Habitable planet discovered nearby! (Well, relatively nearby)
By
beyeajus,
Posted on: 2010-09-29 21:29 in Comic and Hero-Villain Culture
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The actual estimates for this planet range from 1.1 to 1.7Gs. Remember that gravity is not merely a function of respective masses, but also of distance. The density of the planet is going to have a big effect on the gravity; that is why our Moon as 1/6 the gravity of the Earth, it is 1/4 the diameter of the Earth but has only 1/81 of the mass.|
Originally Posted by Lothic
Well since they say this new planet is 3x or 4x as massive as Earth if a human-like critter did evolve there they'd be used to a much higher gravity environment than Earth's. My guess is if they were to come to Earth at the very least they could hop around pretty high the same way we can when we go to the Moon. Maybe not exactly Super Jump, but certainly more super than us.
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Also the planet's surface temperature is estimated to be around 244 Kelvin, or about -29 Celsius. Even in the twilight band it's gonna be a snowball world and the temperature differential between the light and dark sides will cause continuous strong winds.
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Originally Posted by Leo_G
Then you just need some tech to make a brake so you don't have to start decelerating half way there
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Originally Posted by Core_Tap
Okay this virus talk always gets my goat. It usually indicates the person doesn't understand biology or nature in general. Humans are not like a virus. Virus need other cells to reproduce and can't reproduce on their own. That’s it. That’s the only difference between a virus and EVERYTHING else. We behave no different than any other organism. Given the chance, every other creature from a gorilla to the most simple e.coli will use up all the resources it can get its hands, paws, claws, tentacles, pseduopods or flagella on.
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Originally Posted by Core_Tap
Okay this virus talk always gets my goat. It usually indicates the person doesn't understand biology or nature in general. Humans are not like a virus. Virus need other cells to reproduce and can't reproduce on their own. Thats it. Thats the only difference between a virus and EVERYTHING else. We behave no different than any other organism. Given the chance, every other creature from a gorilla to the most simple e.coli will use up all the resources it can get its hands, paws, claws, tentacles, pseduopods or flagella on.
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^This^
DestineeFable's Guide to an MSTF run (fixed!)
My latest AE madness
The amount of humanity-hate I read on pages 2 and 3 is really sad.
You don't like progress? You don't like technology? You don't like mankind harnessing and utilizing resources? What are you doing on this forum? What are you doing on the internet? Why do you have a computer? Why are you using electricty? Why are you in a building? Are you enjoying all our tech advances for yourself but don't think other people deserve them? Do you think you're special?
Don't even get me started on actual biological drives we have built into our DNA to procreate and survive.
Do you like having free time to play an MMO? Do you like having a cell phone? Do you like having a grocery store nearby instead of having to hunt and gather? Do you like a police and fire department protecting your security? Are you a fan of modern medicine, vaccination, and antibiotics? Do you like jumping in a car to go to a restaurant or movie?
Evil, evil society and advances has made our lives easier and more enjoyable.
</pant>
Before we can get to the MOON or MARS let alone this new planet we have to sort some things out:
1) Efficient transport of more than 2-3 people at a time. 10-20 might not even be enough.
2) Non-petroleum based fuel source that is efficient enough to run a colony. There probably won't be much petroleum out there until we can get to some of Jupiter's moons.
3) Building materials that can withstand solar and cosmic radiation. We've been spoiled by our magnetic field.
4) Figure out how to get the right atmosphere and water, then food. Gravity would be nice too.
5) Building and maintaining a biosphere for a small hamlet to start, then increase the size and population.
In summary, it ain't happening anytime soon. I'd like to see us try and shoot for a moon colony, it would definitely spark innovations and improvements for life on Earth. And those people that go to the moon first? They aren't going to have many if any of the great creature comforts we take for granted. Neither did the pioneers of unsettled lands here on earth, but their hard work to set a foundation has made what we enjoy today possible.
Whew. </off soapboax>
DestineeFable's Guide to an MSTF run (fixed!)
My latest AE madness
More importantly, interstellar travel means we (for all intents and purposes) get access to unlimited resources.
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Actually it will happen soon, relatively speaking. 100 years ago, we did not have as much as we do now. Cars were a rarity. No access to computers, major electrical networks, and other things we consider necessities. Just look at 10 years ago. Social networking was only getting started. Facebook, iPhones, iPods, and Twitter didn't exist. 10 years from now will cause us to see interesting changes with the development of certain technologies like nanotechnology and 100 years from now will change the very face of humanity that we will not even be able to imagine what the world will be like just like a person from 100 years ago would not be to imagine what the current world is like. 100 years from now we might have probes actually travelling toward various star systems of interest or even have people on those planets of interest depending on whether someone develops certain technologies.
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Originally Posted by Teikiatsu
Before we can get to the MOON or MARS let alone this new planet we have to sort some things out:
1) Efficient transport of more than 2-3 people at a time. 10-20 might not even be enough. 2) Non-petroleum based fuel source that is efficient enough to run a colony. There probably won't be much petroleum out there until we can get to some of Jupiter's moons. 3) Building materials that can withstand solar and cosmic radiation. We've been spoiled by our magnetic field. 4) Figure out how to get the right atmosphere and water, then food. Gravity would be nice too. 5) Building and maintaining a biosphere for a small hamlet to start, then increase the size and population. In summary, it ain't happening anytime soon. I'd like to see us try and shoot for a moon colony, it would definitely spark innovations and improvements for life on Earth. And those people that go to the moon first? They aren't going to have many if any of the great creature comforts we take for granted. Neither did the pioneers of unsettled lands here on earth, but their hard work to set a foundation has made what we enjoy today possible. Whew. </off soapboax> |
The first step in being sane is to admit that you are insane.
I kinda wonder if the natives on that planet are engaged in an eternal war of light vs dark
Seeing as though the 21st Century is set to be the age of Biotechnology, some experts have said it would possibly be easier to adapt Man to the destination's enviroment rather than the other way around.
Thus in the future we could have different varieties and cousins of the original Human species colonizing space. Those strange hard-skinned tri-eyelid humans from windswept dustworld, the gilled and web-fingered waterworld Humans from the marine planet, the hulking muscular humans from dense gravity world all round a stretcher talking to the thin and delicate ambassador from light gravity gasworld - all together having a party, an anniversary-bash and commonwealth of humans.
Be one hell of a party!. I imagine racism would be dead by then.... or maybe not knowing our track record. *rolls eyes*
I doubt we'll ever get anywhere close to getting past Mars with humans, or even getting to Mars. We'll likely screw ourselves over with either political conflict, overpopulation, overexploitation of Earth's resources, an energy crisis or some form of pandemic.
We're just too wasteful, too proud, too.... human.
(Don't mind me, just feeling bleh. Give me a few days and I'll be all 'Technology hell yeah' again.)
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Only six years? That can't be right.|
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
By galactic standards it's as close as we've ever seen. Temperatures that allow liquid water, only 1.5 G gravity, and only a 6 year trip from Earth. The only possible lack is oxygen in the atmosphere...and we can put a colony in a dome.
Yeah, 'habitable' and 'nearby' would seem to apply in this case. If you're looking for a garden of Eden out there, you ain't gonna find it. |
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Originally Posted by Core_Tap
Okay this virus talk always gets my goat. It usually indicates the person doesn't understand biology or nature in general. Humans are not like a virus. Virus need other cells to reproduce and can't reproduce on their own. Thats it. Thats the only difference between a virus and EVERYTHING else. We behave no different than any other organism. Given the chance, every other creature from a gorilla to the most simple e.coli will use up all the resources it can get its hands, paws, claws, tentacles, pseduopods or flagella on.
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There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
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When I mentioned the "humans as viruses" idea I implied it was not a strictly precise analogy. But I'll try to clarify what I meant for the people who are taking this statement far too literally.|
Originally Posted by Core_Tap
Okay this virus talk always gets my goat. It usually indicates the person doesn't understand biology or nature in general. Humans are not like a virus. Virus need other cells to reproduce and can't reproduce on their own. Thats it. Thats the only difference between a virus and EVERYTHING else. We behave no different than any other organism. Given the chance, every other creature from a gorilla to the most simple e.coli will use up all the resources it can get its hands, paws, claws, tentacles, pseduopods or flagella on.
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Obviously human beings are not functionally close to viruses biologically speaking, but we are like them from the point of view that we don't seem to be able to establish harmonious equilibriums with our natural surroundings. For instance it's been demonstrated that animals like gorillas, deer or pretty much any other mammal will actually slow their rates of reproduction to adjust/respond to the availability of food or grazing space. A given population will adapt to the world around them.
On the other hand humans (and things "like" viruses) do not self-regulate like that. We have historically demonstrated that we have no problem striping the world around us of resources without regard to the future consequences. This is particularly sad when you realize that viruses at least have an excuse for their reckless paradigms: they have no rational thought to contemplate the consequences of their over-reproductive actions.
So while we don't reproduce like viruses do we do a pretty good job mimicking their ability to destroy their own environment via their own unchecked nature. Hopefully we can learn from that and finally decide to control ourselves.
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Its going to be your points 2,3 and 4 that finally gets us to the point that means we eventually have to get our ship together. Maybe that lazy 20th century infinite resources attitude will change over the next hundred years, if we don't get off our homeworld - its got too really.|
Originally Posted by Zortel
I doubt we'll ever get anywhere close to getting past Mars with humans, or even getting to Mars. We'll likely screw ourselves over with either political conflict, overpopulation, overexploitation of Earth's resources, an energy crisis or some form of pandemic.
We're just too wasteful, too proud, too.... human. |
All the projections point to our planet being able to comfortably support 5-6 billion, possibly a tad more if we were better organised and the enviroment doesn't change drastically. 9 billion or heaven forbid 12 billion as some of these 2050 projections forecast would be the global crashpoint.
Oils got a couple of (very pricey) decades left, before we are disregarding treatys & r@ping Antarctica for all she's worth. If that happens all bets are off because the oil won't disperse if we screw up at that latitude.
I fully expect we are living in the last two-to-three generations where things are going to be remotely recognisable. You read those sci-fi writers who paint the future 200 years from now as that type of scavenging sci-fi western scene with animals pullling vehicle chassis as everyday transport and communities are highly mobile. I can see that.
I can also see (i hope anyway) us having the foresight to master green technologies and buy us a little time to establish basic colonies on the Moon and Mars.
If we can stop fighting one another long enough to do that and get to the point where we can mine from the asteroid belt then our troubles would be eased because why r@pe Earth for minerals when there are asteroids out there with enough ore in them for anything we could ever want, literally... everest-sized chunks of titanium, gold and iron all floating around just beyond our reach enough for building entire colonies and fleets of ships.
I'd love to see into the future to see what is achieved. I'm sure It would either be absolutely heartbreaking or make you very proud and relieved.
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Yep, six years. That's relativistic travel for you. Try this calculator -- you want the 'Long Relativistic Journeys' section.|
Originally Posted by DumpleBerry
Only six years? That can't be right.
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Again, from the point of view of people on Earth it would take 22 years. But only six for the people on the ship.
And note that six years of constant 1 G acceleration is far beyond anything our technology is capable of, right now. Just because the trip is possible doesn't mean we can start today.
...
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Right. So my magic teleporter can get you there in ten minutes. Why are we waiting? |
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
Yep, six years. That's relativistic travel for you. Try this calculator -- you want the 'Long Relativistic Journeys' section.
Again, from the point of view of people on Earth it would take 22 years. But only six for the people on the ship. And note that six years of constant 1 G acceleration is far beyond anything our technology is capable of, right now. Just because the trip is possible doesn't mean we can start today. |
There are no words for what this community, and the friends I have made here mean to me. Please know that I care for all of you, yes, even you. If you Twitter, I'm MrThan. If you're Unleashed, I'm dumps. I'll try and get registered on the Titan Forums as well. Peace, and thanks for the best nine years anyone could ever ask for.
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Science is also hard at work on extending human lifespans and also our latent talent for hibernation that all humans (except students |
Originally Posted by RemusShepherd
Yep, six years. That's relativistic travel for you. Try this calculator -- you want the 'Long Relativistic Journeys' section.
Again, from the point of view of people on Earth it would take 22 years. But only six for the people on the ship. And note that six years of constant 1 G acceleration is far beyond anything our technology is capable of, right now. Just because the trip is possible doesn't mean we can start today. |
) have evolved out of and forgotten. It lays dorment within us and may hold the key to longer space-travel.Whats also interesting is who decides who gets what?, i mean.... The Chinese are emerging as the next superpower and have plans for a manned moon mission far in advance of NASA.
How is this going to work?, first there to stake a claim a'la ole' pioneer ways in the new world (America)?, - because this time it really will be the new world.
Whats stopping nations grabbing land that is the most strategically placed landmasses for defence?, or has the most resources? - or will we be so spoilt for worlds that each Nation (if we are still using the seperate nations model) or religious denominations that will have their own world(s) in their own system?.
I think if we went to the stars in our present state with everything we let divide us today, it would just be a case of a matter of time before distant cousins of humanity found an excuse to pick a fight. Sadly.
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America already planted a flag there, that's the rule, the moon is Americas. Native Americans lost the continent cause they didn't have a flag. |
Originally Posted by Mothers_Love
Whats also interesting is who decides who gets what?, i mean.... The Chinese are emerging as the next superpower and have plans for a manned moon mission far in advance of NASA.
How is this going to work?, first there to stake a claim a'la ole' pioneer ways in the new world (America)?, - because this time it really will be the new world. |
Seriously though, I'm still hoping some big advertising company puts a giant digital billboard on the moon, maybe sell ads to Pepsi, or Pizza Hut.
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"When the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's CHICAGO TOWN PIZZA!"
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Originally Posted by Innovator
Seriously though, I'm still hoping some big advertising company puts a giant digital billboard on the moon, maybe sell ads to Pepsi, or Pizza Hut.
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Lol ! - thats truely terrible ! - I sincerely hope advertising never gets so rampantly out of control like that so looking up at the moon smacks of branding. Urrgh!.|
Originally Posted by Zortel
"When the moon hits your eye like a big pizza pie, that's CHICAGO TOWN PIZZA!"
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I still think Britain should of got to the moon first though and left little woollen Clangers to confuse you Americans, maybe furnished little footsteps leading back to a crater, some brass wreckage and a recording of Clanger song.
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unfortunately, i find myself believing that human beings, as a group, tend to propagate madness far faster than awareness. |
Originally Posted by Mothers_Love
Its going to be your points 2,3 and 4 that finally gets us to the point that means we eventually have to get our ship together. Maybe that lazy 20th century infinite resources attitude will change over the next hundred years, if we don't get off our homeworld - its got too really.
All the projections point to our planet being able to comfortably support 5-6 billion, possibly a tad more if we were better organised and the enviroment doesn't change drastically. 9 billion or heaven forbid 12 billion as some of these 2050 projections forecast would be the global crashpoint. Oils got a couple of (very pricey) decades left, before we are disregarding treatys & r@ping Antarctica for all she's worth. If that happens all bets are off because the oil won't disperse if we screw up at that latitude. I fully expect we are living in the last two-to-three generations where things are going to be remotely recognisable. You read those sci-fi writers who paint the future 200 years from now as that type of scavenging sci-fi western scene with animals pullling vehicle chassis as everyday transport and communities are highly mobile. I can see that. I can also see (i hope anyway) us having the foresight to master green technologies and buy us a little time to establish basic colonies on the Moon and Mars. If we can stop fighting one another long enough to do that and get to the point where we can mine from the asteroid belt then our troubles would be eased because why r@pe Earth for minerals when there are asteroids out there with enough ore in them for anything we could ever want, literally... everest-sized chunks of titanium, gold and iron all floating around just beyond our reach enough for building entire colonies and fleets of ships. I'd love to see into the future to see what is achieved. I'm sure It would either be absolutely heartbreaking or make you very proud and relieved. |
here's a great primer on exponential growth (not directing this to you ml, just in general):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-QA2rkpBSY
the punchline goes like this: even if we managed to get to a habitable planet within a time frame of 1-2 generations, including r&d time to develop the ability to get there and back, we've already entered a critical phase of environmental/social contract degradation that may cause significant upheaval. if the applied technology of creating such a craft were to be used on earth (such as power generation in a reasonably clean way) we're still left to deal with a variety of industrial and economic ills that show no sign of abatement while still growing exponentially, or at least trying to.
personally, one of the greatest fallacies of the 20th century was infinite growth in economics, as it led to all kinds of abuse to meet that 'rule'. up to then, there could be a forgiveness for believing the unlimited potential of growth on such a vast entity, but that's changed. adding a brand new planet to the mix won't change what we are, and how we do things on a regular basis here, which would necessarily translate to 'bringing it there' considering the current status quo.
while avatar tended to place such thoughts in a more back burner way in its' story, the idea of a company town being the first thing on the planet in order to make a buck is not so far fetched.
Kittens give Morbo gas.
Two interactive reports I found interesting.
How Much Is Left? The Limits of Earths Resources.
12 Events That Will Change Everything.
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This. This more then anything is why I think humanity is not ready for the stars. Technology to get us to the stars being the next thing on the list. |
Originally Posted by Mothers_Love
I think if we went to the stars in our present state with everything we let divide us today, it would just be a case of a matter of time before distant cousins of humanity found an excuse to pick a fight. Sadly. |
When we learn to stop killing each other over money, lust for power, or religion (especially ones that are badly translated or deliberately misinterpreted), then we can look to the stars.
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All those things are our nautre though, what your impling is we would have to evolve before traveling to stars, I don't think I would go quiet that far.
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Originally Posted by Nericus
This. This more then anything is why I think humanity is not ready for the stars. Technology to get us to the stars being the next thing on the list.
When we learn to stop killing each other over money, lust for power, or religion (especially ones that are badly translated or deliberately misinterpreted), then we can look to the stars. |
I hereby name this planet Reach.
Let's go settle it! I'm sure nothing bad will happen. >.>
I have very little hope for humanity, but good lord people, lol. I don't believe that we should just stop what we are doing in terms of progress (especially in space) just because we have flaws that any aliens out there could also have themselves. It's going to take a long time and something cataclysmic to make us the perfect little humans we see in Star Trek.
Personally, I believe that's more reason for us to explore the stars. I can almost gurantee that the day we find out we're no longer alone in the universe will be the day humanity grows up.
Also (I'm not sure if I posted it here or not, I've discussed this same planet discovery in several other forums), this has me excited for the future of inter-system exploration.
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Then you just need some tech to make a brake so you don't have to start decelerating half way there
And I think they need to develop their bio-stasis tech so that I can apply for the program and actually see this planet for myself.