Weakest AT/powersets


Afterimage

 

Posted

Hmm.

Elec/dev blaster.

It may not be the weakest powerset combo out there, but it's certainly not going to be winning any awards.


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Posted

Dual pistols/devices blaster. I have one


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Even Grav/Sonic?
Make that 4 characters to delete


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Posted

I'm not much of a powerset snob. That said, Sonic Resonance is truly bottom of the barrel. And yes, I would say it is worse than Force Field. A few Resistance debuffs do not fix the 4 of 9 powers that accept no IOs at all, the massive Psi hole, the unreasonable recharge on Liquefy, the complete lack of resistance to meaningful debuffs that even Defense sets like Cold Domination gets, or the inability to utilize Power Boost in a meaningful way. The set feels like it was built to settle an argument about whether Buff/Debuff set could have no heals and still be useful. And interestingly, every single set in that category released prior to City of Villains--Force Field, Sonic Resonance, and Trick Arrow--is now on the list of "worst of" power sets. It almost feels like when a set gives up healing or regen capability in this game, it's punished extra hard for it. (Cold Domination, however, is an exception.)

Prior to the invention of incarnate abilities, rock bottom status would have gone to Ice Control/Sonic Resonance as a special contender for worst-of. It's rare for me to label a combo "unplayable" but if anything was, this was it. Sonic's runaway endurance costs combined with horrible damage mitigation capability combined with a nearly defenseless pet, all wrapped in a neat package of never seeing your blue bar again. I cannot possibly exaggerate how awful this combo truly was.

I will give honorable mention to Force Field on Defenders as a truly struggling power set. Now that you can cast AoE Power Boosted shields, there is very little to recommend FF on a Defender any more. My FF/Ice character was the only one of my heroes who was unable to solo Trapdoor in the incarnate mission. And any power set where people routinely take 4 powers and skip everything else can't really be said to be operating at capacity. I still give this one higher marks than Sonic only because in the 10-45 game, it actually is pretty good. It only falls out once IOs enter the picture. However, the set is also the victim of the collective fantasy that knockback is a comparable debuff to something like -Regen or -Resistance when wielded by players with infinite levels of skill. Meanwhile powers like Force Bolt are so unimpressive that they provide the template for Veteran powers with slightly longer recharges and much increased damage.


 

Posted

Peacebringers
Elec/dev blasters
Grave/emp controllers


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostwind_EU View Post
* Something with terrible redraw... maybe TA/Pistols?
The thing is that oil slick is really *that* good. You could drop flash, glue, disruption, oil slick, light, and then do DP AOEs. It would actually melt spawns and you would only have to look at redraw once.

I know people say TA is gimped, but I have a TA/A that can kill whole spawns (just even level) almost as fast as a fully IOd fire/fire tank. It is really hard to argue with that... I think it is gimped in some ways, but balancing that is that it can kill whole spawns easily and you don't even have to bother herding them into a tight group.


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A partial selection from my 50's on Freedom: Ail = Ice/Traps, Luck = Street Justice/Super Reflexes Stalker, Mist = Bane, Pixy = Trick Arrow/Archery, Pure = Gravity/Energy, Smoke = Fire/Fire Dominator

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
Grave/emp controllers
Actually Grav/Emp has an advantage over other sets.. Siggy can be buffed with regeneration effects. Its the only way to heal the poor bugger and a siggy with Regen Aura or AB on it is wicked tough. Unless they changed the regen aspec...

I'd have to up out Elec/Fire.. solo farming AE its good.. on a team.. 10 seconds to activate 4 powers... makes it not so good. Your secondary totally outshines your primary by a wide margin.. and that is just sad.


 

Posted

I think:

Stalker: Energy Melee / Regen (I give MA an edge over EM for the team critical buff). Regen is just not good on Stalker because Stalker's HP Cap is so low and both EM and MA have no aoe attack all, in a game where aoe shines, you have two negatives going for you.

Peacebringer: The current form of PB is just frustrating.


Controller: Mind/something. Mind control just doesn't work as well on controller as it does for Dominator. Mind lacks aoe immb for containment and it doesn't have domination to make it an excellent control set. It's very good but other primaries have controls and good damage potential with containment.


Mastermind: Petlless MM isn't what I consider a logical build that just sucks. If you want to use the pets, then Merc is the weakest because Merc doesn't excel in anything. Controls? I would vote Ninja, Necro and even Demon having more good controls than Merc. Merc has the worst ST damage, lack of aoe potential with narrow cones, weak resistance with only S/L and a minion Medic that I don't want talk about. If he heals you in time, or put anti-mez on you, consider yourself lucky. The weakest secondary on MM is definitely /Poison. Funny, my first villain ever is 50 Merc/Posion! lol /Poison lacks aoe protection for your pets. If you get any kind of aoe damage, you can't heal the pets in time with that slow moving Green Ball.


These are the ones that are noticeably weak IMO. Those powers should be improved for the AT's need's.


What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghostwind_EU View Post
...
I started thinking it might be a fun challenge to create a normally considered "weak" toon and pimp it to the max with IOs and incarnate powers.
This sounds like an interesting project.

The ideas of petless masterminds or tanks without shields and such dont really fit though. Ruining a good powerset is easy. Making a bad powerset work sounds like a fun challenge.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Two words: Perma Fraggin' Lightform.
The problem with perma Lightform is that if you use that, you really aren't a Human Peacebringer any longer. If someone played as a human form Peacebringer to avoid looking like a squid or a lobster, Lightform defeats that purpose.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Ail_ View Post
The thing is that oil slick is really *that* good. You could drop flash, glue, disruption, oil slick, light, and then do DP AOEs. It would actually melt spawns and you would only have to look at redraw once.

I know people say TA is gimped, but I have a TA/A that can kill whole spawns (just even level) almost as fast as a fully IOd fire/fire tank. It is really hard to argue with that... I think it is gimped in some ways, but balancing that is that it can kill whole spawns easily and you don't even have to bother herding them into a tight group.
I have a DP/TA corruptor.. solo it can be a little tough.. on teams.. he really shines.. and since i never solo its all win win for me..


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Posted

MA is soon to be the weakest powerset for Scrappers, once Street Justice comes out

IMO, of course.


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Posted

Interesting thread.

Probably would be best to preface each combo by AT, because even the worst Tanker combo will solo better than your average defender combo.

So my picks for the Hero ATs would be;

Defender: Empathy/*any* with Sonic/*any* possibly worse

Controller: this one is too Easy ; Grav/Empathy

Blaster : Radiation / Devices (never liked the low damage / fast recharge powers much)
Probably why I cannot get a Peacebringer past the low levels.

Scrapper/Tanker : The Attack sets are all decent, but the Electric Armor defense seems a tad weaker than the rest. The set is solid, but has similarities to Dark and Fire, but those sets both have self-rez and better healing.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterimage View Post
The problem with perma Lightform is that if you use that, you really aren't a Human Peacebringer any longer. If someone played as a human form Peacebringer to avoid looking like a squid or a lobster, Lightform defeats that purpose.
The new version doesn't change your shape. There's complaints in the Kheldian forum in fact that there's no more reason to take Nova form, even though new Lightform carries over to Dwarf and Nova.


Arc #40529 : The Furies of the Earth

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biospark View Post

Blaster : Radiation / Devices (never liked the low damage / fast recharge powers much)
Probably why I cannot get a Peacebringer past the low levels.
Doesn't Blaster's Radiation have modified version? You get the typical 4s/1s and 8s/1.67? I think Radiation Blast seems pretty good on Blaster because of Cosmic Burst's mag 3 stun. Should be pretty useful. And Radiation Blast has like 3 aoe.

On Corruptor, I absolutely hate Radiation Blast for the same reason you listed (I don't like spam low recharge attacks). :P I almost deleted my lvl 42 Rad/Sonic Corr.


What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jibikao View Post
Doesn't Blaster's Radiation have modified version? You get the typical 4s/1s and 8s/1.67? I think Radiation Blast seems pretty good on Blaster because of Cosmic Burst's mag 3 stun. Should be pretty useful. And Radiation Blast has like 3 aoe.

On Corruptor, I absolutely hate Radiation Blast for the same reason you listed (I don't like spam low recharge attacks). :P I almost deleted my lvl 42 Rad/Sonic Corr.

Hmm could be. To be honest, I have tried Rad Blast many times on defenders and when I heard it was ported to Blasters, I actually felt sorry for Blasters. Maybe they should consider fixing the Defender/Corruptor versions.


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HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF

 

Posted

This would come down to soloing potential.

I'm guessing Empathy/Radiation.


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Posted

Radiation Blast shines on Blasters.

Neutrino Bolt and XRay Eyes are indeed normalised to 4s and 8s. 3 area attacks and having your status effect baked into your heavy hitter with Cosmic Blast blast make for a very effetcive set.

I found it a bit lacking on my Defender, but love it on my Blaster.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biospark View Post
Interesting thread.

Probably would be best to preface each combo by AT, because even the worst Tanker combo will solo better than your average defender combo.

So my picks for the Hero ATs would be;

Defender: Empathy/*any* with Sonic/*any* possibly worse

Controller: this one is too Easy ; Grav/Empathy

Blaster : Radiation / Devices (never liked the low damage / fast recharge powers much)
Probably why I cannot get a Peacebringer past the low levels.

Scrapper/Tanker : The Attack sets are all decent, but the Electric Armor defense seems a tad weaker than the rest. The set is solid, but has similarities to Dark and Fire, but those sets both have self-rez and better healing.

Unfortunately for you (or not) my Emp/archery Defender can solo +0/x8 very efficiently. RAs, RoA+AoEs, take out stragglers, if any, and repeat.

As for Electric armor, my Elec/Kinetic/mu tanker is indestructible. It can solo labs/warehouse in lambda incarnate trial for example. I literally took out almost every box of sweets in one lambda trial run by itself. Energize is also a much better heal than Dark's and Fire's because it increases your regen greately and also reduces your endurance consumption for 30s or something like that.

Something that's extremely gimped is EM/dark stalker. Sure, it can take out anything with its' huge burst dmg but that's it. After you take out one enemy the rest swarms you and swat you like a fly. Tried and true.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Narkor View Post
Stone/Stone Brute. Playing it without Granite armor (aka with a sh*t ton of toggles as well heavy endurance-using abilities; or how to murder a blue bar). Why without Granite? Because with it, there's less SMASH!
I am going to have to take exception to this..that is all


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akhillius View Post
Unfortunately for you (or not) my Emp/archery Defender can solo +0/x8 very efficiently. RAs, RoA+AoEs, take out stragglers, if any, and repeat.

As for Electric armor, my Elec/Kinetic/mu tanker is indestructible. It can solo labs/warehouse in lambda incarnate trial for example. I literally took out almost every box of sweets in one lambda trial run by itself. Energize is also a much better heal than Dark's and Fire's because it increases your regen greately and also reduces your endurance consumption for 30s or something like that.

Something that's extremely gimped is EM/dark stalker. Sure, it can take out anything with its' huge burst dmg but that's it. After you take out one enemy the rest swarms you and swat you like a fly. Tried and true.
I did not mention secondaries for Emp and Sonic because there are too many ways to combine powers and ancilaries to say for certain which secondary is THE worst. For what it is worth Archery, Sonic, Ice and Dark do notmake it to the worst list. Which leaves sets like Rad, Electric, and Psi blast towards the bottom of the list and the rest somewhere in between. Take your pick of the worst blast set (mine would be Rad) and combine it with Emp or Sonic and you just made a "gimp" defender.

I will have to take your word for it on Stalkers, but having played all the Melee defense sets, they all function (especially once you have some IOs) but I have found Energy and Electric to be slightly less powerful than the rest. It is just my opinion that I would take Fire or Dark over Electric and by the same token I would take Shields or Super Reflexes over Energy. YRMV


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HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Biospark View Post
Scrapper/Tanker : The Attack sets are all decent, but the Electric Armor defense seems a tad weaker than the rest. The set is solid, but has similarities to Dark and Fire, but those sets both have self-rez and better healing.
Wait, a power that only works when you have been defeated is one reason a set is better? Dark and Fire have better healing, but Elec has better resistance as well. Based on SOs, Fire is the weakest set. Once you factor in IOs and Incarnate, I don't think there is a set that's weak.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Akhillius View Post
As for Electric armor, my Elec/Kinetic/mu tanker is indestructible. It can solo labs/warehouse in lambda incarnate trial for example. I literally took out almost every box of sweets in one lambda trial run by itself. Energize is also a much better heal than Dark's and Fire's because it increases your regen greately and also reduces your endurance consumption for 30s or something like that.
Elec armor is the best set for trials, so it's kind of like saying how great Invul is while on a S/L mission. Energize isn't better than the other two. Dark Regen can make a tank go from 1 hp to full health in one use. Healing Flames recharges in 40 sec. Energize recharges in 120 sec. The fact that Energize helps with end recovery is a small benefit considering Elec has Power Sink.

EDIT: I do like Elec though and it might be my favorite armor to play right now.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by New Dawn View Post
This would come down to soloing potential.

I'm guessing Empathy/Radiation.
Let's see here...

- Perma stun on bosses in your attack chain.
- Great regen and recovery.
- Self heal when needed.
- 3 AoE's to rock the Reactive with.
- Great buffs for Lore pets.

Seems solid to me.


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