Why can't defensive sets ever max out at 100%
Schedule A enhacements.
33.33% base, ED diminishing returns hit hard 95%+
Accuracy, Confuse, Damage, Defense DeBuff, Endurance Modification, Endurance Reduction, Fear, Fly, Heal, Hold, Immobilize, Intangible, Jump, Recharge, Run, Sleep, Stun, Taunt
Schedule B Enhancements
20% base ED hits hard at 56%+
Range, Defense Buff, Resist Damage, To Hit Buff, To Hit Debuff
http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Enhanc...iversification
Basically a defence SO is a lower buff amount than a damage one, and everything else you see flows from that.
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You're missing several things actually.
First is Enhancement Diversification. In a nutshell, any enhancement of the same type after the third is reduced so much it might as well be considered nothing. Even the third enhancement is reduced slightly.
Second is that there are 4 types of enhancements. Where a tier 1, like accuracy, single origin enhancement buffs a power by 33%, a tier 2, like defense buffs, only buff the power by 20%.
Third, is that the base value of the buff for combat jumping is itself quite low. For a scrapper, it only provides 1.875% defense. If I stick a single SO defense buff in it, it becomes (1.875*1.2) 2.25% defense. If I stick 2 SOs in it (40% buff) it becomes (1.875*1.4) 2.625% defense. A third SO in CJ only buffs the power by about 56% instead of 60% due to enhancement diversification, so it only bumps it to (1.875*1.56) 2.925% defense to all.
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Enhancements operate under a diminishing return formula. The rule of thumb is only place 3 SOs worth of enhancement, anything beyond that is essentially useless. The DEVs labelled this Enhancement Diversification. Set bonuses are not subject to ED, so they apply face value to your powers.
I've noticed this every time I build a new toon and pick up a power like Combat Jumping to help with my defenses. When slotting for this power, I usually six slot it with maybe five Defenses Buffs and maybe one Jump. Sometimes I may max all six slots with the Defensive Buffs. When I then view my percentage of where I am at, it always shows it at around 66% or thereabouts. Unlike other power sets when you view them they will usually show what percent you are getting which is normally much higher in percentage. For my level 50 Blaster, I have her 6 slotted with the Red Fortune set and still can barely reach just under 70% with that. Is there something I am missing here about slotting defensive sets or is it impossible to get any defensive set to reach 99% or 100% capacity?
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That seems like a terrible waste of valuable slots. Six slotting Combat Jumping on a Blaster barely gains you 1% better defense over a completely unenhanced CJ. Even on a Tank, you'd only gain about 1.5% higher defense by doing this. Those slots could be so much better used in other ways.
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Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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That seems like a terrible waste of valuable slots. Six slotting Combat Jumping on a Blaster barely gains you 1% better defense over a completely unenhanced CJ. Even on a Tank, you'd only gain about 1.5% higher defense by doing this. Those slots could be so much better used in other ways.
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PuffCat claw/rgn scrapper
Painfull Death fire/fire tank
Spiney Slaughter spine/da walkingnuke
And many others including lvl50s of all ATs.
Mainly on Virtue, but Heroes on all servers.
A few lowbie villains on Justice and Virtue
http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
For a tank maybe, but for a blaster the 3% to all from the power & enhancers, boosted up to 6% ranged from the 6th red fortune is kinda a big deal.
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+1 to CJ, +1 to SJ
slot 2x Zephyr in each
With that you get +8% ranged DEF and have 3 slots left over.
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Defenses really tend to become stronger as they get, well, stronger, and so the higher you get them, the more you get out of each point of increase. This is probably why the defenses are all on Schedule B instead of Schedule A.
I mean, if a Resistance ITSELF maxed out at 100%, that means you would resist 100% of damage.
I've noticed this every time I build a new toon and pick up a power like Combat Jumping to help with my defenses. When slotting for this power, I usually six slot it with maybe five Defenses Buffs and maybe one Jump. Sometimes I may max all six slots with the Defensive Buffs. When I then view my percentage of where I am at, it always shows it at around 66% or thereabouts. Unlike other power sets when you view them they will usually show what percent you are getting which is normally much higher in percentage. For my level 50 Blaster, I have her 6 slotted with the Red Fortune set and still can barely reach just under 70% with that. Is there something I am missing here about slotting defensive sets or is it impossible to get any defensive set to reach 99% or 100% capacity?
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Actually, when you slot to 66% what you are really slotting to is "1.66x". In other words, you're slotting to 1.66 times higher. There's nothing magical about slotting to 100%. After that comes 101%, then 102%, then 103% - you are basically increasing the dial from 1.66, to 2.00, to 2.01, to 2.02, and so on.
The reason why you can't get much higher than about 60% for some things, and 95% for other things, is because enhancement strength has diminishing return limits.
Just to be sure you understand, defensive powers are quoted in percentage strength: Focused Fighting offers 13.875% defense unslotted. That "percentage" doesn't mean you dodge 13.875% of all attacks: there's a formula which basically says critters have a 50% chance to hit you by default, and 13.875% defense means you *subtract* 13.875 percentage points from the attacker chance to hit: 50% - 13.875% = 36.125%. That's all that "percentage" means. Obviously, the goal is not to hit one hundred percent, but fifty percent, because 50% - 50% = 0. Except the game enforces a floor of 5%, which means defense of 45% is the limit.
Enhancements have a percentage, but those are just multipliers like I mentioned above. A power with 10% defense that has 66% enhancement is not 76% (10% + 66%), its 10 percentage points of defense boosted to 1.66 times the original strength, or 10 * 1.66 = 16.6. That power would then offer 16.6 percentage points of defense.
Its important to try not to get the "%"s mixed up. Think of defense powers as offering points of defense, and enhancements as offering multipliers to those powers.
A good source for more information on these areas is the paragonwiki page on Attack Mechanics. That article covers the topic more generally, accounting for more effects.
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DEF/RES stuff maxes at around ~55%
Most other stuff maxes at around ~95%
If RES/DEF went up to ~95%, it'd make stuff wacky.
Dispari has more than enough credability, and certainly doesn't need to borrow any from you.
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Edit: Looked at CatWhoorg's link you can get up to 195% in Knockback.
What about Knockback? I wanted some cheap +recharge and -end and the set bonuses were nice so grabbed a few knockbacks out of a set and ended up with +133%.
How high can go with it? any others that go this high?
For a tank maybe, but for a blaster the 3% to all from the power & enhancers, boosted up to 6% ranged from the 6th red fortune is kinda a big deal.
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Those slots would still be better used slotting up a more useful power, ESPECIALLY on a Blaster.
There are several options:
*Put the Red Fortune set into Maneuvers or Weave.
*6 Thunderstrike in a ranged attack for 3.75% ranged.
*6 Mako's Bite in a melee attack for 3.75% ranged.
*1 Steadfast unique for 3% to all.
*2 Blessing of the Zephyr in a travel power for 3.13% ranged.
*6 Gaussian's in a to-hit power for 2.5% to all.
Edit: Looked at CatWhoorg's link you can get up to 195% in Knockback.
What about Knockback? I wanted some cheap +recharge and -end and the set bonuses were nice so grabbed a few knockbacks out of a set and ended up with +133%. How high can go with it? any others that go this high? |
Basically ED really kicks in once you're got the equivalent of three even level SOs slotted into the power (it starts having an effect at or just above 2 even level SOs). Since SOs have one of four different values (20%, 33.3%, 40%, 60%) ED kicks in at different points.
Because defensive powers tend to get too strong if you just double them, instead they go up to 160% maximum. That's Defense, Resistance, ToHit Buffs and Debuffs. (Damage buffs and debuffs can't be slotted, but they'd probably go in this category too) It's not that you have only 60% of the overall Enhancement, it's that the maximum Enhancement is only +60% of the base. (Glad Arcanaville posted that, I didn't even think about that that was what the OP was thinking of)
Range is on the same schedule as defenses for whatever reason. Knockback and Interrupt actually are higher than 100%.
It might help to note that before Enhancement Diversification, the maximum was 300%, where it is now 200%. (Or 220% where it is now 160%) Most people ended up slotting damage for about 266%, since they still needed a slot for Accuracy. That was still quite extreme, and made very high level characters much more powerful than they are now. IO's have compensated for some of that, but a lot of the problem was that the devs felt that the gap between high level players and low level ones was too great. There was just not enough room at the highest levels to tweak power strengths without nerfing low levels.
Six slotting Combat Jumping on a Blaster with lvl 50 Red Fortune provides only 5.3% ranged defense.
Those slots would still be better used slotting up a more useful power, ESPECIALLY on a Blaster. There are several options: *Put the Red Fortune set into Maneuvers or Weave. *6 Thunderstrike in a ranged attack for 3.75% ranged. *6 Mako's Bite in a melee attack for 3.75% ranged. *1 Steadfast unique for 3% to all. *2 Blessing of the Zephyr in a travel power for 3.13% ranged. *6 Gaussian's in a to-hit power for 2.5% to all. |
*All of the above for softcap or close to it.
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
I've noticed this every time I build a new toon and pick up a power like Combat Jumping to help with my defenses. When slotting for this power, I usually six slot it with maybe five Defenses Buffs and maybe one Jump. Sometimes I may max all six slots with the Defensive Buffs. When I then view my percentage of where I am at, it always shows it at around 66% or thereabouts. Unlike other power sets when you view them they will usually show what percent you are getting which is normally much higher in percentage. For my level 50 Blaster, I have her 6 slotted with the Red Fortune set and still can barely reach just under 70% with that. Is there something I am missing here about slotting defensive sets or is it impossible to get any defensive set to reach 99% or 100% capacity?