To address methods in which the community might adapt to particular circumstances...would those holding CCs consider holding a winner or runner-up's prize money effectively in escrow if the recipient were unable to claim it at the time?
A bit of a honey pot methodology, but you know what they say about flies.
[QUOTE=TrueGentleman;3830016
This is entirely typical in F2P systems, just like the have's-vs-have-not's community division, and should not be shocking.[/QUOTE]
Not much shocks me, a few things horrify me. 
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It seems that some of the limits on free and even premium players are going to affect subscribers in many ways that I fear will actually deepen the divide between VIPs and free/premium players, creating an even more distinct "class" hierarchy in the game. |
Originally Posted by Bright
Not being able to drop Inspirations on a free player seems like a harsher limitation than we really need. You can give them to current Trial players, and that really comes in handy when you're showing a completely new player the ropes and trying to convince them that the game is fun.
They're going to jump into fights they can't handle. They're going to make mistakes. They're going to go through their own supplies faster than they get them. Sure, they can just hit the hospital... but it's much quicker to hand off an Awaken, and you don't have to worry about them making it back across the zone to the door.  |
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It is if you don't have access to tells. In fact, it's not just hard, it's impossible. They may want to, but they simply won't have access. The question here is how can we maintain a culture that says blind invites are "rude" when there is not /t option for free players?
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Originally Posted by Selina_H
If you can't be arsed to send a short, simple message telling me level, location and activity, I'm not going to put myself to the trouble of joining your team to find out whether you're doing something I might actually want to participate in.
Like you said, it isn't hard. |
Still...and I must say this as loudly as possible, and yet remain in normal font!
Inspirations are a mechanical need for new players, old players, excellent players, and bad players. Drunk players (Hiya Pinacle) Sober players, Cat Girls, Lobster Bois, Demons, Prostitots, and everything ever invented. Without the ability to pass inspirations you break fluidity of the game, missions, and pretty much all content.
I don't want to sit in a sewer for half an hour waiting for people to return, and I don't think they want to either.
Cut trades for anything else and we can manage.
On another note...I guess I could totally merc my Empath and my red side Pain Corr out for missions to allow for smooth completion of a normal mission.
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. . . or have the range of vet and bought costume pieces that add to one's ability to create awesome costumes. Vet status cc's are very much better in these terms. And may actually be a good way "around" the inability to give ingame rewards to free players. It would be unfun to enter a cc knowing the first prize is $50m, second $25m, and third $10m (or whatever), to come in first and then have someone who came in third get more of a "prize" than you do. But if the cc is only open to freeps . . . well, that makes it seem more fair (though it does bring up that ugly specter of freeps being "other").
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Originally Posted by Amy_Amp
Pet peeve. I never really liked CCs just because the quality of the look was vastly in part related to how much a vet the player was. A 1 month player most likely isn't going to have the equal skill of a 5 year player. I thought doing CCs based on vet status was much better.
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Yes, the lack of inspiration-passing will affect everyone, but hey! maybe it will change the "accepted" (largely dismissive) view of emps in the game! Woohoo! I'll happily run my emps to help teams run missions more effectively and quickly.
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Originally Posted by Nyx
Still...and I must say this as loudly as possible, and yet remain in normal font!
Inspirations are a mechanical need for new players, old players, excellent players, and bad players. Drunk players (Hiya Pinacle) Sober players, Cat Girls, Lobster Bois, Demons, Prostitots, and everything ever invented. Without the ability to pass inspirations you break fluidity of the game, missions, and pretty much all content. I don't want to sit in a sewer for half an hour waiting for people to return, and I don't think they want to either. Cut trades for anything else and we can manage. On another note...I guess I could totally merc my Empath and my red side Pain Corr out for missions to allow for smooth completion of a normal mission. |
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Unless we have some way to tell that a particular invite is from a free player, it won't be reasonable to assume the person is being rude. |
Originally Posted by Tahliah
It is if you don't have access to tells. In fact, it's not just hard, it's impossible. They may want to, but they simply won't have access. The question here is how can we maintain a culture that says blind invites are "rude" when there is not /t option for free players?
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I don't object to blind invites because I think they're rude. It's the other way around - I think they're rude because I object to blind invites, and know that today people don't have to make them blind. In the future, I still won't like blind invites, and I will still most likely reject them. I just won't be able to assume that the person who sent them could do any better.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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I was referring to current players who refuse to send tells before inviting because it's too much work, not new F2P players who obviously will not be able to do so due to game limitations.|
Originally Posted by Tahliah
It is if you don't have access to tells. In fact, it's not just hard, it's impossible. They may want to, but they simply won't have access. The question here is how can we maintain a culture that says blind invites are "rude" when there is not /t option for free players?
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As for your question, I don't have an answer. I'm likely to continue to ignore blind invites as I do now. Unfortunately F2Pers who *would* have sent a tell but can't may end up as casualties of the system.
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Ha! It seems we were talking at cross purposes; I don't currently accept blind invites either (for the most part) and even have this in my search request line. |
Originally Posted by Selina_H
I was referring to current players who refuse to send tells before inviting because it's too much work, not new F2P players who obviously will not be able to do so due to game limitations.
As for your question, I don't have an answer. I'm likely to continue to ignore blind invites as I do now. Unfortunately F2Pers who *would* have sent a tell but can't may end up as casualties of the system. |
I will, however, adjust this when Freedom launches for the reasons we've been discussing. Or at least adjust my attitude about it; I mostly team with the same people when I'm not soloing, so it's only rarely that I join pugs (not that I have anything against them, I just run with the same crowds, typically).
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I'm OK with the development of a less privileged underclass so long as there's a way for those of us higher up the food chain to exploit them properly for our own gain. Otherwise there's no point in having an underclass. Plutocracy only works if the peons can be made to pull their betters' weight along with their own.|
Originally Posted by TrueGentleman
Either that, or players in the /search window will be labelled F2P, Premium, and VIP (something that might promote stratification in the community).
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If you really can't tell, this entire remark is tongue-in-cheek.
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There's a Freeloader on this screen but I can't find anything that identifies him as a Freeloader. It almost seems like the Freeloaders would have to use the Search Comments in some manner to stand out.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
I expect that Free players will be marked as such in Team Search, which will give me a good enough reason to be snobbish towards blind invites anyway. That said, I spend the bulk of my time in instances where I can't be invited anyway.
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I wonder if Sam has ever even seen this screen?
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| Freeloaders can see tells sent to them and they can read Broadcast. They can't send to Broadcast and they can't send tells. |
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Originally Posted by Nyx
I chose to quote this point, but really I meant to quote everything you wrote...
You make no sense! |
This is what Freeloader chat looks like, everything said in Braodcast the freeloaders can read. Every tell sent to them shows up, it doesn't magically disappear.
If you start up a Posi TF and in Broadcast say
Posi TF LF 7 Send Tell
and then you go stand at the Aution House, you're not being very Freeloader freindly.
If you start up a Posi TF and in Broadcast say
Posi TF starting up, send tell or meet me at Posi for an invite
and then go stand at Posi you are being Freeloader friendly.
My point is Freeloaders can use Broadcast to find teams if Prems and ViPs don't mind just a little more typing and don't mind standing in a certain place.
In closing I would like to point out that even though Freeloaders can not send a tell to any other player, they will still be able read any tells sent to them.
My point is if you send a tell before sending an invite you're not only
Freeloader Friendly
you're not only
Prem Freindly
you're not only
ViP Friendly
You are
Community Friendly
Addendum to my above note about considering Blind Invites equivalent to Spam Mail and Telemarketing...
A Blind Invite is sent to someone who is NOT marked as LFT and also does NOT indicate they might be interested in teaming in their Note.
If you send an invite to someone out of the blue, who has absolutely ZERO indication that they might be interested, then you are being impolite. If you do so even though their Note states that they are most definitely NOT interested, then you are being immensely rude. Now, not everyone is as bothered by this as others, but the fact remains that what you are doing by Blind Inviting is potentially very unwelcome. Sending a tell first is a great way to alleviate this issue... but that is something that a 100% freeb won't be able to do. Considering how little it takes to become premium, I'm hoping this won't be an issue for many, and I'm hoping that for those it IS an issue to, that they simply use the tools we're given, and use the LFT window appropriately, and if they wish to start a group themselves, they start off sending invites to those indicating an interest. Once they have others in their group, if any of those others have chat capabilities, well, the problem's solved. Or, they can just flag themselves as Looking For Any and accept any invites that come along, and again- problem solved.
Politeness goes both ways, as stated above... make sure you're making it possible for /tell-less freebs to be able to join your group, too!
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They are "other". They can't do many of the things we take for granted. Their account status is objectively inferior, and will be treated as such (even if they don't realize it; it will happen, I promise, as most people don't know everything Free can't do)* by paying customers who don't suffer those limitations.|
Originally Posted by Tahliah
(though it does bring up that ugly specter of freeps being "other").
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It goes like this:
"Valued Customer" aka VIP Account
"Current Customer" aka Premium Account
"Potential Customer" aka Free Account
VIP accounts are objectively superior to Premium accounts. Premium accounts are objectively superior to Free accounts. The game itself treats them this way and that isn't going to change.
* - For example: If I recall correctly, Free can't use /bug or /petition (and likely can't use /stuck either). Now, admittedly, most people don't use those very often, but when you need them ...
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This is a very good point. The sentiment also seems to be that Freebers won't stay Free for long, as the temptation to purchase even something basic would be that much greater if they aren't paying anything at the time. So perhaps it will be a non-issue and the majority of 'new blood' we get will actually be at Premium level...|
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
We should keep in mind that while we have an obligation to integrate the new players that arrive with Freedom, we have no obligation to hand the game to them. |
*Runs off to examine what is open at that level*
Maestro Mavius - Infinity
Capt. Biohazrd - PCSAR
Talsor Tech - Talsorian Guard
Keep Calm & Chive On!
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Actually... it isn't, since noob is a derogatory term.|
Originally Posted by warden_de_dios
froobs (free + noobs, is that better)
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What's wrong with: Freems, Preems, and VIPs?
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I think it's more the tude being tossed than the sense being made.|
Originally Posted by warden_de_dios
Not Sure If Serious
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I don't care if someone can get tells.
Im more concerned about being herded into the VIP section in order to ensure I am on a team which can work to complete normal content without the hassles that "Would" make the game annoying to play for any of the tiers of "Paydom"
Trading insps, is my main beef, which I have made clear, but Im also concerned about this and other options creating a huge devide amongst players. Much like the Tirinity does in pretty much any other game.
I do not want to hear the following.
"Mission team or ITF LF2M. Must be Prem, or VIP" which is close to "LFM Healz needed"
Why? Because it's stupid, and it means longer wait times trying to assemble a team because now you are not just picking and choosing between the AT's you are letting in, but now you need to worry about whether or not you can actually function.
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Because this|
Originally Posted by Thirty-Seven
What's wrong with: Freems, Preems, and VIPs? |
should never equal this
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Hey!|
Originally Posted by Nyx
Drunk players (Hiya Pinacle)
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We're not nearly as think as you drunk we are!
(hic)
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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Ah, those were fun time |
Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Don't get too used to all those HOs, though.
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Are we referring to the impending "nerf" to Hamidon enhancement percentages or to the rumour that exposing yourself to the Hamidon too much would have negative consequences in the future, though?
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I understand what you're saying and agree that this is the setup by the game itself. It just seems from reading the many forum threads since Freedom was announced that some people actually believe they are "better" than someone who doesn't fork over $15 a month for a game. That strikes me as beyond absurd and slightly delusional.
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Originally Posted by Sun_Runner
They are "other". They can't do many of the things we take for granted. Their account status is objectively inferior, and will be treated as such (even if they don't realize it; it will happen, I promise, as most people don't know everything Free can't do)* by paying customers who don't suffer those limitations.
It goes like this: "Valued Customer" aka VIP Account "Current Customer" aka Premium Account "Potential Customer" aka Free Account VIP accounts are objectively superior to Premium accounts. Premium accounts are objectively superior to Free accounts. The game itself treats them this way and that isn't going to change. * - For example: If I recall correctly, Free can't use /bug or /petition (and likely can't use /stuck either). Now, admittedly, most people don't use those very often, but when you need them ... |
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Hey, if you don't like my opinion, that's just too darn bad. I'm not saying that your preference is 'wrong, just that it's NOT automatically everyone's default opinion.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Woah... I got a sudden case of deja vu, like I fell over backwards in to 2004...
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Don't like blind invites? Don't accept them. Just don't make it your life's goal to hunt those people down and ruin their lives for the horrible insult, or anything similar.
I was just disagreeing with the general notion that ALL players feel that way.
My memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Also, my memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
"The tip of a shoelace is called an aglet, its true purpose is sinister." The Question
And before I get any more sassy replies or insulting PM's - when I make teams I send tells. I just don't insist that people send me tells. I just want to team with people. I send tells first because a lot of people get in Really Bad Moods if i don't, not because I want or expect them myself.
Other people have opinions that are not yours. Deal with it.
My memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Also, my memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
"The tip of a shoelace is called an aglet, its true purpose is sinister." The Question
Don't get too used to all those HOs, though.
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