All that excitement and the architect gets pushed back? Forgive me, but I'm calling you out on this. Your priorities are a little out of whack.
No, I do not need people defending Positrons' decision. NCNC can defend themselves very well. But am I the only one to point out that PvP simply isn't a meaningful reason why people play CoH?
Multiple builds may sound like a good idea, but this means buying up a whole new set of Enhancements. If you're allowed to share enhancements between them, fine, but IOs are very much speciality items. You'll have a lot of IOs which are useless in a second build. This means buying up a lot of IOs to properly manage two builds, driving this feature home as something to appeal only to the hardcore PvPer, who is already specced up for PvP.
The other features, I'm wary about, but only out of caution. This business about PvP rebalancing scares the bejesus out of me. They say they're going to re-do powers for the benefit of PvP, yet they have also said for years they don't want powers to function differently in PvE and PvP. You can't have it both ways, guys... you just put the fear of God into everyone (read: me) about what will happen to their powers. The last time we had a global rebalance for any reason was the Great Nerfs of I5, which demanded not just a respec, but a rethink on how people make their characters. Now you tell us changes are on the way just for PvP, then act all coy and hold back information? What changes?! This had better be good, guys.
The supergroup base changes are very welcome. The entry barrier to making a good base needs to be lowered so that everyone can use them.
It seems that they're more interested in making the most of features that they already have, making PvP and SG bases available to the masses. If this is their intention, I welcome it. But these changes are going to have to REALLY rock the boat to make this new Issue 13 anything less than a pale shadow of what it was. I mean, a set of story arcs for a zone that already exists, one new powerset (Pain Dom is empathy at its core, hardly new), more proliferation of existing sets, and a bunch of other small things is... well, it's small. There. I said it. I13 looks small.
If the changes to PvP and SG bases are SO large that they truly open them up to everyone and anyone, that will be well worth a single issue. But that's a very lofty goal. I need more details.
What the devs have done is disappoint everyone who wanted the architect, and not give enough information about what we're getting instead. C'mon, fellas. Take a long, hard look at what's in I13, without speculating as to what might be, or could be in there. New arcs, a new set, day jobs, PvP and SG base tweaks, Levelling Pact, and other things which fall into the realm of QoL stuff. An awful lot is riding on the PvP and SG side of things, and we know next to nothing about that.
We'll get more info 'in the coming weeks'. They said that a couple of weeks ago about the old I13, and after PAX there was a blackout. Forgive me if I'm a little bitter.
Necrobond - 50 BS/Inv Scrapper made in I1
Rickar - 50 Bots/FF Mastermind
Anti-Muon - 42 Warshade
Ivory Sicarius - 45 Crab Spider
Aber ja, nat�rlich Hans nass ist, er steht unter einem Wasserfall.
Well they kept the stuff I wanted and added more to it so I am looking forward to I13, was thinking of taking a break for a while but will probably do that around I14 time unless they add something to that which interests me
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
[ QUOTE ]
I assume the level pact means that you can only earn XP when your friend is online and then only at the same rate. I'd suggest you might have to be in the same team for this to work too.
The people crying about someone being power leveled to 50 without logging on is frankly stupid.
Common sense isn't as common as it used to be I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]
The whole point of that is that both chars DONT need to be online.
[ QUOTE ]
I assume the level pact means that you can only earn XP when your friend is online and then only at the same rate. I'd suggest you might have to be in the same team for this to work too.
The people crying about someone being power leveled to 50 without logging on is frankly stupid.
Common sense isn't as common as it used to be I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny post. I laughed. I cried. I laughed again.
I believe that I may be the person you describe as 'crying about someone being power leveled to 50'.. I actually posed the question would it be possible..?
No crying involved.
The announcement about the Level Pact states have your XP be permanently in sync, whether both characters are online or not. You will always be the same level, even if your buddy plays ten times more often than you do!
So you do not need both characters online to take advantage of it. And my common sense seems to suggest that it wouldn't be implemented by penalising the player who can play more often...
So that seems to leave open the possibility of levelling a character whilst not playing them.
I know that common sense is anything but common. It would appear that comprehension isn't as widespread as I'd once hoped.
Good job that even though I'm 'frankly stupid' I'm still not stupid enough to get wound up by imbecillic trolls...
By my mohawk shall ye know me!
my toons
Funny: Ee-Ai-Ee-Ai-Oh! #3662 * The foul-mouthed Handyman! #1076 * City of Norms #132944
Serious: To Save A Single World (#83744) * Marketing Opportunity (#83747)
The problem i have with this system is i cant start a lvl pact with my 50 and a new toon, as to me it would seem you have to make TWO new toons to start a pact and thats just not PL, shame to as it would have made my life a wee bit better if i didnt have to have the toon on i was PL-ing ah well maybe next update
[ QUOTE ]
What the devs have done is disappoint everyone who wanted the architect, and not give enough information about what we're getting instead. C'mon, fellas. Take a long, hard look at what's in I13, without speculating as to what might be, or could be in there. New arcs, a new set, day jobs, PvP and SG base tweaks, Levelling Pact, and other things which fall into the realm of QoL stuff. An awful lot is riding on the PvP and SG side of things, and we know next to nothing about that.
[/ QUOTE ]
(my emphasis)
Judging by the general comments on the two threads (and Ive not looked at the US boards yet) Id say that very few people are interested in these two things and everything is riding on the other stuff in the issue.
[ QUOTE ]
The problem i have with this system is i cant start a lvl pact with my 50 and a new toon, as to mean it would seem you have to make TWO new toons to start a pact and thats just not PL, shame to as it would have made my life a wee bit better if i didnt have to have the toon on i was PL-ing ah well maybe next update
[/ QUOTE ]
Dont tell lies you wanted a pact with 4 chars attatched to your 50 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
What the devs have done is disappoint everyone who wanted the architect, and not give enough information about what we're getting instead. C'mon, fellas. Take a long, hard look at what's in I13, without speculating as to what might be, or could be in there. New arcs, a new set, day jobs, PvP and SG base tweaks, Levelling Pact, and other things which fall into the realm of QoL stuff. An awful lot is riding on the PvP and SG side of things, and we know next to nothing about that.
[/ QUOTE ]
(my emphasis)
Judging by the general comments on the two threads (and Ive not looked at the US boards yet) Id say that very few people are interested in these two things and everything is riding on the other stuff in the issue.
[/ QUOTE ]
What else is left, if not these tweaks? If the PvP and SG base side of things is as small as you assume, this is a damn slim issue. And I'm not just saying that because it doesn't have the architect.
Really, making PvP and SG bases popular might just be their intention.
Necrobond - 50 BS/Inv Scrapper made in I1
Rickar - 50 Bots/FF Mastermind
Anti-Muon - 42 Warshade
Ivory Sicarius - 45 Crab Spider
Aber ja, nat�rlich Hans nass ist, er steht unter einem Wasserfall.
In all honesty, it doesn't really mention anything about the way that xp is gained.. I mean, if one is online, do they level as normal and the offline one earns xp to match? Or do the online one, not gain xp at all (Which would make you a tad redundant in one afternoon of play at low levels!)?
@Wolfybane
-Defiant Server-
H: Wolfsbane(50 MA/ReGen), Orthoclase(50 Stone/Axe), Dreamhunter (50 Ill/Storm)
Daybreak(50 Fire/Kin) Tygrrforce (50 Hooman PB), Tygrrstryke(50 NRG/NRG), EbonWolf(50 WS)
V: Spektor(50 Spiddy)
[ QUOTE ]
The problem i have with this system is i cant start a lvl pact with my 50 and a new toon, as to me it would seem you have to make TWO new toons to start a pact and thats just not PL, shame to as it would have made my life a wee bit better if i didnt have to have the toon on i was PL-ing ah well maybe next update
[/ QUOTE ]
I've never PL'd, but if you do I'd guess that the fast way to level 2 characters is:
- create the two characters
- create the level pact asap
- and then only ever play one of the characters and play them in a conventional PL team (so get SK'd to your bridge for farms)
Two people could even do this for each other, so:
- player A and B both have 2 characters (A1,A2 and B1,B2).
- A1 has a pact with B2; and A2 has a pact with B1
- both players play there 1st or 2nd characters together (possibly in farm teams) - so A1 and B1 or A2 and B2 play at any one time.
btw I'd have thought it possible that the devs put some form of limit on this, maybe something like breaking the pact if one character doesn't log whilst the other gains 10 levels. But I dare say that even if they do, there will be low pain ways to avoid the limit.
But then... what does anyone really care if it can be abused?
The people who would abuse it (in some people's eyes) are the same people who'd PL anyway. Players who actually enjoy playing/levelling their characters aren't going to suddenly stop and become level-pact PL'ers.
By my mohawk shall ye know me!
my toons
Funny: Ee-Ai-Ee-Ai-Oh! #3662 * The foul-mouthed Handyman! #1076 * City of Norms #132944
Serious: To Save A Single World (#83744) * Marketing Opportunity (#83747)
I welcome all these additions, people seem to forget that all this IS free and any addition is always a good thing. Devs workin very hard to keep the game new, up to date and interesting. GRATZ
@Wedge
50's
Wedge Inv/Fire Tank
Wedge NG Bs /Regen Scrapper
White Wedge Bot/Dark MM
Fire Wedge SS /Fire Brute
Rad Wedge Ill/Rad Controller
Fire Wedge Fire/Kin Controller
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I assume the level pact means that you can only earn XP when your friend is online and then only at the same rate. I'd suggest you might have to be in the same team for this to work too.
The people crying about someone being power leveled to 50 without logging on is frankly stupid.
Common sense isn't as common as it used to be I guess.
[/ QUOTE ]
Funny post. I laughed. I cried. I laughed again.
I believe that I may be the person you describe as 'crying about someone being power leveled to 50'.. I actually posed the question would it be possible..?
No crying involved.
The announcement about the Level Pact states have your XP be permanently in sync, whether both characters are online or not. You will always be the same level, even if your buddy plays ten times more often than you do!
So you do not need both characters online to take advantage of it. And my common sense seems to suggest that it wouldn't be implemented by penalising the player who can play more often...
So that seems to leave open the possibility of levelling a character whilst not playing them.
I know that common sense is anything but common. It would appear that comprehension isn't as widespread as I'd once hoped.
Good job that even though I'm 'frankly stupid' I'm still not stupid enough to get wound up by imbecillic trolls...
[/ QUOTE ]
First of all - apologies if I caused any offense, I was writing in response to the many replies on the US forum rather than this thread. I guess my language was exceptionally harsh and probably way too provocative.
As for the "common sense", I'd think that in order to give a character not logged on more XP, they'd need to update that accounts details. Are they likely to do that when the person isn't online? What if hes online but on another character? What is that accounts subscription lapses? Are we going to see a system where someone creates a character then cancels their subscription, only to come back when they've automatically been leveled to 50?
I'd imagine that practical consideration has been put into the system before they built it. The thought of an account being modified or updated when not logged in seems an absurdity to me. Perhaps my viewpoint differs greatly from the norm - in which case I can only apologise.
I guess I'll wait and see how its implemented, I could well be totally wrong - thats not unheard of. In which case I have been profoundly stupid and guilty of jumping to conclusions....
[ QUOTE ]
people seem to forget that all this IS free and any addition is always a good thing
[/ QUOTE ]
Free is great, but i cant help thinking the time is drawing near when a paid for expansion that really is big would be good.
Maybe give 50s something to do etc. There are a lot of people that have come to the end of the road with rolling new chars, new power sets are great but its the same old slog without new content.
[ QUOTE ]
What else is left, if not these tweaks? If the PvP and SG base side of things is as small as you assume, this is a damn slim issue. And I'm not just saying that because it doesn't have the architect.
[/ QUOTE ]
Of the new things that have been announced most people in these threads seem to be very interested in the Levelling Pact and the Multiple Builds, and there were a lot of people getting bouncy about the Day Jobs when they were originally announced.
Thats what led me to think they were the most popular things. I havent seen that many comments about the PvP stuff, nor about the SG Base stuff.
[ QUOTE ]
Really, making PvP and SG bases popular might just be their intention.
[/ QUOTE ]
The only thing that is going to make the SG Bases half good, and therefore grab the interest of the masses, is to make the editor easy to use and actually able to accomplish something. IMO that will (hopefully ) come with the Architect issue.
[ QUOTE ]
The only thing that is going to make the SG Bases half good, and therefore grab the interest of the masses, is to make the editor easy to use and actually able to accomplish something.
[/ QUOTE ]
Absolutely, or if they cant manage a new builder, at least add an off map storage area for base items while you edit.
[ QUOTE ]
Of the new things that have been announced most people in these threads seem to be very interested in the Levelling Pact and the Multiple Builds, and there were a lot of people getting bouncy about the Day Jobs when they were originally announced.
Thats what led me to think they were the most popular things. I havent seen that many comments about the PvP stuff, nor about the SG Base stuff.
[ QUOTE ]
Really, making PvP and SG bases popular might just be their intention.
[/ QUOTE ]
The only thing that is going to make the SG Bases half good, and therefore grab the interest of the masses, is to make the editor easy to use and actually able to accomplish something. IMO that will (hopefully ) come with the Architect issue.
[/ QUOTE ]
The Levelling Pact is very swish, but as a feature it isn't very big. Nor are day jobs, even though I quite like the idea.
And you're right about SG bases, the problem is we don't know what we're getting.
Necrobond - 50 BS/Inv Scrapper made in I1
Rickar - 50 Bots/FF Mastermind
Anti-Muon - 42 Warshade
Ivory Sicarius - 45 Crab Spider
Aber ja, nat�rlich Hans nass ist, er steht unter einem Wasserfall.
[ QUOTE ]
I welcome all these additions, people seem to forget that all this IS free and any addition is always a good thing. Devs workin very hard to keep the game new, up to date and interesting. GRATZ
[/ QUOTE ]
Free is always good but are we getting anything to give the game life, i now have one of every AT at 50 plus many more at 50 of the same AT with different powers i have done EVERY mission on both coh and cov more than once infact loads more than once so waht more is there to gain from starting at lvl 1 again, so for me there is little left to do. A paid for update like WoW gets would imo be worth it if we got the same kind of NEW content that they do
[ QUOTE ]
First of all - apologies if I caused any offense, I was writing in response to the many replies on the US forum
[/ QUOTE ]
I thought it a bit odd.. must admit that I didn't consider looking at the US forums on this yet. Even with pure speculation the signal to noise ratio is normally better in the EU...
[ QUOTE ]
I'd imagine that practical consideration has been put into the system before they built it. The thought of an account being modified or updated when not logged in seems an absurdity to me. Perhaps my viewpoint differs greatly from the norm - in which case I can only apologise.
[/ QUOTE ]
I wonder if the characters will be updated whilst you're offline, or whether the character accrues xp and is actually awarded it when you log in (much as vets rewards are received when you log the character in, even if the reward was actually 'earnt' weeks ago)
I'd guess that some system must have been worked out for the similar awarding of job-time.
And I'm trying to remember if an offline xp-boost was talked about by devs or merely speculated on by players...
Either way I'd guess that it'll be the same system in place for awarding the job time and xp gains (through level pacts) to characters.
There's been a few times in the past that people have spotted doom in a proposed system, and generally it's all come good in the end. Inventions comes to mind as the last biggy. That even showed ED to have been a reasonable idea, just implemented in a cart before horse manner...
I still think that the devs generally try to do the best for the game and know that a couple of its big strengths are the ease of teaming and casual-friendliness. However they implement the level pact I can't see them doing anything to seriously upset those strengths - and if they inadvertently do then I'd guess we'd see a patch PDQ.
The reason the level pact got an initial 'hhhhmmm...' from me is that I fully expect some sort of conditions to apply. The devil may be in the details with this one.
By my mohawk shall ye know me!
my toons
Funny: Ee-Ai-Ee-Ai-Oh! #3662 * The foul-mouthed Handyman! #1076 * City of Norms #132944
Serious: To Save A Single World (#83744) * Marketing Opportunity (#83747)
"Day Jobs (Offline Character Progression)"
I must admit this idea intrigues me and could be interesting.
Multiple Builds
This is good news and I must admit is something I would quite like for my characters.
New Powersets
Shields Meh, really doesnt appeal to me at all and is so un-herolike its untrue unless you can have one like Sue Storm rather than Roman ones
Pain Domination Looking forward to villainside finally having something like Empathy.
Levelling Pact
This is so open to abuse its untrue. The whole point of playing is to level and grow with your characters, but I guess farmers win out yet again, they dont even have to log on now. This is a BAD idea.
The Merit Rewards System
This again could be interesting as long as they dont [censored] up the economy any more than it already is. Hopefully though, it could mean getting some purples occasionally. I play every night and yet have only had 3 since December.
Villain Patron Power Respec
While in one way its good news, its also a bit pointless as most of the villain patron powers suck bigtime as they dont follow on from your powers like heroside.
Supergroup Base Repricing
Again, while good for people pricewise, maybe a little variation to be able to make bases other than magic or tech would be nice, or even your own private lair.
PvE and PvP Powers Rebalancing
Cant help thinking "Nerf"
New Cimerora Missions, Invention Origin Sets, new Costume Sets, Zone Refinements, always good.
Although the Devs have done this, considering they said "over the next few weeks we will reveal more" means that it isnt even going to test for weeks, so how they reckon it is earlier than expected I dont know as we are already well overdue for an issue.
As for the Mission creator, I couldnt care less as it really does not appeal to me in the slightest, though it does seem to mean that I14 is something for me not to look forward to, so I will have to wait till next Summer for I15 instead.
Zhaan, Chakyra, Fiorina 161, Aeryn, Polly Nation, Dee Pression, Shazanne, Night Jester and too many more to mention.
Network Hell 47640
Valley of the Harpies 74519
Green and Pleasant Land 75966
[ QUOTE ]
Then i would have to ask where is the prof that player feedback has forced this change as in the past player feedback has NOT change the outcome of updates or changes made by the devs.
[/ QUOTE ]
If the devs stating player feedback changed it, there's not an awful lot else which will convince you. 
[ QUOTE ]
*snip* Forgive me if I'm a little bitter.
[/ QUOTE ]
Why do people always start ranting without properly reading all the information? (No, you don't need to answer that.)
This should take out a big part of your bitternes. From Positron:
(emphasis mine)
[ QUOTE ]
PvE and PvP Powers Rebalancing: Floyd Castle Grubb and the powers designers have been hard at work in finding ways to strike a better balance between the many powers in the game. The scope of what they are doing is too broad to go into details here, but were very excited and well share more information soon. Suffice to say we know that you dont want your PvE powers adjusted because of how they play in PvP, so were taking a new tact in power balancing with Issue 13.
[/ QUOTE ]
@True Metal
Co-leader of Callous Crew SG. Based on Union server.
[ QUOTE ]
The Levelling Pact is very swish, but as a feature it isn't very big. Nor are day jobs, even though I quite like the idea.
[/ QUOTE ]
I was kind of just going by what other people are getting excited about, rather than what seemed big, as Im not that excited about these either. Heck, I didnt see any point in the veteran non-combat pet awards until I got them, and then I found they were so much fun to have a round (and I dont roleplay ).
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The only thing that is going to make the SG Bases half good, and therefore grab the interest of the masses, is to make the editor easy to use and actually able to accomplish something.
[/ QUOTE ]
Absolutely, or if they cant manage a new builder, at least add an off map storage area for base items while you edit.
[/ QUOTE ]
I can't do magic desks, but I would so like to be able to stack items. (Now that I have to wait until April I'll go try again with the stacking. )
I keep thinking that if they (the Devs) have some program that allows people to create a series of rooms (on different levels), then lets people access that area via doorway or portal (or maybe an updated login screen) then why cant that be a SG base instead of a mission?
(See how optimistic I am. Crazy really. )
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
*snip* Forgive me if I'm a little bitter.
[/ QUOTE ]
Why do people always start ranting without properly reading all the information? (No, you don't need to answer that.)
This should take out a big part of your bitternes. From Positron:
(emphasis mine)
[ QUOTE ]
PvE and PvP Powers Rebalancing: Floyd Castle Grubb and the powers designers have been hard at work in finding ways to strike a better balance between the many powers in the game. The scope of what they are doing is too broad to go into details here, but were very excited and well share more information soon. Suffice to say we know that you dont want your PvE powers adjusted because of how they play in PvP, so were taking a new tact in power balancing with Issue 13.
[/ QUOTE ]
[/ QUOTE ]
But not changing pve powers is one thing but changing them for pvp will still make people think nerf, as what the devs think is "balance" is sometimes far from what the players think.
I assume the level pact means that you can only earn XP when your friend is online and then only at the same rate. I'd suggest you might have to be in the same team for this to work too.
The people crying about someone being power leveled to 50 without logging on is frankly stupid.
Common sense isn't as common as it used to be I guess.