, a Claws Scrapper of some kind. Claws/Regen, I think, which would then put it before ED.

I can't remember if anyone did it between (when we got ED) and I9, when we got inventions. Once Inventions really got rolling, though, it became increasingly common to see posts about it. (Note that doesn't mean it's common overall, as the forum population is small compared to the player base, and probably a bit more likely to have the know-how and motivation to try such things.)

Today it's probably better to ask what difficulty people do it on, as they might not be doing it at +0.

A while ago someone made a thread about them soloing the ITF (which has several AV's) with a fire/SS tanker. And that was before incarnates, I think.

So yes, it's definitely possible even with a tanker. Easier with a brute or scrapper though.

There was a time when only the highest-end melee builds, in the hands of the most skilled players, could manage to solo even the easiest AVs. That time is long past now. You basically need 3 things to defeat an AV:

1) DPS higher than the AV's regen. AVs regenerate ~100 hp/sec, so you need >100 DPS. With Interface and etc etc, almost any melee build can break 200 DPS without much effort, and some can get MUCH higher, so even AVs with high resistance are not out of reach. If you use Lore pets, this part becomes laughably easy; most Lore pets can outdamage AV regen by themselves.
2) The ability to survive. AV fights are long (although not so long as they once were), so you can't just count on defense, some hits WILL get through. You need to be able to reliably survive an AVs attention for minutes at a time.
3) Endurance. AV fights are, again, long, so you need to be able to fight for a long time without breaks.

Note that "damage, survival, endurance" are the same three things ANY decent melee build will include, and with Incarnate powers, they'll usually have them in spades. Soloing an AV with almost any good melee build isn't even particularly challenging.

I can't think of any of my builds right off that can't solo a +0 AV.

Depending on difficulty, you need anything from 100dps(+0 and it's gonna take an hour) to 475dps(54+3 in less than 5 minutes). More reasonable expectations would be 120 dps to 180dps. I am not currently aware of any melee builds capable of 475, but there are a multitude of builds in between. I'd expect the current top end with assault hybrid to be between 360 and 400.

See:
Current: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=130754
Pre-lore* :http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showt...130754&page=72

See Also: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...NmtRQUE#gid=13

*You could add 40 to 80 dps to any of the pre-lore older numbers to extrapolate approximate current non-lore performance.

Cimmies were in the 360 to 400 dps range depending on Alpha. 400 dps is gonna be hard to beat for all but the most elite builds. Some of the new stalkers, or the most elite DM/SD or FM/SD might manage that.

Yes, it's not that hard these days...

I have a Peacebringer that can solo AVs and Rikti Pylons without much of a problem. Have taken a couple AVs down without using Lore Pets at all. Others I could have. Was ticking away at their Health just fine before finally just using the Lore Pets to speed it once I knew I could do it (pretty once half their health is gone)

I'll grant these AVs were set to +0, but still, PBs soloing AVs of any shift was laughable not that long ago. I believe she could take some down at +2 (maybe higher) - I'll experiment someday and see...

In any case, if PBs can do, it's a no-Brainer Meleers can.

Claws/sr scrapper here. Back before Inventions, I had soloe'd Neuron, Antimatter, Shadow Hunter, and a cpl others.

At one point my Dm/Wp brute was soloing the redside AV's/Heroes that are in the 20s. Of course, this was post inventions, but still.

I solo'd all the AV's in the Maria Jenkins arc with an INV/SS Tank before Incarnate powers. So yes, it's perfectly possible for melee characters to do it.

Plus, in most cases, the melee toons who do solo aVs do it with no temps, or insps.

I think it was Shred Monkey that soloed an AV while surrounded by other AVs. No temps or insps.

It takes some know-how, but Hopeling pretty much nailed it on the head. It used to be much harder, but it's gotten more doable for everyone with the advent of Incarnate powers and all that.

Recently, I've been on a kick of solo attempts on my Katana/Super Reflexes scrapper, Pathrunner. I managed to solo the entire ITF, but couldn't get past Dr. Aeon on the STF. Still, there's like 10 AVs on the way to Aeon, so yeah - is it possible? Yes.

I've been soling AVs with my Kin/Elec armor stalker since before I-trial content. First AV I ever soloed was Numina in the Ghost Widow arc at 41, even conning. It was hard as heck and I failed several times, but I pulled it off.

Now with Super Inspirations, Ultimates, ATOs, Incarnate powers, and the recent stalker changes my Kin/Elec stalker plows through AVs like they're EBs. I've also been able to solo an AV with pretty much every toon I have now, so it isn't that big of a deal to solo an AV anymore.

I have plans for a melee toon to solo GM's without using pets, temps, or insps. Will take awhile though. I'm broke from kitting out my last melee toon.

Interesting, Claws. So you must have five hecatomb including the proc in shadow punch, as well as total radial reactive, but what of the sixth slot? Tanker AT proc or damage proc of some sort?

Right off the top of my head I can't think of any build that couldn't solo an even level AV without Lore pets. With a good build pretty much any build should be capable of soloing one without insps, temps or incarnate powers. When AV soloing was still hot stuff I used to run a FM/SR Scrapper with a very moderately priced build (around 150mil) who could solo most AVs under the no insps/temps rule before we had access to incarnate stuff.

As an aside, Ill/Rad is one of the big old names for AV/GM hunting, but it is not as powerful as some other high-end builds are at that.