It's probably best frankenslotted.
I either go 2 Recharge; 2 damage IOs or (for soft cap Def building) a full set of Enfeebled Ops (builds recharge as well)... its cheaper than going with a set of Positron's Blast.
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Impeded Swiftness: Chance for Smashing Damage
I like 2 recharge, 2 Nucleolus Exposure (acc/dam), the Impeded Swiftness proc, and the Positron proc.
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This is optimal, or damn near IMO.
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Originally Posted by ketch
I like 2 recharge, 2 Nucleolus Exposure (acc/dam), the Impeded Swiftness proc, and the Positron proc.
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Exactly how i slotted mine
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Originally Posted by ketch
I like 2 recharge, 2 Nucleolus Exposure (acc/dam), the Impeded Swiftness proc, and the Positron proc.
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I could only fit one recharge, but yeah, this.
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Originally Posted by ketch
I like 2 recharge, 2 Nucleolus Exposure (acc/dam), the Impeded Swiftness proc, and the Positron proc.
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Heck, that's all you need sometimes. Creepers expire if you cast a new set while the old set is out. Once you reach the point that you have them perma, it's alright to skip out on recharge.
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Originally Posted by Machariel
I could only fit one recharge, but yeah, this.
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My current plan is to include the following procs on the Plant dom I'm currently leveling: Posi, Trap of the Hunter, Impeded Swiftness, Explosive Strike. Is there any reason to not use any of those procs? How about Javelin's Volley?
The last 2 slots were going to be Ragnarok Acc/Dmg/Rch and Acc/Rch. With global recharge Creepers are easily perma. That leaves the damage slotting a bit light. I'm not averse to swapping out the Rags for Nucleoluses (Nucleoli?) but then it's not perma by 10 seconds. If only there were an Acc/Dmg/Rch to use, man TAOE sets suck. I wouldn't want to use 1 Rag by itself.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
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I'm just going from memory here so maybe I'm wrong, but I think the reason people use the slow and positron procs over others is that all attacks from CC do damage (so posi works for all them) and most of them (maybe all) do slow so Impeded Swiftness work in most or all of them as well. The immob proc would only work in CC's immob powers and Explosive Strike only on the attacks that do kb, which if memory serves aren't as many as the ones with slow. Javelin's Volley should work like Posi, so a good pick.
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Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
My current plan is to include the following procs on the Plant dom I'm currently leveling: Posi, Trap of the Hunter, Impeded Swiftness, Explosive Strike. Is there any reason to not use any of those procs? How about Javelin's Volley?
The last 2 slots were going to be Ragnarok Acc/Dmg/Rch and Acc/Rch. With global recharge Creepers are easily perma. That leaves the damage slotting a bit light. I'm not averse to swapping out the Rags for Nucleoluses (Nucleoli?) but then it's not perma by 10 seconds. If only there were an Acc/Dmg/Rch to use, man TAOE sets suck. I wouldn't want to use 1 Rag by itself. |
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I thought they stack?
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Originally Posted by ketch
Heck, that's all you need sometimes. Creepers expire if you cast a new set while the old set is out. Once you reach the point that you have them perma, it's alright to skip out on recharge.
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Currently my plant/fire dom and my plant/storm troller are slotting 2xNucleolus (acc/dam HO's), 2xL50 Recharge IO's, the positron blast and impeded swiftness proc. That gives me 66% Acc, 66% dam, 80%+ recharge and the two best procs.
Even with a perma-dom build having the recharge slotted in carrion creepers is nice - while it may follow you around, it can be a little slow and the big slow patch doesn't follow you - plus I do believe it can stack, although I haven't tested this. On my plant/fire dom my recharge is down to 100s for the creepers, which is quite nice - makes a big difference on BAF's as it lets me keep the slow patch up constantly during the prisoner phase.
Prior to 50 slotting 2 Acc/dam IO's in place of the HO's is probably a good call - I susepect you might even get more bang for your buck out of L50 acc/dam IO's but I had a bunch of nucleolus sitting around from the days protector used to do weekly hami raids so I slotted them since I knew they would effect all the CC powers.
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On another note... is there a way to dismiss CC? /releasepets doesn't seem to work. I'm low 40s in Grandville and I always dismiss pets when I go outside until I get to 47 or so. Creepers seems to stick around though and potentially aggro nearby mobs.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
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While true, I think it's better to have as much recharge as you can because when you summon them under a mob you get a big mass of them all at once, and you get a chance of a vine for each living dude in the mob. |
Originally Posted by ketch
Heck, that's all you need sometimes. Creepers expire if you cast a new set while the old set is out. Once you reach the point that you have them perma, it's alright to skip out on recharge.
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If you are waiting for them to catch up, they don't spawn all at once and you end up with fewer vines because the mob is dying while the vines are summoning, if that makes any sense.
Actually what it probably is is that since the patch follows you when it is not making vines and dealing damage, and is presumably centered on you, when you already have it up and attack a mob, you only get the possibility of vines for the closest enemies to you. If you start fights by immediately running into melee this is probably less of a problem. In any case yeah perma creepers is great but even though they expire when you recast them, there's a benefit to adding more recharge so you can summon a new batch under each spawn (or every other spawn, or every 3rd spawn, or w/e).
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Originally Posted by Deacon_NA
My current plan is to include the following procs on the Plant dom I'm currently leveling: Posi, Trap of the Hunter, Impeded Swiftness, Explosive Strike. Is there any reason to not use any of those procs? How about Javelin's Volley?
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I would imagine Javelin's volley is less used because it's expensive and you'd rather slot for acc/dam/recharge after you get the two cheap procs into it.
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Originally Posted by EricHough
Prior to 50 slotting 2 Acc/dam IO's in place of the HO's is probably a good call - I susepect you might even get more bang for your buck out of L50 acc/dam IO's but I had a bunch of nucleolus sitting around from the days protector used to do weekly hami raids so I slotted them since I knew they would effect all the CC powers.
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Only for a moment. If you watch them closely, you'll see how you lose ownership of the vines when you cast a new set and they die moments later even if they were freshly spawned. I presume this is because the creeper patch (the actual caster of the vine pets) is replaced with your new creeper patch.
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Originally Posted by Granite Agent
I thought they stack?
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Just thought I'd take some time to clarify exactly how Creepers works so people can be sure of how their procs and slotting affects the power. First, there are several different entities spawned when creepers is summoned:
1. The AoE slow patch aka "bramble". 20' radius. Follows you like an invisible pseudopet, aggroing enemies, etc. This one can take the impeded swiftness proc which has a chance of firing first when the slow patch is summoned and then once every 10s for each enemy affected, similar to putting the proc in tar patch.
2. The immobilizing, damaging AoE patch bursts AKA "creeper patches". These are summoned by the AoE slow patch pseudopet (described in No. 1) on every defeated enemy in an 8' radius with a 5 target cap. These AoE patches are typed AoE damage and immobilize and are summoned under every defeated foe once every 10s. These patches take the trap of the hunter proc (immobilize), positron's blast proc (AoE damage), and the javelin volley proc (AoE damage). Each of these procs then have a chance to fire every 10s for each enemy affected within 8' of the defeated foe the patch is springing forth from. If that makes sense. Needless to say, the high number of procs available for these bursts is awesome and I've jumped into a spawn, killed a few minions/lts, and watched lucky creeper patch bursts do massive damage to the remaining bosses.
3. The ranged damage, slowing vine thorn attacks aka "vine thorns". For each live or dead enemy under the bramble patch, there is a 50% chance of spawning a vine every 10s. As you know, these vines fling thorns at enemies with a range of 60'. These vine thorns are typed ranged and carry a slow effect. As a result, the impeded swiftness proc works on them, giving every vine's thorn attack a 20% chance to proc damage. This is very valuable since the vine's fling thorns every 4s and each vines' vine attack has the chance to proc. Unfortunately, we can't slot ranged damage procs into Carrion Creepers or else we'd have another proc that would work here.
4. The melee, knockdown, slowing attacks by each vine aka "vine smash". Each vine has a 10' melee attack in addition to their ranged vine thorns attack. This melee attack does .6 KB (i.e. KD), slows, and does typed melee damage. Because we can't slot melee attack procs into Carrion Creepers, the valuable procs here are the impeded swiftness and explosive strike procs. Both have a chance to fire on each vines' melee attack.
So that's it. That's the complexity that is Carrion Creepers. So all in all, the impeded swiftness proc is the most helpful, followed by posi, jav, and TotH. The least effective (but still very effective to be sure) is the explosive strike. Another thing to note is that vine smash, vine thorns, bramble, and creeper patches all require a tohit check with a base accuracy of 1, so slotting at least some ACC is recommended, although outside tohit buffs such as tactics help with the vine thorns/smash accuracies (but not creeper patches...I think). And no, there is no stacking of Carrion Creepers. Resummoning kills all of the effects of your existing Carrion Creepers and replaces them with the new ones.
For those who may be curious about my personal slotting preferences, I built for high global recharge on my plant/psi, which means I don't slot any recharge in it because it is already perma for me. And since I sit in melee at all times, I don't have any problems with Carrion Creepers only affecting the fringe of a spawn. It almost always follows me quickly into the mass. But I still need Acc so I slot with one Acc IO, and the rest with the 5 procs I listed above. I find that slotting for straight damage is a waste (imo) because even the explosive strike proc, which is 20% chance to do 71 dmg, procs often enough to far outweigh the extremely piddly straight damage of the attacks/patches. I'd rather have a proc available on every vine smash than use damage IOs/HOs to increase each damaging attack by around 10-20 damage. I've tried using 2 acc/dam HOs and eliminating explosive strike, and I felt that the damage decreased slightly, although I admit I didn't go through the combat log to check because Carrion Creepers does havoc to the combat log. I may try slotting two HOs again just to be sure.
Anyway, sorry for the lengthy post. Blame Carrion Creepers. Hope this helps for any who were unsure about how this power works exactly.
Thank you very much Little_Whorn, no need to apoligize for the length, it was perfect for helping me get a better handle on Creepers slotting and also what the heck it's doing. CC's always been inscrutable to me.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Yea, CC is one confusing beast. But the sheer number of procs it regularly fires off is simply staggering. Add Reactive to the mix and CC becomes truly devastating and single-handedly wipes out x8 spawns.
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This isn't quite right. The Vine Attacks seem to be coded to use Targetted AOE Damage in their attacks. This was a change made by Castle to allow Vines attacks be slottable with the damage sets which the power was already set to accept (it'd be too confusing to allow Melee and Ranged but only have them affect 1/2 the vine attacks apiece)|
Originally Posted by Little_Whorn
3. The ranged damage, slowing vine thorn attacks aka "vine thorns". For each live or dead enemy under the bramble patch, there is a 50% chance of spawning a vine every 10s. As you know, these vines fling thorns at enemies with a range of 60'. These vine thorns are typed ranged and carry a slow effect. As a result, the impeded swiftness proc works on them, giving every vine's thorn attack a 20% chance to proc damage. This is very valuable since the vine's fling thorns every 4s and each vines' vine attack has the chance to proc. Unfortunately, we can't slot ranged damage procs into Carrion Creepers or else we'd have another proc that would work here.
4. The melee, knockdown, slowing attacks by each vine aka "vine smash". Each vine has a 10' melee attack in addition to their ranged vine thorns attack. This melee attack does .6 KB (i.e. KD), slows, and does typed melee damage. Because we can't slot melee attack procs into Carrion Creepers, the valuable procs here are the impeded swiftness and explosive strike procs. Both have a chance to fire on each vines' melee attack. |
That means the Posi proc works for both of these attacks. I've verified it myself in the past via the Combat Logs and Vine attacks will both inherit Accuracy, Damage etc from Targetted AOE sets and will proc Posi Blasts.
in my AE tests Impended & Posi were basically neck and neck with regards to #procs over time, with the other two being an order of magnitude less frequent (ie 1/10 as often).
Procs. Procs procs procs procs.
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I just have a single acc/dmg HO in mine, which is bumped up to like 80% enh slotting with Musculature. On my dom it's perma without any recharge slotting so I didn't need to slot for it. And with 45% S/L/R defense and 130% global recharge I had very little room for proc slotting, but if I ever somehow scrounged up an extra slot I would add the impeded swiftness dmg proc to it.
What is considered the proper carrion creeper slotting? I've heard that AOE damage sets is a bad idea because it would not enhance the single target portions of the damage is this true?