Origins

So... I´m sure people have already made comments about it but heer it go again anyway.

I believe that chosing an Origin should actually mean something to a character, rather than just being a question about wanting to use a Nemesis Staff or a Blackwand (when you can use them, of course). On Comics the Origin makes all the difference...

- Mutants on Marvel are feared and hated. Most of their main story arc work around this concept...
- Magical users can affect things nothing else can... Superman as an example is vulnarable to 2 things: Kriptonite and Magic. That should be true to us too, as Rikti are said to fear magic.
- People who rely on Technology to get powers may end up without batteries. Spidey tends to get in trouble with his Web-Shooters on the most hilarious ways. (Even tought he is not the perfect example as he have powers from a Spider bite too)
-Natural heroes have their own problems in dealing with other supers... You have to outsmart them, because you can not defeat them with only your "powers". That´s how Captain America and Batman work, and both have fought some legendary battles.
-The Science guys are mostly geeks... But you will run to them whenever you need to know exactly how to close that dimension rupture you accidently opened...

I mean, they´re DIFFERENT from each other... Not the same thing with a different small litle power that you probably never use again after you reached level 10. I´m not saying they should do any drastic changes to gameplay, but they could at least make some use of the Origins story wise at least.
What you guys think?

Expect to be flamed on this one. People love their origins having NOTHING to do with their character/playstyle.

Me? I'd like the Origin to tie into the tutorial... Depending on Origin you'd have a different tutorial set in a different but small zone.

Follow the link in my sig to the COH trailer guide. Most importantly, go through the dev diaries.

Origin used to mean more - a LOT more - but this was in, oh, *alpha.* As in how many powers you could choose, and how far you could develop them. The system got dumped in an overall rework.

Right *now,* I think origin's fine as is as far as it relates to what you can do with your character. Leave the "story wise" bit to the player, please. Not least because, as Photon says... five years on is a bit late to make this sort of a change to (literally) millions of characters. It is, probably as a holdover from the prior system, a fundamental, non-changing part of your character. We've been told it's seen as fundamental and unchangeable as AT, primary and secondary as far as what makes your character up.

All that said, the one place I *would* like to see Origin affect things is in storyline. Let other options become available in dialog and in contacts that aren't available to the other origins. (The biggest problem with this, of course, is that what the developers consider "appropriate" to an origin might not be what YOU had in mind for the character. For instance, Science: "The (X group) is trying to break into your old lab and retrieve the data from your experiments that gave you your powers!" could be a storyline... except, of course, that my Science origin is from toxic waste in the bay I was dumped in by some gangsters. No lab, no experiment.

See my Guides and Tutorials

Origins as defined in this game are too flawed to have anything meaningful tied to them.

Oi.

Captain America is NOT a natural hero.
Captain America is Weapon I. The first weapon produced by the Weapon Plus program, that is more commonly referred to as Weapon X. Of course Weapon X is Wolverine, the 10th Weapon produced by the Weapon Plus program.

Without going into detail, the bullets seem to suggest things like:

- use the Marvel Universe's cultural setting for mutants.
- use the DC Universe's model for magic (though it would apply to Marvel as well).
- use a special form of recharge/dependability issues, apart from endurance, to limit Tech, rather in the manner of Champions "Obvious Accessible Focus" and "Charges" modifiers (the paper and pencil system, not the new MMO).

In short, make origins model your favorite advantages and limitations from different comic book settings.

I disagree. There is always a variation on the theme of "origin" - not to mention endless fodder for arguments other whether a given iconic hero is a given origin (viz. this thread, whether Cap is Natural or Science).

Leave Origins as a touch of color players can use or ignore, selecting powersets and enhancements (we don't have disadvantages as such) to emphasize the aspects of their powersets that please them.

Problem being that the game occurs in its own fictional universe.

Hallowed are the Ori!


Oops, wrong universe...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trialtester Rikti are said to fear magic.

So how do you explain the Rikti Maguses?

My feeling is, the devs already have a story in the design stages when it comes to Origins, and we should let it play out. This world is not the world of Marvel, Mutants are not going to be hated. This world is not the world of DC, Magic is just one origin of many.

I'm convinced we'll be seeing origin dependent storylines at some point. However I most definitely don't want them to be a rehash of what has been done in other comics.

Well, I actually tought I would get flamed... But as it turned out it might be because I didn´t express myself correctly.

Sorry, the bullets were supposed to be just examples... I don´think in CoX it should be EQUAL to any other universe, I just think they should MEAN something like they do on other universes. Like, being a Mutant or Magic origin would make any difference... Besides that lil´power and have to selll different origins enhancements ´cause you can´t use them.

I don´t want any radical changes like in Origins mechanics... I just want some more "flavor" to it. Some storyline flavor (that´s what I meant by story wise, sorry). You would think that after 5 years the would have made some storylines where Origins are meaningfull (besides that run-and-talk one where you get the badge...) I actually liked some of the suggestions... Begginer area being different, Badges, Missions... Things like that might make people try different Origins just for fun. Well, maybe not badges, making more exclusive badges might be a wrong move.

Well Memphis_Bill said what I had tought to say.... They don´t "fear" magic, just have some "weakness" to it. Again, a bad placed word. English is not my main language so at times I mess up, specially late at night when I usually write this stuff. :-)

These are the Origins as I see them:

Natural - no super powers, an alien whose powers are totally natural to them, relies on training to advance.

Most sensible powerset selections - Archery, Trick Arrow, Assault Rifle, Traps, Devices --

Wait a minute!

Technology surely has a role to play here?

Categorising Origins is a tiring and thankless task and is ultimately down, imho, to the individual to justify their origin.

For example, any psychic characters I have tend to be Mutants. This is due, no doubt, to the influence of Marvel on me and especially due to the X-Men: The Animated Series that was on when I was 12 (back in the early nineties).

Another example comes from the confusing nature of Science Single Origin Enhancements: I always used to wonder why I didn't pick Science as an Origin. Have you read some of the names of its enhancements? And the art (i.e. the colour of the enhancment) is sometimes so obscured as to be of no use when deciding if you've just picked a Defense Buff or a Resistance Buff.

The Inventions system has helped tremendously with this problem, for me.

Plus there are all sorts of quandaries involved with, if you like this sort of thing (and I do!), the justification of Origins such as Magic and Technology:

With Magic it's a case of - A Wizard Did It.
With Technology it's a case of - A Wizard with a Spanner Did It.

***

To finish, we do currently have (minor) nods to our Origins. We have starting temp powers and a whole arc called The Origin of Power.

Of course that arc, depending on who you speak to, could contradict what you, as the player, consider to be the reasoning behind your choice of Origin. Blueside, for example, Manticore makes no mention of Aliens in his stance as the Natural contact for the arc. However, the text on the 'Choose Your Origin' screen does. Sister Psyche (and her counterpart, the Russian guy in Cap Au Diable) allude to the fact that even psychics may be, or have been, their own unique Origin. They also place Mutant activity/birth at the time of the first Atom bomb or thereabouts. It's considered a 'newer' origin than, say, Magic, which has been around for a looong time.

To ask the Devs to either rewrite or modify this open, story-telling device for our characters would be, in an ideal World, okay. But I think there are more pressing projects that they're working on right now.

What the origins mean is set in stone through the official manual that came with City of Heroes... but... ofcourse we are free to chance what we like. I will never do that though, as its a part of destroying my immersian to the game.

Natural
Natural abilities is all that is normla for what you are. Natural to what you are. And enhanced through training. Skills gained. Batman is natural... But Superman is natural too. He is an Kryptonean and has nothing more then every Kryptonean has.

Mutant
Those born with their abilities... but a mutation through evolution of the natural order of their species. X-Men are all mutants...

Science
Normal/natural who gains his abilities through an accident or scientific process. I know that its said that they mutated after that. But this is still originated in a scientific process. Spider-man, Hulk, Flash and the Fantastic Four are all science in origin.

Magic
Normal/natural who gains his abilities through the use of magic. Either by using an artifact that was magically enhanced or through the study of mystical/other dimensional energies and learning how to use those. Some good excamples are sorcerers and witches like Dr. Strange and Zatanna. Magical artifacts users are Dr. Fate and Bloodstone.

Technology
Normal/natural who uses high-tech to be able to do special feats. Armor, belts, boots and devices. Robots are included here too. He can create these things himself or he can have another make them. Good excamples are Robots like Vision and the original Human Torch, Cyborgs like DC's Cyborg or Marvel's Deathlock, Armor wearing guys like Iron Man and Dr. Doom... the latter even a robotics creator too.

Officially the game stated that the missions granted are set to the origin picked. And ofcourse the enhancements differ... even if its only in the availability. Some shops are harder to get too then others.

I guess what the OP is actually talking about a second inherit ability locked on the origin where the one we have now and the one that is locked to the AT. If done right this can be cool... but dont overdo it and keep it balanced.

What is alien?
To the alien he is normal and humans are aliens...

So I guess when you go to the Natural Store, your alien uses their imagination and are not really using Military-named enhancements? Im just saying.