New Archetypes


3dent

 

Posted

I thought of new Archetypes for Heroes and Villains. I always felt there was 1 missing.

Heroes could have the almost equivalent to the VEAT with attacks that can be say a mix of melee, ranged and traps. I've always fancied something that can shoot a bow, throw knives and do some punches and kicks or use a sword or something. Couple that with some leadership qualities and its a nice character to play. The combination of looking at a CO character with a sword on their back, knives strapped and firing a bow plus me playing a Paragon this morning has made me think that perhaps its something CoH can do with. A character that can use a bow, do some kicks and throw knives all in the same chain is the sort of thing I am ideally after. Ofc you can change that to fire pistols, do some punches and throw shurikens. I think with the right power tree you can surely have people mix it up with a variety of options such as crossbow even.

Villain side there is no shape shifter. Whilst the hero version is a kheldian a Villain version can shape shift into different human proportions. In different proportions they then take on different roles that can round a team off doing whatever role what archetype maybe missing from team. It certainly doesn't have to be shape shifting to an alien form so no new stuff. It could be going from normal size to huge or to incredible small and thin. Kind of like growth in a way and with the different sizes they can become more brutish, speedsterish or small and highly defensive and stalker like. A nice trick would be like in the brute form there is some absorbency so lets say instead of maneuvers offering defense they have the resistance equivalent or a pbaoe toggle that is -dam. That sort of thing could imply that the brute size is infact blocking aoe damage.

Either way I think their is enough in the box of what already exists to create them and could done right give something new for people to look forward too. I know its pointless me making up what powers they have because a balancing act is needed by the guy (Castle) whose paid to do that and would be better at it or maybe there would be a reason why it could not happen.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

No thanks. No new shiny things left half done.


 

Posted

Why not? Currently there is little in the way of bugs with both graphics and powersets and so when it comes to team resources its probably not going to take anything away from fixes to the present game that you and other people are after.

Actually, the only opinion this needs is that of a Developer especially when US server players outnumber europe players 10 - 1.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

Right a Character like Shannon described is in fact missing though it is one of the most popular concepts of comic history - most martial arts characters do have some kind of weapons or distance abilities, mentioning that I do like the idea of finnaly bringing shields into the game but I also do miss, the most popular way of using a shield in comics as I recall it meaning throwing the shield (like Captain America).
Otherwise could I imagine that it might also be enough to have a little extra abiliy for weapons for example with the fighter.
I also do kind of miss a shape changer - meaning like growing in size or form like Mr. Fantastic for example or Giant


 

Posted

I recon new ATs could shake things up pretty nicely and could add a fair bit to the amount of choice i would even go so far as to suggest the adding of more than 2 ATs tho not all at the same time.

Some personal ideas

Hero - Commander AT - would be a hero equivalent to a MM however more focus would be placed on the actual character as opposed to the pets and so things like the pet buffs would be replaced with additional attacks

Hero - spy ([censored] name i know) - these would have dominator secondaries as primaries and stalker secondaries they could also be given a version of the surveillance power as a inherent perhaps only usable from hide but it would do a greater degree of debuff.

Villain - Decimator - these would be kind of a Blaster AT for villains they would have blasts as primaries and armours as secondaries however to avoid out right tank mageness there would be debuff associated with some of there armours (think things liek -speed, -damage, -acc) so for example say energy/stone Decimator could become like a gun emplacement static but able to lay out a massive amount of fire power

Villain - Pack leader(think goblin queen, darkness) - another MM ish character for villains but would work differently Pack leader would instead make use of more beastal like pets and so wouldn't have control over them like a MM dose (think controller) there attacks and pet buffs would be replaced with melee attacks so for example

1.shadow punch
2.Summon zombie
3.smite
4.Shadow mall
5.Grave night
6.Siphon life
7.lich
8.Midnight grasp

they would use the armour sets for secondaries

Hero/villain - shape shifter - more a pipe dream really but it would be nice if we got a proper non epic AT shape shifters along the lines of beast boy perhaps primary could be the shape shifts with a mix of full shifts and partial shifts with a secondary more angled towards buffs

Hero/Villain - Inventor - Not sure if this could work or even how it could work and it would probably have to be some kind of unlocked AT my basic idea is that this would be a AT in the vain of character like forge you would build temp powers from salvage and these would take the form of attacks/buff/armours etc that you could then either use your self or give to other players. perhaps one set could be offensive in nature and another defensive in nature villains would have offence/defence and heroes would have defence/offence


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
I also do kind of miss a shape changer - meaning like growing in size or form like Mr. Fantastic for example or Giant

[/ QUOTE ]

Kheldians are fairly close, but the full-on WoW Druid type shiftery to make either a jack-of-all-ATs or a master-of-one would be quite cool.

Though that does bring to mind watching a Fire/Kin controller and his imps play scrapper for a team I was in last night. We christened his build a Scroller.


Blueside Union: Starblayde (Blaster), Pax Imperia (Tanker), Pax Britannia (Defender)
Redside Union: Natasha Redshade (Stalker)

 

Posted

Well the Hero EAT in Shannon's OP sounds like a good candidate for some kind of Longbow character, to me anyway. Do you go down the route of Spec Ops? (stealthier, lots of 'toys' - characterised by Crimson and Indigo) or Warden? (sturdier, a few pets - characterised by, well, Longbow Wardens ^^)

Spies/Rogues was something mentioned in passing (not confirmed as a possibility at all) a while ago - in the form of a random questionnaire thingy and also some kind of poll, although I forget when.

It was around the same time as ideas about Moonbases, Atlantis-style tilesets and Psychic Weaponry were being flung around.

Again, not as definite future projects but as a 'do you think these would be a good idea, players?' exercise.

Heroic MMs could be good BUT Controllers 'sort-of' do it anyway. Mercs could easily carry over as an Heroic Commander-style thing but what other 'minions' would you suggest? Actually, Robots could carry across too. Ninjas would be stretching it for me a little. Zombies and Thugs - definitely not!


 

Posted

As you said mercs and robots transition easily.

As do Ninjas i think there's nothing says ninjas are evil tho they do seem to get some bad press re skin them in a more heroic white and hey presto good ninjas.

Thugs could be reskined as some kind of minore heroes think group of low powered heroes banding together under strong leadership

Zombies are difficult However not impossible re skin them into spirits the think something like shaman king where the "commander" is able to call on his ancestors to aid him in battle


 

Posted

Longbow and Vigilante pets? Thinking along the lines of The Dark Knight's Batman wannabes who would give their right arm (and more) to fight alongside the dark knight.


Blueside Union: Starblayde (Blaster), Pax Imperia (Tanker), Pax Britannia (Defender)
Redside Union: Natasha Redshade (Stalker)

 

Posted

A mix it up (ie pistols, MA kicks and traps or Bow, Katana, throw knives) character with leaderships is missing. It is a common concept and it would happen to be one of those things that I would be looking to do if another game had it.

Shape shifting ie Growth, Absorbency like powers in Brute form to help the team, Stalker/Speedster like powers in small form (great solo) and in medium form they could be something along archery/traps lines.

Hero side: A power tree could be what makes some people select crossbow instead of pistols, bow, shurikens or knives. I kind of like the idea of a Swiss gun, a gun bit like a swiss army knife like the assault rifle in that it can fire off a different ammo except less. In melee you can select Broadsword, Katana, Martial Arts, Boxing, Streetfighting and then for survival you can have leadership skill and traps, perhaps that time bomb that people do get to detonate?

Villain side: Its a case of Large form , absorbency version of leadership powers in which case you lower damage from AoEs, you can be similar to Brutes yet not quite as good, plenty of KU and KB powers. Some attacks like a Brutes. Small form, you have similarities to the Stalker/Speedster but again not quite as good. Medium form you could be similar to that of a scrapper but again not quite as good. Each form like Khelds unlocks powers as it means you can take on a different fighting style.

Thats somit I would like to see but without saying anyone has to be from any faction because if you can be a little bit flexible it'll allow people to differ from eachother with their own concepts better..Somethings are universal. Like a top in the wardrobe going with any pair of shoes.

With the growth clearly when you make a costume the items have to be those that can fit to Male, Female and Huge Form. Growth may have to be with females a simple case of having proportions range to what you can scale from one extreme to another or they can scale characters on screen in height.


He will honor his words; he will definitely carry out his actions. What he promises he will fulfill. He does not care about his bodily self, putting his life and death aside to come forward for another's troubled besiegement. He does not boast about his ability, or shamelessly extol his own virtues. - Sima Qian.

 

Posted

I know this is a "Suggestions Thread" and I'm not trying to be rude but people shouldn't really put too much effort into introducing new powersets/ideas. We are still waiting for dual pistols since around 2007 when they were hinted at being done and hinted again in the speech in pocket D. Probably still looking at i19 before implementation if we go at the current trend of [censored] content in the issue updates.

Edit: No offense intended to OP or following posters just seriously [censored] off with the state of affairs at the moment


47 Month Vet
Main: Sullster: Level 51 STJ/SR Speedster

 

Posted

I think your missing the point of this forum section is called "Suggestions" and that's what were doing we realise that the suggestions will more than likely never happen but something its just nice to suggest something.


 

Posted

Well then I'm suggesting not to suggest.

Again like most suggestions its not going to happen but I'm just putting it out there.


47 Month Vet
Main: Sullster: Level 51 STJ/SR Speedster

 

Posted

I'd love to see a manipulator or stealth AT for heroes, as a stalker equivilent, or a sort of 'short ranged controller/defender'

Primary powers include stealth as a given, and mostly focus on enemy disorienting powers and melee/close-ranged attacks, but nothing as powerfull as stalkers.

Each primary set has one directly-player-controlled pet, which renders the player defenceless to attacks whilst used. The pet is similar to a traansformation for keldians, as you are given access solely to it's powers when used; mostly to be used for reconansence or distraction, although some could trade this out for ranged attacks.

Secondary powers focus on single-target buffs and a 'base creation'. - By this I mean powers which, whilst they can be used in combat, are more suited for creating bases away from the action for weak players to retire to, as well as unique powers such as recall points (see below).

Some examples could be;
(note; powersets under this are not complete, but just some examples of powers)

Primary; Cognative Suppression

Hide in plain sight
stealth

Sleep
close ranged power, sends target to sleep if effective. If it misses, your stealth is broken

Mind melting
medium psychic damage, melee range, short stun duration

Distract
Targeted AoE - Creates an imaginary target at the chosen location which continually taunts with a wide AoE untill it is destroyed

Trusting Touch
If effective, the target follows you and attacks anyone you attack for a short period of time, or just confuse in pvp

Trick of the mind
Pet spawn - Whilst in use, you are completly stationary, as it takes all your concentration to control the entity.
If the pet takes damage, your body doesn't, and the damage is relayed at melee distance to anyone directly behind it.

Powers; fast teleport, hover, Taunt (single target), Taunt (multiple targets), Psychic blast (knockback, no damage)


-----

Primary set - gadgets

Stealth Suit
Stealth

Tazer
Melee ranged, medium damage, stun

Stun Gun
Hold on a ranged target, low damage

Feign
Drops a copy of your dead body on the ground, placate in a large AoE

Spybot
Creates a pet spybot - Small in size making it hard to see (high stealth and defence) and very fast. Made of durable alloys (high health). Possible to allow it to walk on walls?
Powers; Super Leap, Laser beam (low damage weapon), Whistle (toggleable AoE taunt), Self destruct (aoe damage and knockback)

Possibly allow the spybot to use clickies and open doors?



--------------


Secondary Set; Defencive Fire

Enveloping Smog
+stealth and defence on selected ally

Firewall
Targeted AoE - Creates high flames around the edge of the ring which do damage and knock the enemies either out (if trying to get in) or inwards (if trying to get out)

Cauterizing Flames
Targeted +regen and +dmg(fire)

Pheonix's Nest
Creates a 'teleport to' point for yourself. On creation, gives you a small pop-up box with a single-use 'recall' button that you can activate as long as you are in radius (similar to recall friend's). The recall can be used when dead.

The nest can be destroyed by enemy attacks.


Campfire
Creates a small fire that has an AoE +regeneration and +def (cold) effect. Can be put out by enemy attacks, inc firefighter temp powers

Pheonix's call
Grants a 'recall' popup button to a targeted teammate, so long as you have a Pheonix Nest open. The power only has 5 recharges per nest opening.

The pheonix nest is upgraded to have a maximum of 3 uses before it vanishes, but any player, including the owner, can only use the recall once.

Using a pheonix call on a nest will upgrade it to ressurect the next dead person it transports - if used, the player comes back with half health, no endurance and power dampening for 5 seconds. An upgrade counts as a single use of the power.


-------------

Secondary Set: Dark Arts

Dark Armour
Applys the dark armour buff to an ally

Howling Winds
Targeted pbAoE, enemy Push/repel, knockback and knockup, ally hover, +def

Soul Sharing
Damages a targeted ally's target (provided it is an enemy) and heals the ally by an equivilent ammount

Grapple Point
Targeted AoE - Creates a small portol in the targeted location. The user and any allys in the AoE on creation get granted a temporary power; Dark Grapple.
Using this on an enemy - if successful - pulls both you and the enemy through the darkness and back to the portol, heavily damaging the target and healing the user. If unsuccessful, the user may still be teleported back


Undead guards
Self AoE - Summons 2 Zombie soldiers which cannot leave the AoE they were spawned in. They patrol the outer rim of the AoE, attacking anything that comes near enough.
The Zombies are armed with fast regeneration, swords, shields, and short-ranged Fear attacks. So long as the spell is working, the Guards will be automatically respawned at short intervals.

The AoE does not move after being created.

The power is inturuptable and has a heavy taunt effect whilst casting. As you are in the center of the spell, it should not be used in combat.


 

Posted

i still think dual guns is the thing to have, simply because we don't have that without minions to spoil the fun.

i do want to see a different kind of origin, 2 actually.
angel kind and demon kind, they sound like they should be magic, but to them it's not magic but rather a normal thing.
but because normal is way to much focused on human normal, it doesn't fit there ether.


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
i still think dual guns is the thing to have, simply because we don't have that without minions to spoil the fun.

i do want to see a different kind of origin, 2 actually.
angel kind and demon kind, they sound like they should be magic, but to them it's not magic but rather a normal thing.
but because normal is way to much focused on human normal, it doesn't fit there ether.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kheldian Peacebringers are Natural, by the way. And they're floating tentacles of energy! I don't consider that "human normal".

I think five origins, plus the NPC Incarnate origin is plenty. :3


Ideon's Paragonwiki page
Member of Paragon/Rogue Knights
Arc: 60092 - Supa Rumble in the Park
"Keep living the dream, and never let any jerk tell you what to do."
-- High-Roller

 

Posted

it doesnt have to be "Human Normal", just normal for whatever you are (Aliens for example).


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
i still think dual guns is the thing to have, simply because we don't have that without minions to spoil the fun.

i do want to see a different kind of origin, 2 actually.
angel kind and demon kind, they sound like they should be magic, but to them it's not magic but rather a normal thing.
but because normal is way to much focused on human normal, it doesn't fit there ether.

[/ QUOTE ]

Quoted from the Origin itself;

"You aren't 'super' at all; your amazing talents come from intense training and innate abilities. You might have been driven to physical excellence by some all-encompassing desire for perfection or revenge, or perhaps you are not human at all, and possess powers natural to your race. With your natural origin you have to rely on your cunning and skil."

I take it some people don't slot Reading these days?


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Originally Posted by Zwillinger View Post
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon View Post
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
i still think dual guns is the thing to have, simply because we don't have that without minions to spoil the fun.

[/ QUOTE ]

Only if one of the powers is a John Woo esque leaping to the side, firing both barrels like there's no tomorrow and sliding to a halt on the floor twenty yards away.


Blueside Union: Starblayde (Blaster), Pax Imperia (Tanker), Pax Britannia (Defender)
Redside Union: Natasha Redshade (Stalker)

 

Posted

And hopefully with some 'wibbly background' slow-mo stuff too... Okay, perhaps that's for a different game .

Does anyone think that Dual Pistols might be 'Gunslinger-ish' with a few 'special' bullets' btw? And the John-Woo thing too, natch.


 

Posted

The reason Jacen exists is becuase I wanted a gunslinger. John Woo FTW!
*leaps sidways off chair, injuring himself in the process. medic!*


 

Posted

Heroic MM would keep me happy for months!

I think the Devs said that they didn't quite fit thematicallky at some point, which I really don't get. Just call them Team Leaders or whatever. There's nothing un-heroic about leading a team.


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Heroic MM would keep me happy for months!

I think the Devs said that they didn't quite fit thematicallky at some point, which I really don't get. Just call them Team Leaders or whatever. There's nothing un-heroic about leading a team.

[/ QUOTE ]

Team Leaders?

Aren't those the terms huge corporations use for low level managers?

Team Leader hits you with Office Politics for 100 damage. You are confused.
Office Worker hits you with Paper Cut. You are bleeding.


 

Posted

Well, I once suggested a heroic MM here. It related to a MM a bit like corruptors are compared to defenders.

Ranged attack (or assault) primary, summon secondary (with buffs instead of attacks) and Rage that affecs pets and team instead of "heroic MM" himself. (but is gained by heroic MM's attacks.)


 

Posted

One AT I've always wanted but understand would be ruddy hard to program (I mean really hard, next to impossible infact under the current engine and would require a lot of work to get going) would be a shapeshifter that gains the powers of the mob types they defeat it would be similar pattern to an MM primary but they would lack a secondary (more on the reasons why later).

1) Personal attack.
1) First form slot.
2) Second personal attack.
6) Build Up (or Aim).
8) Third personal attack.
12) Second form slot.
18) Utility power.
26) Third form slot.
32) Fourth form slot form clickie.

As you defeat foes (perhaps linked to badges) each form slot can be assigned a specific mob form, the tougher the form, the more defeats required. 10 for a minion, 20 for a lt and 30 for a boss. The fourth slot would be an acception, any defeated mob can be put it that slot from minion to AVs/Heroes however it only has a 1 minute duration with a long recharge.

Each form (except the 4th) is a mutally exclusive toggle, like Granite in stone armor, you can't run other armors while it's running, you couldn't run more than one slot at a time. Each toggle could be slotted for acc/dam/end/defense/resistance. Selecting the 'form' for each slot would be a drop down menu of the available forms, the characters model would be replaced ala the Halloween costume temp powers.

So your first slot could be a Damned Hellion boss with access to the powers and hit points of the Damned.

So the shapeshifter would have access Flares, Fireball, Fire breath, Scorch, Incinerate and Combustion with a mild resistance to fire, effecitively turning them into a squishy fire/fire blaster. The enhancements slotting into the toggle would affect the powers used.

The second slot could be a Freakshow tank and decide to 3 slot it for Resistance giving them around 50% resistance to Smashing/Lethal, 60% resistance to cold but still suffer the -30% energy resistance. They would also have access to the powers. Sawblade, Tank Grenade, Cybernetic hammers, Handclap, Dull Pain and Revive.

By now it should be obvious why it's a one power set AT, the primary powerset, with the forms, can function as both a primary AND a secondary.

Yes I realise in order to get this I'd probably have to go create my own MMO but still it would be awesome.


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