Ragnarok: Chance for Knockdown question?
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2011-04-20 09:19 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
IIRC, the knockdown from the proc reports in your combat log. So you can try checking those as you spam the power, see if the game is telling you the proc went off when nobody gets knocked down.
Fire Cages does negate knockback for 12s if the immobilize effects the target. However, I believe that enemies that don't get immobilized (bosses) will still have a chance to get knocked down, which will be worth some mitigation.
Having Vengeance and Fallout slotted for recharge means never having to say you're sorry.
Fire Cages provides -KB mag to enemies affected by it for the base duration of the power (or just about). As such, putting the ragnarok proc in this will do you little good.
It might be okay in the Elec or Gravity AoE immobs, since they don't contain -KB, but not in Fire's.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
Quote:
Actually the -kb is a separate effect that will be applied whether or not you stack enough magnitude to immobilize the enemy
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Originally Posted by Kelenar
Fire Cages does negate knockback for 12s if the immobilize effects the target. However, I believe that enemies that don't get immobilized (bosses) will still have a chance to get knocked down, which will be worth some mitigation.
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I could be wrong here but as I understand it, Knockdown is basicly 1 mag or less of knockback.|
Originally Posted by Kelenar
Fire Cages does negate knockback for 12s if the immobilize effects the target. However, I believe that enemies that don't get immobilized (bosses) will still have a chance to get knocked down, which will be worth some mitigation.
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Up to 1 mag of knockback and the target is knocked down, more then 1 mag and the target is knocked back. Wouldn't most bosses have some knock back protection negating any and all knockback less then 1 mag?
I guess I was over estimating the power of this proc but I was expecting to hit a x8 group with fire cages and see around 1/4 of the minions and Lt's hit the ground.
Dark Tower. SL50 Stone/Stone Tanker
Founder The Freedom Phalanx Reserve
An Infinity Top 25 Super Group
Founded January 4th 2006
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Huh, I thought all the -KB on immobilize powers were tied to the immobilizes being successful. Maybe I'm thinking of holds or something.
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Originally Posted by Adeon Hawkwood
Actually the -kb is a separate effect that will be applied whether or not you stack enough magnitude to immobilize the enemy
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Having Vengeance and Fallout slotted for recharge means never having to say you're sorry.
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It's tied to hitting. If you miss, obviously, there won't be a -KB, but as long as you hit, any maz that applies the -KB will apply it regardless of whether the target is mezzed or not.
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Originally Posted by Kelenar
Huh, I thought all the -KB on immobilize powers were tied to the immobilizes being successful. Maybe I'm thinking of holds or something.
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Actually, it's about 0.76 mag turns into KB. 0.75 or below is KD.
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Originally Posted by Dark_Tower
I could be wrong here but as I understand it, Knockdown is basicly 1 mag or less of knockback.
Up to 1 mag of knockback and the target is knocked down, more then 1 mag and the target is knocked back. Wouldn't most bosses have some knock back protection negating any and all knockback less then 1 mag? I guess I was over estimating the power of this proc but I was expecting to hit a x8 group with fire cages and see around 1/4 of the minions and Lt's hit the ground. |
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
Quote:
No, you're getting the impact of the proc correct, it's just that you're putting in a power that will cancel out the effect.|
Originally Posted by Dark_Tower
I guess I was over estimating the power of this proc but I was expecting to hit a x8 group with fire cages and see around 1/4 of the minions and Lt's hit the ground.
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Since KD and KB are the same effect mechanics-wise the KB protection in Fire Cages makes it's targets immune to KD as well.
It's an awesome proc, but you put it in just about the worst possible power to have it in.
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Fire Cages immobilizes enemies while also preventing them from being knocked down or knocked back. Putting a knockback proc IO in that power is very counter intuitive; it's like slotting an attack with a proc that heals the enemy.
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Originally Posted by Dark_Tower
I guess I was over estimating the power of this proc but I was expecting to hit a x8 group with fire cages and see around 1/4 of the minions and Lt's hit the ground.
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Technically, the 0.75 is just a guess. We only know for a fact that the threshold is between 0.7437 and 0.8174. I think 0.75 is a good guess, though |
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
Actually, it's about 0.76 mag turns into KB. 0.75 or below is KD.
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
Alright, thanks for the quick feed back everyone, as soon as I get my funds back up I'll be switching the KD IO out for the dam/rech IO.
thankfully the KD IO was only about 30 million, now I need to find another 300 million. 
Dark Tower. SL50 Stone/Stone Tanker
Founder The Freedom Phalanx Reserve
An Infinity Top 25 Super Group
Founded January 4th 2006
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If you're willing to, you can use Alignment merits to buy high demand recipes (Like the LotG +Recharge) then sell them on the market. 100mil+ every other day.
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Originally Posted by Dark_Tower
Alright, thanks for the quick feed back everyone, as soon as I get my funds back up I'll be switching the KD IO out for the dam/rech IO.
thankfully the KD IO was only about 30 million, now I need to find another 300 million. |
@Oathbound & @Oathbound Too
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The LotG +Rech (and most other recipes worth that much) cost 2 Alignment Merits, which means that's once every 4 days, not 2.
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Originally Posted by Oathbound
If you're willing to, you can use Alignment merits to buy high demand recipes (Like the LotG +Recharge) then sell them on the market. 100mil+ every other day.
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@Roderick
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I think you can buy a merit for 20mil every day.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
The LotG +Rech (and most other recipes worth that much) cost 2 Alignment Merits, which means that's once every 4 days, not 2.
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Yes, you can. But you need to have 50 reward merits too.
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Originally Posted by Mr_Kingkillaha
I think you can buy a merit for 20mil every day.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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The Kismet +6% Accuracy (tohit) only costs one A-merit, iirc
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Originally Posted by Roderick
The LotG +Rech (and most other recipes worth that much) cost 2 Alignment Merits, which means that's once every 4 days, not 2.
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RaikenX is currently seeking new quotes to add to his signature.
Someone say something funny.
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Originally Posted by Smiling_Joe
::looks at RaikenX's signature::
Something funny. |
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And there's (well, essentially) no limit on the number of reward merits you can earn in a day, so the option still exists in the realm of possibility.
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Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Yes, you can. But you need to have 50 reward merits too.
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Actually you should have made your last slot be Gravitational Anchor - chance for HOLD (also a purple). Not that silly knockdown you put in there. So every time you spam your fire cages you will likely catch 1 - 3 of the mobs in the hold not just the immob.
Put the chance for knockdown in in like a fireball if you pick up fire epic.
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Right, you can see this pretty quickly with a Grav/FF controller, hit a boss with your first Hold, and not only is he not held, but you also can't now use Lift or Force Bolt to keep him from coming at you because he is protected from Knockup and Knockback. Grav has its -knockback switched to its Hold from most other controllers who have it in their Immob, making it kind of a pain in that case.
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Originally Posted by Lazarillo
It's tied to hitting. If you miss, obviously, there won't be a -KB, but as long as you hit, any maz that applies the -KB will apply it regardless of whether the target is mezzed or not.
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Yesterday I was able to purchase the last Ragnarok IO I needed to fill out my Fire Cages, currant slotting below.
Level 2: Fire Cages -- Ragnrk-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Ragnrk-Dmg(3), Ragnrk-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(5), GravAnch-Hold%(17), Ragnrk-Acc/Rchg(27), Ragnrk-Knock%(46)
One of those IO is the chance for Knockdown, somewhere I read that someone had slotted this IO in Fire Cages for extra damage mitigation, they cant attack while theyre on their ***, at the time this made since but now that Ive got it slotted I wonder.
I have yet to see any mob hit with Fire cages be knocked down, I even went to a lower level zone and using only fire cages I tested this on many mobs. Considering how many times my Gravitational Anchor chance to hold proc fired I should have seen at least one knockdown.
So Im wondering, is it not working or is fire cages negating the porc?
Should I remove it and slot in the damage/recharge IO even though I'm over the damage cap as it is?
Dark Tower. SL50 Stone/Stone Tanker
Founder The Freedom Phalanx Reserve
An Infinity Top 25 Super Group
Founded January 4th 2006