We Paid for These Paragon Points, Mr. Positron
By
all_hell,
Posted on: 2011-10-06 08:42 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Another week? Call the FBI!
Edit: not sure why this couldn't be posted in the original thread created by Zwill that is referenced in this thread... 
*shrugs*
I'm just waiting until next week for Street Justice. No biggie, got plenty of other characters to work on.
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It's my understanding that these points/tokens will still be awarded in the correct month, just not on the the correct day. Is that wrong somehow?
I'm fine with things if I get my points a week late or a week early. Same with tokens. I'm not fine if I don't get my points/tokens for a given month at all, or if I get none for two months then suddenly get three months worth all at once.
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That's also my understanding, which is why I think this duplicate thread is much ado about nothing.
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Originally Posted by Emberly
It's my understanding that these points/tokens will still be awarded in the correct month, just not on the the correct day. Is that wrong somehow?
I'm fine with things if I get my points a week late or a week early. Same with tokens. I'm not fine if I don't get my points/tokens for a given month at all, or if I get none for two months then suddenly get three months worth all at once. |
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Fortunately I find myself in a position where I'm not really going to have to rely on the monthly grant of points to get what I really want from the Market. As long as I get the those points at some point I don't really care if it's today or two weeks from now.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
Obviously the first order of business is to fix this billing-related error as quickly as possible. Fixing this, however, looks like a long- or medium-term issue, a matter of "months" rather than weeks. Here's hoping Zwillinger will have more news for us soon.
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I realize that many people are counting on having and using those points more than I am, but I just want to make it clear that not every VIPer is going to find this situation as critical as others. I trust that the Devs will eventually have these problems squared away and I'm willing to allow them the time to do that before I get too worried about it.
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OP misunderstood the topic. There's nothing wrong with the paragon points distribution, the delay is there because they gave you points in advance, so they are purposefully holding off until mid October to put that back on schedule. It is by design, there are no missing points and there's no problem to fix. That topic was about reward tokens which due to the underlying mechanics of the system will be given out at a different time than previously stated.
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This isn't an issue of patience, but one of customer service. It's further compounded by potentially missing out on sales for months to come. Again, it's a significant problem that there's no timetable or deadline for resolution.|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
Another week? Call the FBI!
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Edit: not sure why this couldn't be posted in the original thread created by Zwill that is referenced in this thread...
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Really? A weeks delay is that big of a deal to you? You know they are coming, you even know when. They'll be a month apart near enough from the first date. |
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
This isn't an issue of patience, but one of customer service. It's further compounded by potentially missing out on sales for months to come. Again, it's a significant problem that there's no timetable or deadline for resolution.
While I've already posted there, this particular problem is also one in a series of difficulties with service that we've been experiencing. Bringing up this overarching issue there would just be derailing the thread. At some point, this is going to affect the playerbase's morale. It would be reassuring if Paragon could give an indication, or better still a good will gesture, that they appreciate this. |
You really appear to be making a mountain out of a mole hill here.
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Looks like I'm an affected subscriber. My subscription date is the 4th, so for the next few months I'll have to wait an extra week until the 11th to get my monthly allotment of bonus points.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
The next important issue for Paragon Studios is how to retain the good will for affected subscribers and the playerbase in general.
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Considering that they're giving me 400 extra points per month, and also that I received 1600 points at the launch of Freedom when I only expected 1200, it's going to take a lot more than this for Paragon Studios to lose my good will.
I'm still trying to figure out if the OP is being completely serious.
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Yes, they do. It was in the post you quoted. By October 13, Point grants will be caught up do date to the beginning of a billing cycle. Token grants happen at the end of a billing cycle.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
Unfortunately, Paragon Studios does not yet have a timetable for when we can expect this problem to be corrected or indeed a definite endpoint for when everything will be resolved.
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/done
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Wow. Folks sure can get into a hissy over virtual goods, can't they? To me it's just a game and I can wait as long as it takes to accrue the allotment of default PP points I need for whatever. There is no life or death issue associated with any of this stuff. So much ado about "I want pretend stuff nao". Patience, grasshopper, patience.
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That's a philosophical attitude to take individually.|
Originally Posted by Lothic
Fortunately I find myself in a position where I'm not really going to have to rely on the monthly grant of points to get what I really want from the Market. As long as I get the those points at some point I don't really care if it's today or two weeks from now.
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It does not alter the basic arrangement between Paragon Studios and "VIP" customers that the subscription comes with a stipend of 400 monthly points for the market awarded on the player's renewal date.
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Originally Posted by Zaion
There's nothing wrong with the paragon points distribution, the delay is there because they gave you points in advance, so they are purposefully holding off until mid October to put that back on schedule.
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Originally Posted by Diggis
You really appear to be making a mountain out of a mole hill here.
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The indisputable fact, however, is that this is yet another problem directly related to CoH Freedom. Even if it's the last (if anyone wants to take that bet), Paragon has a compounded customer service problem on their hands.
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Me too.
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Originally Posted by Red_Raccoon
I'm still trying to figure out if the OP is being completely serious.
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Where to now?
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Except, it's not really that big of an issue. It's a few day, which in the grand scheme of things is nothing really. Heck, I don't even know when my billing date is.
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
This is a cut-and-dried customer service issue. There are neither mountains nor molehills being made here, nor even any recommendations about what Paragon Studios should do as far as compensation might go.
The indisputable fact, however, is that this is yet another problem directly related to CoH Freedom. Even if it's the last (if anyone wants to take that bet), Paragon has a compounded customer service problem on their hands. |
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I'm affected also but per Wednesday's UStream chat they will be fixing this. Because it is tied to some weird glitch in the whole system they apparently can't just reset it automatically. Instead they will pull back the date a little each month until February when they should finally have it sorted out and fixed entirely. So each month between now and February they will award the points sooner in the month and as it catches up with your billing date it will be awarded.
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Originally Posted by Red_Raccoon
Looks like I'm an affected subscriber. My subscription date is the 4th, so for the next few months I'll have to wait an extra week until the 11th to get my monthly allotment of bonus points.
Considering that they're giving me 400 extra points per month, and also that I received 1600 points at the launch of Freedom when I only expected 1200, it's going to take a lot more than this for Paragon Studios to lose my good will. I'm still trying to figure out if the OP is being completely serious. |
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Let me give you a refresher here. You did not buy those. Your money is for your subscription which grants you VIP level access to the game. Those points and reward tokens are bonuses that are supplied free. To put it bluntly, you are complaining about a freebie!
Now, had you actually bought those points, you'd have a case. As it is, those are free points and tokens, which means you can accept that you will not get them on your own terms or cancel your subscription and not get them at all. Do remember that if Paragon Studio decides to, they can scrub the bonus points and reward tokens from VIP accounts at their own discretion and the most you can do is cancel your subscription.
They have notified you of a delay on the free points. Accept it and move on. There's nothing on the market that's an immediate must have anyway.
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There's nothing to fix. There's no problem. You got points in advance, you are ahead of everyone else, now you are slowed down a little for a month while other people catch up.
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
Except that this will now take months to fix, plural, with no established endpoint. If this had been a short-term problem, or even one that had an anticipated finish, it would be a different mater.
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And they are working on fixing it. Apparently it isn't as simple as just pushing a reset buttton so to get every synchronized right will take until February 2012.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
This is a cut-and-dried customer service issue. There are neither mountains nor molehills being made here, nor even any recommendations about what Paragon Studios should do as far as compensation might go.
The indisputable fact, however, is that this is yet another problem directly related to CoH Freedom. Even if it's the last (if anyone wants to take that bet), Paragon has a compounded customer service problem on their hands. |
So yes you are making a mountain out of a mole hill because they have responded rapidly and appropriately. Just not in the way you might have wanted.
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"I'm all right, Jack."|
Originally Posted by Fritzy
Patience, grasshopper, patience.
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Originally Posted by Diggis
Heck, I don't even know when my billing date is.
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Originally Posted by LordLundar
Let me give you a refresher here. You did not buy those. Your money is for your subscription which grants you VIP level access to the game. Those points and reward tokens are bonuses that are supplied free.
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I think good customer service would be to tell the customers about the problem and offer an intermediate solution (there may be a week or two of delay getting your points each month until the DB catches up to the rewarding mechanism).|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
This isn't an issue of patience, but one of customer service. It's further compounded by potentially missing out on sales for months to come. Again, it's a significant problem that there's no timetable or deadline for resolution.
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That's definitely what we need.
<Somebody whispers into my ear at this point>
Oh, it's already been done? Cool. The mission is complete. Let's go eat sushi or something.
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And you're making assumptions not backed up by facts.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
You're under a misapprehension about the new system. Everything except basic access to the game is now monetized. "Freebies" were such things as new costume pieces or the Mission Architect system that were introduced to all subscribers under the old business model and which are now offered on the Paragon Market. That is the reason why VIPers get a stipend, which is part of their subscription package. So, yes, those points are something we've paid for.
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We received two new costume sets and one new powerset with i21. Free. We have been told that we will continue to receive free sets in addition to the store sets. If this is true, then not everything is being "monetized" for subscribers.
The free allotment of points over and above our subscription fee will allow us to pick and choose from a wider variety powersets, costumes, and such *over time* than ever before. Putting them in the store instead of tying their release to a full Issue brings them to us faster than ever before, so if you want to spend money on them you can, but if you choose to use just your free points, you can save them up and get them over time as you would have if you relied strictly on Issues and expansions.
It's entirely possible that the "free" costumes and sets paired with what we can pick up with our monthly stipend will exceed what we received on average under the old system. We won't know until enough time has passed to allow for analysis.
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To reiterate, that's months plural, not singular. If that were the case, this wouldn't even be a discussion. Indeed, if all players were on the same schedule and could play regularly every day from week to week, it wouldn't be an issue either. That's not how things are in real life.|
Originally Posted by Zaion
now you are slowed down a little for a month while other people catch up.
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Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
I'm affected also but per Wednesday's UStream chat they will be fixing this. Because it is tied to some weird glitch in the whole system they apparently can't just reset it automatically. Instead they will pull back the date a little each month until February when they should finally have it sorted out and fixed entirely. So each month between now and February they will award the points sooner in the month and as it catches up with your billing date it will be awarded.
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As it stands, some players can now look forward to months of missing out on regular sales. After repeated server downtime, unscheduled maintenance, market bugs and inaccessibility, Freedom's eleventh-hour delay, the end of level pacts, etc., etc., what's one more glitch between Paragon and paying customers?
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From my reading quote, looks like you get points every month, just what day of month changes. How is this equating to being months behind?
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
To reiterate, that's months plural, not singular. If that were the case, this wouldn't even be a discussion. Indeed, if all players were on the same schedule and could play regularly every day from week to week, it wouldn't be an issue either. That's not how things are in real life.
Thank you, that's actually a piece of solid information (not mentioned in Von Krieger's helpful summary). Unfortunately, Zwillinger did not specify this in his post, so either the situation has changed or further clarification is necessary. As it stands, some players can now look forward to months of missing out on regular sales. After repeated server downtime, unscheduled maintenance, market bugs and inaccessibility, Freedom's eleventh-hour delay, the end of level pacts, etc., etc., what's one more glitch between Paragon and paying customers? |
I think it would be amusing if Paragon resolved this by refunding the OP's sub and locking his account...
After reports of missing Paragon Points and Reward Tokens, our diligent community manager Zwillinger has stepped in to alert the CoH community to a significant problem with the VIP billing cycle:
So how will VIP subscribers be awarded their monthly stipends and Reward Tokens?
Lets address your Paragon Points first. If your game account has a bill day between the 1st of the month to the 10th of the month, you should expect your October stipend of Paragon Points on October 11th, provided your VIP subscription continues. Over the next few months, your stipend date will line up with your bill date as long as you maintain the VIP status of your game account. If your game account has a bill day between the 11th of the month to the 31st of the month, you will receive your Paragon Points on your game accounts billing date, as long as you maintain the VIP status of your game account.
The monthly Paragon Reward Tokens are awarded differently. They follow the same schedule as the old Veteran Reward program. This means you may not receive them on the same date that you receive your monthly VIP Paragon Rewards Points. Veteran rewards are were calculated based on the time your game account is was actually playable with active paid game time, and not just based on your bill date. Just as a temporary block changed your Veteran Reward dates, these types of things changes to your game account will also change the date you receive your monthly VIP Paragon Reward Tokens. You also have to play out the month of game time before receiving the tokens. You may pay for time in advance, but you have to play out the time before you receive your next reward.
We sincerely apologize for any confusion that this may have caused. I know that many are anxious to receive their monthly points, especially in light of our weekly releases in the Paragon Market. Hopefully this post will help set expectations moving forward and allay concerns you have about receiving your points for October.
Thanks!
-Z
Obviously the first order of business is to fix this billing-related error as quickly as possible. Fixing this, however, looks like a long- or medium-term issue, a matter of "months" rather than weeks. Here's hoping Zwillinger will have more news for us soon.
The next important issue for Paragon Studios is how to retain the good will for affected subscribers and the playerbase in general. Positron has on numerous occasions declared how much they value CoH's devoted community and clearly appreciates that once good will is lost, it's incredibly difficult to regain. The issue of how to preserve this abstract quantity also overlaps with addressing other recent problems that have come up during the launch of CoH Freedom (e.g. the erratic server behavior and downtime, unscheduled server maintenance, the last-minute delay of VIP head start, the Mac client's stability issues and market access, etc., not to mention the on-going logout bug in the forums). This rather large ball is of course in Paragon's court. In other threads about game-related problems, people have suggested everything from partial refunds and extra Paragon Points to special badges, costume parts, or emotes and double-XP weekends. There may well be remedies that Paragon has already been considering behind closed doors and is on the verge of announcing. We can only wait to see what the next move will be.
Meanwhile, anyone whose billing cycle lands on the first third of the month can expect their VIP Paragon Points to be held in escrow for another week.