ATTN: Dev's - PvP 2.0 Proposed Changes and Fixes

PvP 2.0 Desired Changes

(Values of proposed changes are debatable; my main concern is the idea behind the changes).

General:

PvP Merits:

• Due to the incredibly low drop rate on ANY type of PvP IO Recipe and to help cut down on the mindless AFK farming to increase the chances of getting just one (1) PvP IO in the course of a 12 hour period. System would also be striving towards giving a tangible incentive to PvP for certain amounts of time with a set (and tangible) goal in mind.

• Divide rep of the target defeated by the size of the team that killed the person (Rounded up).

• Ex 1. Team of 6 kills someone for 5.00 Rep = 1 PvP Merit rewarded to each person on that team.

• Ex 2. Team of 2 Kills someone for 5.00 Rep = 3 PvP Merits rewarded to each person on that team.

• Awarded in Zones and Arena (Maybe a Merit bonus for winning team? Exploitable?)

• Rep timers reset every five(5) minutes.

• Would stop the complaining of PvPing in zones for hours and receiving nothing but maybe a few inspirations drop on you.

• Ice blast, amongst other powers across various power sets went to crap after the “Animation time” damage calculation factor was applied.

• To help those powers out and bring final balance amongst other powers of similar nature I propose to invoke a system that not only calculates Animation time, but also calculates at what “Tier” the power being used is.

• This would bring a nice and much needed buff back to Bitter Ice Blast and also bring sets that should be flourishing, back on par with those sets which got a huge buff previously.

• Gives back the sensible endurance usage of “Nukes” and adds to them a reasonable damage component which can once again be used in a PvP setting.

• In an effort to bring back the usefulness of “Buffing” characters and power sets other than empathies and pain domination I propose that all Global Resistances be re-evaluated and reduced to 60% of their current values.

• Under the current system certain buffs which should help you out do nearly nothing at all for you in nearly every current PvP scenario, which indirectly negates the usefulness of many “buff” powers ( i.e. Sonic/Thermal/Cold/Force field Shields), and in return makes those archetypes useless.

• Lowering the Global resistances places characters further away from the steep Diminished Returns curve, allowing buffers to give reasonable buff numbers to those on their team and around them in PvP – thus making them useful and welcomed on teams.

• No Buff should give less than 30% of its buffed value.

• In contrast, Only 1 “Shield-type” of buff can be placed on any character at a given time, and the higher value buff trumps the lower one.

• Ex. Having 1 Thermal RESISTANCE shield and a Cold DEFENSIVE shield are ok and won’t cancel each other, if a sonic were to come along and try to buff whoever had the higher value on their RESISTANCE buff would trump the other.

• Applies to Fortitude and similar powers.

• Does NOT apply to Clear Mind or buffs of similar nature.

• Boost the Elusivity numbers on appropriate powers by 5%.
  

• This gives Defense-based power sets a similar boost that Global Resistances give to Resist-type power sets.

• Fix delayed damage calculation from Psi Blast (If possible).

• Cage-type powers fixed at a six(6) second duration.

• Fix the Ancillary Telekinesis power; make it resemble that of the controller.

• Cage-type powers fixed at an eight(8) second duration.

• Nothing huge ATM (admittedly I don’t play scrappers so inform me if there are issues).

• Re-evaluate Ancillary Power Pool range-type damage powers. Fossilize does more damage, or equal damage, than some blaster big hitters (Bitter Ice Blast, Blaze, etc.)

• 5% base damage boost (Even in PvE) on all damage powers.

• Warshades would need a complete revamp to pose viable in any mildly serious form of PvP.

• Electric Blast – Ball of Lightning currently does PvE damage in PvP.

• Lingering Radiation permanently travel suppresses and slows without DR being applied.

• Working as Intended?

• Remove the Critical effect from Stalker Patron Powers. A stalkers main power, Assassinate, is and can easily be trumped by “Trowin’ Shraks”. This is detrimental to the fundamental structure of the Stalker AT and thus needs to be re-evaluated.

• Cage-type powers have a base 4 second duration

• Hold-type powers have a base 6 second duration

• Mace Blast – Poisonous Ray is bugged on Damage/Debuff (I can’t fully remember)

• Domination Revamp:

• While Domination is active all hold-type and Cage-type powers have their duration increased by 50%.
  • Holds up to 9 seconds
  • Cages up to 6 seconds

• Domination is hard/impossible to “perma” under the current system and with DR going, so even recharge heavy builds would only gain such a benefit from this revamp over those who aren’t built for recharge.

• Working as Intended?

• Add Elusivity to Bane Spider Training – Cloaking Device.
• Fix Indomitable Will on Night Widows and Fortunata's so that the Knockback Resistance isn't suppressed when "Mez'd"

Remove the base resists altogether or at least give an option to turn them off in arena.

Seems like a reasonable good start - nicely done Bitters.

I've been talking about a reward/merit system for PvP zones to most of my friends/teamates since PvP IOs first came out. I can't see why a mission contact couldn't be added to RV like the other PvP zones. Sure, like anything else it may be exploitable, but it would hopefully curve the frustration of playing for hours/AFK farming AND adjust the ridiculously high price/availability for some of the more desirable PvP IOs.

On a side note, if range damage is adjusted (reduced) for melee ATs, then I would like to see an adjustment to the travel suppression in order for melee builds to be able to "close the distance" if their range damage gets reduced.

Way too many things i disagree with.

- The rep system is dumb and therefore should not be cornerstone of a pvp merit system. It fosters dumb play and lowers the overall skill level expected of a player engaging in PVP. The goal should be having a system that teaching newbies how to play by rewarding intelligent gaming. The rep system gives you optimal results when you cycle through targets sequentially. No good pvp team does this; it's dumb. People don't learn to evade when they are never targeted. People don't learn to spike coherent if there are no good evaders. Either the system for PVP merits needs to be objective-based (ie, capture the flag, team wins, final match kill differentials, etc) or contribution based (ie, warhammer-style rep where healers get "rep" depending on how much they heal and who they keep alive).

- If you remove the critical effect from stalker patrons, AS needs to be buffed. Either through raising the base damage or lowering the DR curve on damage for stalkers. Back in the day, one hit after getting AS'd meant you were dead on a squishy. The interrupt time on AS should be used when calculating the base damage.

- Kheld damage is ok. As much hell as I give them kheld players, the problem at this point is that all the kheld data points are coming from really inexperienced players that have yet to learn how to build one adequately. It's essentially like saying that Regen is a bad secondary because Demon Slayer dies on it.

- Speaking of Regen; scrappers needs to be looked at after another zone pvp revamp. The current rule-set makes them far too easy to play in a zone environment. Regen needs to be looked at too, as it is currently the only viable scrapper secondary.

- Offensive toggles cause travel suppression. Either their recharge should be tripled while in a PVP zone, or suppression should last only during the first 4 seconds of being toggled (my preferred fix).

- Remove base resists from No DR matches. We've been asking for this for over a year. Curious Observer told us back in i13 that it was the most requested change back then; can we please get that done?

That is Indomitable Will right?

Yep, both NW and Fort versions.

A question that needs answered is: What is the point of playing a defender? With DR, the extra 7-12% you get isn't really worth the damage reduction, lack of pets/controls that you get with controller or corruptors.

With all due respect, most of us don’t want to work with this 99% garbage PvP 2.0 system, we want it in the trash where it belongs.


Here is my quick list...

No DR. That’s what debuffs are for.

No TS. That’s what debuffs are for.

TS like TribHavok suggested.

No HD.

Put back -Max Run Speed.

Get rid of Elusivity.

Keep Phase combat.

Get rid of PvP damage resistance.

Keep damage holes closed in our “shields” but offer “shields” at lowbie levels. So in other words, get rid of the level 41 only epic requirements crud and make them like any other PP. Scaling the powers just like everything else. No it won’t unbalance PvE and it will offer “shields” to those PvPing in low level zones.

If attack damages are to remain higher then all ATs and attacks need to reevaluated not just blasters. Also, the amount of base resistance, defense and HP should be looked at as well.

Base HP for PvP should be evaluated irregardless of whatever changes take place.

Rep cash in system for PvP IOs.

I've been a fan of limiting certain buffs from being stacked as well.

Review every AT set and power for PvP compatibility.

*I have an idea for a Mez system but I need some time to work out details.


When it comes to melee ATs I personally feel there are just too many limitations and sacrifices being made when building for PvP in order to be competitive. After having to take and slot all of the armors and utility powers for survival I'm generally left with 1 travel power and very few (7') attacks. I think they should combine all (under tier 9) armors into 1 or 2 toggles that have utilities built in as well so that basic survivabliity does not become such a huge performance sacrifice compared. Then they could throw in a couple of "useful if taken" but "skippable if desired" powers like other sets have.

or..

Just provide all melee with tier 9 "super armor" toggle armor that cancels out the other armors.

Either way melee toons need to have more flexibility.

What i would like to see before ANY changes are made, is for the devs to admit that there are vast unbalances since I 13.
I would like to see proposed changes by the devs, that the community can vote on, we don't need another I 13 beta where they don't listen & implement whatever they think is right by the noobs.

I really don't think they need to look at /regen, it is one, not if the only set that does seem to work right, and that fact, in comparison to the others that got the heaviest nerf makes it seem overpowered. The other sets need to be..unbroken to be brought up to par with regen.

DR, HD,& especially TS need to be scrapped.
There should be no reason someone with a raptor pack should be able to fly faster than someone with 3 slotted flight. As someone else pointed out, TS only makes the 8 vs. 1 gankings easier.

From my observance DR has completly disabled the abilities of buffers, inspirations, and most secondaries.
I've heard people complain about pre I13 not being able to hit widows & that was why they needed to be nerfed so badly. I had played on both sides of this so-called issue, not only did mine have no problem being hit by a properly built character, but i had serveral heroes that could damage them 1 vs. 1, admittedly not killing, but just damaging ( claws sucked for scrapper then as much as now).

Now i take a fortunata in RV and she loses 72% of her defense, with defender like damage, and low hit points its just a target.

As long as i'm pointing out toons that were once good but got severly nerfed, /willpower scrappers. I don't even need to go into whats wrong with this, i just dare any dev to go into zone and see how long they last vs. anything else, the only fair fight for a /wp is another /wp, then its just fight clubbin'

If activation time is supposed to affect damage, then why does something like the snipe moonbeam still suck for damage for both sides?

Why will web gernade bring you down from flight, but not hover?

If several people on a team have tactics, & it stacks to allow them to see stalkers in thier primary defense, hide, then why can't several stalkers on a team have hide stacked to overcome that? If its fairness , and equality they want across AT's for PvP so the noobs can compete, shouldn't something of this nature apply?

Why, after all this time have the badges needed for accolades for red side not been moved from PvP zones, for those who don't wish to participate in that aspect of the game?

If the special effect of critical attacks applies to widows melee attacks, why not to fortunatas ranged attacks?

The drop rate is a joke for the PvP recipies, all one has to do is look at the market & see what was sold & when, how much is even more of a joke, but lends to factsof extreme rarity.

So many things need to be fixed, or should i say unfixed, they already know what system the public prefers. Take that pre I13 system & build off that, BUT NOT WITHOUT CONSULTING THE PLAYERS... they know who we are, the customers.

Most shocking experience I have ever had; logging into RV on my stalker and hitting a 950 pt AS on a PB.

Never mind that I had BU and a 55% global damage buff on.

Now I am depressed.

I blame barrier.


In all honesty, stalker's need to have AS buffed and sharks toned down. Possibly tone down impale. POSSIBLY. As it stands, AS is pretty weak now. A lot of the people don't consider the time it takes for a coordinated stalker team to get a double AS off. In zones, that time is equal if not more then it takes for a single blaster to down 1 possibly two squishies depending on what kind of squishy it is.

Stupid is stupid.

The Merit system needs work.

I proposed a Merit System in the Market forums. Simply award Merits on completion of team matches 1-3 per player. Award additional Merits for being on the winning team (3-5) and a lesser amount to each member of the losing team (1-3). Additionally, see about incentivizing Merits in PvP for good play. A timely phase that saves you should get a Merit, so should a good heal. Award them for kills as well, but stagger these so you can't just set up a Merit farm in the Arena.

Make the sales 40 Merits for a random roll. Exclude recipes you think should remain at the high end as needed, if you only want these as drops.

For zone play, award Merits for time spent in zone outside of bases. A base buffer shouldn't be getting anything. Award 1-3 Merits for every 50-10 minutes spent in a zone. Award additional Merits for accomplishing zone objectives (perhaps?) or even winning various stages of combat. Of course, to avoid farming you can cap how many Merits a player can earn in a certain amount of time.

Do not under any circumstances award Merits uniquely for kills. That will create farming/exploitive scenarios which should be discouraged. A close 4-3 match should be rewarded just as much as a 12-2 one, if not more.

Place the Merit vendors in the Arenas and base hospitals in zones.

Other items:

Restore cages to 6 seconds or so. Keep cage suppression, but change that so that the cage durations lessen if the same target is under that attribute.

Remove global resists altogether or at least reduce them somewhat.

Otherwise list looks interesting, but no comment on the AS etc stuff as it doesn't involve my style of play.

To solve the problem of AS:

Upon entering a PvP zone, a hero gets the following macro put into every empty slot in their tray.

/Macro AS Prevention ++Forward$$++Up

This game is harrrrrrrrrd