Really, was it all about me?
By
Aneko,
Posted on: 2011-10-29 10:00 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
I only know of one place where the wild 
can be found... You should definitely be playing redside to avoid stuff like this. (-:
Why didn't you just move on?
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I wanted to attempt to make the team right. I would have eventually moved on if things didn't get fixed, but I wanted to attempt to fix things. Then I was kicked. After that, I had my convo and logged out. I logged out partly because I was disgusted with the convo I had, and partly because I wanted to watch the MSU v. Nebraska game. =)|
Originally Posted by LISAR
Why didn't you just move on?
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The reason I convo'd the person who was saying that I just wanted "free XP", was to legitimately explain my case and hopfully educate the person as to why I was making a simple request. I really, honestly was not trying to start a fight, I simply wanted to tell the person that I was not out solely for "free xp."
Yeah people are not always near their thinking caps during large events. Chalk it up to human fault and move on.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
This is slightly off-topic, but why do people ToT in a league rather than in regular teams? I think I missed something somewhere.
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If your team was in agreement with you about the problem, you could have withdrawn them from the league and gone to another zone.
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League leader fail. Don't sweat it, that guy is a tool.
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Just out of curiosity, were the teams locked? Because you could've just assigned the star to a 50 on your team, you don't have to be the league leader to do that... unless, it was locked.
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Originally Posted by DocBenway
....At some point I became the leader of my team in the league. This obviously was a problem since we were in PI and i'm level 36. Nobody on my team could open doors, or make a meaningful contribution to the battle. I asked the league leader to fix the teams and was ignored....
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I missed that too. I dunno either.
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Originally Posted by Primary_Unit
This is slightly off-topic, but why do people ToT in a league rather than in regular teams? I think I missed something somewhere.
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Yea, I'm not exactly sure either. I had just logged in and was looking for a team. I got invited to the league, and figured I'd just go with it. I realize that what the other teams in the league do doesn't count for my team, but honestly I was just happy to have a team.|
Originally Posted by Primary_Unit
This is slightly off-topic, but why do people ToT in a league rather than in regular teams? I think I missed something somewhere.
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Originally Posted by Aneko
If your team was in agreement with you about the problem, you could have withdrawn them from the league and gone to another zone.
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Originally Posted by Kismet Angel
Just out of curiosity, were the teams locked? Because you could've just assigned the star to a 50 on your team, you don't have to be the league leader to do that... unless, it was locked.
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Agreed, call it holiday/badging stress or whatever it may be but you're right, it's no excuse and they didn't have to say such things. Sometimes people just seem to forget that this is just a game.
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Correct (and a heroic thing to say!). He might have thought you were asking him to fix your problem for you, when you could have easily right-clicked and passed the star.|
Originally Posted by DocBenway
This I can take full responsibility for.
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That being said however, the league leader's response was WAY out of line, and you were right to petition him. Unfamiliarity with all of the game's nuances is not a crime. Especially with the influx of new and returning players, there's no reason to expect everybody on your team to understand all (or even any) of the mechanics. But the moment you put your feelings on your sleeve, you were putting yourself out there for the trolls.
If you were on most of the teams I've ran with on Virtue, you likely would have gotten a helpful, non-condescending explanation of the way teams work.
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So, here's my take on the whole thing.
You open a topic about a minor ingame incident, as to get reassurance that You Are A Good Person, while Other People Are Stupid. That's either misguided or manipulative, as there's only one side of the story and people are naturally inclined to agree with someone they know (you), as little as they might know about said person, than an unknown person or group (others). Said topic is filled with me, myself and I talk, which seems... Telling, considering its title.
You start to show passive aggressiveness in game by making snide comments regarding people's inabilities rather than address the problem directly like a reasonable person trying to communicate, and keep it up by cheaply jumping on the chance to report someone as soon as a bad word is said.
Then you switch to the offensive and send tells to someone. It's hard to see more than two reasons for someone to do that: either you are, indeed, that self-centered to think that any random stranger would care so much about you that they absolutely had to hear your justification (or even more self-centered than that and don't even think about the point of view of the other person), or trollish and aggressively trying to argue.
By your own account all that guy did was make one comment, something that might have been said snidely or in jest, but certainly not some kind of detailed personal attack against you or anything that might warrant starting a holy crusade in private for the purpose of reestablishing your good name.
To my eyes this person is the victim, and you're harassing them. On top of the aforementioned unsollicited conversation, your manner of speech is overly provocative. Repeated uses of "lol" or any other words implying that you're laughing at them, as well as mentioning the boards... Again, those are either tactics one expects to see from a troll, or blurts from someone so mad with rage they try to fake amusement, but certainly not something anyone genuinely trying to have a discussion and clear up some misconceptions should do.
The final straw is you ignoring them right after saying something - and a question to boot! After you initiated the whole convo! Extremely hard to see anything in that but someone who can't deal with the potential reply and/or wants to infuriate the other person.
I don't know anything about you save for this thread. I won't claim you're a terrible person or anything. However, I would certainly avoid you ingame, because I'm simply not playing a video game to get into disproportionate and fruitless arguments with random strangers everytime I say something. I suspect some other people might feel the same way.
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You're certainly entitled to your view on things, and I can agree with you that this comes solely from my point of view. I wish you could have been there to see the whole thing play out. Unfortunately I didn't capture everything that was said, and was only able to get a snippet of the entire conversation. I didn't, in fact, igonore him directly after asking a question. There were a few more things said, and then I ignored him.|
Originally Posted by Nihilii
So, here's my take on the whole thing.
You open a topic about a minor ingame incident, as to get reassurance that You Are A Good Person, while Other People Are Stupid. That's either misguided or manipulative, as there's only one side of the story and people are naturally inclined to agree with someone they know (you), as little as they might know about said person, than an unknown person or group (others). Said topic is filled with me, myself and I talk, which seems... Telling, considering its title. You start to show passive aggressiveness in game by making snide comments regarding people's inabilities rather than address the problem directly like a reasonable person trying to communicate, and keep it up by cheaply jumping on the chance to report someone as soon as a bad word is said. Then you switch to the offensive and send tells to someone. It's hard to see more than two reasons for someone to do that: either you are, indeed, that self-centered to think that any random stranger would care so much about you that they absolutely had to hear your justification (or even more self-centered than that and don't even think about the point of view of the other person), or trollish and aggressively trying to argue. By your own account all that guy did was make one comment, something that might have been said snidely or in jest, but certainly not some kind of detailed personal attack against you or anything that might warrant starting a holy crusade in private for the purpose of reestablishing your good name. To my eyes this person is the victim, and you're harassing them. On top of the aforementioned unsollicited conversation, your manner of speech is overly provocative. Repeated uses of "lol" or any other words implying that you're laughing at them, as well as mentioning the boards... Again, those are either tactics one expects to see from a troll, or blurts from someone so mad with rage they try to fake amusement, but certainly not something anyone genuinely trying to have a discussion and clear up some misconceptions should do. The final straw is you ignoring them right after saying something - and a question to boot! After you initiated the whole convo! Extremely hard to see anything in that but someone who can't deal with the potential reply and/or wants to infuriate the other person. I don't know anything about you save for this thread. I won't claim you're a terrible person or anything. However, I would certainly avoid you ingame, because I'm simply not playing a video game to get into disproportionate and fruitless arguments with random strangers everytime I say something. I suspect some other people might feel the same way. |
Where you are certainly wrong is my intent to have people stroke my ego and tell me that I'm a really good person. I was genuinly curious about whether what I did was out of line or not. According to you, it was out of line. Fair enough, and point taken.
When I sent the /tell to the person that I had the convo with I was not trying to start an argument or go on the "offensive." I was simply trying to communicate a possible misunderstanding, and wanted to let this person know where I was coming from. I started out being very civil towards this person. I am certainly not a troll. I detest arguing. It may be hard for you to accept, but I can't stress enough how much I was simply trying to inform him why I was acting the way I was in a very civil and non-argumentative way. I didn't want to have the conversation in broadcast or the help channel or any other public channel. It only devolved into "lolz" and other unhelpful talk after I was repeatedly accused of being self centered. Like I said before, I didn't catch that part of the convo in time. You'll just have to take my word on it (even though it sounds like you've already made your decision about that).
The way you make it sound is that I initiated a private conversation with this person, and immediatly started in on them with condescending and inappropriate talk. This is certainly not the case.
In the end, you're absolutely right. This is only coming from my point of view, and the other person is not here to defend themselves.
I wish you could have been there to see the whole thing play out. I'm not out to make other peoples experience terrible, and I'm certainly not out to attack anyone. I was simply trying to communicate in a respectable manner with someone, and it all went to hell.
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The game is full of people to have potentially rewarding conversations with, but seriously, don't expect this from just anyone with a game account and a keyboard. Also realize, to that guy, you might have come off as the troll, based on your persistence alone. Find some good people to play with on a regular basis, and absolutely leave your feelings at the door when you enter any random pick up group. You have no idea who those people are, or how much compassion they have for the average Joe. I believe in the inherent good in many people, but some people in this world just aren't reasonable. The moment you let strangers know their behavior has affected your mood, they'll come out of the woodwork to drag you down even further. Hey, it's the Internet. They may even think they're the ones in the right. You can't win that game, so don't play it. That reality applies to these forums, too. |
Originally Posted by DocBenway
I was simply trying to communicate in a respectable manner with someone, and it all went to hell.
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If you don't like how a team is being handled, go form your own. Back seat leading is bad.
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-wipes eyes- Thanks that was hysterical.
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Originally Posted by Nihilii
So, here's my take on the whole thing.
You open a topic about a minor ingame incident, as to get reassurance that You Are A Good Person, while Other People Are Stupid. That's either misguided or manipulative, as there's only one side of the story and people are naturally inclined to agree with someone they know (you), as little as they might know about said person, than an unknown person or group (others). Said topic is filled with me, myself and I talk, which seems... Telling, considering its title. You start to show passive aggressiveness in game by making snide comments regarding people's inabilities rather than address the problem directly like a reasonable person trying to communicate, and keep it up by cheaply jumping on the chance to report someone as soon as a bad word is said. Then you switch to the offensive and send tells to someone. It's hard to see more than two reasons for someone to do that: either you are, indeed, that self-centered to think that any random stranger would care so much about you that they absolutely had to hear your justification (or even more self-centered than that and don't even think about the point of view of the other person), or trollish and aggressively trying to argue. By your own account all that guy did was make one comment, something that might have been said snidely or in jest, but certainly not some kind of detailed personal attack against you or anything that might warrant starting a holy crusade in private for the purpose of reestablishing your good name. To my eyes this person is the victim, and you're harassing them. On top of the aforementioned unsollicited conversation, your manner of speech is overly provocative. Repeated uses of "lol" or any other words implying that you're laughing at them, as well as mentioning the boards... Again, those are either tactics one expects to see from a troll, or blurts from someone so mad with rage they try to fake amusement, but certainly not something anyone genuinely trying to have a discussion and clear up some misconceptions should do. The final straw is you ignoring them right after saying something - and a question to boot! After you initiated the whole convo! Extremely hard to see anything in that but someone who can't deal with the potential reply and/or wants to infuriate the other person. I don't know anything about you save for this thread. I won't claim you're a terrible person or anything. However, I would certainly avoid you ingame, because I'm simply not playing a video game to get into disproportionate and fruitless arguments with random strangers everytime I say something. I suspect some other people might feel the same way. |
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Why did you keep pestering someone?|
Originally Posted by DocBenway
I wanted to attempt to make the team right. I would have eventually moved on if things didn't get fixed, but I wanted to attempt to fix things. Then I was kicked. After that, I had my convo and logged out. I logged out partly because I was disgusted with the convo I had, and partly because I wanted to watch the MSU v. Nebraska game. =)
The reason I convo'd the person who was saying that I just wanted "free XP", was to legitimately explain my case and hopfully educate the person as to why I was making a simple request. I really, honestly was not trying to start a fight, I simply wanted to tell the person that I was not out solely for "free xp." |
Why did you make this thread?
Just let go!
Move on.
Enjoy life or at least the game.
How much free time do you have that THIS is a concern?
Even trolls would have moved on to something else by this point.
I know! I keep a vacation home under a bridge.
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See, right here? This is where it went off track. Your dismissive "lol" should have been the simple explanation that with you as leader your team was conning far below the enemy, as a result they were unable to hit or damage the mobs. It's a very simple explanation. |
Originally Posted by DocBenway
me: honestly, i expected the -bare minimum- me: that i could open doors him/her: It was... me: couldn't even do that me: literally all i could do is stand there and do nothing him/her: Then how it that the problem of the team? me: lol |
Might I ask why you "lol"ed? Did you expect that the lead knew your level and/or the mechanics of the conning system?
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and the leader wasn't dismissive with the "how's that the teams problem?"|
Originally Posted by ketch
See, right here? This is where it went off track. Your dismissive "lol" should have been the simple explanation that with you as leader your team was conning far below the enemy, as a result they were unable to hit or damage the mobs. It's a very simple explanation.
Might I ask why you "lol"ed? Did you expect that the lead knew your level and/or the mechanics of the conning system? |
I'd lol too if a league leader provided such a daft response.
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Having seen a very nice person attempt to lead a ToT league and struggle with sorting teams, I'm willing to give the league leader the benefit of the doubt in that they either did not realize that Doc was not 50 or did not understand the conning system. However, yes, the leader too was a bit dismissive. Even now there are people ignorant to how forming and organizing leagues functions. Even Doc himself did not know that you could promote within the team if it was unlocked.|
Originally Posted by Mr. DJ
and the leader wasn't dismissive with the "how's that the teams problem?"
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How's the old saying go, "Never attribute to maliciousness what can be explained by ignorance", or something to that effect?
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I certainly do. But not about the OP; I would avoid you. |
Originally Posted by Nihilii
I don't know anything about you save for this thread. I won't claim you're a terrible person or anything. However, I would certainly avoid you ingame, because I'm simply not playing a video game to get into disproportionate and fruitless arguments with random strangers everytime I say something. I suspect some other people might feel the same way.
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I'd hardly consider the League Leader nice if they're kicking people asking for them to fix the problem and/or randomly calling people "incompotant" and trolls, and wrongly at that.|
Originally Posted by ketch
Having seen a very nice person attempt to lead a ToT league and struggle with sorting teams, I'm willing to give the league leader the benefit of the doubt in that they either did not realize that Doc was not 50 or did not understand the conning system. However, yes, the leader too was a bit dismissive. Even now there are people ignorant to how forming and organizing leagues functions. Even Doc himself did not know that you could promote within the team if it was unlocked.
How's the old saying go, "Never attribute to maliciousness what can be explained by ignorance", or something to that effect? |
If there's any crime here...it's the murder of basic English from the person he talked to...
I joined a ToT league today in Peregrine Island. I was on my level 36 MM and went to go start arresting the holiday bad guys. I got to the giant motel where the big teams do their door clicking and started opening doors and arresting the bad guys.
At some point I became the leader of my team in the league. This obviously was a problem since we were in PI and i'm level 36. Nobody on my team could open doors, or make a meaningful contribution to the battle. I asked the league leader to fix the teams and was ignored. I asked a couple more times with no response. I told the leader that the entire team was ineffective and that i was only level 36, to which I finally got a reponse of "we're doing it for badges." I can understand that they're only doing it for badges and not XP, thats fine with me. But my entire team was completely ineffective at even getting the defeat badges. After my continued asking to fix the teams I got kicked.
After that I made a comment about people not paying attention and not being able to organize their team appropriately and that maybe they should learn how to do that. Well, I got called a &^*^%$# retard, and then somone said somthing along the lines of ... oh you're sad cuz you can't get free experience. He didn't say that exact quote, but it was definitely along those lines.
So, I reported the person who called me a &^*^%$( retard, and then sent a tell to the person who was claiming that i was just around for free xp. I wanted to state my case w/out any kind of name calling or aggressive debate. I explained to him that I really wanted to play the game and that my entire team was completely ineffective, and I just wanted the league leader to fix the team. What followed was this person claiming that I was being selfish and wanting everything centered around me, and that "what was i to expect? this isn't a planned league." This is the rest of the conversation after that.....
me: honestly, i expected the -bare minimum-
me: that i could open doors
him/her: It was...
me: couldn't even do that
me: literally all i could do is stand there and do nothing
him/her: Then how it that the problem of the team?
me: lol
him/her: Why wasent it about you?
me: cuz i'm trying to play a game, and was completely ineffective
him/her: Oh right! It was about you sorry... Your just complaining
me: LOL
me: this conversation is definitely going up on the boards.....
him/her: HAve a nice day troll, and think twice next time about what YOU can do to improve things
me: hahahahahahah!
me: i was just trying to explain myself to you and you're saying its all about me?
me: woiw
him/her: Dont blame others cause your imcompotant
me: errr wow
me: lol
me: how am i incompetant when the leader won't make the teams proper?
That was pretty much the end of the conversation. After that I ignored the person and logged off.
I'm honestly curious if I was really being that selfish and asking too much?