We Paid for These Paragon Points, Mr. Positron
By
all_hell,
Posted on: 2011-10-06 08:42 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
My billing date was Oct 3.... I don't fee l like I'm "months behind" if I get my points on October 11. I'm a little miffed I don't get a token until November 3, but hey.
Seriously, some of these threads are just sad. They don't NEED to compensate us for every time we get a wrinkle in our panties.
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Won't keep people from posting a picture of the wrinkled knickers though.
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Originally Posted by Feycat
My billing date was Oct 3.... I don't fee l like I'm "months behind" if I get my points on October 11. I'm a little miffed I don't get a token until November 3, but hey.
Seriously, some of these threads are just sad. They don't NEED to compensate us for every time we get a wrinkle in our panties. |
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If you mean that subscribers will no longer get free goodies with each issue and we'll have to buy all that stuff with points instead, I have yet to see any evidence to support that conclusion. Issue 21 came with plenty of freebies for subscribers and Paragon has promised to continue this trend. Looks to me like the Market really just replaced the old expansion packs they used to offer. Except there's more stuff offered, I can buy items piecemeal if I want, |
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
You're under a misapprehension about the new system. Everything except basic access to the game is now monetized. "Freebies" were such things as new costume pieces or the Mission Architect system that were introduced to all subscribers under the old business model and which are now offered on the Paragon Market.
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and I get $5 to spend each month before even usuing any of my own money. Sound pretty good to me. I'm certainly not complaining just because I get those points a little late for a little while.
Well, it's not a long delay so I'm not THAT bothered, but really Paragon... this is pretty simple stuff to code... Doesn't engender a lot of confidence, y'know?
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Is anyone else finding it odd that the OP is telling us of the severity of this problem and the hue and cry that shall inevitably follow it... while being told be literally every other person in the thread that it's just no big deal?
Someone's not having a reasonable perspective here. It's either the OP, or it's every single other person.
Make your own judgements based on that.
"Strength of numbers is the delight of the timid. The valiant in spirit glory in fighting alone."
- Mahatma Gandhi
Still CoHzy after all these years...
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I get it. You have your hand out. Another entitlement thread. <yawn>
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Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
The next important issue for Paragon Studios is how to retain the good will
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My points are delayed and yet I still have good will. I accomplished this mighty feat by not being an entitled ******. I highly recommend it to others!
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This claim that there will be no more free things given in the game and you will have to buy it all has been made ever since the first booster set went on sale. It wasn't true then and it isn't true now.
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Originally Posted by Red_Raccoon
If you mean that subscribers will no longer get free goodies with each issue and we'll have to buy all that stuff with points instead, I have yet to see any evidence to support that conclusion. Issue 21 came with plenty of freebies for subscribers and Paragon has promised to continue this trend. Looks to me like the Market really just replaced the old expansion packs they used to offer. Except there's more stuff offered, I can buy items piecemeal if I want,
and I get $5 to spend each month before even usuing any of my own money. Sound pretty good to me. I'm certainly not complaining just because I get those points a little late for a little while. |
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
List of Invention Guides
A week ago there was a thread about this in the Technical forum that explained that subscribers with a start date earlier than the 11th got their points for September in advance because COH Freedom was released after their regular date. What Zwillinger is saying now contradicts this. Zwill's saying we'll get our points on the 11th; before they were saying we wouldn't get any at all. I prefer Zwill's scenario.
But TrueGentleman is right. There shouldn't have been this level of misunderstanding in the first place.
This isn't about points, or tokens, or even how much money and time we've put into the game. It's about the confusion of this new system, and what appears to be intentional obfuscation on the part of Paragon Studios. CoH contains some of the smartest players in any MMO, and we are more knowledgeable about this game than any other game community. If a game company intends to turn us into puppets, we can see the strings being tied to our fingers.
Microtransactions, multiple currencies, essentially worthless giveaways and 'technical problems' that encourage players to make impulse buys -- these are tricks used by amoral companies to addict players and squeeze money off of them. And all of them came at the expense of actually improving the game.
Now we have a delay in reward points that just happens to coincide with the release of a long-awaited powerset. But this 'technical problem' can be overcome easily by just giving them extra money. Isn't that convenient.
These incidents are eroding my trust in this game and the developers behind it. All of CoH Freedom seems shady to me so far. It feels like there's a shell game going on and I've lost track of where they're hiding the ball.
...
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The thing is that the money I spent, a yearly subscription, which is now being applied to Freedom, was spent in a chunk.
I am receiving less value for that money than if I had held on to it and spent it today.
The decreased value comes, in part, from having less time to enjoy the fruits of that expenditure--I could be playing w/ w/e things from the Store atm if I had not given them the money in advance.
But, because I gave them the money in advance, the amount of time I have to enjoy the items from the store is decreased because I cannot purchase the items for months to come even though I paid for the points to spend before the people who waited until now to pay.
So, annual subscribers are getting less value for their money than those who waited until now to give NCSoft their cash.
I may be mistaken, but I think that this is, in part, what the OP was addressing.
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I thought that was just for October, not from now on. Am I mistaken?
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Originally Posted by Red_Raccoon
Looks like I'm an affected subscriber. My subscription date is the 4th, so for the next few months I'll have to wait an extra week until the 11th to get my monthly allotment of bonus points.
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I guess I'm one of the dumber MMO players, because I don't see it.|
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
CoH contains some of the smartest players in any MMO, and we are more knowledgeable about this game than any other game community. If a game company intends to turn us into puppets, we can see the strings being tied to our fingers.
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| Now we have a delay in reward points that just happens to coincide with the release of a long-awaited powerset. But this 'technical problem' can be overcome easily by just giving them extra money. Isn't that convenient. |
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They said it would take a few months for the point allocation date to align with our subscription dates. It wasn't clear to me if the allocation date will remain on the 11th until fixed, or if it will slowly move closer to the correct date each month. Either way, not a big concern for me.
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Originally Posted by all_hell
I thought that was just for October, not from now on. Am I mistaken?
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My free stuff arrives based on confusing and conflicting algorithms! I want my money back!
--NT
They all laughed at me when I said I wanted to be a comedian.
But I showed them, and nobody's laughing at me now!
If I became a red name, I would be all "and what would you mere mortals like to entertain me with today, mu hu ha ha ha!" ~Arcanaville
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Are our points and tokens etc free now? Cause if so, then I got scammed cuz I paid money this year that is ostensibly being applied to my account to gain the stuff. But if the stuff is free, why are they keeping my money? Or are you mistaken about our subscription benefits being "free"?|
Originally Posted by NuclearToast
My free stuff arrives based on confusing and conflicting algorithms! I want my money back!
--NT |
And I am still waiting on delivery. While waiting I cannot access the benefits of paying that money. However, if I had not paid them that money and had held on to it until now, I could enjoy the benefits of paying that money at the moment AND over the next several months. Instead I will spend the next several months waiting for the rest of what I purchased months ago to arrive. Thus when the point do finally arrive over the next several months I will acquire less playtime with the items I purchase.
It really needs to be understood that the delay of ten days (at most, depending on your billing date) plus the extra 400 points we got (400 points for July + August + September is 1,200, yet we got an additional month's worth) puts us all... ahead.
So, thank Paragon Studios for giving us more than they promised us.
Laugh at yourself if you spent all of it already and are miffed because you want more free points now.
Relax... Enjoy... Choose to stick with this game or not.
I'm a critical bastage... and I've got nothing to complain about regarding this.
Have they come off a bit... amateurish/haphazardly (in regards to not being aware what was going on with their new system)? I think so!
Does that bother/trouble me?
It's cool... Joe down the street sells stuff. He makes mistakes too. Sometimes I make them as well.
Paragon Studios has come through in the past and has been doing so currently as well.
This was a big free issue! Without any additional store or "Freedom" stuff... this was a cool issue. I'm looking forward to more. As usual!
Add in the free points and the additional stuff in the store... and, hey, so far, pretty cool!
Again, I'm a highly critical, budgeted, completionist (used to be anyway) who didn't want this new business model.
Things are okay! Morale is okay! The future looks promising!
Most of this is just opinion... but the fact that we got a full month's EXTRA Points completely makes up for any problem (perceived or otherwise) with a 10 day delay.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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Please check your sarcasm meter for accuracy before posting |
Originally Posted by all_hell
Are our points and tokens etc free now? Cause if so, then I got scammed cuz I paid money this year that is ostensibly being applied to my account to gain the stuff. But if the stuff is free, why are they keeping my money? Or are you mistaken about our subscription benefits being "free"?
And I am still waiting on delivery. While waiting I cannot access the benefits of paying that money. However, if I had not paid them that money and had held on to it until now, I could enjoy the benefits of paying that money at the moment AND over the next several months. Instead I will spend the next several months waiting for the rest of what I purchased months ago to arrive. Thus when the point do finally arrive over the next several months I will acquire less playtime with the items I purchase. |
Oh wait, you're actually serious. I'm sorry for you.
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*snarf*
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Originally Posted by Brillig
I think it would be amusing if Paragon resolved this by refunding the OP's sub and locking his account...
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If the game spit out 20 dollar bills people would complain that they weren't sequentially numbered. If they were sequentially numbered people would complain that they weren't random enough.
Black Pebble is my new hero.
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No you're not. You're getting the same amount of points, in fact you are getting them faster than everybody else. You got points on Sept 14th, then you get points on Oct 11th, that's less than a month, then you will get them on Nov 8th or something, again less than a month. You have overall accelerated point gain until your stipend aligns with your bill date. They couldn't give you points on the 14th and on the 2nd or 3rd or whatever because that would have been only 2 weeks between stipends which is ridiculous to expect. Honestly. You still have the bonus advanced stipend, and you'll still get your stipend for every single month you're subscribed. They are just buffering the date to keep them at close to a month apart like they should be.
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Originally Posted by all_hell
I am receiving less value for that money than if I had held on to it and spent it today.
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The paranoia inherent in this is amazing. You mean your being forced to spend money now to buy it? You can't wait 6 days from the release of the new stuff until you have points?|
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
Now we have a delay in reward points that just happens to coincide with the release of a long-awaited powerset. But this 'technical problem' can be overcome easily by just giving them extra money. Isn't that convenient.
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Does this mean that Positrons flying black thug squad will show up at your door to force you to buy points rather than waiting?
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
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I think the one point that has been missed from the OP or not explicitly given is that there are weekly sales, if your stipend comes in after that week (when it should have) you missed a sale.
The one thing that could happen is that sales could be extended to be 2 weeks long addressing one of the key issues that the OP has presented and knowing the problem will persist for the next few months as it is corrected, this would be a reasonable solution.
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The number of points IS the same. That is true. But that's not the issue. Points are worthless until I spend them and then use the purchased item in game. Using the purchased items is the value. The more time I have with the purchased item, the more time I have to gain value from having it. Conversely, the less time I have with it, the less time I have to gain value from it.|
Originally Posted by Zaion
No you're not. You're getting the same amount of points...
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Am I the only one who remembers the threads about GR being included in some bundle for free?
The argument was that the people who purchased GR for full price got the value of having it the whole time to play.
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Originally Posted by Zaion
..., in fact you are getting them faster than everybody else.
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The only thing that annoys me is that you get your token at the end of the cycle when it should be tied to the points at the beginning. When you pay for something you usually expect to get the product right away, not a month later.
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Again, this isn't about me, or points. It's about one way in which a company who is savvy about their users psychology can wring amoral profits from their microtransaction system.|
Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
The paranoia inherent in this is amazing. You mean your being forced to spend money now to buy it? You can't wait 6 days from the release of the new stuff until you have points?
Does this mean that Positrons flying black thug squad will show up at your door to force you to buy points rather than waiting? |
Let's say the game has 100,000 players. Let's say that 1% of them do not have the impulse control necessary to wait 10 days to get their points. They spend $10 to get the points to buy a new powerset, and the company gets $10,000 this month that they normally would not receive.
Next month they can play the same trick again with some other new content.
Microtransactions are a way to play on the psychology of gamers to wring additional profits out of them. Multiple currency systems are a way of obfuscating the amount of money the player is spending. All the game companies are switching to these systems and hiring psychologists to learn how to manipulate their playerbase. This isn't paranoia, it's an industry acknowledged practice. (Long article, but it presents the concepts very well.)
I don't mind this, mostly because it's everywhere. I just thought Paragon Studios was better than most companies and they wouldn't use their new Freedom system to do evil. But shady 'technical problems' make me question my confidence in them.
...
New Webcomic -- Genocide Man
Life is funny. Death is funnier. Mass slaughter can be hilarious.
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You're easily amazed. I spend time on some political forums, so maybe my bar for what constitutes amazing paranoia has gotten off kilter.|
Originally Posted by TerraDraconis
The paranoia inherent in this is amazing.
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I to have suspected that some of the snafu is a marketing ploy. Not that I have familiarity with the games marketers, but I have heard tell of other marketers behavior.
fyi "have suspected" is different from "do think"
This month I get my points on the 11th. Next month a bit sooner etc. etc. Until I'm getting them on my billing date.
But it's MY sadistic mechanical monster and I'm here to make sure it knows it. - Girl Genius
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