It really depends on how you intend to play the character
Getting them 30-33 is very exemplar friendly. Getting them later in the game gets, the best bonuses.
Only you know how you intend to play the character, and that determines your answer
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
In terms of performance IOs level 26 and above are equal to or better than SOs. So people who want exemplar friendly builds tend to slot in the 30-33 range (as Cat said). IOs in this range are slightly better than SOs, keep set bonuses when exemping down to level 30 and almost all sets are available in this range.
However, the problem is that actually getting recipes in this range can be very difficult. The vast majority of recipes generated are at level 50 so recipes in the 30-33 range are in short supply. This means that you often have to wait a long time to get them, particularly if the recipe is in something other than pool A.
I usually start at level 27, when its time to refresh your SO's.
Some of the best levelling sets start at level 30 (Thunderstrike, Crushing Impact, Red Fortune, Doctored Wounds), and by then the actual bonuses from the enhancements have settled down enough that waiting a few levels makes little difference.
I start slotting regular IO's (those without set bonuses) around level 22 if I have the recipes in my inventory....as far as set bonuses go, I agree with DrMike....I start them around level 27.
Thanks for the advice. Hopefully I explained my intent properly. Just to clarify, say I am at 32, I can slot my attacks with 35 IO Sets, and it be equivalent or better than SO's or generic IO's as far as acc, dam, end redux, and also benefit from the set bonuses?
yes.
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Unless you are planning on PVP, couldn't you just make your second build exemplar friendly? Slot the second build with SO's and frankenslot whatever drops. This should let you play with lower level toons nicely.
(Although if you are planning on collecting Ourboros badges I don't think my plan would work so well)
I always slot level 33-38 sets so I don't lose the bonuses when exemplaring down for TF's.
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Hate to nitpick but that highlighted word might suggest "set bonuses" to some. Better to use enhancement values.|
Originally Posted by Catwhoorg
It really depends on how you intend to play the character
Getting them 30-33 is very exemplar friendly. Getting them later in the game gets, the best bonuses. Only you know how you intend to play the character, and that determines your answer |
Sorry. I don't mean to pick a fight.
;=/
I also am in the habit of slotting sets in the low 30s for the purposes of exemping.
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Is this really true? The catch 22 of Set IOs to me has always been that set IOs enhance more than one aspect of a power at a lower percentage than an equal level basic IO. So is it really correct to say that slotting a six piece set of lvl 35 IOs into a power gives ≥ accuracy, damage, and end redux than say slotting two lvl 35 SOs, or two lvl 30 basic IOs of each? |
Originally Posted by Forevermore
Thanks for the advice. Hopefully I explained my intent properly. Just to clarify, say I am at 32, I can slot my attacks with 35 IO Sets, and it be equivalent or better than SO's or generic IO's as far as acc, dam, end redux, and also benefit from the set bonuses?
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You get the set bonuses with the set IOs of course, but do you really get better acc, dam and end redux?
(Sometimes, I wish there could be a Dev thumbs up button for quality posts, because you pretty much nailed it.) -- Ghost Falcon
Quote:
Level 1: Aimed Shot |
Originally Posted by mousedroid
Is this really true? The catch 22 of Set IOs to me has always been that set IOs enhance more than one aspect of a power at a lower percentage than an equal level basic IO. So is it really correct to say that slotting a six piece set of lvl 35 IOs into a power gives ≥ accuracy, damage, and end redux than say slotting two lvl 35 SOs, or two lvl 30 basic IOs of each?
You get the set bonuses with the set IOs of course, but do you really get better acc, dam and end redux? |
(A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage: Level 30
(3) Thunderstrike - Damage/Endurance: Level 30
(3) Thunderstrike - Damage/Recharge: Level 30
(5) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 30
(5) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 30
(7) Thunderstrike - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 30
Level 2: Snap Shot
(A) Accuracy IO: Level 50
(7) Damage Increase IO: Level 50
(9) Damage Increase IO: Level 50
(9) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50
(11) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50
(11) Empty
aimed shot
snap shot
acc: %56.55 %42.4
dmg: %97.62 %83.32
end.red.: %56.55 %42.4
rech: %56.55 %42.4
Keep in mind if you ever exemp below the level of the enhancement you'll experience diminishing returns.
Set IOs are the way to go.
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You are quite correct, that would have been a better phrase to use
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Originally Posted by milehigh77
Hate to nitpick but that highlighted word might suggest "set bonuses" to some. Better to use enhancement values.
Sorry. I don't mean to pick a fight. ;=/ I also am in the habit of slotting sets in the low 30s for the purposes of exemping. |
@Catwhoorg "Rule of Three - Finale" Arc# 1984
@Mr Falkland Islands"A Nation Goes Rogue" Arc# 2369 "Toasters and Pop Tarts" Arc#116617
Quote:
OK, thanks. That looks much better than I thought it would.
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Originally Posted by milehigh77
Level 1: Aimed Shot
(A) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage: Level 30 (3) Thunderstrike - Damage/Endurance: Level 30 (3) Thunderstrike - Damage/Recharge: Level 30 (5) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Recharge: Level 30 (5) Thunderstrike - Accuracy/Damage/Endurance: Level 30 (7) Thunderstrike - Damage/Endurance/Recharge: Level 30 Level 2: Snap Shot (A) Accuracy IO: Level 50 (7) Damage Increase IO: Level 50 (9) Damage Increase IO: Level 50 (9) Endurance Reduction IO: Level 50 (11) Recharge Reduction IO: Level 50 (11) Empty aimed shot snap shot acc: %56.55 %42.4 dmg: %97.62 %83.32 end.red.: %56.55 %42.4 rech: %56.55 %42.4 Keep in mind if you ever exemp below the level of the enhancement you'll experience diminishing returns. Set IOs are the way to go. |
(Sometimes, I wish there could be a Dev thumbs up button for quality posts, because you pretty much nailed it.) -- Ghost Falcon
Quote:
Paragon wiki has a nice chart that shows the relative enhancement values on different enhancement types.|
Originally Posted by mousedroid
OK, thanks. That looks much better than I thought it would.
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http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Enhanc...ncement_Values
If you don't care about the set bonuses AND you want to enhance multiple aspects of a power, you can outperform SOs as early as level 18 (or even 15 in some cases).
Any ranged damage attack with 6 slots using +0 SOs:
Damage
Damage
Damage
Accuracy
Accuracy
Recharge
----------------------
Damage 94.93%
Accuracy 66.60%
Recharge 33.30%
VERSUS
Any ranged damage attack with 6 slots using level 21 IOs:
Tempest Accuracy/Damage
Salvo Accuracy/Damage
Volley Fire Accuracy/Damage
Maelstrom's Fury Accuracy/Damage
Maelstrom's Fury Damage/Recharge
Volley Fire Damage/Recharge
----------------------
Damage 95.13%
Accuracy 67.25%
Recharge 33.63%
The second build can be slotted 4 levels earlier and never has to be replaced. It also has more flexibility than SOs, which have to be slotted in full 33% increments. The frankenslotted build can replace an Accuracy/Damage with a Damage/Endurance and take a small hit to ACC for a small amount of END. And if you add in triple aspects you can slot them even earlier and still get more benefit than an SO. Oh, and even with frankenslotting you still get a tiny bit of set bonus (above gets 4% regen and 3% run speed).
Obviously this only works if you have multiple aspects that you WANT to enhance. IOs in Health won't outperfom SOs until level 30ish, because +Heal is the only aspect you want to enhance. True Grit takes Heals and Resistance, but there are no Heal/Res IOs so you can't frankenslot that either.
But for the majority of powers, there is almost always an IO that will outperform SOs (excepting the limited use of the Yin SO from Faultline).
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Quote:
This is not true. Diminishing returns is based on your actual level and the level you exemp to. The level of the IO does not matter. Also very small bonuses might not get reduced so double and triple IOs can work at full value down quite low. A level 50 Quad works at full value all the way down to level 21 for example.
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Originally Posted by milehigh77
Keep in mind if you ever exemp below the level of the enhancement you'll experience diminishing returns.
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"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Quote:
Also, the frankenslotted build will not be effected by exemplaring back down later on due to Step 1 of the exemplaring formula (link goes to the wiki page explaining the process). If you've made it to level 50 and have the above SOs slotted then exemp down to level 25, your bonuses drop to 69% damage, 48% accuracy, and 24% recharge. But the IO'd build is still at 95/67/33 because no single bonus is higher than 20%.
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Originally Posted by Eek a Mouse
The second build can be slotted 4 levels earlier and never has to be replaced. It also has more flexibility than SOs, which have to be slotted in full 33% increments. The frankenslotted build can replace an Accuracy/Damage with a Damage/Endurance and take a small hit to ACC for a small amount of END. And if you add in triple aspects you can slot them even earlier and still get more benefit than an SO. Oh, and even with frankenslotting you still get a tiny bit of set bonus (above gets 4% regen and 3% run speed).
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"Hmm, I guess I'm not as omniscient as I thought" -Gavin Runeblade.
I can be found, outside of paragon city here.
Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
Quote:
I stand corrected. IOs will not provide their full enhancement value when you exemp down to lvl 32 and below.|
Originally Posted by GavinRuneblade
This is not true. Diminishing returns is based on your actual level and the level you exemp to. The level of the IO does not matter. Also very small bonuses might not get reduced so double and triple IOs can work at full value down quite low. A level 50 Quad works at full value all the way down to level 21 for example.
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wiki linky
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This is generally when I start slotting IO set as well. Keep in mind though, that many IOs are quite rare in this level range. Plan ahead, and makes some bids several levels below level 27 if possible. I also start storing any salvage I know I'll need which will cost a lot when you want to start crafting. Buying salvage at the time of crafting can become a huge Influence sink if you don't want to wait on lower bids.
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Originally Posted by DrMike2000
I usually start at level 27, when its time to refresh your SO's.
Some of the best levelling sets start at level 30 (Thunderstrike, Crushing Impact, Red Fortune, Doctored Wounds), and by then the actual bonuses from the enhancements have settled down enough that waiting a few levels makes little difference. |
24 hours of advance planning (for salvage) is really all it takes. Sometimes 10 minutes of advance planning is enough... most of your ugly spikes pass through the system really fast.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
Quote:
Oh, I agree whole-heartedly. But such a small percentage of players out there have the patience to wait even ten minutes, I generally advise saving some salvage.
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Originally Posted by Fulmens
24 hours of advance planning (for salvage) is really all it takes. Sometimes 10 minutes of advance planning is enough... most of your ugly spikes pass through the system really fast.
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Quote:
You know, I think I'd pay $10 or $15 for an increase in Vault Storage capacity...
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Originally Posted by Ignatz
Oh, I agree whole-heartedly. But such a small percentage of players out there have the patience to wait even ten minutes, I generally advise saving some salvage.
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Quote:
I'd pay that much to allow more than 18 storage bins in a SG base, but not for Vault storage. I don't even use the vault since it is individual to a character -- maybe after e-mailing goes in.|
Originally Posted by Tyrrano
You know, I think I'd pay $10 or $15 for an increase in Vault Storage capacity...
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My base has 12 salvage racks and 6 enhancement bins, and they are routinely full. I am the only one in the SG. Did I mention I was a bit of a hoarder?
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[U]Virtue Villains (Serenity's Orphans):[/U][/COLOR][/SIZE][SIZE=1][COLOR=Yellow] [/COLOR][/SIZE] [SIZE=1][COLOR=Yellow] [B]Eek a Rat[/B], [B]Bomb Blondeshell[/B], Babe Brute, Jeanne Dark, Fallen Angle[/COLOR][/SIZE]
Hi all. Been gone for awhile, and just curious, when is the best time to start slotting Io's for sets bonuses? Mid 30's? I am really curious, as I want a good return on the actual percentage that they are buffing (def,res,end redux) and want the sets as well.