is all high level content as stupid as the ITF is now?
By
Acemace,
Posted on: 2012-01-08 12:55 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Please can somebody alluded to this poblem that I have entered the game with a new account, I get to create the character but in the last part tells me something about Stach 2 download something like that areglar as alluded PLEASE!
Please, someone I can allude to this poblem that I have entered the game with a new account, I get to create the character but in the last part tells me something about Stach 2 download something like that areglar as alluded PLEASE!
A lot of the trouble with interpreting the speed vs shard, and etc., scenarios is that the game's NPC AI is very poor. Imagine if all your opponents in the ITF were individually run by reasonably skilled players, and imagine they had some time to plan and practice.
In-game missions are easy not just because we have mechanical advantages against the NPC mobs, but because individually they have very simple control heuristics, and as a mission group they have virtually none at all.
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The game is quite big, so the download happens in 4 stages, which lets you start playing before the whole game is downloaded - you just need to wait until each stage is downloaded.
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Originally Posted by Alan2296
Please, someone I can allude to this poblem that I have entered the game with a new account, I get to create the character but in the last part tells me something about Stach 2 download something like that areglar as alluded PLEASE!
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Golden Girl's answer is correct; what you're seeing is perfectly normal. |
Originally Posted by Alan2296
Please, someone I can allude to this poblem that I have entered the game with a new account, I get to create the character but in the last part tells me something about Stach 2 download something like that areglar as alluded PLEASE!
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Also, please use the proper forum to post technical questions: ALL ACCESS: Gameplay / Technical Issues & Bugs. I noticed you posted your question four times in three different threads, off-topic to all three. You'll get better help by using the proper forums -- we have very helpful experienced players who frequent them.
Finally, welcome to City of Heroes!
and how long each download?
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The 4 stages are different sizes - the first one is for the costume creator, which lets you design your avatar while stage 2 is downloading in the background.|
Originally Posted by Alan2296
and how long each download?
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Stage 2 is the tutorial - when you're playing that, stage 3 is downloading in the background.
Stage 3 is Atlas Park and Mercy Island, the starting zones for heroes or villains that you go to when the tutorial is done, so it's a bigger download than the tutorial - stage 4 will download in the backgound while you're in these 2 new zones.
Stage 4 is the rest of the game, so it's the biggest download - but it should be done by the time you've finished all the starting zone missions.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
and how to do the latter because to me the second asks for the character
la 2°
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Easy solution here. Form your own team.
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Originally Posted by dugfromthearth
I just did the ITF for the first time in years. It was simply stupid.
Every character simply ignored the foes and ran through the missions past them, taking out only the ones they needed to. There was no challenge to it. 90% of the foes may as well not have been there. Is the rest of the high level this stupid now? |
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You may be right, but in the Cyst mission, it seemed like nobody but me and the tank had the defenses to withstand the nictuses surrounding every cyst, to say nothing of all the Cim ambushes that created further adds, which meant everyone but us died by the time a cyst was at half hit points. If we were lucky, the tank and I (a willpower brute) could finish off the cyst before dying ourselves, and then wait for everyone to res or come back from the hospital. Multiply that by the ten cysts that have to be destroyed, and you have just one mission that takes forever to finish.|
Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
You had a bad team. There's very little reason you should be dying over and over on the ITF.
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Then, in both of the missions involving "traitors", we had ranged squishies and controller squishies who could not survive all the mobs that came along with every cyclops or minotaur. And then in the fight with the computer console, I had to destroy it almost single-handedly because everyone else just kept dying and only I seemed to have the means to stand there and shrug off attacks.
And then, when facing nictus-infused Romulus, nobody else could deal with his AV buddies who were spamming him with heals without dying constantly, so after 20 minutes of pounding on him, the team was wiped out and we just gave up for the night.
If the most fun TF in the game requires a finely-tuned balance of just the right power sets and a group of players who know all the tricks of how to beat each mission, then it is by definition one of the least fun TFs in the game to me. Maybe it is fun when the "speed" version is mastered and you don't ever have to face any deaths (who has time to die when it is finished in 15 mins?), but speed runs don't appeal to me for various reasons and I'm unlikely to bother with the TF enough times to know how to speed through it.
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Ive run kill-all ITFs that went as fast as speed runs, due to the extreme damage output. Like usual, the big bag o' hps that is the console took a lot of time. But barring that, the tf ran stupidly fast. I would not say those people were just running past everything.
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Hew in drag baby
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Where abouts are you in the game right now? Are you still in the tutorial?
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Originally Posted by Alan2296
and how to do the latter because to me the second asks for the character
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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I see you speaking English, but this makes no sense to me.
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Originally Posted by Rodion
unstealthed squishie
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Deamus the Fallen - 50 DM/EA Brute - Lib
Dragos Bahtiam - 50 Fire/Ice Blaster - Lib
/facepalm - Apply Directly to the Forehead!
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Originally Posted by Shubbie
Im very good at taking a problem and making it worse.
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I've been on a pile of ITF runs this week, leveling up my TW scrapper. All of these have been for shards/xp, but I have seen others running speed ITFs as well. I just haven't bothered joining those. I'm on Virtue, BTW.
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Originally Posted by Demobot
Can't blame iTrials for everything.
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Originally Posted by Demetrios Vasilikos
You see the game is at its best for all when you dont NEED anything but the company of others doing thier own thing to have fun to.
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Originally Posted by I Burnt The Toast
Yes, I burnt NT. It was me.
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--NT
They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!
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Me. As I said before, speedruns on any TF always get me killed. Not fun.
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Originally Posted by Wing_Leader
Maybe it is fun when the "speed" version is mastered and you don't ever have to face any deaths (who has time to die when it is finished in 15 mins?), but speed runs don't appeal to me for various reasons and I'm unlikely to bother with the TF enough times to know how to speed through it.
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If I'm joining a random PuG I worry a bit more about team chemistry, but team defensive buffs always help on an ITF. The cims will debuff your defense so being a few points above the softcap is ideal.|
Originally Posted by Wing_Leader
If the most fun TF in the game requires a finely-tuned balance of just the right power sets and a group of players who know all the tricks of how to beat each mission, then it is by definition one of the least fun TFs in the game to me.
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Usually I'm on one of my well-IO'd brutes or scrappers who are softcapped, and can solo every spawn if absolutely necessary. Even better if I play my widow who can buff the team. But I find that teams assembled from the private global channels I'm on can throw together just about anyone regardless and do well.
The ITF I was on last night had a blaster, a stalker, and three brutes. Another player decided we had enough melee and swapped out a tank for a defender. This worried me a bit because none of the brutes were 50 and mine was only 35. I was partially IO'd, with about 15-18% smashing/lethal defense. I grabbed a bunch of purples before we started, but actually between ice shields and other buffs from two defenders and a corr, I was typically at 60% to 80% defense. I kept an eye on my defense and when it dipped to 45% or less I popped a purple. I was able to act as one of the primary tanks for the entire TF, and never died.
That's more a testament to the fact that we had a good ice defender, people running manuevers, and that I always monitored my defense so I would know when I might be in trouble. Cims can debuff you defense very quickly, and then you're in real trouble. But to me, those are the things that make a big difference between a team of experienced players and a random PuG; mostly that I know without asking that we'll have most of the elements to be successful, whereas on a randomly assembled PuG it's an open question.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
It's a fun Story Arc TF and can be done in an hour or half, I don't hate anything about it, just don't want to do it over and over again. Incarnate Trials are lvl 50+ and yes they can be hard to do.
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I'm going to preface the rest of my post with a disclaimer: if you're cynical, you can read what I say and distill it to "learn to play". That's not the spirit in which I post it. If you're willing to accept that, please read on.|
Originally Posted by Wing_Leader
If the most fun TF in the game requires a finely-tuned balance of just the right power sets and a group of players who know all the tricks of how to beat each mission, then it is by definition one of the least fun TFs in the game to me. Maybe it is fun when the "speed" version is mastered and you don't ever have to face any deaths (who has time to die when it is finished in 15 mins?), but speed runs don't appeal to me for various reasons and I'm unlikely to bother with the TF enough times to know how to speed through it.
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I think I've established in this thread that folks I regularly play with are among folks who know the ins-and-outs of this game well enough that the ITF is not very challenging to them, and wasn't deeply challenging even when it was brand new. Therefore, my typical experience with the ITF cannot be considered representative. Because of that, I in no way intend to compare your experience there to those I typically have.
However, what you described does not sound at all like what I am used to seeing when I play with other players, or when I hear other people talk about their (non-speed) ITFs. Generally, they perform much better, even if they find the ITF a real challenge.
What you're describing sounds to me like a combination of factors that had to contribute to the rough time the team had. A team in CoH is usually much greater than the sum of its parts, but sometimes that sum can be unusually small. Something that can make a team have a rougher time is when its constituent players have underperforming builds or playstyles. For example:
- Builds that aren't well slotted, even with just SOs
- Builds that don't take key powers that the devs do likely assume we take, like mez protection on melees, pets on Masterminds, or shields on bubblers and Cold Domination characters.
- Players who don't do important things when they should, like grab aggro off of squishies, heal with something other than an auto aura, etc.
This is especially true if the team's composition that cannot absorb some of the above issues. For example, if the team is mostly "squishies", no effective aggro holder, and not enough buffs or controls (mostly SO'd Blasters, for example). If you get something like that and the individual issues above, any content will be rough.
I think this sort of thing is the only way I can explain an ITF experience like what you're describing. The ITF is not trivial content, but it is also not content that a reasonably constructed team of reasonably performing characters should get killed on constantly, for the whole of theTF.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
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Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
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Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
I played a dug-style ITF tonight. Random PuG, leader decided to switch to his uber tank and run at +4. We had two MMs, two crabs, a stalker, and my fire/rad troller. Things went pretty well until we got to Rommy, but this is where the difference between a PuG and a run with the people I normally work with was apparent -- we didn't fully clear, we didn't even kill the minotaur and cyclops on either side of Rommy before jumping him. We wound up pounding him for 15-20 minutes while barely making a dent, before enough people died and we pulled back to regroup. I hospital'd to grab new inspirations, nobody else did that, then we decided to try again -- but we once again did not clear, did not discuss strategy, just jumped in. We did pull him to the grass this time, that helped. And we finally won. 2 hours, I gained 4 levels, can't complain about that at all.
So I guess that's doing it the challenging way. Personally I prefer a good steamroll run. ^_^
It amused me that Impy was level 54 though. He was handclapping and footstomping guys into oblivion, lol.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid
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Ha! I'm pretty sure I was on the same team on my Bots/Traps Painmachine; you were Indigo Rose, right? Part of the problem was that everyone was so used to just stomping Rommie flat that no one including me could seem to quite recall any other strategy. I got the shards & Notice to get my third tier Alpha, so it worked out OK.
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Originally Posted by Organica
I played a dug-style ITF tonight. Random PuG, leader decided to switch to his uber tank and run at +4. We had two MMs, two crabs, a stalker, and my fire/rad troller. Things went pretty well until we got to Rommy, but this is where the difference between a PuG and a run with the people I normally work with was apparent -- we didn't fully clear, we didn't even kill the minotaur and cyclops on either side of Rommy before jumping him. We wound up pounding him for 15-20 minutes while barely making a dent, before enough people died and we pulled back to regroup. I hospital'd to grab new inspirations, nobody else did that, then we decided to try again -- but we once again did not clear, did not discuss strategy, just jumped in. We did pull him to the grass this time, that helped. And we finally won. 2 hours, I gained 4 levels, can't complain about that at all.
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Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth
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Do you have super speed? A stealth IO? Softcapped defense? Do you use insps?|
Originally Posted by Scythus
Me. As I said before, speedruns on any TF always get me killed. Not fun.
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It doesn't take a whole lot to stay alive on speed runs when you have the above.
I am willing to set up an ITF again where we do a 'Shard Run' (=kill all) on +3 or +4...
When I usually give this option people are scared or don't have the time.
Is the OP willing to join such a run?
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I guess I will just have to not play with incarnates so the game has some challenge.
I don't mind that the game has incarnates. Just like I don't mind the game having farms - if people want to pay the devs and support the game while avoiding a challenge that's their choice. I find it boring, but I assume they find how I play boring.
my lil RWZ Challenge vid