Super Booster UPDATE!
By
Agonus,
Posted on: 2010-06-16 11:34 in The Global Training Room Test Server
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Rep still occurs even though its not showing. I just turned it off ever since I couldn't see the comments (with ease) because they were part of why I kept it on |
Originally Posted by Trialtester
Techbot, just how in the world do you find these pics so quick? This one specially was hilarious...
Rep + If you had rep on... |
Also, mostly it's a few google searches. Although the one(s) I use as trademarks I have saved in a word file
"And by my facepalms shall ye know me..."
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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oh @#$$%%ing hell. what did we get in issue 17 again? animated tails? look, sam, the reasoning that a person is guilty until proven innocent against claims that cannot even be produced is a witch hunt, not a reasonable stance. Look Sam, i am not asking you to be reasonable, but i am asking that on the most basic possible concept of open communication, you do not assume things to be true without evidence. Correlation is NOT CAUSATION! gyah.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Jay himself once said either that he hates furries or that he's not going to make any costume pieces that furries can use, I don't remember exactly how it went. However, he HAS said this, so it stands to reason to assume this is how he feels unless he or someone who can speak for him says otherwise. Again, as with all things Jay says, no-one is ever sure how much can be taken on face value, but consider this - Jay has said he does not want to make animal parts and animal parts have not been made. While many explanations for this exist, the possibility of a correlation IS a very prominent possibility.
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as i said, zek IS a usually reliable poster, but since she did not transcribe the comment, nor give the exact context we cannot hold something against the guy, that is insane. you do not know the quote, as you show, because it was never posted here, the whole comment is heresay, you can be more rational than that, right sam?
Even if he said it to my face totally deadpan, I would take it with a grain of salt; this is Sexy "Nice Axe" Jay we are talking about here. The man does humor.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
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Hey, he could always make a Beast/animal booster and prove us all wrong |
Originally Posted by Kitsune9tails
Even if he said it to my face totally deadpan, I would take it with a grain of salt; this is Sexy "Nice Axe" Jay we are talking about here. The man does humor.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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then sam would be absolutely convinced that one time he totally said he hated steam-punk costume bits and hates steampunkers, citing the twin damning pieces of evidence that there have been no new steampunk bits AND, that chewbacca was a wookie and not an ewok,i didnt quite catch the whole of his second point, to be honest. 
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Actually, the comment very much was posted here and I read it. We may be speaking of two different comments, but unless you want to question my memory, I saw him say this. I'm not making things up, I'm not relying on other people's hearsay. This is what I saw, this is what was said.|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
oh @#$$%%ing hell. what did we get in issue 17 again? animated tails? look, sam, the reasoning that a person is guilty until proven innocent against claims that cannot even be produced is a witch hunt, not a reasonable stance. Look Sam, i am not asking you to be reasonable, but i am asking that on the most basic possible concept of open communication, you do not assume things to be true without evidence. Correlation is NOT CAUSATION! gyah.
as i said, zek IS a usually reliable poster, but since she did not transcribe the comment, nor give the exact context we cannot hold something against the guy, that is insane. you do not know the quote, as you show, because it was never posted here, the whole comment is heresay, you can be more rational than that, right sam? |
Secondly, I reserve the right to draw my own conclusions, and as long as I'm not forcing them on you, I don't appreciate you berating me for them. I don't recall sending Jay angry e-mails or calling him names, so I don't believe I've made a mess of it, but this is what I believe, and I hardly see what business my beliefs are of yours. You're not going to change how I feel by arguing about it, because this is not scientific evidence based on scientific fact. This is my belief and my feeling on the matter, and it's not going to change via argument. It can only ever change via action, the kind that I am starting to see only just now.
As far as animated tails go, yes, I took this to be a good sign. However, the animated tails we got are merely animated versions of the static tails we had before, and animation is BABs' territory. It's useless to argue that he can't model, because he can. The the smaller tech shield without glowing parts is one he made when he was working on Shields, with Jay making the larger glowing one later in Beta.
I want to be wrong. Trust me, I really, REALLY want to be wrong and believe the guy has simply been overworked and it's management cutting off his creative freedom. We already saw David pussyfooting around the issue of animal parts, opening with "devil's advocate" testing questions, so there's evidence for that. I looked to the Mutant pack to prove me wrong conclusively, because both David and Positron have been dropping pretty heavy hints that apparently I and many others simply misread. I was looking at the mutant pack to prove me wrong, but all it did was seemingly prove me right.
I don't want to be right. It hurts me when I'm right about these things, and I still want to be proven wrong. The wolf/fox tail is a very good start and it keeps me hopeful, but after the disappointment of the Mutant pack, I'm not going to believe this until I see it. I used to say the same about the 5th Column coming back, and I'm glad I was proven wrong. The game is all the better for it.
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Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
then sam would be absolutely convinced that one time he totally said he hated steam-punk costume bits and hates steampunkers, citing the twin damning pieces of evidence that there have been no new steampunk bits AND, that chewbacca was a wookie and not an ewok,i didnt quite catch the whole of his second point, to be honest.
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As I've said numerous times in this thread, I know what Jay said, because I saw it with my own eyes. I don't know if Jay was serious when he said it, because nothing that man says is ever straightforward. I have a hard time accepting he got a box of hammers in the mail which he believes are meant for merrymaking, so I assume he was joking when he talked about the hammers, and it's not just possible but quite probable that he was joking about his hatred of furries, too. That's his style of posting, and while it is amusing to read, it is badly uninformative.
However, events since then tend to point to a grim possibility, and unless you have a problem with what I think and feel, that's the possibility I find to be most likely. Unless my opinion on the matter starts mattering some day, I would advise you against trying to change it. It's not worth your time, and you won't succeed anyway.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I just want to thank the wonderful people who post keywords like these:
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Heh.
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$10 tail is the best!, a tail of two furries, animation? assume!, city of furries, furries get no tail, furries get some tail, get your yiff on, hail to the tail, i want a catgirl mount, less rp more pvp, lughebu, lughebu shall eat tail?, oh god how do i tag, oh god how do i tail, pvpers pay too, retail tail, retailiation, rub you tail on me, some mutants get tail, that's more like it , twisted tails, were wolf tail, werewolves aren't mutants, wolf tail, woot!
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A game is not supposed to be some kind of... place where people enjoy themselves!
*raises hand*
I put in retail tail and retailiation.
Tags are a fun forum game.
Playstation 3 - XBox 360 - Wii - PSP
Remember kids, crack is whack!
Samuel_Tow: Your avatar is... I think I like it
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Far too many of them are low-brow insults done with the double-anonymity of not leaving a name behind for me to really bother to read them, especially when it gets to the various hate groups. I'm not saying yours are, but tags in general are far more often insulting than they are interesting to read, just like rep comments used to be.
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Originally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Tags are a fun forum game.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Pull the stick out, Sam. Low brow insults are just a form of humor to many many people. Depends a lot on how one is with one's friends and family. I, for example, grew up in a family where cutting each other crap was a form of affection. Most of my friends are the same way. Don't take it so seriously. They're mostly throw-away gags.
Dec out.
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I don't see why my not bothering to read tags on threads should bother you, though. I'm immune to being convinced of the the virtue of tags like city of furrys ftl, and I'm doubly immune to being convinced in the virtue of "good-natured ribbing," as I don't acknowledge the existence of such a thing.|
Originally Posted by Decorum
Pull the stick out, Sam. Low brow insults are just a form of humor to many many people. Depends a lot on how one is with one's friends and family. I, for example, grew up in a family where cutting each other crap was a form of affection. Most of my friends are the same way. Don't take it so seriously. They're mostly throw-away gags.
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In the end, all it means is that tags are useless in the function that tags were designed to do and are only useful in the function of cheap humour, which a humourless person like me is inherently incapable of appreciating. Hence, they have no use for me, hence I don't read them and keep forgetting they exist.
Again, just like rep comments.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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in that case sam, i question your memory, because i tend to follow jay's posts very closely and have never seen him post on the topic, ever. unless the post was posted and instantly removed, or posted well before i became active on the forums, which is unlikely since most "beast" options were introduced in issue 6, then i do question it. if you can link, then fine, but otherwise i have serious doubts that it was ever posted. i frequently check the past posts of devs, partly as an idle hobby when the forums are slow, and partly to see how styles evolve over time, and since jay is one of the developers who's work tends to be of high importance to me, i follow him pretty closely. so I am forced to doubt that i missed his post, unless it was in a thread that was moderated out of existence within a few days of posting and i missed it. Other than that i am forced to challenge that he ever posted on the matter, whether it is a misremembering or simply a interpretation of a comment, i am going to have to require something stronger than just your word, particularly since it is on a subject that i myself have kept an eye on and have not seen it.
furthermore, the mutant pack does have nonhuman looking pieces, holding overly specific notions of what is and is not nonhuman does lead to you setting yourself up to be disappointed, as well as forces a incorrect affirmation of your points. the luminous parts especially have been shown to make a very convincinf sea-themed character, as well as an impressive alien, if we are saying that for something to be beast it must contain some specific parts, then we set ourselves up for what becomes a self-fulfilling disappointment unless we are particularly specific about exactly what we want, assuming consensus could be reached among the forum goers in question, and they directly affirm that they have read them and are addressing them.
and no, i am not insulting your intelligence, i was doing a south park reference, i am questioning your sense of humor, as well as your ability to retain rational perspective in a discussion.
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Moving on from the Jay topic, which is not really much of a concern for me anymore;|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
-snip-
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As for quotes on the Mutant pack; Either they were all in extra-sourcel locations (interviews), or someone has traced back through the forum posts and cut a LOT of posts out. There were posts telling people waiting for more animal/anthro parts "Dont worry, wait for the Mutant Pack!"
And they are no longer there.
This is...irritating. Those posts were there. I'm not the only one who's mentioned them.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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if i recall, that was posi at herocon last yea, he was asked if there would be beast parts in the natural pack, and he replied that sounds more like the mutant pack. again, i don't have the exact quote , it was relayed to us by various posters who were there, but that was where i had gotten the assumption of more beast parts from.
trust me, i know where i stand on new beast parts, i just don't like seeing a guy get roasted without proper evidence. It has happened to me in the past, and possibly like jay, i was unable to defend myself thanks to management interference, and worry that speaking would just get me more torn apart by people who weren't being rational at that point already. so thats why im trying to call for rationality and not just assuming guilt. sometimes you cant defend yourself due to professional restrictions, but in order to keep a healthy relationship between the developers and players that we have now, we cant go burning people at the stake because of something we are sure we read, but cant find now, nor can we remember the exact words or or context, it just isn't fair, and would only encourage developers to stay away from here for fear of becoming the next victim.
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Fair enough. I have no evidence, so if you choose to doubt my memory, you have every right to. I freely admit I may be mis-remembering, but the memory of seeing a post like this will not leave me regardless. Can't really argue with you there.|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
in that case sam, i question your memory
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| furthermore, the mutant pack does have nonhuman looking pieces |
I fully admit this was largely my own fault for building up wrong expectations, but I lay much blame on official comments, who managed to be badly misleading in their attempts to be cryptic. I agree with what someone else said before in the thread - as long as we know something is coming and when it's coming, then there's no point being cryptic about it. If you want to be cryptic, then just don't say anything and let people discover the truth when the pack comes out. This attempt to have our cake and eat it, too led to completely the wrong expectations.
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| and no, i am not insulting your intelligence, i was doing a south park reference, i am questioning your sense of humor, as well as your ability to retain rational perspective in a discussion. |
There is nothing rational or logical in a sense of humour. That's what makes it fun. Some things are funny to some people. Some things are distinctly NOT funny to some, regardless of how they were intended.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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You should actually see me snarky. I avoid being full on snarky here(nor anywhere anymore) because i dont want to get the rep for being as nasty as i get, i used the smiley to defuse the comment as a light hearted jab, not a foot to the face. sorry if that didnt come across.
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Yeah, so do I... Posi said something about that too, but not in a traightforward answer... He sais beats parts sounded more like a mutant pack...
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Moving on from the Jay topic, which is not really much of a concern for me anymore;
As for quotes on the Mutant pack; Either they were all in extra-sourcel locations (interviews), or someone has traced back through the forum posts and cut a LOT of posts out. There were posts telling people waiting for more animal/anthro parts "Dont worry, wait for the Mutant Pack!" And they are no longer there. This is...irritating. Those posts were there. I'm not the only one who's mentioned them. |
"Looks can be deceiving" - Statesman (in Memoriam)
[QUOTE=Samuel_Tow;2964058]
I fully admit this was largely my own fault for building up wrong expectations, but I lay much blame on official comments, who managed to be badly misleading in their attempts to be cryptic. I agree with what someone else said before in the thread - as long as we know something is coming and when it's coming, then there's no point being cryptic about it. If you want to be cryptic, then just don't say anything and let people discover the truth when the pack comes out. This attempt to have our cake and eat it, too led to completely the wrong expectations.
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Heh, the Devs can't really win on this point.
- If they say nothing before a feature is totally tested and ready to roll, they get slammed for not soliciting our feedback, not advertising the game, and allowing rampant speculation to rule. Not to mention various threats to quit because they obviously are doing nothing but swimming in their money vaults.
- If they give partial information, then what they say is misinterpreted, wildly speculated upon, judged to be misleading or considered teasing and being mean.
- If they give complete information along with frequent updates, they are called liars when something is wrong or is changed, accused of prioritizing the wrong things, accused of catering to the vocal minority, and accused of working too slow or doing too little. Not to mention incurring the wrath of the Black Pebble
Regardless, I am personally in the camp of 'keep us as involved as possible at every step' although I am sure the signal to noise ratio can be maddening.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
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Unless you provide the quote, I'm gonna call bull-[WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS] on that. I follow the dev posts almost religiously, and I don't ever recall him posting something to that effect.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Actually, the comment very much was posted here and I read it. We may be speaking of two different comments, but unless you want to question my memory, I saw him say this. I'm not making things up, I'm not relying on other people's hearsay. This is what I saw, this is what was said.
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I'm not questioning that you actually think you read a post, but I am questioning whether it even actually happened. The fact that you can't even recall if he said he "hated" furries or just had a "strong dislike" further weakens the credibility of your argument.
If you can produce the quote, do it, and I'll say I was wrong, otherwise, this is just hearsay and slander.
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Blatantly false.|
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Moving on from the Jay topic, which is not really much of a concern for me anymore;
As for quotes on the Mutant pack; Either they were all in extra-sourcel locations (interviews), or someone has traced back through the forum posts and cut a LOT of posts out. There were posts telling people waiting for more animal/anthro parts "Dont worry, wait for the Mutant Pack!" And they are no longer there. This is...irritating. Those posts were there. I'm not the only one who's mentioned them. |
Posi said that some people would be happy with the Mutant Booster Pack when there was a discussion of costume parts, including requests for "furry" parts. Furry-fans (used for brevity) read "we're getting furry parts in the Mutant Super Booster" into that statement, and set their expectations accordingly.
Why did Posi say what he said? Who knows.
Perhaps he thought that the non-human new pieces in the MBP would appeal to the same type of people that like furry parts. Perhaps there were some pieces under consideration that did not make the final cut (like the wolf tail initially). Or perhaps he's an evil [WARNING EXPLICIT LYRICS] that enjoys the gnashing of teeth and frenzied wailing of furry-fans when they don't get what they want/expected (seems unlikely though). There are a million reasons why he could have made that statement.
Now, once the furry-fans started posting their expectations based on what he said, perhaps he should have posted something to temper those expectations... that's assuming he even looked at that thread again...
IIRC, that post (and others) may have been in beta forums, which is why we may no longer be seeing them.
First, regarding the "organic armor with skin" variation that has been much requested here. You say you want to do it but can't. So let me guess: you put the stuff into testing but did not reserve art time to fix problems/complaints that would arise? Isn't that the point of testing, to find problems and fix them?
Yes, one costume part was added but that was already in the pipeline and it still took the personal intervention of the art lead. You may want to rethink your work process a little.
Second, organic swords but not organic claws. Why?
Third, the new pieces were added to monstrous thighs but NOT to monstrous feet. Again, why?
Those are serious questions, I would really like to learn the reasoning behind these two decisions.
I do not suffer from altitis, I enjoy every character of it.
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Yes, Posi did say that "those sound like they would be part of a Mutant Pack, not Natural"... all that meant was that animalistic pieces would be more fitting for a Mutant Pack as opposed to being in the Natural pack, not that there would necessarily actually be any animal pieces in said Mutant Pack. People read too much into that statement and assumed that the Mutant Pack would be heavily animal-based.|
Originally Posted by rian_frostdrake
if i recall, that was posi at herocon last yea, he was asked if there would be beast parts in the natural pack, and he replied that sounds more like the mutant pack. again, i don't have the exact quote , it was relayed to us by various posters who were there, but that was where i had gotten the assumption of more beast parts from.
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For all we know, they could do more animal pieces for the next round of Origin based boosters if they go that sort of theme (animal pieces could also fit into the Science catagory as well, not just Mutant, and be called the Experiment Booster or something like that).
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Originally Posted by Hallowed
Posi said that some people would be happy with the Mutant Booster Pack when there was a discussion of costume parts, including requests for "furry" parts. Furry-fans (used for brevity) read "we're getting furry parts in the Mutant Super Booster" into that statement, and set their expectations accordingly.
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Ashes to ashes,
Pheonyx
The Cape Radio
"It's good to have friends. Wish I did." - Troy Hickman
People are still complaining about the Mutant Pack? Ugh...
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Someone will always complain about something. What I think is funny is that all of the people crying and moaning that there weren't any "furry" pieces are still complaining. The devs through you guys a bone with the tail and you still complain? Seriously? I thought the pack was great as it was in my opinion. I don't see how people can complain over something like this. The problem is reading into the devs' statements too far that you think something will happen that was never going to in the first place. Just chill out and enjoy what's in the pack and stop whining.
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Originally Posted by Xzero45
People are still complaining about the Mutant Pack? Ugh...
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Characters:
- Dawnshift (50 Peacebringer/Virtue)
Techbot, just how in the world do you find these pics so quick? This one specially was hilarious...
Rep + If you had rep on...
"Looks can be deceiving" - Statesman (in Memoriam)