Best */Time or Time/* ?

With Time manipulation coming out, which looks really cool, I'm looking to make the best time manipulator that I can.

I really loathe asking this on the boards, but I'd like to ask what power set out there that can go with TM to make the most effective character.

'Most effective' meaning most useful in incarnate trials... able to survive and overcome medium sized groups of +1s to +3s.

I'm currently leaning towards a fire/time controller. Although I would have loved to make a grav/time for thematic reasons, I don't think grav/time would be as effective in trials.

Perhaps */TM corruptor or MM would be better?

Opinions?

A Fire/Time Controller is a good pairing. The proclivity towards being in melee range to take advantage of Hot Feet will be good, since /Time has a decent amount of PBAoE powers. The Holds will stack, allowing you to hold bosses quickly, and huge swarms of minions and lieuts, and take advantage of the double damage of containment easily.

I would say, after that, that Defenders are the best to pair with Time, after other melee-based Controller sets. MMs will be good with the set, but the pets can't take advantage of the +Recharge from some of the powers. Corruptors might actually be the worst paired with it, but will still be good. The tendency to take advantage of Scourge, combined with a very active secondary set like /Time will mean that you're having to click a lot, and having to switch between primary damaging powers and secondary buffs/debuffs means less overall DPS.

Here's my rankings of Time based on my experiences so far:

1) Melee-Based Controllers
2) Defenders
3) MMs and Corrs
4) Other Controller sets

I'm sure that others will differ.

If my napkin math is correct, a decent build earth/time/power controller should be able to AoE control entire AV groups due to stacking holds from Volcanic gases, Time disruption, and time stop as well as fossilize and stoney..

Once you perma Chrono, you'll get perma hasten, triple stacked Time disruption, and perma Volcanic gases.. which means more holds and control then you'll know what to do with. Add power boost to make your single target holds last longer, and all the debuffs from both earth/ and /time and it'll be a pretty nasty combination.

I tend to agree with fire/time controller being on the highend of time manip characters for the purpose of itrials.

For my 2inf, I think Illusion/Time will be strong. It has a strong +recharge, and a -res -def ability, the same traits which made rad such a good combo with Illusion. It won't be quite the AV killer as an Ill/Rad, but the extra control elements Time has will should make the build insane for team play.

I'm just going to repost my comments from the Feedback forum here. Basically anything on a Controller currently pairs well with Time, because Time is a Tank Mage set. This post was my second response to a challenge to prove that I could soft cap a Time Manipulator without using IO set bonuses (I couldn't on a Controller, but read on). Note I'm not saying this is either well balanced nor necessarily a complete crisis, although the ability to use Power Boost with Farsight is a bit surprising.

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Take a look at a Controller. Power Boost + Farsight grants a base ~24 defense to everything (achievable with SOs on a Controller); you need just 21 more to soft cap all positions.

Assuming 2 regular lvl 50 IOs: Hover (3.37) + Manuevers (3.93) + Combat Jumping (3.37) + Weave (6.74) = 17.41%.

So technically I lied when it comes to Controllers. SOs gets you to "just" 41.41 defense to everything. You need one 3% defense IO to get you to 44.41%. Realistically speaking, you would probably also drop either Hover or CJ (so you can take Hasten), and slot one more easy defense grab IO set to soft cap. Or just not worry about it and go with ~41.04% defense to all (Hasten instead of Hover and 1 slotted 3% IO), which is probably what I will do unless there is a change. I mean, why not, since we have not even looked at what the -ToHit toggle is doing yet.

For comparison, a Super Reflexes Scrapper with all of its powers except Elude and 2 defense IOs in each slot, along with a similar configuration of Hover + Manuevers + CJ + Weave comes out at 43.8% Defense to 3 positions (2.39% ahead) and 14.6% in everything else (26.81% behind). It's possible I made a mistake on the Scrapper build and the numbers should actually be higher. I hope so.

There is no armor set in the game that can compete directly with Time Manipulation combined with Power Boost in terms of numeric armor values. Defense debuff might lower some of that, and the character won't have as many HP, but remember we're comparing a buff/debuff set to an armor set. None of the other buff/debuff sets have defense debuff resistance either. The set is anything but underpowered.

[We also really don't want to talk about what is going to happen when we start IOing this set. Here's the preview though: it becomes able to soft cap to multiple positions in incarnate content. And will likely be walking around with +50% perma base recharge (the equivalent of having a second account character with Speed Boost following you around.)]

It seems to me most people are answering the OP as if he was asking about Time in general content whereas he specifically limited it to itrials, so just as a general reminder, the incarnate softcap is 59% and trial AVs are, so far, highly resistant to controls.

I haven't checked the fourth trial on Test, but on the three released ones, I would tend to consider the damage tradeoff for better controls not worth it on high control primaries. If it's an AV, you're still not going to be able to mez it, if it's a normal mob group, fire has more than enough control to do the trick.

To be honest, I don't even use Flashfire while soloing itrial groups on my fire/cold. The animation is too long, the higher amount of bosses per group makes it much less efficient, and 59%+ ranged/AOE def with high regen coupled with spamming the AoE immobilize is almost always enough mitigation.

About the only itrial encounter where controls at the cost of damage are desirable is the escapee phase in BAF.

Illusion (PA, really) can be invaluable to absorb all those nasty ST effects the AVs tend to use, but the AoE ones can be a pain in the *** to the league - a decoy will never move back after two rings, for example, nor will it stop attacking Antimatter too early if too close. In a situation where the decoy isn't the one holding the aggro, it's essentially bringing no survivability value, just small additional damage.

The usual powerhouse sets. You know, Fire, Plant and Ill. Two of which do good damage, and one which controls the things other controllers can't.

I don't see the point of Earth since there's no point going overboard with controls in general. So much stuff out there is mez resistant, trial IDF spawn extremely boss-heavy and trial AVs are either completely immune or extremely reistant to controls. The true power of the controller is not as a "support" AT or a mezbot, but that it's a character that can be designed to have good damage, good control, good debuff and good survivability all at once - i.e. a tankmage.

Electric/Time will be very strong. Elec is already in melee to get best use of conductive. The sleep patch in Elec + the hold patch in Time + Conductive Aura + Times Aura. Elec also gets a radial chain confuse which is actually pretty strong. IT jumps alot and I have had it confuse the entire Freedom Phalanx on the LRSF, albeit not for long.

Conetptually You will see a lot of Gravity/Time. Time covers a lot of the control functions lacking in gravity. Singy is a control fiend and does remarkably good damage.

Mind/Time will be potent as well tho light on the damage aspect.

Which if your going for damage then Fire or Phantom Army will be best. I agree it won't replace PA/Rad builds for av destruction tho. But time seems to be a bit better at handling/dealing with mobs, something I personally find rad lacking in as well as being a bit on the boring side. Note this is just my feeling and not a bash on the set, it is just a bit to fire and forget for my likings. My Phantom Army/Rad is fairly boring to play solo and even a bit more so on teams since I really don't need the other 8 people most of the time.

Even Ice/Time has a lot of good stuff going for it. Just not as good as some other sets mind you.

I think in general it comes down to what you want. Since your looking primarily for incarnate trials I honestly don't think it matters. In most trials I have been on I have not noticed a difference between any of my controllers. Stuff just dies so fast or people just go off in their own direction. Hell I wager most people have no idea what anyone else on their trial is doing or even what their powersets are. I have participated in a trial with no enhancments what so ever. Just to test a theory and the experience honestly wasn't that different. But YMMV.

Damage: Fire, Phantom Army, Plant
Control overkill: Earth
Best Rounded: Mind, Electric, Ice
Thematic Fun and effective: Gravity

Just my thoughs

Going Ice/Time myself. I've played Fire to death on my Fire/Rad, but that PBAoE toggle is too sweet not to pair it with something in the primary set. Sure, less damage, but that's what pets like Scrappers and Blasters are for :-D

Ill/Time

Playing Fire/Time on beta. IOed to the gills. She's very, very good.
43% S/L Defense
34% NRG Defense
28% Ranged Defense
with 223% Recharge
a -18% Tohit PBAOE Toggle
and ~6 seconds between pbaoe HoTs

I want a Stone/Time dominator so I can run around shouting "Stop! Hammer time!"

Casting my vote for Electric/Time. Time Manip is a touch endurance heavy and only Elec will get you over this hump.

Take the Magic: The Gathering 'What Color Are You?' Quiz.

I've been toying around with Mind/Time on the beta server.

AMAZING.

Really lovely ST damage and great debuffs/buffs. What more could a time traveling telepath ask for right?

Definitely looking forward to Elec/Time. I would make a Fire/Time but I already have a Fire/Earth Dominator and I try not to repeat sets without a great reason.

I24 Proc Chance = (Enhanced Recharge + Activation Time) * (Current PPM * 1.25) / 60*(1 + .75*(.15*Radius - 0.011*Radius*(360-Arc)/30))
Single Target Radius = 0. AoE Non-Cone Arc = 360.

By the way, Muon... I'm fairly certain that the Stone Dom set (Earth Assault?) has a couple of the hammers... just throwing that out there.

Rolling an Electric Control/Time here (already reserved my name, heh). Looks like it's going to be fun.

Oh, and MM? I dunno- there are a few Controller combos that lend themselves to ridiculous amounts of damage, like my beloved Plant/Stormie...

Exactly what Local said. The line I quoted said the "true power" of controllers isn't support or "mezbotting" (a term I don't understand anyway...what the heck is wrong with mezzing, especially on controllers). That is far from the truth. The true power of a controller is in being that force multiplier on a team. I've always looked at the controller as the battlefield general. You have to be much more aware of the mobs and you can dictate where the action will be and who you weaken and who you strengthen. I know a lot of people want to think that support is somehow a bad thing or weak or less than DPS. I say, you want to feel powerful? Lock down three mobs for your team with enough controls to handle that extra mob the mouth breathing scrapper just aggro'd. Then watch a blaster go in completely untouched and nuke one group while a scrapper almost one shots another and a few defenders finish off the third with hardly a HP dropped or endurance lost. The red numbers aren't where a controllers powers are, I'd argue the purple and blue and orange make them powerhouses.