How Will You Alpha?


Aett_Thorn

 

Posted

News on the Alpha Slot are on the Going Rogue website, and this page actually details the numbers for the enhancements. Given that info, how are you going to Alpha? Bonuses from the Alpha Slot will carry over to all your powers, and also allow you to boost from 1/6 to 1/2 of the bonus beyond ED.

I'm mulling over the possibilities still, and probably need to check this out with Mid's. For instance, will it be worth it for Fiery Aura to up its resist numbers? Or will the overall number not be worth it (if I'm reading it right, I could carry all the resist bonuses in Fiery Aura's shields and Tough to 13-14% beyond the ED cap. Not sure if that's enough overall to make a big difference). Or will it be better to increase recharge time and healing?

Each AT, powerset, and build will have many options, and I only hope that primaries will be boosted enough to warrant adding on to those things (primarily defense, resistance, and damage, considering how most IO sets work). What are everyone else's thoughts?


Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc:
Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory

 

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Tough choice, and I think it's going to depend on the build. Aett might try to go for the Nerve branch, and adjust slotting to more recharge instead of Defense. My Shield/Mace will likely go with the Spiritual branch, for the recharge goodness.

My other characters are likely going to have very tough choices ahead.


Edit -> and as far as the math goes, I think this is how it'll work:

Fire Armor base numbers: 30% for S/L. You can enhance that to the decently functional cap of 1.56%, bringing you up to 46.8% S/L Resistance.

Let's say we get to the Radial Paradigm level of the Alpha slot. That's a 20% Resistance boost, 2/3rds of which ignore ED. Since we're already at the ED cap, we'll get a 16.7% boost on top of what we've got, bringing the modifier up to 1.727. This will cause our Resistance value to become 51.8%. Not a huge boost, if you ask me, but it might be worth it.


Edit2 ->

If we add Tough to the mix, it also gets the bonuses of this slot with no additional cost. So, that's the 15% base value, times the same 1.727, and we end up with 25.905 S/L Resistance from Tough. Total S/L Resistance: 77.7%

Whereas before the Alpha slot we were at about 70.2% Resistance to S/L. This is a functional increase of 7.5% Resistance. Dang.


Compare this with the Defense values of, say, Ice Armor.

17% * 1.727 = 29.359% Defense.

Pre-Alpha Slot:

17 * 1.56 = 26.52, for a whopping increase of slightly less than 3% Defense. Hmmmmm...


Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson

"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus

 

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will probably go spiritual radial for my wp/dm. Endurance cost isn't really an issue and the added heal bonus will boost syphon life and regen (hmm wonder if it will boost the hp too?)


http://www.scene-and-heard.com/cov/covsig.jpg

 

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My Fire/, Dark/ and Elec/ tanks will go for Cardiac Core Paragon. 45% End reduction for Dark/ is going to go a long way. Then having the resist will always be helpful.

For my Ice/ and Shield/ tanks? Probably the Nerve Core Paragon.

For my WP/SS, it's obviously going to be the Spiritual Core Paragon. Recharge and Stun help for the /SS, and the heal for the WP/! The combo was more for that Alpha.


@Rylas

Kill 'em all. Let XP sort 'em out.

 

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I really have no idea. Ill be too busy respecing once issue 19 drops first. Then ill figure out how these things work and HOW LONG its going to take me to get them.


The hard things I can do--- The impossible just take a little bit longer.

If numbers are so much more important than a teammate who is fun to play with, forget about the game altogether and go play with a calculator instead. -Claws and Effect-

 

Posted

Seems like on my two ice tankers currently at 50,

My Ice/Ice will be going Spiritual, towards the Partial Radical Revamp, and ending as a Radical Paragon. The Slows and healing (More Regen from Health etc, bigger bulk heal from Hoarfrost. The Recharge will probably only just help with my slotting (slotted for bonuses not ED capping recharge on attacks) and so I'll probably benefit best from that, as that character is already soft-capped to S/L/N/E with EA applications.

My Ice/Kin tanker might end up going into the Nerve tree, as a Core, from the math above in this thread, the 3% Def increase from pushing over the ED cap should allow me to drop one Kinetic Combat set from my slotting, and thus being able to pick up more damage on that toon. Plus the Acc should help. As once again things have been slotted for set bonuses not E.D capping stats.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn View Post


Compare this with the Defense values of, say, Ice Armor.

17% * 1.727 = 29.359% Defense.

Pre-Alpha Slot:

17 * 1.56 = 26.52, for a whopping increase of slightly less than 3% Defense. Hmmmmm...
Can you whip out the math for an Ice Tanker that uses their Alpha slot with Nerve, which grants alot of Accuracy and a 20% defense buff.


 

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I'll probably get more damage for my Fire Tank. Mwahaha.


 

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I imagine CMA may go for the endred depending on how things shake out once I finalize an i19 build... that's my current biggest issue on Live. I think I've overcome it with my theoretical i19 build though; if so I may look to either more resist (minor I know) or possibly something else.

Sword of Damocleve, my BS/Shield scrapper will probably be looking for damage since endurance is no problem at all. Other characters I'll evaluate their needs at the time. My Fire/Rad is very likely to also go for endurance... that thing's the biggest end hog I have.


COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes

 

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will this allow us to go over the 400% damage cap then?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn View Post
Edit -> and as far as the math goes, I think this is how it'll work:

Fire Armor base numbers: 30% for S/L. You can enhance that to the decently functional cap of 1.56%, bringing you up to 46.8% S/L Resistance.

Let's say we get to the Radial Paradigm level of the Alpha slot. That's a 20% Resistance boost, 2/3rds of which ignore ED. Since we're already at the ED cap, we'll get a 16.7% boost on top of what we've got, bringing the modifier up to 1.727. This will cause our Resistance value to become 51.8%. Not a huge boost, if you ask me, but it might be worth it.


Edit2 ->

If we add Tough to the mix, it also gets the bonuses of this slot with no additional cost. So, that's the 15% base value, times the same 1.727, and we end up with 25.905 S/L Resistance from Tough. Total S/L Resistance: 77.7%

Whereas before the Alpha slot we were at about 70.2% Resistance to S/L. This is a functional increase of 7.5% Resistance. Dang.
Apparently I completely misunderstood the math. I saw "+20% global resistance" and "x above the cap" and concluded, "Hell, the resistance cap is 90%. My Fire Tanker is already at 70.2% s/l resistance...this will take her to 90%!!!"

But that's wrong, I take it, from what I'm seeing here?


If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------

The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InUse View Post
will this allow us to go over the 400% damage cap then?
No, caps are caps, as far as defense, resists, and damage goes. ED is different from that. You will be able to up your offense more on your own than you used to, however. Not sure if that'll be a goal for my tanks or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailboat View Post
Apparently I completely misunderstood the math. I saw "+20% global resistance" and "x above the cap" and concluded, "Hell, the resistance cap is 90%. My Fire Tanker is already at 70.2% s/l resistance...this will take her to 90%!!!"

But that's wrong, I take it, from what I'm seeing here?
Nope, it's an amount beyond the ED cap, if you look at the print with each enhancement. So you are not going to get a straight 20%, unless you are that far below the ED cap already. That's why this Alpha slot might be better to fill in holes in your build that you didn't slot as much, rather than percentages you already have at the ED cap.

Though after Aett's overview, it might be worth it for my Fiery Aura tank to go for the extra resists. Going from 70-78% resist to S/L won't be shabby (and a bit more for Energy, Dark, and Cold). Might wait and see what kind of damage and mobs we're facing with the new content, however.

Thanks for doing that, Aett. I'm not much of a numbers guy on my own (other than being able to analyze what end numbers can do, heh).


Guide: Tanking, Wall of Fire Style (Updated for I19!), and the Four Rules of Tanking
Story Arc:
Belated Justice, #88003
Synopsis: Explore the fine line between justice and vengeance as you help a hero of Talos Island bring his friend's murderer to justice.
Grey Pilgrim: Fire/Fire Tanker (50), Victory

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailboat View Post
Apparently I completely misunderstood the math. I saw "+20% global resistance" and "x above the cap" and concluded, "Hell, the resistance cap is 90%. My Fire Tanker is already at 70.2% s/l resistance...this will take her to 90%!!!"

But that's wrong, I take it, from what I'm seeing here?
Yeah. It applies a 20% Damage Resistance enhancement to all of your powers with slottable +Resistance, two-thirds of which bypasses Enhancement Diversification.

And for a Fire tank, it seems very, very hard to pass up Spiritual Core Paragon. Recharge and healing are very important parts of your survival.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by warden_de_dios View Post
Can you whip out the math for an Ice Tanker that uses their Alpha slot with Nerve, which grants alot of Accuracy and a 20% defense buff.
First of all, Accuracy is so prevalent in sets that you shouldn't need it from the Alpha Slot. I can understand the allure of defense buffs for a defense-based character, though.

If you are already soft capped, this enhancement won't do you much good. If your build focuses on damage, recharge, and non-defensive bonuses, you may gain some benefit, but it will be marginally useful.

The very rare Alpha enhancements ignore 2/3 of enhancement diversification. So, 2/3 of 20% = 13.33%, leaving 6.67% being affected by diminishing returns. Assuming your defensive powers are already at 55% enhancement bonus, you will gain 4.67% from the ED-affected portion of the Alpha Slot bonus. That makes the total 73% enhancement to defense in your defensive powers.

If you don't understand that math, it may be best to wait for Mids' to release an update that includes the Incarnate system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by InUse View Post
will this allow us to go over the 400% damage cap then?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailboat View Post
Apparently I completely misunderstood the math. I saw "+20% global resistance" and "x above the cap" and concluded, "Hell, the resistance cap is 90%. My Fire Tanker is already at 70.2% s/l resistance...this will take her to 90%!!!"

But that's wrong, I take it, from what I'm seeing here?
Nothing has been released that suggests they are raising any caps. The Alpha Slot enhancements enhance POWERS, not statistics. You don't gain 20% resistance or defense. Your powers that grant enhanceable resistance will now grant more resistance if you choose to use certain Alpha Slot enhancements.


 

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my fire/fire tank is already at 77% s/l resistance...i cannot pass up getting even more s/l resistance added to him. so its an easy pick for me...cant wait!


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnElfCalledMack View Post
And for a Fire tank, it seems very, very hard to pass up Spiritual Core Paragon. Recharge and healing are very important parts of your survival.
But...global healing bonus doesn't affect Healing Flames because it gives resistance (in this case, to Toxic).


If we are to die, let us die like men. -- Patrick Cleburne
----------------------------------------------------------

The rule is that they must be loved. --Jayne Fynes-Clinton, Death of an Abandoned Dog

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailboat View Post
But...global healing bonus doesn't affect Healing Flames because it gives resistance (in this case, to Toxic).
And there's lots of players with a bone to pick about that little gotcha, myself included back before we (or I at least) knew about that. It does kind of limit the usefulness of a healing bonus on a large number of sets that may have heals but also get another bonus along with the heal.


COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailboat View Post
But...global healing bonus doesn't affect Healing Flames because it gives resistance (in this case, to Toxic).
Where did this information come from? I'm not sure I totally believe this.

It does affect it in mid's. I have never tested in game though.


 

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thst why cardiac seems like the best bet here...obliterations are end starved in the first place. 33% end reduction is just the best way to start for a fire/fire. then toss in that extra dam resistance.

man goood stuf!


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BunnyAnomaly View Post
Where did this information come from? I'm not sure I totally believe this.

It does affect it in mid's. I have never tested in game though.
Unless it's changed in the last few issues it doesn't work according to player testing done shortly after issue 9.


COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes

 

Posted

Definitely Cardiac for most of my characters. Hopefully it'll mean moving some slots from places like Health and Stamina and putting them elsewhere.


Global name: @k26dp

 

Posted

[quote]The very rare Alpha enhancements ignore 2/3 of enhancement diversification. So, 2/3 of 20% = 13.33%, leaving 6.67% being affected by diminishing returns. Assuming your defensive powers are already at 55% enhancement bonus, you will gain 4.67% from the ED-affected portion of the Alpha Slot bonus. That makes the total 73% enhancement to defense in your defensive powers.[/quote

Glacial Armor has a base of 17% def to smashing. Onlive I'm getting 26.87%. Adding the accuracy/def boost would raise that to (.17*1.73) = 29.41.

Which Ironically was in the set of numbers Aett gave us in the first place. I think I got a handle on it now. Thank you.


 

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so does that mean if i have 77.56% right now for s/l resistance and only need 12.44 then its possible that ill be capped for s/l resist just by adding the cardic alpha slot?

if it is then id be a happy camper!


 

Posted

For anyone who isn't following closely, the alpha slot stuff won't affect IO set bonuses, so when you're figuring everything out make sure you remove the effect of IO set bonuses. That can make you think you'll get more out of the slot than you will for def and res, although res set bonuses are pretty rare.

As for a WP/KM tank, it's pretty obvious you'd go for spiritual. A heal bonus, then also a bonus to recharge so that kinetic siphon comes back faster, and a stun bonus to boost KM's CC. It's a boost to offense and survival, good slot.

I just wish the taunt enhancement was there rather than heal...


Active (Freedom): Setna (Ice/Psi Dom), Arram (WP/KM Tank), Tesmiel (Elec/SS Tank), Astredax (Robot/Dark Mastermind), Operative Vidali (melee fortunata)

Retired (Virtue): Gaav (Inv/EM Tank), Baqra (Fire/SS Tank)