Praetorian Clockwork IS PEOPLE!!
By
Aett_Thorn,
Posted on: 2009-10-26 13:21 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
Are the Praetorian clockwork actually controlled by the Clockwork King? I didn't think that they were, just that they were supposed to 'look like' the clockwork on Prime Earth.
Even if they aren't, no reason that this couldn't be, but I'm just sayin'.
Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.
~Ralph Waldo Emerson
"I was just the one with the most unsolicited sombrero." - Traegus
Yeah i always said that it'ld make more sense for Tyrant to make the defeated heroes into his version of Praetorian Protectors. Would just seem more fitting!
Though they do look/fight REALLY cool 
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In the current background info, the Praetorian Clockwork have no connection to the Clockwork King - but that could be retconned in GR.
@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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I see one of two scenarios:|
Originally Posted by Aett_Thorn
Are the Praetorian clockwork actually controlled by the Clockwork King? I didn't think that they were, just that they were supposed to 'look like' the clockwork on Prime Earth.
Even if they aren't, no reason that this couldn't be, but I'm just sayin'. |
- The Clockwork King as such never came to be. Blue Steel didn't do the big bad on him (one of those alter/mirror universe duality thingies), he didn't turn to evil etc. He was taken into Chimera's programme and passed, thus becoming one of Cole's lackeys to do his bidding.
- He was inducted into Chimera's programme when his psychic talents were noticed by Mother Mayhem and her psychic friends network. He failed, Mother Mayhem and her merry band of mind-riders now control him and he controls the Praetorian Clockwork.
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'Praetorian Clockwork' is the fault of the old (current) Praetorian minions of Anti-Matter and Neuron. Anti-matter built the blue robots, Neuron built the silver robots. They were, irrc, inspired by the Clockwork of Primal Earth. Anti-matters minions used radiation, while Neuron's minions stuck to using electricity.
These new ones are a whole new breed of kickass.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Or the Praetorian Blue Steel just went a little further than the Primal Earth one, and simply killed him.
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Originally Posted by The_Killbot_5000
The Clockwork King as such never came to be. Blue Steel didn't do the big bad on him
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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So that means Primal Earth got the evil Blue Steel. The one who doesn't kill people, rather electing to keep their brains in fish tanks.
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
Or the Praetorian Blue Steel just went a little further than the Primal Earth one, and simply killed him.
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Although I've linked the Clockwork King of Praetoria (existant or not we do not know) to the Praetorian Clockwork's creation it's not essential that he be involved at all for the crux of my theory to be correct. That those shiny blue and silver 'robots', may actually be Supers who failed Chimera's induction programme.|
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
'Praetorian Clockwork' is the fault of the old (current) Praetorian minions of Anti-Matter and Neuron. Anti-matter built the blue robots, Neuron built the silver robots. They were, irrc, inspired by the Clockwork of Primal Earth. Anti-matters minions used radiation, while Neuron's minions stuck to using electricity.
These new ones are a whole new breed of kickass. |
The Prateorian Clockwork seen already in the game (sprocket and cog types) who turn out to have been created by Neuron and Antimatter could easily be explained in several ways. First, they could well have been inspired by Prime Earth's Clockwork King and his version of Clockwork to create their own robots for their nefarious plots in our dimension. Alternately, Emporer Cole could be claiming that they are Neuron and Antimatters technological creations as a cover story for rather unsettling idea that inside those metal skins are the hearts, minds and bones of your sister Kim who should be 'overseas' fighting the good fight.
It leads nicely into the idea that the Resistance are aware of this and probably other aspects of Cole's evil scheme, and so do all they can to get the news out.
It is the absense of information about the Prateorian counterpart to the individual who on Prime Earth became the Clockwork King, that makes me think that he may be central to the conspiracy. We have had a lot of information about the new Praetorian Clockwork, we've seen screenies, live gameplay demos, costume code giveaways, but in all this has it specifically been mentioned who their creator is? If not, why not? I would think because it's central to the storyline and not something that they'd want to reveal except through gameplay.
If there is an offical NCSoft / Paragon quote from a Redname somewhere that specifically states that the Prateorian Clockwork (in their Going Rogue incarnation) are the products of Neuron and Antimatters tech skills then I'll happily drop the idea of the Pratorian Clockwork King being behind them.
Even if that's the case though, I'm still firm in my convictions that their presence on the streets of Praetoria as a 'servant' class to do 'menial' labour, therefore contributing to Cole's 'greater good', plays perfectly into the seditious thought that they are the failed output of Chimera's induction programme.
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The Praetorian Blue Steel might have gone after the CK with the intention to kill him - our one didn't |
Originally Posted by ResidentBaka
So that means Primal Earth got the evil Blue Steel. The one who doesn't kill people, rather electing to keep their brains in fish tanks.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Well if you kill them then you can't recruit them into your AQUARIUM OF LOST SOULS
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Originally Posted by Golden Girl
The Praetorian Blue Steel might have gone after the CK with the intention to kill him - our one didn't
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Here, this is proof.
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Anti-Matter
You pay to play. Having fun is ok. Kill Skuls or kill Crey. Hunt at night or in the day. Black or white or shades of grey. Play it your way. We have no say.
Silas' official theme song: Word Up!
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I like how he thinks "cracking portal tech" is gonna get Dominatrix all up in his battle suit.|
Originally Posted by Silas_Gray
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"Hey girl, I just synthesized an equation for transcending dimensional boundaries. Does that set your heart aflutter or what?"
edit:
"Dominatrix, honey, I just found a dimension composed entirely of small, adorable puppies. What say you and I put on our stomping boots and we can leave our pants at the portal?"
edit:
"Baby, you've invaded dimension Kappa-Phi 30-80. Also known as 'my heart.'"
edit:
"What say we go back to my place and I launch my strike force into your transdimensional phasegate?"
edit:
"Wanna do the robot?"
edit:
"What say I relocate a search party to praetorian Uranus?"
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Well, that's current proof - we don't know what retcons GR might bring |
Originally Posted by Silas_Gray
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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I keep thinking of Desperate Guy and Turndown Girl |
Originally Posted by ResidentBaka
I like how he thinks "cracking portal tech" is gonna get Dominatrix all up in his battle suit.
"Hey girl, I just synthesized an equation for transcending dimensional boundaries. Does that set your heart aflutter or what?" edit: "Dominatrix, honey, I just found a dimension composed entirely of small, adorable puppies. What say you and I put on our stomping boots and we can leave our pants at the portal?" edit: "Baby, you've invaded dimension Kappa-Phi 30-80. Also known as 'my heart.'" edit: "What say we go back to my place and I launch my strike force into your transdimensional phasegate?" edit: "Wanna do the robot?" edit: "What say I relocate a search party to praetorian Uranus?" |
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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On Praetoria, they're married.
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
I keep thinking of Desperate Guy and Turndown Girl
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Hi Silas. This is proof of what? That Paragonwiki has information about the current incarnation of Clockwork from Praetoria that's on the live servers in a few missions? That the info says that they are the creators, that's excellent. I'm referring to the new Going Rogue incarnation of the Praetorian Clockwork which as yet doesn't have any official backstory that I'm aware of.|
Originally Posted by Silas_Gray
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So, essentially the existing info from the Tina MacIntyre arcs only provides the most basic of information about them. They are created by Anti-Matter to prove his worth to Tyrant and Dominatrix. That these versions of the Clockwork look physically different from the new Going Rogue versions and that there is nothing specifically outlining the process he went through to create them.
I can imagine numerous ways in which the two story-lines can be converged. The Clockwork seen in the Tina MacIntyre arc were designed by Anti-Matter as copies of the version he'd seen on Prime Earth, that way they'd be less likely to expose his inter-dimensional nature. This wouldn't preclude the idea that back on his home dimension of Praetoria a different version (the Going Rogue version) of Clockwork are actually the shells for the mind-controlled Supers who have failed Chimera's induction programme.
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Robots becoming 'human' is a staple of the genre. I can see the Clockwork King (a non-head-in-a-jar version) being the catalyst for the Clockwork become self-aware and becoming part of the Resistance.
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Fact:
We dont know.
Additional Fact:
We WONT know until GR comes out, or at least closer to release.
Sorry, I get sick of speculation after a while.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Who is Praetorian Canada Joe?
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Then come back in 6 months |
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Sorry, I get sick of speculation after a while.
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@Golden Girl
City of Heroes comics and artwork
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Contact for the best TF in the dimension.
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Originally Posted by Prof_Backfire
Who is Praetorian Canada Joe?
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http://www.fimfiction.net/story/36641/My-Little-Exalt
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*looks at thread title line*|
Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
Fact:
We dont know. Additional Fact: We WONT know until GR comes out, or at least closer to release. Sorry, I get sick of speculation after a while. |
*looks at Techbot Alpha*
hmm...why do I get the feeling...
so these Clockwork are Praetorian Cybermen?
*whips up a hot cocoa; pulls up a chair*
Interesting, tell me more...
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That was my thought as well. The newer Cybermen of course: humans surgically* converted into mind-controlled cyborg slaves, not the originals who were actually a militaristic alien species of cyborgs. So metas who fail their indoctrination are converted into organic power and control systems for the Praetorian Clockwork. As are any family members who opt to join their 'traveling' relatives.|
Originally Posted by Rodoan
*looks at thread title line*
*looks at Techbot Alpha* hmm...why do I get the feeling... so these Clockwork are Praetorian Cybermen? *whips up a hot cocoa; pulls up a chair* Interesting, tell me more... |
(Reminds me of a Changeling game where anyone who attracted the ire of the Redcaps 'went to Florida'. Or at least that's what we'd say whenever anyone asked, 'Whatever happened to _____?'
)*Basically the brain and possibly a few organs scooped out and installed into a cybernetic body to function as the computer system. Lots of controls to limit emotions and self-awareness. Cybermen who recover full awareness tend to go mad from the trauma and horror of what's been done to them.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
To respond to Techbot Alpha's concerns, yes, this is pure unadulterated speculation. One could almost say it's rampant.
Moving on.
Yes, the comparison to the modern Cybermen is very fitting. To recap, I'd speculate that the only reason why Emporer Cole allows Chimera to run a programme that has a 90% rate is because actually the scenario is a 100% boost to his control over the city. 10% of Supers get indoctrinated and become Tyrant's Super Minions. 90% don't make the grade but are nonetheless useful as being the lynchpin in his ability to make Praetoria the Utopia it is. I can't think of anything more totalitarian than to treat your populace like resources, so it fits his profile.
Whether these Praetorian Clockwork are ultimately created for Cole by Anti-Matter, Neuron, the Praetorian Clock King (or what that individual amounts to in this topsy-turvy world), isn't crucial to the remarkably evil nature of the overall scheme and doesn't really lesson it's impact story wise. If the Devs chose to stick with the hardline approach of keeping the Tina MacIntyre arc as canon and developing on that idea to have Anti-Matter and Neuron the creators of the Praetorian Clockwork then they'd keep fans of the arc happy and not have to retcon it's history and all that's involved there. If they decided to develop the Clockwork King character in Praetoria then they would naturally have a wealth of dystopian scenarios to play out involving discovery of such a plot.
Character origins are important turning points in any timeline and from what we know of Prime Earth's origins for the Clockwork King, the entity by that name only came into existance after a really brutal encounter with Blue Steel. So what have we learnt of there being any Praetorian Blue Steel? Where would his affiliations lie? Would he be in the Police? One of Cole's loyals? Is he that Clockwork over there compacting garbage?
I don't think there's been any word yet officially, but let's speculate.
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A Spanner In The Works Part One, ArcID: 336662, A Spanner In The Works Part Two, ArcID: 336665, Enter Japes, ArcID: 96001
In The Darkness Creeping, ArcID: 347709, When Dimensions Collide, ArcID: 412416.
I've been following the news coming out of HeroCon regarding Going Rogue avidly and just had a revelation. With Emporer Cole running an efficient empire, and Chimera's induction program for Supers running at a 10% success rate (mostly failing with loyalty issues), and the remaining 90% going "overseas" to never be seen again... just what do ya think Cole is doing? To me killing the failing 90% is the 'obvious' answer, but how grossly inefficient! Much better to put their powers to good use, in a controlled fashion.
Much has been said about the new Praetorian Clockwork, but very little about the Clockwork King himself. If the Clockwork King is subjegated to Emporer Cole in some fashion, then he would be capable of controlling the minds of Supers who didn't make the grade. With the economy of Prateoria behind him Emporer Cole would be able to create his army of Clockwork, but just like on Earth Prime in Paragon, the robots aren't what they appear to be at first glance.
What I'm saying is...
Praetorian Clockwork IS PEOPLE!!
K5K - The Killbot 5000
A Spanner In The Works Part One, ArcID: 336662, A Spanner In The Works Part Two, ArcID: 336665, Enter Japes, ArcID: 96001
In The Darkness Creeping, ArcID: 347709, When Dimensions Collide, ArcID: 412416.