"No Ambushes" option on difficulty slider


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Posted

City of Ambushes isn't fun for most of my characters.

I'd like to be able to turn them off; even if it was only when solo (like bosses).

It's the main reason I won't start a character in Praetoria. I notice there's a lot more ambushes creeping into CoV/CoH too. It's unwelcome for low level squishies.





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Posted

My initial point was: How far do you need to go to water down the game? If ambushes aren't fun for you because you can't handle them on every character you play, so they get removed, then what's the next to go?

More than that, ambushes are a necessary part of the game. They're part of the story, and they're not impossible to deal with. Pretty much every mission you get ambushed in you can see it coming a mile away. Text warnings and visual cues are present. Pack a few inspirations.


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Posted

The narrative flow of certain missions would be broken without ambushes. So while I understand your concern, I don't think this is a good idea or likely to become reality.


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Posted

I quite like the ambushes as they make the missions more lively and give the impression that our enemies are actually reacting to our attack, rather than just standing around waiting to get taken down.

That said, I hate hate hate the ones where the ambush spawns directly onto you, in melee and instantly firing off their attacks. Unless they have been established as having teleport abilities/technology they shouldn't really be doing that. I've noticed several of those in the Tips, though the GR missions generally have them running into combat in a more believable, and survivable, way.


 

Posted

I understand the OPs feelings on this, especially in Praetoria.

Ambushes that;
1) Don't spawn on top of you
2) Don't auto-home like a rabid bloodhound
3) Don't auto detect through stealth

Thats not much to ask for. Especially when the ambush size in Praetoria doesn't seem to be x1 even when set to x1. It very often seems like x2. Which is not balance or a 'challenge' like debuffs are. Thats just unasked for and unneeded.


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Posted

I dont usually have an issue with ambushes in general. What I greatly dislike are some of the Praetoria missions where the ambushes keep coming and coming ... and coming.

Some lowbie archtypes just cant deal with it. They really need to limit the number of ambushes in a single mission that a solo character has to deal with. Yes, inspirations help, but after a certain number of ambushes, those run out.


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Posted

Simply making ambushes target your location would solve 90% of the problems they present. Ambushes that don't ignore stealth, don't chase you all over creation, don't ignore Mastermind henchmen and which you can hide from without the need for special powers would be far more manageable.


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Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
I understand the OPs feelings on this, especially in Praetoria (also, the snark was unnecessay, Dechs. C'mon.)

Ambushes that;
1) Don't spawn on top of you
If you want that as "Review spawn points," sure. If you want "Detect where the player is and move elsewhere," that's more problematic. (For instance, the honoree mission in the Alpha slot arc, I'll tend to run back to the start to ambush the ambushes - having them spawn elsewhere because I was "too close" would be highly annoying.)

Quote:
2) Don't auto-home like a rabid bloodhound
If it's just "go to location," what's the point of an ambush? Besides, the homing makes it easier to ambush the incoming ambush. Coming for me? Let me set up a surprise around the corner...

Yes, I mean this as a Stalker, too.

Quote:
3) Don't auto detect through stealth
Are you saying the same as the above, or the occasionally odd-seeming aggro splitting? If the second, it's really not an "ambush" problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel Tow
Simply making ambushes target your location would solve 90% of the problems they present. Ambushes that don't ignore stealth, don't chase you all over creation, don't ignore Mastermind henchmen and which you can hide from without the need for special powers would be far more manageable.
Why bother with ambushes at all, then? Just stick the mobs somewhere in the first place and have them standing around picking their noses like every other mob.

It makes sense for SOME ambushes to be location-targeted ("Someone hacked the mainframe/broke into the safe!") Making that the sum total of what they do, though? Boring, bland, and pointless.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill View Post
Why bother with ambushes at all, then? Just stick the mobs somewhere in the first place and have them standing around picking their noses like every other mob.

It makes sense for SOME ambushes to be location-targeted ("Someone hacked the mainframe/broke into the safe!") Making that the sum total of what they do, though? Boring, bland, and pointless.
That's assuming the point of ambushes is to make fights tougher by throwing more enemies at you, in which case it's trivial to turn the question around - why not just make spawns bigger? Because that's all ambushes do - make for longer fights with more spawns without giving you the option to pace yourself. To me, this overriding of the difficulty I've chosen is what I hate about ambushes more than anything else.

As far as Stalkers go, getting the drop on an unaware spawn makes a far greater difference than picking which corner to pop out of. Not only does it allow you to rest and let your powers recharge, but it also lets you open with a larger attack - Assassin's Strike - which is otherwise rendered completely pointless with enemies who auto-aggro on you.

What's the point of ambushes? None to my mind. I would have no problem with removing them from the game entirely where they aren't vital to the proper functioning of missions, such as when they're used as triggers. And even those can usually be reworked or at the very least toned down.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilGeko View Post
The narrative flow of certain missions would be broken without ambushes. So while I understand your concern, I don't think this is a good idea or likely to become reality.
Precisely what came to my mind.

But I also don't agree the game is that hard. Having solo'd most of the game on a variety of ATs and builds, the current difficulty slider is more than adequate to cover the content.


 

Posted

That makes the game start sounding more like this:



Ambushes don't let you pace your recovery? This is not a bad thing. So you can't sleep through a mission. *shrug* No, adding more mobs to a spawn is not the same thing at all. You can still just hang back if that's all that's done (or bypass them entirely - and not just on a stalker.) It would be "overriding the difficulty you've chosen" if they forced the ambushes to be EBs or AVs. You don't - bugged ambushes aside - get a bigger spawn than you normally would. In fact, with the way some spread out, it's often smaller and easier to handle.

It's not like they come up by surprise, either - very rarely do I see one show up without SOME sort of indication that lets you prepare.

And so what if you can't open with Assassin's Strike on a stalker? They also tend to have other decent attacks as well (if not other "tricks" entirely.) Get out of the "AS-Placate-Hit-Run" and actually scrap it out. Yes, Stalkers can do that, despite their hit-and-run reputation.

I tend to - well, *not care* if being ambushed means all my powers haven't recharged. Why should I have all the advantages, all the time?


 

Posted

Are ambushes really a problem? Can't you simply outrun an ambush using sprint? If it is a problem I can run to a safe zone such as an Arbitor/Police Drone.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
What's the point of ambushes?
Ambushes, to some degree, remove the tactical initiative from the player.

With an ambush, you don't have us much chance to approach the spawn on your time-table, review the spawn composition, pick which targets have to die first, and set up buffs at your leisure.

For some players / ATs / builds / playstyles, this can add significant variety in play experience (and difficulty).

It can be overused, of course. And I'd be hard pressed to argue that case that Praetoria didn't cross that line, at least in some cases.


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Posted

Am I the only person that uses this craftable temp power to keep from getting killed by ambushes that start to overwhelm me and to get to a position where I can pick them off?

Ethereal Shift Self Intangible

You can shift yourself into the Ethereal Plane. Although you do not become completely invisible, you are translucent and hard to see. You are intangible, and cannot affect or be affected by those in normal space. Once activated, you will remain shifted for 30 seconds. You cannot rest on the Ethereal Plane. You may use this ability five times.


Sure I have to replenish it a lot in Praetoria but they aren't hard to replace.


 

Posted

A good number of missions wouldn't make any sense anymore if you removed the ambushes.

I like ambushes. They're often the only thing that adds a little flavor or challenge to otherwise straightforward missions.

What I hate however, is ambushes that spawn, move toward you, only to turn around and walk away without engaging you. It's especially bad on the second mission of the ITF. Really annoying.


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Posted

A little from both sides?

Keep ambushes no matter what.

Add slider for ambush difficulty.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill View Post
That makes the game start sounding more like this:

And what's wrong with that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill View Post
I tend to - well, *not care* if being ambushed means all my powers haven't recharged. Why should I have all the advantages, all the time?
I prefer to play the game on my terms and indeed have all the advantages of being the player. You clearly disagree, but that doesn't mean I'll appreciate ambushes more because of it. Any game element which has consistently done nothing more than to irritate me is not a game element that will ever get my support under any circumstances.

I don't care about challenge or difficulty when it's annoying, that's what it comes down to. I'd rather play a game that's boring to one that makes me scream bloody murder at my screen and punch my keyboard.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill View Post
If you want that as "Review spawn points," sure. If you want "Detect where the player is and move elsewhere," that's more problematic. (For instance, the honoree mission in the Alpha slot arc, I'll tend to run back to the start to ambush the ambushes - having them spawn elsewhere because I was "too close" would be highly annoying.)
I don't know when it started, but before whenever it was, Ambushes would always spawn somewhere else, and then run to you. Wether they homed in or were location base didn't matter; they always spawned somewhere else, even if it was in the last room, the door to the current one, or just down the tunnel.

Since, however, there have been many, many times when an ambush has triggered and it has spawned right on top of a player. Notably on the ITF for example; you're suddenly surrounded by Romans that seem to have sprung from the ground.

This makes no sense whichever way you look at it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinch View Post
A little from both sides?

Keep ambushes no matter what.

Add slider for ambush difficulty.
This is an interesting concept, allow the player to pick the difficulty of Ambushes separately from regular spawns.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
[overthetopsnark]
Great contribution. Very well thought out. Really. Should put it up for a Pulitzer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha View Post
I understand the OPs feelings on this, especially in Praetoria (also, the snark was unnecessay, Dechs. C'mon.)

Ambushes that;
1) Don't spawn on top of you
2) Don't auto-home like a rabid bloodhound
3) Don't auto detect through stealth

Thats not much to ask for. Especially when the ambush size in Praetoria doesn't seem to be x1 even when set to x1. It very often seems like x2. Which is not balance or a 'challenge' like debuffs are. Thats just unasked for and unneeded.
You have actually successfully identifed the issues which lead to my post. Thank you for taking the time to actually think about it.

1) Makes no sense
2) Doesn't make any sense unles they are watching security cameras and know where you are (aim at a hacked glowie yes but I'm three corridors away now)
3) This removes a tactical advantage which isn't realistic especially when combined with 2).

The Praet difficulty does seem higher than 'normal settings'. I'm not the best player but I'm not the worst. If you guys can handle a harder difficulty then sure; ramp up the difficulty slider. But for those of us who can't you're raising the MINIMUM. I love this game because any AT can solo. Or could. The move seems to be cramming in ambushes which don't add to the atmosphere or content but kill anything not tank/brute/scrapper/stalker.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hercules View Post
What I greatly dislike are some of the Praetoria missions where the ambushes keep coming and coming ... and coming.

Some lowbie archtypes just cant deal with it. They really need to limit the number of ambushes in a single mission that a solo character has to deal with. Yes, inspirations help, but after a certain number of ambushes, those run out.
Again, absolutely right. Ambush farms in AE on a decked out 50; great. On a low level squishy; not so much. Ambushes used to stop at three waves, not targetted on you personally. Now they seem to be almost continuous on some missions and running and hiding isn't an option.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Simply making ambushes target your location would solve 90% of the problems they present. Ambushes that don't ignore stealth, don't chase you all over creation.
I take it you solo a fair bit too? You're absolutely right. I don't care exactly what is done to ambushes to make them more solo/squishy-AT-friendly and thanks to those here who are at least coming up with ideas. I'd just like to maintain the original balance of any AT can solo which from which we seem to be moving away.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Quinch View Post
A little from both sides?
Keep ambushes no matter what.
Add slider for ambush difficulty.
Fine! Great idea. Allows for flexibility. Awesome.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Support View Post
Are ambushes really a problem? Can't you simply outrun an ambush using sprint? If it is a problem I can run to a safe zone such as an Arbitor/Police Drone.
Not inside a mission, no. And not if they are targetted on YOU not your location. If they are, running doesn't help.

I mainly play redside. For the past three years, I've been handling ambushes, using insps and yes I scrap on stalkers. However, I feel that the ambushes used in Praet and moving into CoV/CoH are over-the-top. It's like the Devs are assuming everyone is running setted-out 50s. Let's not think of a challenge (the way Trapdoor WAS) but let's shove a continuous stream of ambushes at people. It's lazy content which penalizes solo'ers and those who aren't running tougher AT's (in my view).

Yes I like a challenge; that's why my main runs at +4 x8 but she's 50, setted and Alpha'd. My little lowbies using TO's would like a break! That isn't asking for simple simon games, it's asking for content appropriate to them.





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