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Originally Posted by Durakken
Power Pool set to add Swing...
Grapple Pull: Pulls a mob or multiple mobs to you. Wrap up: Wraps an enemy up to prevent them from attacking or wraps up the legs of an enemy so they can't move (so the enemy can't move or can't attack for a short period of time) Swing: Let's you swiiiiing Hang On: toggle, allows that when you are swing around someone to attach onto you and swing Reel in: targeted grapple shot that when it hits pulls you quickly to that point |
Oh look another swinging travel power suggestion.
<gets popcorn and sits back to watch the upcoming argument>
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I know, but maybe they'll add it eventually if we keep saying it!
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Oh look another swinging travel power suggestion.
<gets popcorn and sits back to watch the upcoming argument> |
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Good luck. I'm staying out of the line of fire this time and just watching what happens. |
Originally Posted by Durakken
I know, but maybe they'll add it eventually if we keep saying it!
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*Sighs, goes and gets the cookies and a comfy seat*
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Originally Posted by Forbin_Project
Good luck. I'm staying out of the line of fire this time and just watching what happens.
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
*Sighs, goes and gets the cookies and a comfy seat*
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No, I'm mad that this is getting attention when **I** said "Grapple/Web!" way back when, and still do to this day, and then this person tries to make it "new" in some way. The nerve.
But that's ok... attention is attention, as long as grapple/web gets some.
+1!
/Signed
//-jranger
August 31, 2012. A Day that will Live in Infamy. Or Information. Possibly Influence. Well, Inf, anyway. Thank you, Paragon Studios, for what you did, and the enjoyment and camaraderie you brought.
This is houtex, aka Mike, signing off the forums. G'night all. - 10/26/2012
Well... perhaps I was premature about that whole 'signing off' thing... - 11-9-2012
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No, just amused that people still think this is ever going to happen.|
Originally Posted by Durakken
Ya'll are just mad you didn't think of it first :P
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The words 'mechanical impossibility' must be feeling lonely at the back of an unread dictionary right about now.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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I don't buy that for a second.|
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
No, just amused that people still think this is ever going to happen.
The words 'mechanical impossibility' must be feeling lonely at the back of an unread dictionary right about now. |
All it is is movement through 3D space while doing an animation.
With an item in the character's hand
With a line coming from that
That last part would be the only conceivable problem with implementing and that's only because the code doesn't exists as far as i know to do something like that quite completely, but I would argue that that could easily be changed.
I think it's more along the lines of the "we don't want to make the line shoot off into nothing" which I think is a cop out personally, but whatever.
You don't have to buy it. That doesn't make it any less true, not when the Devs themselves have come out and explicitly said that it's not possible with this creaky ancient game engine.
It's not 'just moving through 3D space', not if you want an actual swinging/grapple power rather than what amounts to a glorified super jump. You need to have an anchor point to swing the character from, and that needs to be coded and implemented. Then you need the physics of the actual swing, and the three character models would all need new animations. Not to mention that, yes actually, it DOES look bloody stupid when you are swinging off nothing. Sky hooks, maybe?
There is plenty of reasoning behind not having this power, and the likes of running super-speed along water and wall-climbing and running up buildings and the like.
The reason that another game has those powers is because it was built from the group up with them in mind. CoH was NOT. It's built on a seven year old and rather creaky engine. It's a miracle the Devs have been able to wring as much out of it as they have been able to, and that's coming from someone who hasn't got the foggiest idea about coding and the like.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Patches and updates. That's what they're for. It's not a ton more work. |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
You don't have to buy it. That doesn't make it any less true, not when the Devs themselves have come out and explicitly said that it's not possible with this creaky ancient game engine.
It's not 'just moving through 3D space', not if you want an actual swinging/grapple power rather than what amounts to a glorified super jump. You need to have an anchor point to swing the character from, and that needs to be coded and implemented. Then you need the physics of the actual swing, and the three character models would all need new animations. Not to mention that, yes actually, it DOES look bloody stupid when you are swinging off nothing. Sky hooks, maybe? |
The other game uses an upgraded version of CoH's engine
And part of the benefit of going Freemium is so that all these things that they couldn't do because they couldn't justify it are now possible because they can justify it under the new model.
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Originally Posted by Durakken
Patches and updates. That's what they're for. It's not a ton more work.
CO uses an upgraded version of CoH's engine And part of the benefit of going Freemium is so that all these things that they couldn't do because they couldn't justify it are now possible because they can justify it under the new model. |
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Originally Posted by Durakken
Patches and updates. That's what they're for. It's not a ton more work.
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Originally Posted by Durakken
It's not a ton more work.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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A Jackie Chan facepalm?
The actual meme name is 'My mind is full of ****'
It's pretty much all that can sum up the 'logic' here.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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The problem, as mentioned most times this comes up is this: the game does not have the appropriate mapping for vertical surfaces to be interacted with. As such, your rope couldn't 'swing' from nearby buildings. This leaves the only other possibility of a phantom rope coming from the sky, not interacting with the environment...which may seem okay from the user's perspective, but ends up looking very silly to anyone else. (Look! a man swinging from a rope disappearing into the sky!)
Secondly, the 'hang on' power: There is no way to do this. Explaining why shield charge had to be a teleport and not just the character moving forward, Castle said the game has no way to move a character along a path for the player. This is part of why you cannot ride moving vehicles or the Atlas blimp: there is no such thing as a moving platform, or any gradual movement aside from the player's directional input. (Like no handshaking/highfive emotes even. all stuff is limited to a give/receive interaction of independent animations)
Perhaps there's a bypass to allow the second player to have their movement mapped by the first player's movement, but that seems rife with connectivity error possibilities. Also, there are no powers in the game that has any prolonged interaction between to characters.
I'd love for swinging to be allowed, but it pretty much comes down to awaiting CoH II and a system that can handle (a) surface mapping for more than just "floor' surfaces, with full collision detection on walls/ceilings, (right now only floors can be navigated, walls/ceilings are merely 'barriers') and (b) automated pathing on the system's side that can be applied to players' characters.
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yep.|
Originally Posted by Seldom
The problem, as mentioned most times this comes up is this: the game does not have the appropriate mapping for vertical surfaces to be interacted with. As such, your rope couldn't 'swing' from nearby buildings. This leaves the only other possibility of a phantom rope coming from the sky, not interacting with the environment...which may seem okay from the user's perspective, but ends up looking very silly to anyone else. (Look! a man swinging from a rope disappearing into the sky!)
Secondly, the 'hang on' power: There is no way to do this. Explaining why shield charge had to be a teleport and not just the character moving forward, Castle said the game has no way to move a character along a path for the player. This is part of why you cannot ride moving vehicles or the Atlas blimp: there is no such thing as a moving platform, or any gradual movement aside from the player's directional input. (Like no handshaking/highfive emotes even. all stuff is limited to a give/receive interaction of independent animations) Perhaps there's a bypass to allow the second player to have their movement mapped by the first player's movement, but that seems rife with connectivity error possibilities. Also, there are no powers in the game that has any prolonged interaction between to characters. I'd love for swinging to be allowed, but it pretty much comes down to awaiting CoH II and a system that can handle (a) surface mapping for more than just "floor' surfaces, with full collision detection on walls/ceilings, (right now only floors can be navigated, walls/ceilings are merely 'barriers') and (b) automated pathing on the system's side that can be applied to players' characters. |
so in the current engine, the best you could get maybe it would look more like another teleport, right? you could slow the casting animation down to shoot a grappling hook to the surface based target [right now wormhole for example works on walls and ceilings and floors], but then the tp wouldnt have any sort of swing really. you could sort of make a yank, but it'd still be a TP like shield charge... leaving you at the target, rather than using that as a swing-from point.
right? :/
Actually, this could work. Been playing Just Cause 2 and that zip line is a pretty handy form of travel and since it sticks to anything, you could use it to pull you to any distant point even on the ground.
"Samual_Tow - Be disappointed all you want, people. You just don't appreciate the miracles that are taking place here."
I love how long-term players love to piss on any suggestion they don't like.
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Err...different game, different mapping, different engine. The above mentioned game had a grapple in its design, so the devs mad not just the system for the grapple, but mapped out everywhere where it could stick, and how. Now ask the devs to make a movement method in a system that before couldn't move a player for them, and map out sticking/collision interactions for every zone, every instanced map, every surface. I'm sure they could, but 'would' is a bit more dubious. I am certain that if a new engine is made, climbing/swinging mapping will be in there, but at that point we are talking about the effort to make something that revamping huge swaths of this game's elements. :-/|
Originally Posted by Anti_Proton
Actually, this could work. Been playing Just Cause 2 and that zip line is a pretty handy form of travel and since it sticks to anything, you could use it to pull you to any distant point even on the ground.
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*edit*
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Originally Posted by dbuter
I love how long-term players love to piss on any suggestion they don't like.
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EDIT---
Never mind, can't tell it not to target a point in mid-air...
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Maybe copying spider man is impossible (and maybe we shouldn't copy him anyway...) but some Batman style gadget shot and then attached at the belt seems very possible to me.
1) Teleport Power already exists. The Teleport power faces it's target before teleporting, and applies hover for a short time.
2) Copy/Paste Teleport, rename as "Grappling Hook" or perhaps "The Durakken Device".
3) Make new power animation for it. A simple gadget, possibly using the old Taser item, firing a straight line to the target with a wire texture. Instead of the teleport animation your character takes a second to attach the device to their belt. The travel effect is quick and jerky so it looks like the new super jump teleport attack move.
4) Change animation for it's 'hover' to add a wire from the location target and attached at the belt line (does not affect power animations, everything works like from hover) and increase duration of added hover to 5minutes, but it cancels immediately if the player moves.
5) Tweak as necessary. Maybe have the wire attach high, or the teleport hit a little low (so the wire is not attaching you to the target surface horizontally and defying gravity). Or, you could let the player fall just briefly to give the wire some hang. This would also serve as a simple check to see if they are on the ground. If they land and stand, hover does not kick in.
6) ????? points in the store.
7) Profit
Precedent:
1) Teleport power
2) Repeated animations show lots of copy/pasting especially early on.
3) Sniper shots go crazy distances and leaving lingering beams.
4a) Take a look at plants set. Lots of things can appear at ground targets and know where targets are.
4b) Some powers cancel if you try to move, like snipers.
5) The game knows when you are standing with things like the Grounded power.
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Don't get us wrong, we want it, it's just with the current engine it's as good as impossible to do. Can't find a link/source, but way back when this was shot down by a lead Dev as being technically impossible and a lot of work for something relatively small gameplay-wise.
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Originally Posted by dbuter
I love how long-term players love to piss on any suggestion they don't like.
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I am the Blaster, I have filled the role of Tank, Controller and Defender
Sometimes all at once.
Union EU player! Pip pip, tally ho, top hats and tea etc etc
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I've played off and on since launch, and if I had a penny for every time I've heard that about something that got put in the game would have paid for itself and it's subs.
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Originally Posted by CBeet
Don't get us wrong, we want it, it's just with the current engine it's as good as impossible to do. Can't find a link/source, but way back when this was shot down by a lead Dev as being technically impossible and a lot of work for something relatively small gameplay-wise.
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Yeah. That's not the case.|
Originally Posted by dbuter
I love how long-term players love to piss on any suggestion they don't like.
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In fact, it was brought up again during this week's Freedom Fridays.
Here's the response
"Sorry, there are no plans for a grappling hook travel power. While it has been widely requested, there's no good way to make it work animation-wise; the player would either be grappling onto nothing in mid-air, or would be swinging from a floating device of some kind."
"I saw my advantage and took it. That's what heroes do." - Homer Simpson.
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Originally Posted by terrible_deli
Yeah. That's not the case.
In fact, it was brought up again during this week's Freedom Fridays. Here's the response "Sorry, there are no plans for a grappling hook travel power. While it has been widely requested, there's no good way to make it work animation-wise; the player would either be grappling onto nothing in mid-air, or would be swinging from a floating device of some kind." |
Ah, he's right.
I assumed in my post above that a person would target a building but there wouldn't be a way to rule out targeting nothing in mid air...
Power Pool set to add Swing...
Grapple Pull: Pulls a mob or multiple mobs to you.
Wrap up: Wraps an enemy up to prevent them from attacking or wraps up the legs of an enemy so they can't move (so the enemy can't move or can't attack for a short period of time)
Swing: Let's you swiiiiing
Hang On: toggle, allows that when you are swing around someone to attach onto you and swing
Reel in: targeted grapple shot that when it hits pulls you quickly to that point