Issue 20 info is up!

They aren't your powers. They are powers that you're taking (or being granted) from the Well of the Furies.

Doesn't make them any less unimpressive.

I think folks get where they come from. That's the issue with the design.

Folks are requesting alternate pets for the system. I don't think the suggestion is unreasonable.

But I don't see that option happening any time soon or for ANY of the currently revealed slots.

I'd argue the Devs care whether EVERY SINGLE PLAYER likes their content or not. They will also strive to improve such content based on feedback given to them. Hence the changes to make the Incarnate Content more soloale. The devs realize also that they can't please everyone all the time, but ARE (unlike some foolish posters in this thread) willing to hear the criticism. That's what makes the game great and doesn't seem to be changing based on some threads posted by Red Names in the last few days. So no, you cannot say no one cares if so and so likes the content, as saying that shows you don't know what you're talking about.

So no, there are some folks who care whether Sam or you or me likes the content. If he doesn't they want to know why. And if they can they fix it they will, if they can't they will simply note what someone like Sam likes and try to EVENTUALLY create that. (Whether Sam [or folks like Sam] wish to wait for that is a different story.)

Social interaction =/= teaming. Hell I've seen LESS social interaction in speed runs. Ive been on speed runs and regular teams where NO ONE talks. I'd bet eventually the same will be of these trials. With just the raid leader giving out instructions.

I get more social interaction from the Global Chat Channels than some teams. This idea that teaming = social interaction in game is a fallacy (especially for this one).

And thankfully this MMORPG isn't like the dreck that's out there.

EDITs: To clean up words and meanings.

Encouraging is fine, forcing it when you haven't done so for seven years is complete bull ****.

Frankly this raid stuff, I think is massively detrimental to the game, why are the devs trying to be more like the market leader, instead of focusing on what made the game unique on the market?

I mean the AE, pretty cool but it has been done before, and the same effect can be had in 'market leader' with the right add ons.

The character creator? If they are going to slow down on adding options to it, or making all the options paid for, then the 'former studio' of this game will catch up with their options, and slightly better layering options.

The league finder? 'Market Leader' did it over a year ago, the latest competing game launched with one in place.

Multi-party fights? Been done since the beginning of the genre.

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This game used to be very alt friendly, but now it is becoming like a generic 'fantasy' MMORPG, choose one toon as your main and do your dailies and weeklies to gear up, don't bother rolling an alt because you'll progress at half speed.

I'm not saying it is unreasonable to ask for different pets. I agree with that. In fact, I would much prefer a customizable pet so everyone can have their own buddy along.

I'm just explaining the issue of where the powers come from.

Actually a lot of this stuff reminds of the MMO based on the IP which the market leader originally ripped off back in the 90s, as do things like the in-zone Praetorian events.

The problem with that approach was that in that other game a lot of those Events were basically always empty and unused, especially in lower population servers.

Just like the Praetorian Zone Events are now basically (about 3 months after they came out).

That's possibly the biggest challenge for these Trials, for every Rikti Mothership there's a Cathedral of Pain.

Uhhh I don't think folks don't know where the powers came from by now.

For lower population servers that will be a large, glaring issue.

Hopefully the cross server aspect that's being hinted at comes out sooner than later.

Not really going to help us EU players though.

To a point yes and to a point no but then the same can be said to every AT now. Dont know if anybody else has mentioned this but those 1k+ damage powers? They're the same figures for every AT, they dont use AT modifications but are instead fixed values.

So while it would be possible for a team to have perma +def shields on them, the downside is that they gradually lose their effectiveness as time goes on whereas the buffers could keep every player up to the cap perma. So im 50/50 on this until we are able to get a few players up to full incarnate level 5.

It's not my fallacy. It's the industry's fallacy. Let's say I agree with you and to a certain extent I do. Why then hasn't a game been made where teaming is 100% optional the way you all describe optional, I.e. no reward is gated to team/group content?

I've thought a lot about this, and the level of social interaction that teaming requires is different than social interaction like chatting or marketeering. There's a game element to it. Now this particular game is different than other game where certain roles are not always necessary to succeed. But in other game and even some content in this game, you actually need people to fulfill specific tasks in a group.

Even here, we expect a bubbler to actually bubble. Or a Tank to at least grab the biggest NPCs attention. That's different than just talking to other people. It is you putting other folks in charge of your game to a certain extent. Even if you never say a word, it's putting yourself out there in a way that simply talking or selling stuff on a market does not. I know that on the often hated speed runs, I have to put a lot more faith in the group than I do for a normal TF. It's exhilarating when you get a team where everyone knows what to do and can really push the envelope. For me, and I'd wager others it's more fun that even over the top solo tasks.

So yes, you're right social interaction does not equal teaming. But teaming is a form of social interaction that is unique and worthy of reward.

Am I mistaken but isn't the current Market (Wents/Black market) cross server with EU?

EDIT: Honestly they need to merge the EU list with the US list and offer you guys free transfers, so that you have at least SOME characters that can get into teaming when your home EU servers are ghost towns, at certain times.

I frankly think it'll help the game a lot. This is what I've been waiting for, for a long time. If end game content was just a few level 50 arcs,I'd have been pissed. I'm sure I wouldn't have been the only one.

I'm mainly just wondering what some people thought End Game content was going to consist of.

Sam doesn't apparently. Remember I was responding to him. Incarnate powers are not 'your' powers.

Think they looked at low population servers while creating these raids and even though we do have a low population EU side, think we're organised enough now that with this new LFG/league system and the low player requirements for the trials that we can say setting one up wont take longer than it would for a tf.

Well hopefully Paragon Studios / NCSoft will actually do it right if/when it occurs and any Cross Server play also includes a Region/Server List merge.

When the 'shiny' has worn off, and you're working night shifts?

It is. The main issue is the fact that the Global Names system is split into two regions.

You see I was hopeful about this, until the whole NDA that actually hid, sweet bum **** all.

The same type of mind that uses 'secret' as a ploy to create hype, won't let a server list merge occur, because it might result in bad PR "City of heroes merges server lists ZOMG CITY OF HEROES IS DYING!" Is the kind of response that is possible, and thus I don't think they'll let it happen.

Dont think the shiny will go for a while yet People like myself who play at really random times and want every single slot will be wanting in on every single raid going and it WILL take an absolute age to get to the 5th level on just one character.

Actually for a lot of the newer MMORPGs you DON'T need to team, at all, to great rewards. I can't really discuss it without falling afoul of the no comparisons rule, so I'll put that aside for now.

And in this game, no I don't expect a bubbler to always bubble as it's not always necessary. And in some instance due to the level of power individual players have built into their characters, a bubbler is irrelevant. That's the thing about the this game (unlike many other MMORPGs), which you alluded to. Multiple ATs can fill multiple roles. So much so that the level of interaction you might need with a holy trinity style set up in other games, just isn't necessary here.

Relating to that is why speed runs are so successful, and why it's possible to do some tasks in this game without anyone having to say a word. Some of the stuff you can speed through in this game you could NOT do it if buffs worked the same way they do in other games. I don't think that's a bad thing at all mind you.

I agree that teaming is worthy of reward. My question is for this game, when has it never been well rewarded?

To me social interaction actually means talking to folks. Getting on a speed run, not saying a word and simply completing your task/role isn't interaction. It's replaying something that's been programmed into you via repeatedly doing the content to the point of perfection. For many folks that's not fun nor is it interactive socially. Sure it's interactive in completing tasks you've been programmed via repetition to do, but it's sure as hell not universally as fun as cracking jokes, discussing comics, and talking about builds on the forums or Global Channels. THAT is why I say teaming =/= social interaction.

As for those other mmorpgs it can often be WORSE, as you're so busy worrying about dps rotations ,healing rotaitons, reapplying VERY short duration buffs and debuffs, and when to do specific tasks to the microsecond so that the entire raid doesn't wipe based on your mistake, that you don't really do anything I would call social interaction. THAT DOES NOT sound AT ALL like fun. Sorry. It's the reason many folks who play this game DON'T. PLAY. THOSE.

Thankfully the other two Superhero mmos have avoided adding that nonsense to their endgames.

I think that is why folks despise Raiding systems and are VERY wary of COH adopting that model. I think they are worrying a little about nothing but I can definitely see where they are coming from.

How exactly do you know the NDA has hidden nothing? I mean whatever required a physical NDA may not be part of this overview for some reason.

I also completely disagree with the idea that NCSoft / Paragon Studios would see a Server List merge as being them admitting the game is dying. More likely is that the infrastructure challenges facing such a merge are the sort of challenge which the Powers That Be haven't given the green light to solving.

Eh, from those statements of his it seems like he is coming at it from an RP perspective rather than a mechanics one.

I am totally with the Geko on this one.

Sam (and others certainty) cannot, will not, accept the fact that someone attacking their opinions is not a personal attack. Being a trained debater showed me this 30 years ago.

I don't have anything against Sam as a person and I am sure I am one of the people referred to in this next post.

This is nothing more than sticking one's head in the sand. The whole point of a discussion board is to encounter and challenge ideas that are different to yours.

And this is why I, personally, attack Sams ideas as well as others - they come from a deep sea of unhappiness. Regardless of weather or not I find it enjoyable. How's that for taking responsibility for my actions, Sam?

I do not want changes/'fixes"/additions to the game to have their genesis based upon such an unhealthy outlook.

Nor do I want forums goers to be influenced in by such negative outlooks without being challenged.

I respect every person as a human being who posts here.

I do NOT respect every viewpoint, whack idea, vain posturing or attempted martyrdom espoused be the vocal minority for a very many things discussed on these forums.

As my wife is fond of saying, "If you don't wan't people to laugh at your beliefs, then perhaps you should not have such funny beliefs."

To a certain extent, I agree with this. You do have a pathway to play one main for a long time. But then, that's really the point of the system. People wanted exactly what you posted. A MMORPG endgame.

For my part, I'm alted out. Alts only last a few levels before I tire of them and go back to my mains. But for some folks that's still a relevant style of play and Incarnates do not harm that play. In fact, the WST enhances it. Getting a Sister Psyche is not normally that easy since it's not a great TF. I was much easier when it was the target. Very friendly for altoholics, badgers, etc.

I don't see much negative from Incarnates so long as a player can accept that it might not be for them and it's not the end of the game that this stuff will be added. I'm currently playing that market leader you mentioned. Super casually, highest character is 24. I have NO intention to raid there and don't have a problem with that. I play for enjoyment. If it feels like a job I stop. Incarnates don't feel like a job to me. It's fun.