Suggestions for a Modern Scrapper

Ah calamity and flux! I am thrown into disarray by I19. I am returning to the game and have a bevy of pre 19 builds but of course, they all have their fitness pools built and not inherent. While untangling that to a “best spec” solution is mind boggling in its own right I am somewhat disheartened by intimations that some of the sets may be different in ways that make them more or less effective from when I last saw them back around 15.

So, I wonder if I could get some educated opinions about scrapper directions. I am not asking for builds. If you happen to have any lying around then that’s fine and I am appreciative but you don’t need to go out of your way.

Instead of asking for some sort of mythical “best” build, let me tell you how I like to play and perhaps you can tell me what currently offers that sort of momentum and energy.

I want to live.
Survival is one of the most important aspects. I don’t mind standing in front of a mob for a while and returning to the same attacks over and over isn’t a problem at all. I don’t get bored as long as I am not getting dead. In fact, I am very willing to sacrifice face melting alpha striking thermonuclear power for just outliving my opponent. I figure that if I live longer than the mob then I win.

I am not a big fan of panic-button hunting.
Complex defensive script characters are not that fun for me because I tend to be sidetracked with what is happening on the screen and pay less attention to which savior clicky I should be chasing down until the hospital rings and coming down and I notice that I never clicked that one right there.

I’m not saying there should be no clickys at all, but if there is a build chock full of them where I have to be certain to time the first one right after the opening and then the next one about three seconds later or when I reach half health and then the next one when my power is at twenty five percent unless I have more than half my health in which case I can skip to the fourth one… yeah, that one is likely not for me.

Endo is for chumps
I don’t like managing endurance, especially since there are so many tools for bypassing that particular annoyance. This may lock me into some sort of Regen/WP loop but I just can’t stand having to anticipate the intuitional math of how long my blue will last versus how many mobs I am fighting times the diminishing attack chain I have to unravel just to maintain some semblance of combat.

I want to be able to stand there and unload for as long as it takes, full bore and wide open. Perhaps that is being overly optimistic. I would rather have to jimmie my attack chain as little as possible in order to keep swinging. I would rather rely on spurious influxes of endo (drains and the like) as little as possible.

Down with downtime
This is likely a total non-issue but I will mention it for full disclosure. I don’t mind standing in a fight for a while but I don’t plan to stand around between fights. I don’t recall any scrappers having to much of a downtime hang around waiting for something to reach an acceptable level for the next fight trouble. If any set has developed this in my absence, I will want to be sure to leave that one free for others to engage at their own convenience whilst I skip merrily to some other set.

So in summary

My play style would love a highly survivable, endo self-sufficient, low downtime build wherein I am not endlessly chasing down panic buttons in combat.


I suppose I should also be asking about perma-[insert dominant power here] but I don’t know much about that in truth and it may not be in the cards.

I like the flight pool, the flight power itself, but that too might not be available depending on where things go. I am pretty certain that the Fighting Pool will be involved for tough and weave, and the leaping for the combat jump, perhaps the Speed pool for the ever handy Hasten and even Maneuver from the leadership pool.

In the past, I have had some success with Dark Melee/Regen but even that hit something of a wall at 50. Regen is not a defense and I found myself getting pummeled down mostly because I consistently managed to trigger the Instant Heal in the throes of Dull pain or with Moment of Glory down and it just could not overcome my grinning multi-mob induced death spiral.

I love Dark Melee as a set but I have see it paired with Invulnerability here. I confess to an irrational dislike of Invulnerability from way back. It has always seemed to be the poster child for under-performance, folding like a cheap, nerfed suit in the cold shadow of such greats as Willpower and even Regen, especially given invulnerability’s shamelessly conspicuous endo usage for little more than a lingering tenderized death, the very epitome of “just die tired”.

But of course here I am seeing that someone has soloed no less than nine AV’s with this very mix (dm/inv). Even if it is only a very technical defiance of the spirit of challenge, that is still a formidable feat.

So, setting aside my preconceptions, bearing in mind my notes and open to the possibilities of questions, in what power sets do you think I should invest?

DM/INV or DM/SR; DM or Fire /Shield are great especially if you can work defense in with IO's with INV (I like DM, too)

Katana/willpower jumps out as something you would like

I'll let others chime in on their favs, but those jump out at me and the ones I like.

Oh, and Welcome Back!

Invul no longer sucks. If you're willing to invest in IOs you won't die, and with Dark Consumption and possibly Physical Perfection you won't be tired.

DM/SD is of course the uber single-target killer set, has Shield Charge to compensate for the lack of AoE in DM, and can be very survivable against most things. That is what I have. It is awesome.

Or you could go with DM/WP if you really don't want to deal with clicks.

Or DM/SR even.

If you don't end up going with DM, I second the suggestion of Katana/WP.

Might I suggest the "zen" of scrapping, the claws/sr.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow Ravenwolf My favorite combo is Faceplant/DebtCap with the TeamWipe Ancillary

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dispari Yeah, I like Blasters too.

You're no longer limited to Regen and Willpower for unlimited endurance. The cardiac alpha boost is very very nice... once you get to 50.

I'll second the suggestions of Dark Melee/Shield Defense and Katana/Willpower.

DM/SD - Top end DPS, plenty of survivability to take advantage of it, cardiac alpha boost available at 50 if you do find yourself having endurance problems. AoE can be decent with Shield Charge and if you take an epic that gives you an AoE. Can be a bit pricey if you want absolute top end performance out of it.

Katana/Willpower - Easy to build, easy to level, easy to play, very hard to kill, and gives up nothing in top end power when IO'd to the gills. Rather average damage output, but you'll have all the time in the world to get the job done.

Another thing I'll suggest is claws/willpower. Fast low-end-cost attacks, the knockdown in Focus provides great single-target mitigation, you've got Shockwave if you really need some breathing space, and while Willpower isn't outstanding in any one defensive category it's got some defense and some resists and some regen, so if one's debuffed into uselessness you've got two more ways of staying on your feet. My Claws/WP is a very enjoyable character to play.

DM/Shield/Blaze

Its everything anyone could ever want in a scrapper. Awesome single target dps. Insane AOE with soul drain +shield charge +fire ball. Softcap Def and just enough resist help in a pinch. Can't go wrong with either the Cardiac Radial or the Spiritual Radial.

Put the influence into it, its worth every bit.

I'll acknowledge that if you want survival over damage output, DM/Inv is very potent.

But permit me to sing a song of sword and shield.

I have a DM/Regen and a DM/Super Reflexes scrapper to level 50. The/Regen is great as I have lots of IOs to boost regen and recovery. Especially with the recharge/heal uncommon Incarnate Boost. And there is only a 5 second gap between when Dull Pain ends and it becomes recharged again. So I can basically have that running all the time.

I found, much to my chagrin, that my DM/SR scrapper did really poorly on the Imperious TF. The cimerorans just chewed through my defenses until I was quickly dead. I felt like a blaster or a Kheldian. Not much fun.

Of course, the /SR scrapper isn't nearly as IO'd out as the /Regen scrapper, so maybe that played a part.

Invulnerability is overrated. It gives a lot of S/L resist, but hardly any resistance to other types of damage. It is also good for getting to the soft cap easily, but lacks worthwhile defense debuff resistance to back it up. Basically, if you start fighting things that debuff defenses AND do a non-physical damage (Clockwork in the new TFs), you will be hurting. Also, Invulnerability has no built-in protection against psionic damage and limited toxic protection (Apex has nasty toxic damage in one part). The healing component (Dull Pain) of Invulnerability is very low on HP/s, which is why it needs to be paired with DM.

Positional defense sets (Shield and SR) are protected against all damage types. There are only a few attacks in the game that ignore defense completely and they are easy to avoid, and/or are not a threat. Willpower and Regen can mitigate any damage type as well, through healing. They do require significant investment to increase defense though.

As much as I love my /SR characters (I have 3, all capped) I have to say that Willpower would be an excellent choice for you.

My Kat/WP is a veritable mini-tank just slotted with SOs.

Firstly, I must thank everyone for the wonderful input, yours is certainly the art within the science. I have enjoyed reading though the various suggestions and intellectual offerings here.

With much respect to the Claw aficionados, I must disqualify that particular set from the running on thematic grounds. I know that this particular board lends itself to performance over appearance in many ways and I do not dispute the attractive features of the Claw set. I just find that it visually and thematically leaves me cold.

Don’t think I won’t be squirreling away that build though. I love to collect interesting builds and I thank you for it.

I am seeing Invulnerability and Shield Defense as the top contenders for survivable defense with willpower coming in with a note of ambivalence.

I understand that both Inv and Shield’s dominance depend of a heal coming from somewhere, In fact, that is part of the issue I have always had with Inv. How many times have I watched a Inv tank get slowly dismantled by anything else simply because it had not way to get its health back. Taking 2 points of damage while everyone else is taking 150 is great but if you aren’t healing anything then those twos will add up to a faceplant. A bit over simplified but that’s it in a nutshell.

Which brings me to the idea of sword and board. Oh, how lovely is the look of Sword and Shield. I do whish I could take those sets on just for their epic flavor, some of the sword models are amazing and it just lends itself to the sort of theme I could eat up. But it abrogates my survival rule (and breaks my heart). I have never played shield to any acceptable level in any way but it seems that with no heal coming, sword and shield falls into the same pit as Invulnerability with no heal, slow agonizing death.

It could easily be argued that one should kill one’s opponent before imminent death becomes an issue. But doesn’t a no-heal solution also contain a hard ceiling for survivability.

Conceptually it seems like a heal solution would have less raw damage but more flexibility toward survival and I don’t mind standing in front of a mob for while and if I happen to be the last one standing there, well that’s has its own sort of schadenfreude fueled thrill.

Dark Melee seems to be the only offensive set with its own built in heal and so it is not surprising that it fits so snugly with both Invulnerability and Shield Defense. Oddly enough, it looks like shield defense is the more offensive of the two, a clear choice for damage and AOE to boot. I do wonder if it lack some of the defensive ability of the Invulnerability set and under what circumstances I would notice the disparity.

Willpower, as a defensive set, is like an artfully told dirty joke, it’s not subtle but it makes me smile. Not a lot of guesswork in it and I appreciate that. It lives up to the survival standard admirably and has some nice effects early on. However, everyone talks about it like white bread at the gourmet table. Perhaps it doesn’t scale as potently as the other defense sets and I have noticed a trend among early bloomers to flatten out a bit as it grows. Willpower looks like a bit of a hybrid anyway splitting its attention between regen effects and defenses.

I don’t know much about Katana. I had always considered it a poor man’s broadsword but after a bit of skimming it seems that Katana is very capable even if it becomes more utilitarian and less fireworks in its later phases.

I didn’t even think to ask about ancillaries, I suppose I just assumed that I would be going into Physical perfection and focused accuracy like some sort of arranged marriage but that might actually be too much. I might not need Physical Perfection, especially with the Cardiac Alpha Slot coming available.

I might be able to use the ancillary for damage if I use it at all. It seems like unless I am stacking some sort of power like Fireball on top of an already impressive AOE like Shield Charge as a bonus cheap shot, most of the tertiary powers aren’t that attractive.

The short list looks like:

Dark Melee / Invulnerability – Massive Survivability, Relies on Ancillaries for AOE, Long term Inf Build

Dark Melee / Shield Defense – Great defenses, Several AOE options, Good but possibly expensive DPS

Katana / Willpower – Early bloomer in both offence and defense, competitive defensively, Katana levels out before other offenses

So those are the choices that seem to stand out and what I think I have learned about them here. Feel free to correct my interpretations if they are amiss.

I already anticipate someone correcting me in saying that Invulnerability has no heal by pointing out that Dull Pain does have a healing element. Which is true, it does… sort of… kind of... I guess. I certainly would not trade it out of the set but I would not exactly call it a heal either.

That said, I find myself drawn to the Dark Melee / Invulnerability combo. The Katana / Willpower mix looks like such a winner that I am content to let it set on the back burner ready to take up slack if DM/INV lets me down.

Thematically, it’s hard to see myself with a shield and no sword (with apologies to Capt America). I might be lured into trying it later, perhaps in a bout of my chronic altitis. I may even give Sword and Shield a swing but I suspect that endo starvation and the empty health bar blues might take its toll on that one.

Your answer to the BS/Shield problem is of course aid self.

With the inherent fitness changes you can easily fit it into nearly any build plan you might come up with.

There is one caveat though, and that you'll be interrupted a lot trying to heal yourself until you get close to softcap defenses. Getting there is pretty easy once you get enough slots in attacks and defense powers to start collecting set bonuses but that is generally going to start happening in the mid 30's.

Don't despair though because in my experience with this power set even when solo things just melt so fast that unless you REALLY get in over your head you wont have to worry too much about heals mid fight.

To sum up, BS/Shield I think is a set that will have to mature to reach it's full potential but once it does it just plain rocks. Honestly I've not felt this invincible since SoA's first came out.

The issue with psi is this:

Invul is troubled by all psi damage

/SR is troubled by the non positional psi attacks which are the ones from the mind and illusion control sets. It works normally against the psi blast sets.

Hence master illusionists really mess up /SRs, psi clocks rather less.