Monetary value of new powersets...
By
Amy_Amp,
Posted on: 2011-07-25 12:40 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Quote:
You're overlooking the fact that there was no way for me to actually get the content for Going Rogue without paying extra, over and above my subscription. I actually in fact *paid* for GR, and its content. But there are such paths in Freedom.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
One doesn't need to determine the exact percentage of anything in Going Rogue. Even if you assume all Going Rogue brought us was powersets, they still cost less than what they're being sold for now. That's without counting extra zones, extra stories, extra game systems, extra costume sand more. If Going Rogue were nothing but powersets, we still paid less for them than what they are being sold for now.
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Absolutely no one can yet make the case that a VIP subscriber will have to pay one cent to get an equivalent amount of content over and above subscription, in terms of actual comparable quantity. When you strip away all the "fancy math" what's left is this: if I get more content for the same amount of money, Freedom is a win. Everything else is academic arithmetic. At the moment, given everything I know about City of Heroes Freedom, there is no possible way I could justify saying that the amount of content I'm going to be getting for the same amount of money will be lower. The fact that a powerset "costs" this much or that much "points" when I'm being handed thousands of points a year for my subscription means, in isolation, exactly nothing.
Now, if anyone actually wants to discuss the actual specific mechanics of pricing, at that point there's no avoiding fancy math, because comparing the dollar cost of points with the point cost of items without factoring in the points a subscriber gets for free is, within that context, worthless.
To put it bluntly, I paid for the content of Going Rogue. All evidence to date suggests that all the comparable content that is going to be released in Freedom's launch will be things I will be able to get without paying more money, if I'm just a little patient. So *I* won't be paying more. Everyone who voluntarily wants to pay more, however, is free to do so, and I thank them for doing so.
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Quote:
800 seems high to me, 600 is what I would consider equitable, however, like others have said, I'll pay 800 points for the new powersets and not be upset about it. In the end, prices are in large part about what the consumer is willing to pay.
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Originally Posted by TrueMetal
I'm okay with 800 points. It's high end, but at that price I'll buy all powersets I'm interested in. (Which currenlty will only be Street Justice. I'm not much of a weapons set fan, especially not guns.)
Of course I wouldn't be opposed to them dropping the price to 600 points or so, (realisticly the lowest I believe they'll go) but that still wouldn't be low enough to entice me into buying sets I'm only moderately interested in. |
@Doctor Gemini
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Smersh, it's not that simple.
I get how it works. I really do. That's not the issue.
Everyone who is fine with it is just saying it's all optional.
That's great. For those who are okay with either paying, taking their time or not having.
Should we assume that the majority of a video game's target audience is reasonable and patient? 
Of course, you can't base things entirely around the height of insanity... I'm not saying that either.
However, the fact remains that having so many things to buy with costs being a certain amount over what they're willing/capable of... Can very easily turn people away form the game entirely.
The whole waiting and saving up thing may turn out to be nearly impossible, depending on the rate at which new things are added and the amount of new things that are available. Yes, it'll give you a discount, but if only two things chew up several months of points, and weekly items are added and bigger features are added 3-4 times a month... that method won't catch up (of course, I also fully agree that 3-4 boosters' expense could/should be factored in and spent -if wanted).
The big problem is that we don't know how things are going to go. There's no release schedule, so we can't see if the launch is abnormal or if things will consistently be like that. We simply do not know that (right now, I'm starting to think of it like an expansion and that things will normalize afterward, but that may not be the case at all).
One very easy comparison is that CoH is a country club.
People pay their fee and get use of the facilities.
The place adds in a whole load of new swank that have additional fees and people can choose to buy them and use them, wait and accrue membership points to earn them slowly or just stick with the membership plan and be okay with what they've got.
Some people are not going to be okay with hanging around, using their default gear alongside a bunch of other members with their glowing golf clubs and super carts and spicy wings (not on the main menu), etc.
And they're going to leave.
The question becomes... do you want those current members to be a part of the club or are they expendable for what the club will be afterward.
And I am absolutely not saying that any decision is wrong for Paragon Studios to go with. It's their choice!
I'm also not saying that I'm one of the people that will leave.
I have no idea how things are going to go nor how I'll feel about them until they happen.
I am, however, concerned about the effects this have and have not scenario may have on this game and this community.
We are not all equal in financial stations nor in patience! So, increasing the amount of awesome at the rate that some are willing to spend for can very easily push other people away.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
But Mr. OP,
These new powersets *have no* monetary value. They aren't purchaseable with money but with a system of points that cannot be sold or traded.
Technically, if one were to have bought Going Rogue, they can still sell it if they had the physical disc or codes with the game access. I can't do anything with these points once I get them except add to my account access. I can't get refudunded for my points, I can't trade my extra points for VIP game access(AFAIK) nor can I go on ebay and sell my points for cash or trade them to another player for a service.
So these powersets aren't worth anything but the points you spend to get them...and the devs are giving away these points too (I believe an extra 100+ if you're tier 9 VIP).
Multi-quoting makes my head hurt...
Quote:
1) Surely how much time and effort something takes to make is a basic driving force of economic factors and influences how much is costs to turn a profit?|
Originally Posted by TwoHeadedBoy
For this I'll reference my last post:
If you didn't happen to have a childhood, google "Indian Giving" for more information. What you personally care to play has no hold over the monetary value of each powerset- How much time the Dev's had to develop each powerset also should not effect the worth of the powerset- |
2) See Eco's post as to why Monetary value is affected by personal value...
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Originally Posted by MrCaptainMan
As a VIP, I'll get a new powerset 2 months 'for free' 2 months later than sb who pays $10 at launch, if I do nothing? To me, this is not at all a problem. I'll probably do this for Titan Weapons. Street Justice I'll probably buy as soon as, and I don't think ten bucks is too much. Eco |
Theres no obligation to buy everything in the store, there never has been. I wont be purchasing any of the beast pack, or any of the party pack, and I may purchase the size changing mechanic from the science
If I chalk up enough free points after i've gotten everything I want and theres nothing shiny on the horizon will I get it, possibly. But still unlikely, but thats why the free points have to be considered, they allow me to get what I want without paying any extra, just waiting
Would I pay in excess of $10 for certain powersets, probably, if I could get them for free and wait longer, then I would.
Its called impulse control, even the things I really want, I can put off on getting if I know I can get it for a better deal in the not so distant future. i.e 1 powerset free every 2 months. Altitis handles the rest.
It has always been the amount of money you are willing to spend on the game determins what you get. Now it is more akin to how much time and how much money you are willing to invest before you get what you want.
Not interested in any of the new powersets, then they may as well be free, if you're Golden Girl
and have no intention of ever playing another character, they are useless. Not interested in the boosters because you're happy with spandex clad heroes, they are probably useless, but now you can cater what you're subscription achieves for you, and suplement the rest.... as opposed to being told what you're sub gives you and have to supliment an entire booster pack for only 1 feature from it...Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
You're overlooking the fact that there was no way for me to actually get the content for Going Rogue without paying extra, over and above my subscription. I actually in fact *paid* for GR, and its content. But there are such paths in Freedom.
Absolutely no one can yet make the case that a VIP subscriber will have to pay one cent to get an equivalent amount of content over and above subscription, in terms of actual comparable quantity. When you strip away all the "fancy math" what's left is this: if I get more content for the same amount of money, Freedom is a win. Everything else is academic arithmetic. At the moment, given everything I know about City of Heroes Freedom, there is no possible way I could justify saying that the amount of content I'm going to be getting for the same amount of money will be lower. The fact that a powerset "costs" this much or that much "points" when I'm being handed thousands of points a year for my subscription means, in isolation, exactly nothing. Now, if anyone actually wants to discuss the actual specific mechanics of pricing, at that point there's no avoiding fancy math, because comparing the dollar cost of points with the point cost of items without factoring in the points a subscriber gets for free is, within that context, worthless. To put it bluntly, I paid for the content of Going Rogue. All evidence to date suggests that all the comparable content that is going to be released in Freedom's launch will be things I will be able to get without paying more money, if I'm just a little patient. So *I* won't be paying more. Everyone who voluntarily wants to pay more, however, is free to do so, and I thank them for doing so. |
I barely have to even read an Arcanaville post to agree with it, QFT
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Originally Posted by VoodooGirl
[*]Watching out for the Spinning Disco Portal of D00M!*
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I stand by my earlier statement. If you try to buy every single little thing, you will go broke. It's not the way to F2P on a budget.|
Originally Posted by Electric-Knight
Smersh, it's not that simple.
I get how it works. I really do. That's not the issue. Everyone who is fine with it is just saying it's all optional. That's great. For those who are okay with either paying, taking their time or not having. Should we assume that the majority of a video game's target audience is reasonable and patient? Of course, you can't base things entirely around the height of insanity... I'm not saying that either. However, the fact remains that having so many things to buy with costs being a certain amount over what they're willing/capable of... Can very easily turn people away form the game entirely. The whole waiting and saving up thing may turn out to be nearly impossible, depending on the rate at which new things are added and the amount of new things that are available. Yes, it'll give you a discount, but if only two things chew up several months of points, and weekly items are added and bigger features are added 3-4 times a month... that method won't catch up (of course, I also fully agree that 3-4 boosters' expense could/should be factored in and spent -if wanted). The big problem is that we don't know how things are going to go. There's no release schedule, so we can't see if the launch is abnormal or if things will consistently be like that. We simply do not know that (right now, I'm starting to think of it like an expansion and that things will normalize afterward, but that may not be the case at all). One very easy comparison is that CoH is a country club. People pay their fee and get use of the facilities. The place adds in a whole load of new swank that have additional fees and people can choose to buy them and use them, wait and accrue membership points to earn them slowly or just stick with the membership plan and be okay with what they've got. Some people are not going to be okay with hanging around, using their default gear alongside a bunch of other members with their glowing golf clubs and super carts and spicy wings (not on the main menu), etc. And they're going to leave. The question becomes... do you want those current members to be a part of the club or are they expendable for what the club will be afterward. And I am absolutely not saying that any decision is wrong for Paragon Studios to go with. It's their choice! I'm also not saying that I'm one of the people that will leave. I have no idea how things are going to go nor how I'll feel about them until they happen. I am, however, concerned about the effects this have and have not scenario may have on this game and this community. We are not all equal in financial stations nor in patience! So, increasing the amount of awesome at the rate that some are willing to spend for can very easily push other people away. |
Anyone who goes on a binge and decides that was a bad idea and leaves the game forever? Meh. Don't let the door hit you on the way out, thank you for your business. You're talking about a vanishingly small percentage of players that fit that profile. And that vanishingly small percentage would churn rapidly, anyway.
And if you're talking about player envy, well... we have that already. My wife gets slightly upset sometimes that I have more veteran's rewards than she does. I've got the CoV special edition and the CoH DVD edition in-game goodies, which are not generally available anymore.
And, of course, if you're worried about the demographic that has more envy/greed/desire to 'keep up' than money, well... frankly, that's not a terribly valuable demographic to Paragon Studios.
Your country club analogy needs a little work. The country club has changed to a semi-open club. Anyone can come and play a round without any green fees, and they have sets of loaner clubs for anyone who's interested. They also have the pro shop where you can get higher-quality drivers. They also have a nice restaurant where people who have chosen to continue paying their membership get their meals on the house, and they also get a discount at the pro shop. Of course the people who are playing for free don't get the super-awesome golf clubs, because they haven't shelled out for them. But they can buy the clubs if they want, and they can eat at the restaurant if they're willing to pay for it. And, yes, the loaner clubs available to those who are paying their membership are nicer than the clubs loaned out to the people who aren't paying anything, but the people who aren't paying memberships can pay a la carte for their golf cart pass, if that's what's most important to them.
The people who feel that they deserve the spicy wings without paying for them, or that drive themselves out of the game because they spend way too much on clubs and spicy wings? Oh, well. Most people will be able to play golf and keep themselves on their entertainment budget, and might skip the spicy wings one day so they can go to the movies.
Rambling analogy is rambling, but I feel it's accurate.
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[Caveat: Completely made up numbers. But it's the Internet, so you're used to it.]
Let us suppose we have a computer programmer who costs $100/hr and an artist who costs $80/hr, and they decide to create a new powerset, let's call it Time Manipulation, which has 9 powers and can be used by Controllers, Corruptors, Defenders and Masterminds.
The programmer spends:
8 hours coming up with the basic outline of the set and the powers involved
8 hours adding the new powerset to the character creation UI and leveling-up UI for 4 ATs
8 hours adding the new powerset to the power customization UI in the tailor
8 hours balancing the powerset with other comparable powersets
4 hours playtesting
16 hours watching beta testers playtesting and/or data mining beta test results
8 hours reworking power #9 because it turns out that a tier 9 that genocides an entire species of mobs was exploitable.
---
60 programmer hours = $6000
The artist spends:
4 hours creating each animation, times 9 powers, times 3 body types = 108 hours
16 hours fixing the problem with using power #5 on a huge model who in a flying pose
16 hours fixing the problem with power #3's animation taking 1.25 seconds on a male model, but 1.72 seconds on a female model.
16 hours fixing the problem where power #7 causes fortunata butt capes to vanish mysteriously.
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156 artist hours = $12480
Additionally, the programmer and artist, who actually doing the work, are forced to carry the costs of the CEO, the marketing department, the receptionist, the service that actually manages electronic funds transfers, etc. Call it +100% overhead. (This might even be a little low.)
Total cost of the new powerset: ($6000 + $12480) * 2 = $36,960.
Cost to you: $10.
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so completely irrelevant then
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Originally Posted by PoliceWoman
[Caveat: Completely made up numbers. .
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I do hope that the quality of the sets is good - that they are fun to play. I have no problem with 800 points for a set that I will enjoy and play for 200-400 hours. If I unlock a set and am sick of it by level 20...that's not as good.
(I wonder if I can pay extra points for a revamped /Devices, or buffed Peacebringers...)
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That's fair. I'm just trying to illustrate that it actually costs a ton of money to make this stuff for us. I don't think $10 is a crazy amount of money to ask.|
Originally Posted by Lucky666
so completely irrelevant then
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If you think $10 is too much, don't pay it.
That's how "monetary value" is really determined. By what people are willing to pay.
@PW - Police Woman (50 AR/dev blaster on Liberty)
TALOS - PW war journal - alternate contact tree using MA story arcs
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Quote:
QFE. Grumble all you want and publish all of the analyses and breakdowns you want that "prove" that the cost should be $2.50. If you open your wallet and shell out the $10, then you just acknowledged that $10 is, in fact, the "real" price.|
Originally Posted by PoliceWoman
That's how "monetary value" is really determined. By what people are willing to pay.
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A better measure of value in all of this is to put yourself in the shoes of a newbie free player and ask how the value compares to similar store items in other games.
I won't start making a laundry list because that would run afoul of the forum rules, but I feel that if you look at the stores for other games and put their $10 offerings side-by-side with a powerset from this game that you'll find that the comparison is a favorable one in most instances. In many cases, you'll find that the value of the powerset far exceeds what another game offers for the same number of dollars.
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Yep, Smersh, you and I are on the same page about everything (I was going to include exactly what you did in the analogy, but figured I was already rambling on too much)... except the "Oh well" response! |
Originally Posted by Smersh
I stand by my earlier statement. If you try to buy every single little thing, you will go broke. It's not the way to F2P on a budget.
Anyone who goes on a binge and decides that was a bad idea and leaves the game forever? Meh. Don't let the door hit you on the way out, thank you for your business. You're talking about a vanishingly small percentage of players that fit that profile. And that vanishingly small percentage would churn rapidly, anyway. And if you're talking about player envy, well... we have that already. My wife gets slightly upset sometimes that I have more veteran's rewards than she does. I've got the CoV special edition and the CoH DVD edition in-game goodies, which are not generally available anymore. And, of course, if you're worried about the demographic that has more envy/greed/desire to 'keep up' than money, well... frankly, that's not a terribly valuable demographic to Paragon Studios. Your country club analogy needs a little work. The country club has changed to a semi-open club. Anyone can come and play a round without any green fees, and they have sets of loaner clubs for anyone who's interested. They also have the pro shop where you can get higher-quality drivers. They also have a nice restaurant where people who have chosen to continue paying their membership get their meals on the house, and they also get a discount at the pro shop. Of course the people who are playing for free don't get the super-awesome golf clubs, because they haven't shelled out for them. But they can buy the clubs if they want, and they can eat at the restaurant if they're willing to pay for it. And, yes, the loaner clubs available to those who are paying their membership are nicer than the clubs loaned out to the people who aren't paying anything, but the people who aren't paying memberships can pay a la carte for their golf cart pass, if that's what's most important to them. The people who feel that they deserve the spicy wings without paying for them, or that drive themselves out of the game because they spend way too much on clubs and spicy wings? Oh, well. Most people will be able to play golf and keep themselves on their entertainment budget, and might skip the spicy wings one day so they can go to the movies. Rambling analogy is rambling, but I feel it's accurate. |
However, I can't dispute (nor do I disagree) with "frankly, that's not a terribly valuable demographic to Paragon Studios".
Absolutely. And that's all I'm saying.
Things are going to change and we're going to lose some people due to this.
Worse than that, possibly, is how things just might get a bit nastier (I'd almost rather people left, hehe).
One more thing, about the player envy/greed...
Obviously we have some of that now, but all I am saying (and that was the only target that I was referring to originally) is that it is going to be much worse than it is now.
The things out of reach are pretty few currently.
That is going to change, because Paragon Studios is kicking out (and planning to do so continuously) new fancier things in great abundance.
I honestly hope that the sum total of getting *everything (and using points from being a VIP) will be equivalent to picking up 3-4 boosters over a year.
However, I'm not sure that is a realistic hope.
* "everything" not including consumables/repeatables and such.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
As soon as I get into beta I'll be campaigning for 400-600 prices. Not because I can't afford 800 bu because I want to buy more than power sets with my bonus VIP PP. Greedy? Maybe. But I can live with that.
Here is what I think.
From what I've read, Issue 21 is going to have more content than any of the regular issues. We are going to get more powersets (some free, some are cash items that can be bought with your current subscription), new travel powers and new zones and other goodies.
Creating all the new stuff costs time and money.
With the old subscription, the company probably could only squeeze in half the size of Issue 21 and then we need to wait for another 3-4 months for Issue 22.
If you are VIP, you are getting points to spend. You can either spend all the points and some cash to buy everything NOW or you can wait 3-4 months like you would have needed to wait under the old subscription model. You are not really losing anything. It would only seem "more expensive" if you want everything NOW. I am an impatient person and I know I'll be spending more in the future just because I want things quicker.
However, the only argument I can see is that by pushing so many new things out faster than the old "normal pace", are those new powers balanced enough? Are they unique and interesting enough? We shall see.
Putting all the rewards/cash items aside, have you thought about that some of your old friends could return to this game because it will be "free"? You may meet new friends and have more people to team with. That's one benefit that can't be evaluated in terms of "cash". And if you really hate new people, there will be a VIP server for you.
By the way, I am willing to pay $10 if Dominator is getting something new in Issue 21. :P HINT HINT!
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
One thing to remember is that 10 dollars is the cost at the lowest conversion rate (400 points for 5 dollars). Larger bundles of points were said to have bonus points/better conversion rates. If you got the 30 dollars in paragon points, as a bundle, presumably you could end up with an extra several hundred points to spend.
Sermon
@sermon
One of Six, Cannibal 6
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it's like you are an avatar of evil, hidden behind a winky face...|
Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Maybe that's because quite a few players think the pricing is fine?
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wonder how many people have been banned from these forums for "rage responding" to your incessant...( i can't even come up with a socially acceptable word)
Oh yeah, that was the time that girl got her whatchamacallit stuck in that guys dooblickitz and then what his name did that thing with the lizards and it cleared right up.
screw your joke, i want "FREEM"
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Baiting.
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Originally Posted by Traegus
it's like you are an avatar of evil, hidden behind a winky face...
wonder how many people have been banned from these forums for "rage responding" to your incessant...( i can't even come up with a socially acceptable word) |
I have several problems with all this.
~ I was hoping to maintain a subscription to avoid having to deal with shopping for core features. I can deal with separate cosmetic purchases. Buying two expansions in 7 years was not a giant pain in the butt so I dealt with it. Having to go to the store and typing in my info every time new core functionality comes out is something I specifically wanted to avoid by maintaining a subscription.
~ If I explicitly buy a new set and it sucks I will be annoyed. Playing and being disappointed or annoyed with a new set I didn't explicitly pay for or otherwise use limited resources for was fine. This means I have to now maintain a test server account so I can try before I buy, which also means when I play it to a level where I am satisfied that it will be enjoyable on the test server I have to repeat that starting play from the beginning on a normal server. This, to me, is a problem that I don't want.
Cosmetics don't have any of these issues. I can see from screenshots whether I am interested in them.
If I am going to pay a subscription I want core functionality to be automatically added to my account. It's really not the cash; I would even consider paying a higher monthly fee to not have to schlep to the store every month to purchase stuff.
Moonlighter
50s include MA/SD, MA/SR, DP/Elec, Claw/Inv, Kat/Dark, Kat/Fire, Spine/Regen, Dark/SD
First Arc: Tequila Sunrise, #168563
I hope and pray that the biggest issue I have with i21/Freedom is that there are too many awesome powersets to buy with my monthly stipend alone.
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That's putting it as well as I ever could.|
Originally Posted by Emberly
I hope and pray that the biggest issue I have with i21/Freedom is that there are too many awesome powersets to buy with my monthly stipend alone.
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I've said before on other threads that I'm perfectly happy to pay for a few new powersets a year. Currently, we're averaging new powersets every 4-5 issues--that's completely new sets, not proliferations. The last absolutely free powersets we got were Pain Domination and Shield Defense in i13. The last paid sets we got were with the Going Rogue expansion (i18) a year ago, with an advance on Dual Pistols and Demon Summoning for prepurchasers.
So, if suddenly we're getting 1 free and 3+ purchaseable powersets a year, that's a lot more than we were getting. It's also more options; I rarely play ranged attack ATs, so I might not want to get Beam Rifle*... but I DO play melee ATs, and I want the bejeezus out of Street Justice.
*I do, in fact, want Beam Rifle... just not as much as I want Street Justice!
Regardless, you're getting Time Manipulation included in your subscription; you don't have to pay a penny beyond your regular $15/mo subscription fee or spend any of your monthly subscription bonus points on it.
There will be other new powers automatically included with subscription coming out in the future, at a faster rate than we've seen in the past--I would bet that the post 21 Dominator powerset(s) will be included in your subscription cost. But there will also be more purchaseable powersets (such as Titan Weapons) coming out too, the profits from which will help to fund the free ones.
You'll get more than you've ever gotten in the past included with your subscription in CoH Freedom, but you're not getting everything for it.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
it's NEVER too late to pad your /ignore list!
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If not this it would have been more booster packs and boxed expansions. Those were the only two real options for game expansion.|
Originally Posted by Moonlighter
I have several problems with all this.
~ I was hoping to maintain a subscription to avoid having to deal with shopping for core features. I can deal with separate cosmetic purchases. Buying two expansions in 7 years was not a giant pain in the butt so I dealt with it. Having to go to the store and typing in my info every time new core functionality comes out is something I specifically wanted to avoid by maintaining a subscription. |
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| ~ If I explicitly buy a new set and it sucks I will be annoyed. Playing and being disappointed or annoyed with a new set I didn't explicitly pay for or otherwise use limited resources for was fine. This means I have to now maintain a test server account so I can try before I buy, which also means when I play it to a level where I am satisfied that it will be enjoyable on the test server I have to repeat that starting play from the beginning on a normal server. This, to me, is a problem that I don't want. |
Your problems really seem to be problems directly associated with unbundling. Those may be intractable, because the vast overwhelming majority of people are likely to appreciate unbundling and prefer it. The all in one mentality is really the first permanent casualty of City of Heroes:Freedom. Theoretically speaking, they could make a VIP+ subscription that had certain things automatically included like powersets and signature story arcs or something. But since everyone is likely to have different ideas about what should be included in such a system and what it should cost, that wouldn't really address the problem except in a lucky tiny minority of cases that just happened to coincide with that package's constraints.
Which is not to say that at some point down the road, a VIP+ subscription option might not be in our future if enough players ask for it, and they can come to some median consensus as to what to include with it. But since people are currently still getting confused between Paragon Points and Reward Tokens, any expansion in options is highly unlikely. Its more likely to be on the table when the initial launch settles down.
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That's basically what I've been saying (generally, not just about powersets) since Freedom was launched. Just like I wish there was more content in the game than I could ever possibly explore, I hope there will be more content/items worthy of purchase in the store than I could ever buy. The completionist in my dies a little saying that, but the rest of me understands that generally means unlimited opportunities to expand my gameplay.
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Originally Posted by Emberly
I hope and pray that the biggest issue I have with i21/Freedom is that there are too many awesome powersets to buy with my monthly stipend alone.
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I myself actually think $10 for a power set is a steal, but I don't think it cost any where near your quoted price even though you did say it was all just made up numbers.
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Originally Posted by PoliceWoman
That's fair. I'm just trying to illustrate that it actually costs a ton of money to make this stuff for us. I don't think $10 is a crazy amount of money to ask.
If you think $10 is too much, don't pay it. That's how "monetary value" is really determined. By what people are willing to pay. |
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Actually, although Policewoman just made up numbers and her individual estimates are way off, her total estimate is actually not all that far away from mine.|
Originally Posted by Lucky666
I myself actually think $10 for a power set is a steal, but I don't think it cost any where near your quoted price even though you did say it was all just made up numbers.
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A new powerset doesn't always involve programmers: that's only if it has new mechanics. It does involve power designers, who are not programmers: they are "data designers." They deal in Excel, not C. From brainstorming to initial design it could take dozens of hours just to get the basics down. And I doubt even the first cut at a powerset takes only 60 hours.
Separate from that, and the artwork time to make animations, effects, and other visual elements of the powers, there's also Q&A testing time, design reviews, design reviews, mechanics testing, design reviews, balance passes, design reviews, beta testing, design reviews, and post live support. I would be surprised if there exists a post-launch powerset with less than five hundred man-hours of effort within it, and I'd probably budget 1000 total man-hours for a powerset given what I know about the process (which is incomplete) for design, implementation, testing, and process overhead.
I'm sure Television's eyeballs bugged out of his head when he found out he should be making $100/hour in salary and benefits, but even at more conservative industry standard estimates a powerset is bound to cost between $30k and $50k to implement, if not more.
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