'casual player' earning power
By
Another_Fan,
Posted on: 2010-02-23 11:45 in The Market and Inventions
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There's zero doubt in my mind that this is possible. The main things to bring are +def shielders (cold, FF and - for villains, VEATs), the favored AV debuffs (DR and Regen), and it would be nice to bring a Kin of some kind to help keep people in endurance.|
Originally Posted by Minotaur
Has anybody ever got MoRSF or MoSTF with an all SO team ? Now that would be a challenge, and if some of the best can't do it then I'd suggest not everything is balanced around SOs.
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IOs make this sort of thing achievable at lower completion times or with less support, but they don't specifically uniquely enable it.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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My rad/archery defender has MoSTF, and he is almost entirely a frankenslot/generic IO build and mostly innocent of set bonuses. For the tanker - when the towers are up no set bonus is going to make a difference versus Recluse, and for the rest of the events of the TF none are necessary.
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Originally Posted by UberGuy
There's zero doubt in my mind that this is possible. The main things to bring are +def shielders (cold, FF and - for villains, VEATs), the favored AV debuffs (DR and Regen), and it would be nice to bring a Kin of some kind to help keep people in endurance.
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<《 New Colchis / Guides / Mission Architect 》>
"At what point do we say, 'You're mucking with our myths'?" - Harlan Ellison
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Well hey if you want to use SOs exclusively, no one's gonna stop you!|
Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
Stamina runs perfectly fine with SOs. You don't need IOs.
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Or, did you have some other point here?
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Really, REALLY well said.|
Originally Posted by Nethergoat
It's been my observation that these sorts of genuinely 'new' players aren't the ones complaining about the reward structure.
Assuming they like the game, they're the ones running around having fun exploring stuff and learning by trial and error- IMHO the most fun part of any game. I wouldn't *want* them to care how much inf they were earning or what was most efficient- that inevitably comes with time and exposure. Genuine newbies should be left to discover the game at their own pace. |
Nice job with this project Nethergoat. Thanks for sharing it with the community!
Nice posts, Goat.
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None other than the fact, that casual players don't need IOs.|
Originally Posted by Coyote_Seven
Well hey if you want to use SOs exclusively, no one's gonna stop you!
Or, did you have some other point here? |
But we knew this already. As stated perfectly by the examples posted just above your post.
Carry on.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
And if I hadn't said it before, nice job Goat.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
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Could you define need ?|
Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
None other than the fact, that casual players don't need IOs.
But we knew this already. As stated perfectly by the examples posted just above your post. Carry on. |
People keep using that word. I do not think it means what they think it means.
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The game can be played from 1-50 with SOs.|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Could you define need ?
People keep using that word. I do not think it means what they think it means. |
Simple as that.
Blazara Aura LVL 50 Fire/Psi Dom (with 125% recharge)
Flameboxer Aura LVL 50 SS/Fire Brute
Ice 'Em Aura LVL 50 Ice Tank
Darq Widow Fortune LVL 50 Fortunata (200% rech/Night Widow 192.5% rech)--thanks issue 19!
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Here's my definition, from earlier in the thread:|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Could you define need ?
People keep using that word. I do not think it means what they think it means. |
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Originally Posted by Redoubtable
That's true, "need" is a fairly nebulous concept in this context. My highly subjective definition is that "need" is what's required for your character to perform to the level that one could reasonably expect given the abilities/limitations of their archetype and power sets (assuming relative competence on the part of the player). The line where "need" turns to "want" is when a character gains the ability to solo a tough EB without Shivans/Nukes, partially because this was the expectation I had in SO days, and partially because the game usually gives you a warning if you're about to enter a mission which contains an EB.
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The point of those badges is (meant to be) that they're extremely difficult to get, yet they're attained quite regularly by well-IOed pick-up groups. As UberGuy says, I'd be surprised if an optimised team slotted with SOs couldn't do both.|
Originally Posted by Minotaur
Has anybody ever got MoRSF or MoSTF with an all SO team ? Now that would be a challenge, and if some of the best can't do it then I'd suggest not everything is balanced around SOs.
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Just finishing the LRSF used to be considered a difficult task that required a certain combination of ATs and power sets, but that's not really seen as a tough ask any more because people have figured out all of the best strategies. In these cases, IOs simply become a substitute for experience, skill and tactical nous.
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I've posted my working definition of 'casual'.|
Originally Posted by eryq2
"casual" depends on the person.
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That is the metric this thread operates under.
Other people are certainly entitled to their definitions, but they hold no sway here.
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| The way that YOU leveled yours may have been casual to YOU, but may not be casual as like, say, my cousin that plays whenever he can get 15$ from his parents. But don't worry, i'll tell him he don't need the better things in the game since he can't play like i or you do. |
My last re-up I signed on for 6 months. Then a friend gave me CoD: MW2 and I proceeded to ignore CoH entirely for about two months, logging in my main marketeers every few weeks to manage their inventory.
That lack of play time had zero impact on my 'hardcoreness' or lack thereof.
As for rewards, nobody's entitled to anything they aren't willing to earn in this game.
If your cousin wants l337 gear it is there for the taking if they're willing to make the effort.
Simply subscribing to the game doesn't entitle a player to the best rewards, any more than it entitles them to hit the level cap. The potential is there, but it's up to the player to realize that potential.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
My characters had about 70-120 million influence or infamy upon reaching level 50, a pattern that has held true for half a dozen characters so far. My characters have all paid their own way to 50, so the influence / infamy totals for each were self-generated.
I wouldn't fit the definition of casual offered up by the OP. But, my market activities may look a lot like those of a casual player because I find using the market to be an unpleasant chore and I try to minimize my time spent muddling around with it.
I am doing the same thing with a scrapper right now. I have not outfitted him with any influence. Any salvage is being sold at 1 inf, and any recipe is being put up at the lowest amount in the most recent transactions. Thus far, I am using only SO's.
He's currently at level 37 with 180-odd million inf.
I'd also like to echo the "the game can be played 1-50 using only SOs" sentiment, as all three of my level 50 characters did just that.
Thank you, Champion.
I wrote a huge post last night but it got eaten by the internets *Shakes fist*.
Essentially, my level 35 Ninja/Storm is a 'casual' project (ignore Born in Battle, High Pain Threshold and Force of Nature 
) that got to 80 Merits by level 35 doing Story Arcs, the odd Strike Force and regular gameplay. Now, she's certainly on the high end of the good ramdom rolls as I got a LOTG: 7.5, Miracle: +Recovery, Devastation: Dam/Rech and Pacing: Chance for Recharge Slow. Even so, selling normal drops like an Obliteration here and there got her 20-30 million influence. Adding in those two drops got me close to 300,000,000...but that's not a completely expected occurence.
Even my Spine/SR Scrapper had close to 80,000,000 by level 38 by selling drops and vendoring the odd Merit roll. The slighest contact with the Market will get you enough to outfit in Single Origins for the rest of your career. What you do with the rest is up to you...
Questions about the game, either side? /t @Neuronia or @Neuronium, with your queries!
168760: A Death in the Gish. 3 missions, 1-14. Easy to solo.
Infinity Villains
Champion, Pinnacle, Virtue Heroes
My brute is at 49 now and his earning has picked up a little since my earlier post; I had a 4M bid on a Numina that I'd forgotten about and took back, sold some crafted IO like Doctored Wounds, Thunderstrike, Mako, etc. Was up to about 60M before putting in some bids. I've also made some nice change off of common salvage (seems a lot of folks are bidding 100k on things for no real reason).
That would still seem on the low side, even compared to my other recent 50s. However, he's been pretty darned lucky the last week. A Gravitational Anchor dropped a couple days ago, then a Hecatomb AND a Soulbound Allegiance yesterday. No farming, just from running normal missions.
Suggestions:
Super Packs Done Right
Influence Sink: IO Level Mod/Recrafting
Random Merit Rolls: Scale cost by Toon Level
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My first 50 got there on SO power as well.|
Originally Posted by Bramphousian
I'd also like to echo the "the game can be played 1-50 using only SOs" sentiment, as all three of my level 50 characters did just that.
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And the *only* reason I upgraded some of my older characters to generics was because I hate the way SOs penalize you for leveling and need replacing every so often.
I have several characters who 'get by' just fine with generics and a -KB IO (because I hate getting knocked back =P).
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Originally Posted by gec72
That would still seem on the low side, even compared to my other recent 50s. However, he's been pretty darned lucky the last week. A Gravitational Anchor dropped a couple days ago, then a Hecatomb AND a Soulbound Allegiance yesterday. No farming, just from running normal missions.
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When I had more play time my fire/rad got a lot of great drops from farming, but he also got his share of great drops running missions with teams (he got lots and lots and LOTS of team invites, which I was occasionally able to accept).
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
Unbelievable - now I just got a Fortunata Hypnosis drop (defeated Radio, drop came from a straggler Champion Swiper).
I think we just have to assume that at a minimum someone could expect maybe 50M, but that luck can push you much, much higher. Either way it's way more than enough to outfit SOs.
And yeah - farming is just playing the game way more efficiently, the dynamic is the same. Defeat mobs, get drops.
Suggestions:
Super Packs Done Right
Influence Sink: IO Level Mod/Recrafting
Random Merit Rolls: Scale cost by Toon Level
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Going to co-sign with you there. 50-70 mil seems like a solid casual inf total for a standard 1-50 run, but definitely less than what anyone even trying to mess with the market is going to make, even if you are just selling your rare invention salvage drops. Also, if you just craft the Inventions after about 30 that you get from drops, I imagine most players would be surprised by the amount of decent frankenslotting their powers could get (even if you do not end up with full sets of the "good" uncommon IO sets like CI, DW, or TStrike).|
Originally Posted by gec72
Unbelievable - now I just got a Fortunata Hypnosis drop (defeated Radio, drop came from a straggler Champion Swiper).
I think we just have to assume that at a minimum someone could expect maybe 50M, but that luck can push you much, much higher. Either way it's way more than enough to outfit SOs. And yeah - farming is just playing the game way more efficiently, the dynamic is the same. Defeat mobs, get drops. |
I say all that because, even with my rotten luck, I have managed to get a few of all of the above on my toons between 30 and 50, I just never paid a lot of attention to it, unlike my fiancee (the gaming rookie... heh, nice to say I married up, at least as far as making good with what you get).
11 months of all-nighters, messy feeding sessions, bath fighting and realizing just how good my son's lungs work, and I am still convinced he is the crowning accomplishment in my life. What in the blue HFIL is wrong with me?
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^This. A player starts to lose their "casual" status as their tastes change.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
As I've noted, in my opinion 'casual' is more of a frame of mind than a function of the number of hours you can dedicate to the game, or how many months per year you are able to subscribe for.
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Originally Posted by Nethergoat
My first 50 got there on SO power as well.
And the *only* reason I upgraded some of my older characters to generics was because I hate the way SOs penalize you for leveling and need replacing every so often. I have several characters who 'get by' just fine with generics and a -KB IO (because I hate getting knocked back =P). Some folk like to pretend that you can only get good drops by farming, which is patent nonsense. Farming is more efficient at generating drops than 'regular' gameplay, but you'll get good drops regardless. When I had more play time my fire/rad got a lot of great drops from farming, but he also got his share of great drops running missions with teams (he got lots and lots and LOTS of team invites, which I was occasionally able to accept). |
You MAY get good drops on teams but chances are alot less. You can't even compare drops rates in a x8 farm solo to running with teams. Or at least in my experiences. I've ran umpteen ITF's and have never seen a purp. Sometimes, not even a single drop whereas i can farm and fill 20 recipe slots on each run. Mostly commons but theyre 100k each plus a Numina and an Arma trip that i got yesterday in 3 runs. The 300mil you MIGHT make in a 1-50 run, a farmer can make in a day or so or more. My wife made 900mil in 2 days of farming last month.
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So your point is that you make much more money in a day than a "casual" player makes going from 1 to 50... but it's the marketers that are driving up the prices. Gotcha.
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Originally Posted by eryq2
You MAY get good drops on teams but chances are alot less. You can't even compare drops rates in a x8 farm solo to running with teams. Or at least in my experiences. I've ran umpteen ITF's and have never seen a purp. Sometimes, not even a single drop whereas i can farm and fill 20 recipe slots on each run. Mostly commons but theyre 100k each plus a Numina and an Arma trip that i got yesterday in 3 runs. The 300mil you MIGHT make in a 1-50 run, a farmer can make in a day or so or more. My wife made 900mil in 2 days of farming last month.
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You can actually play the game from 1-50 without enhancing at all. |
Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
The game can be played from 1-50 with SOs.
Simple as that. |
My kin defender is quite welcome on task forces even though its secondary doesn't have a single enhancement slotted.
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Originally Posted by Redoubtable
Here's my definition, from earlier in the thread:
Quote: Originally Posted by Redoubtable  That's true, "need" is a fairly nebulous concept in this context. My highly subjective definition is that "need" is what's required for your character to perform to the level that one could reasonably expect given the abilities/limitations of their archetype and power sets (assuming relative competence on the part of the player). The line where "need" turns to "want" is when a character gains the ability to solo a tough EB without Shivans/Nukes, partially because this was the expectation I had in SO days, and partially because the game usually gives you a warning if you're about to enter a mission which contains an EB. __________________ |
SOs and soloing. Even with this there are multiple regimes to be considered. SOs only pre ED, SOs + HOs pre ed, SOs only post ED, SOs +HOs post ED. Then there is the matter of what is a reasonable level of difficulty and death rate.
In the example above a kin defender on a team doesn't need that much to be viable. That same kin defender would need much more to be viable for solo play and be enjoyable.
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Originally Posted by eryq2
You MAY get good drops on teams but chances are alot less. You can't even compare drops rates in a x8 farm solo to running with teams. Or at least in my experiences. I've ran umpteen ITF's and have never seen a purp. Sometimes, not even a single drop whereas i can farm and fill 20 recipe slots on each run. Mostly commons but theyre 100k each plus a Numina and an Arma trip that i got yesterday in 3 runs. The 300mil you MIGHT make in a 1-50 run, a farmer can make in a day or so or more. My wife made 900mil in 2 days of farming last month.
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Farming is more efficient, yes.
I still get good drops running missions or teaming.
I've gotten my share of purple drops just running missions with friends.
*shrug*
I think there's a perception issue at play here.
If your baseline is an 8 man farm it might seem like you're not "getting any drops" playing 'normally'.
But the reality is purples fall on farmers and 'casuals' alike.
Farmers will get more, since they work to maximize their opportunities. But the %'s are the same whether you're farming, running radios with pals or soloing story arcs.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone
checked my stalker- 58 hours to level 30 and 3/4ths.
The Nethergoat Archive: all my memories, all my characters, all my thoughts on CoH...eventually.
My City Was Gone