Quick question: No Duel Pistols for us scrappers?

Something like this?

This.

u cant haz pistolz

*hands Silverado a fuzzy paw glove*

Here, facepawing hurts a lot less. Especially when you need to do a triple-take double-facepaw.

Buy the temp power revolver?

They ALL float down here. When you're down here with us, you'll float too!

@Starflier

In case you're wondering what you just stepped in, this is one thoroughly beaten dead horse. It's probably all new to you, but it's old to a lot of the locals, which should explain some responses. That and you probably meant dual pistols, and that confusion will probably explain other responses. I'm in favor of dual pistols, perhaps as an epic, and I'd play it if they made it a primary. I have a soft spot for gun fu. But lots of people think it's a stupid idea, and it's pretty much probably never going to happen.

I think the horse has been turned into Jerky by now.

I do wonder about the Epic Power class though. There already is Weapons Mastery, which I believe comes with Shurioken and Shurioken that go boom. It might not be that much of a stretch to have a Weapons Mastery II class with pistols instead of throwing stars.

But if they did that I might have to take a primary power at level 12. I really like having that power choice freed up for one of my pool prerequisites.

Ooh boy, let's not have this debate again - the last one was bad enough Stay on topic people!

I had to do a double-take on the thread title to get it. Yes, exactly something like that

That is the best suggestion I have ever seen. Particularly the armor set

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Originally Posted by Aggelakis PrincessDarkstar: "RAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHH SOMEONE IS *WRONG* ON THE INTERNET!"

That tanker primary is hilariously awesome, I wish we could have it rofl!

Two movies. Equilibrium and Ultra Violet.

If you are actually looking for a semi-serious response, I'm not really sure what drives this particular desire. I think the core of the desire is that players want to do things in the game that don't make sense... because the game already doesn't make sense. Think about it. We already have avatars that can jump tall buildings in a single bound. We have avatars that can shoot beams of radiation from their bare hands. We have avatars that can sprout rocks out of their body.

So, what's the big deal with continuing to be ludicrous? What's the big deal with having Pistols that are used in melee only? What's the big deal with playing a Blaster like a Scrapper? What's the big deal with playing a Scrapper like a tank? What's the big deal with playing a Defender like a Blaster? and so on and so on and so on and so on....

The feeling, well, emotional response of lets do it anyways is, to me, further strengthened by the lack of any real punishment in the game. I don't mean just, well, debt, or the lack of it. I mean beyond that, in relation to the community. I've lost count of the number of spammers, trolls, griefers, and the like that I've encountered in the game that still play, that haven't been banned, even when they do things the devs say are bannable offenses; e.g. putting Ourobous Portal on the ski slope; e.g. dragging Monsters in PI to Portal Courtyard; e.g. Confusing a Player in a PvP zone, then chain confusing to Atlas Park and nuking lowbies; e.g. spamming broadcast in AP with a constant string of words censored by the in-game engine, then working out how to spell those words with leet-speak or punctuation to get around the filter.

Yes, the GM's and Mods do step in on occasion and nail players that really deserve it... but rarely do we ever actually see a developer or mod say something to the effect of you are doing it wrong.

***

Edit: clarification here. I don't think I tied this line of thought into the original argument well enough.

Where I'm trying to go with this line of thought is that we don't often see responses to many of the suggestions and ideas that get tossed around. Occasionally Back Alley Brawler will step in with a facepalm... but for the most part, the developers and moderators stay out of the suggestion threads. So there's a flood of wild and crazy ideas going around that never get responded to on an official level. Yes, other players pick these ideas apart, and either improve them to the point where they are acceptable, like maybe doing Dual Pistols as an Epic / Patron Power (Maelstrom could be a Villain patron... maybe?), or absolutely destroy the arguments. Really, what's the worst we can do to Missy K? Neg-rep her? Well, turn rep off and it really doesn't matter. Ignore her? Well, that means you don't see anything she says in the future, but it doesn't solve the root problem of teaching other players how to play the game, or what makes sense for the game.

With the lack of... I hesitate to the use the word tactile... perhaps... perceived? With the lack of perceived feedback on many aspects of how we play the game from the devs, we're often pressing vague boundaries, or stepping over those boundaries. Yeah, it's a bit much to expect the devs to set hard rules on everything we do... or don't do within the game world or outside of the game world. That lack of a hard-formed environment basically forms a breeding ground for bad ideas to flourish, and for good ideas to get buried. Which is one of the many reasons why most game forums typically draw only a small percentage of the actual playing and paying base.

Still not happy with tying this back into the behavior expectation of why players might feel one way or the other, but I hope it's enough background to establish a point

***

Anyways, bypassing the community aspect and looking back into the game aspect, there's the, well, it's not a problem, but various combinations of IO sets will let one archtype mimic or behave like another archtype. Case in point would be an SR Stalker or Scrapper soft-capping on defenses. Since an SR Stalker or Scrapper can soft-cap very easily, and since that defense generally can't be taken away, why shouldn't they play like brute? Why shouldn't they play like a tank? Why shouldn't a defender rack up on damage bonus's and have ranged combat like a blaster or corruptor?

The developers, as I see it, have boxed themselves into a corner. By designing a better game, an easier to access, and an easier to play game, they've also opened up the game world to be bent in ways the original design never accounted for. From a long-term viewpoint it's not exactly that big of a surprise that some of the things you, or I, find outlandish and crazy, like Dual-Pistols in a Melee set, seem like completely normal and logical steps of game design to another player.

***

Oh, and Bill. A: I wrote that. and B: if you really believe that I'm ignorant when it comes to systems maintenance.. woah are you ever wrong. I've also said that directly to Microsoft employees, and even they can't contest what I say. So if you have a counter-argument, I'd love to hear it, because even the guys who write the software say I'm right.

I'd have no complaints with that. (for what little my complaining is worth LOL) A side arm isn't an uncommon thing, and would fit the concept of giving scrappers access to powers they don't normally have. IE, ranged powers, in an epic pool.

But a whole powerset? I doubt it. don't get me wrong here, i'm not accually against the idea. Just kind of wondering why it's such a popular idea, that makes no since to me personally. But a new powers set, reguardless of where or what, is always welcome in my book. Heh.

I think this is it.

They think, "My character is able to dodge." That automatically goes to "My character is able to dodge WELL, as well as Spiderman or Daredevil." But really, when you get to a character like The Phantom or The Shadow, who traditionally uses pistols, first of all they aren't really as agile as someone like Spidey, they use other methods to defend themselves as well, and usually, their pistols aren't even their main attacks anyway.

Even I've fallen into this trap, I created a character who had superhuman reaction time (due to implants in his head) but used a sawed-off shotgun, limiting his attacks to point blank range. When I created him in CoH I had to create him as a Blaster, with Assault Rifle, but in retrospect I think it fits him better. Maybe a theoretical Ranged/Defense type of character like the EATs would fit as well, but there's also that the EAT's are built around specific power concepts. You wouldn't be given the ability to pick pistols as a Ranged set for SoA, more than likely. Because the Arachnos Soldiers as NPCs don't use pistols.