Best team support Controller

Hello All

I'm looking to make a controller or defender with a focus on team support. I've been given plenty of info on the def thread and now I'm asking the same question here. So what power combinations would you say work best in support of a team?

Thanks

Battleflag

Mind/Kin, Possibly Earth/Kin.

You're a star Max! Thanks again.

BF

Mind and Earth have oodles of control. So I'd go with one of them. Mind is probably a little sneakier and less aggro-prone due to Confuses & a lack of AOE Immob (which tend to get you squished at low levels). Mind also does more damage, a lot of which is Psychic. However a fair few of Minds control powers are ineffective or resisted by later enemies (stupid Nemises), including Terrorise & Confuse / Mass confusion (needs two applications to confuse a Nemises minion). Also Psy damage is poor against most robots (bar clockwork) & zombies. Mind is also a little poor at setting up AOE Containment (not really a concern for a support until the 40s possibly). You can AOE Sleep but you only get one "batch" of containment damage. Plus your teamies may feck it up on you.

Earth seems a stronger "lockdown" set and you get Mr Poo as a pet eventually. The damage pre-pet is probably less though, and Smashing / Lethal. But again, a Support char won't suffer too much from that. The seconary effect of Earth is -defence to those hit by it, which could work well with the secondary.

For secondaries Empathy is the obvious support set. But Mr Poo, the Earth Pet, would love Kinetics Speed boost, as will teamies, and Kin powers are mostly to-hit (you need to hit a mob with them) so the -def of Earth synergises well with it. Plus Kin has the most powerful Melee heal going, with the drawback that it needs to hit to work.

FF & Sonic shields are options too but for Controllers they mightn't be the best option, the buffs aren't that powerful.

So I'd say Earth / Kin probably, or Earth / Emp if you don't fancy Kin.

This is a certainly a tricky question. In terms of primaries, I would say that Earth, Mind and Ice offer very nice AoE control if that's what you're looking for. Fire offers extra damage which is also a type of "control", Gravity is a nice compromise between control and damage, and even Illusion (which is arguably the most solo-friendly) has some very team-friendly powers (e.g. Phantom Army, Group Invis). For secondaries, I would say that all are team-friendly in different ways, it really depends on your playstyle and what you enjoy doing on a team. Obvious choices are /empathy /kin or /FF, and even if some secondaries are solo-friendly (like /rad), they are all very useful in teams (some, like /sonic, are really mainly useful in teams).

I would recommend having a look at this guide to help you decide what troller is best for you.

AoE control, nothing like Illu/Rad IMO

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AoE control, nothing like Illu/Rad IMO

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Ever seen a good Earth/Rad or Earth/Storm in action?

Flash and Spectral Terror vs. Stone Cages, Quicksand, Salt Crystals, Stalagmites, Earthquake, Volcanic Gasses.

It really depends on what you mean by 'support'.

If you want a powerset that causes absolute mayhem in the enemy ranks (Deceive, Phantom Army, Spectral Terror) - whilst providing great support (Transfusion, Transference, Fulcrum Shift etc) go for Illusion / Kinetic.

IMHO the most fun controller powerset to play

Personally I consider Illusion to be quite bad control wise, it's good to absorb the alpha strike though. If you want the best control take earth/storm (radiation is close though).

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AoE control, nothing like Illu/Rad IMO

[/ QUOTE ]I very rarely laugh at stuff I read online, but...Illu, good AoE control? What are you smoking and where can I get some?

If you are looking at a "Team" character simply stuff as many AoE powers in as possible. This includes AoE buffs, or buffs that recharge so quickly they may as well be AoE (like speed boost, bubbles, sonic bubbles).

So it partly depends on what powers you pick rather than what sets.

Looking at the potential for AoE, for instance...

Earth does very well indeed (only 2 single targets effects, although pet is largely single target damage)...

Ice does suprisingly well aswell - the same as earth...

Fire pretty good too - the same as earth...

Mind does pretty well (4 single target effects - dominate, hypnotise, confuse, levitate)...

Grav okish (4 single target effects and pet)

Illusion poor (3 single target powers, 3 pets all with largely single target effects)


As regards to secondaries...

Bah count 'em up yourself!

Interestingly, empaths come out with least potential number of AoE powers of the lot.




Only worth considering. There is more to it than AoE. But in largish teams (5+) AoE is king, and if you plan to be in large teams regularly, the more AoE you can stuff in the better.

Earth/Storm is great for teaming as you have many, many tools to keep your foes occupied.


Mind would be another great primary.


@Cognito, Fire and Ice control do not have the same capabilites as Earth for controlling! Ice is more closer to Earth, but I'd say Earth tops them all for control.

Id agree with you that Earth tops the lot for "control" (maybe alongside mind)

However, we are talking "support". Some of the Fire / Ice powers debuff/damage - not control, but great support.

If you want control Earth and Mind top of my list.

If you want "Support" and AoE effects, Ice and Fire up there with Earth.

However, fires "Bonfire"... hmmm... AoE... but pants most of the time

As for Storm - this has only one single target effect iirc? 02 boost?. I suppose Lightning Storm probably counts as mainly single target effects. Probably the highest AoE potential of any controller secondary (/Rad and /Dark have only one-ish aswell? - Mutate, Petrifying Gaze, Fluffy - I think thats it). So i'd def be with you on the storm side of things.

(Empaths... i think its 6single target effects... heal other, absorb pain, clear mind, fortitude, rez, adrenaline boost ..... yuk yuk yuk! )

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Probably the highest AoE potential of any controller secondary (/Rad and /Dark have only one-ish aswell? - Mutate, Petrifying Gaze, Fluffy - I think thats it).

[/ QUOTE ]Since when is dark a troller secondary?

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Id agree with you that Earth tops the lot for "control" (maybe alongside mind)

However, we are talking "support". Some of the Fire / Ice powers debuff/damage - not control, but great support.



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Righto, I understand you better now.

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AoE control, nothing like Illu/Rad IMO

[/ QUOTE ]I very rarely laugh at stuff I read online, but...Illu, good AoE control? What are you smoking and where can I get some?

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Well an illu rad can have easily bug man teams aggro under control forever, and if you are teaming with some crazy leroy (aka fire-blaster-yay-I-love-fire-rain) can control pretty much safely 2 or even 3 mobs that size.
PA, EM Pulse, and a quick ST+debuffs combo make that possible... which is something no other troller i have come across can do. Can you, Max?

Mind can layer mass confusion, terrify, total dom, and still have levitate, mes and dom to control singles and TK and Mass hypno to take care of extra spawns. That's WAY more stuff than illu has.

Mind has that illu lacks: TK, sleep(AoE and ST) and AoE confussion. Illu has that mind lacks: PA (IMO better than all the stuff said about mind) which can take the aggro of an 8-man team and invisibility for all, which allows that tanks and only tanks get attacked (if there isnt, just PA then)
I didn't say that Illu had more stuff, what I think is that Illu has better stuff.

Anyway I know I'm not going to change your opinion, and you are not going to change mine, but what is sad is that you try and laugh at someone just because his opinion doesnt match yours

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Probably the highest AoE potential of any controller secondary (/Rad and /Dark have only one-ish aswell? - Mutate, Petrifying Gaze, Fluffy - I think thats it).

[/ QUOTE ]Since when is dark a troller secondary?

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Excellent point, well made...

Id still have to say that Illusion is, in my opinion, weak at control.

It also has very poor AoE capability compared to the other control sets - single target powers of spectral wounds, blind, greater invisibility - with Pet and Spectral Terror - all pets with largely Single Target Ability (Phantom Army
should probably at a push be considered AoE due to taunt ability).

Guess what - easiest controller to solo (suprise suprise with all those single target powers)...

I think as MaX said, Mind has the best capacity of any controller for "Control" - i.e. stopping the enemy doing anything... with TK, Confuse x2, Sleep x2, Fear, Dominate x2. In fact, it really has only one non-control power - levitate.

In terms of pure "Control" one would have to say - literrally, that Illusion is weak and Mind is strong - IF you take a narrow and precise view of what control is.


If you are looking at AoE effects - actually neither come out particularly well. Mind slightly ahead.

earth/storm earth/rad earth/Kin

fire/rad fire/kin
fire has good aoe controls and awsome damage

Try /TA. you might like it... Imo with earth or ice as primary. Lacks buffs and heals but very big in slows and massive control topped of with not a so strong but very versatile and nifty arsenal of debuffing.
Certainly interesting to play!

Personally if I was starting up a new troller I would do ?/rad. Why? As a bet against the future. Could be I bet wrong, but that is the way I would go. What do I base this bet on? Recluse Strike Force (RSF).

Come I9 Statesman's Task Force (STF) should be here. If it has lvl 54 AVs, rads will be welcomed opened armed into teams. I personally hope the task Force is designed differently so that some powersets aren't seen as gimped, for doing it with, by many players. However, if they don't have so many tough AVs players on CoV may complain that STF is to easy compared to RSF.

Primary may be important, but more in terms of your playstyle than actual choice. Don't think there is a bad or good choice in the primaries except at certain lvls. If you solo a lot Illusion is hard at the lowest lvls owing to lack of attacks compared to powersets such as gav. However, Ilusion does solo well enough at high lvls (slows down between PA recharges though). Illusion is good for ghosting missions with invis. The other good thing about Illusion control is it has many "fire and forget powers" leaving you to concentrate elsewhere, eg send your PA into the spawn ahead and forget about them. Also with Illusion you can deceive those dreaded sappers, turning them on their allies.

In conclusion I would recommend a primary controller powerset that suits your playstyle with rad secondary. To demonstrate how significantly some players are taking the potential benefit of rads on any STF I can tell you that in my SG we have players who are/going to, lvl rads just for it. Of course it depends how much you want this toon to take part in a STF, and how they design it. Could be I bet wrong!

Paragon Girl

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Id still have to say that Illusion is, in my opinion, weak at control.

It also has very poor AoE capability compared to the other control sets - single target powers of spectral wounds, blind, greater invisibility - with Pet and Spectral Terror - all pets with largely Single Target Ability (Phantom Army
should probably at a push be considered AoE due to taunt ability).

Guess what - easiest controller to solo (suprise suprise with all those single target powers)...

I think as MaX said, Mind has the best capacity of any controller for "Control" - i.e. stopping the enemy doing anything... with TK, Confuse x2, Sleep x2, Fear, Dominate x2. In fact, it really has only one non-control power - levitate.

In terms of pure "Control" one would have to say - literrally, that Illusion is weak and Mind is strong - IF you take a narrow and precise view of what control is.


If you are looking at AoE effects - actually neither come out particularly well. Mind slightly ahead.

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A couple of things... The OP isn't asking about the best "control" set. It was support he asked about.

As far as the Illusion set goes... Spectral Terror is not single target. It's an AoE and a good one at that, if deployed in the right position.

I also see no mention of Flash... another AoE power in the Illusion set that will stop a mob dead in it's tracks.

Of course I'm not saying that Illusion is the best 'control' set but it has good AoE qualities to go along with it's excellent single target attacks.

I'm not even counting the fact that Phantasm can (and does) summon up to 2 decoys of itself to further 'support' a team.

So..... With a deployment chain of Phantom army - Spectral Terror - Flash - Phantasm - Deceive and Blind.... I can assure you that the mob is going nowhere in a hurry, allowing your team mates to pick them off.

This is why stated that Illusion (particularly with Kinetics) was a good 'support' controller set.

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AoE control, nothing like Illu/Rad IMO

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Damn straight. So much sweet soft control.
Only real problem about illu is the lack of posibilities to gain containment. In the pure control department however its prolly the best.