Most Underperforming Powersets.

[ QUOTE ]
And creative players can make the so-called underperforming powers performing better by slotting set IOs.

My Invul/SS tanker has 3 Acc/Dmg/Rch ( mixed sets ) and 1 Touch of Death Negative Dmg, 1 Perfect Zinger Psi Dmg and 1 Mako Lethal slotted into Jab ,Punch and Haymaker. With Rage going on, Accuracy is less relevant and they do hit consistently and apply mixed types of dmg. These are fast recharging attacks, i just leave jab on Autofire and can cycle it with Punch and Haymaker like forever. I throw a KO bLow here and there when its available and Footstomp weakens everything that is around me.

SS definetely can get the job done. Maybe it cant compare to scrappers but it sure isnt in any worst shape than other tanker secondaries. Is Rage necessary to leverage the whole thing? Maybe so but again, i rarely even hit Rage when im just soloing. I do not really need it unless fighting very tough enemies or ones with high defenses like Rikti Drones.

YMMV i guess but i am very happy with my character and he is a blast to play.

Edit: To be more clear, all my three attacks have 3 procs in them, so its 9 procs that are cycling kinda fast since Jab and Punch are up very quick ( I have Hasten also which make the whole even faster when needed ).


[/ QUOTE ]

And the truly creative player is the one who uses their IO slotting and slotted procs to argue that Super Strength doesn't have any issues. SS, numerically, has issues when Rage isn't taken into account (it was proven in this very thread). The set is balanced around Rage. This is a fact. I'd find the dev post, but I'm lazy and it's probably purged by now anyway.

IOs are not the metric we should be using to balance/compare what defines an "underperforming set". This is the problem that everyone needs to get over: realizing that an average set with IOs is still an average set.

[ QUOTE ]
Stone Armor for Tanks: Survivability is thrown around like confetti hero side, and Stoners basically take crippling buff in exchange guaranteed survivability. Considering how frequently the extra survivability is overkill, I feel sorry for the non-irl stoners.

Mind Control: The lack of an AoE immobolize/stun means it's pain to set domination for AoE attacks. Furthermore when purple out your mind troll, you can stop groups every minute with Total Domination and Mass Confusion. Fire Control on the other hand can stop groups nearly as well with Flashfire and cages about every 45 seconds using just SO's. Mind Control really just seems to suffer in the post-io world.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, depends of the situation. I get lot more mileage from Mind Control than Fire Control when i am doing LRSF, ITF and LGTF. If you are not into farms all the time, Mind Control shines alot more than Fire Control IMHO. And i feel lot more safe with confusion and rarely resisted sleep powers that last very long than with only having Char as a fast spamming hold ( others are mostly aoes and on long recharge ). With Mind you get Dominate and Sleep and Confuse which are like up and ready fire all the time.

[ QUOTE ]

IOs are not the metric we should be using to balance/compare what defines an "underperforming set". This is the problem that everyone needs to get over: realizing that an average set with IOs is still an average set.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, but I find Super Reflexes, SOs only, to be an average set. Arcanaville's comparison of scrapper secondaries pre-IOs found it to be average at best, at the time it was one of the worst.

With IOs, SR is borderline overpowered. Some sets (electric armor, for example) benefit dramatically less from IOs.

Dispari, I agree that early levels SR is weaker than most. Weaker than regen or WP in particular, comparable IMO to dark and electric as a scrapper/brute secondary. With SOs it becomes good, very good paired with BS/Kat/DM. With IOs it becomes ridiculous.

If you didn't like leveling a lowbie SR, I expect you'd hate leveling a lowbie Blood Widow. Less defense and fewer hit points until you're about ready to branch.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

IOs are not the metric we should be using to balance/compare what defines an "underperforming set". This is the problem that everyone needs to get over: realizing that an average set with IOs is still an average set.

[/ QUOTE ]

OK, but I find Super Reflexes, SOs only, to be an average set. Arcanaville's comparison of scrapper secondaries pre-IOs found it to be average at best, at the time it was one of the worst.

With IOs, SR is borderline overpowered. Some sets (electric armor, for example) benefit dramatically less from IOs.

Dispari, I agree that early levels SR is weaker than most. Weaker than regen or WP in particular, comparable IMO to dark and electric as a scrapper/brute secondary. With SOs it becomes good, very good paired with BS/Kat/DM. With IOs it becomes ridiculous.

If you didn't like leveling a lowbie SR, I expect you'd hate leveling a lowbie Blood Widow. Less defense and fewer hit points until you're about ready to branch.

[/ QUOTE ]

Except this is a thread about underperforming powersets, and "average" is, by definition, not underperforming. It's merely average. I've leveled an SR. One of my few 50s is an SR. I know how it works and I know its issues. This is made even more apparent when you realize I've had this SR since before the scaling defense change. SR has historically had "issues" before SOs, but that's not unique to SR. With SOs, the set performs fine.

With IOs, anything can be "overpowered". Using IOs to make a point doesn't help you or anyone.

[ QUOTE ]
Mind Control: The lack of an AoE immobolize/stun means it's pain to set domination for AoE attacks. Furthermore when purple out your mind troll, you can stop groups every minute with Total Domination and Mass Confusion. Fire Control on the other hand can stop groups nearly as well with Flashfire and cages about every 45 seconds using just SO's. Mind Control really just seems to suffer in the post-io world.

[/ QUOTE ]

It's funny to say this, but yeah, mind/ doesn't control as well as fire/ in everyday missions and farms. Of course, we're talking heavily IO'd builds here, with flashfires up every 25ish seconds + cinders every 60ish.

Honestly, this control disparity really applies with any powerset that has a quick recharging aoe "hard" control. Terrify is nice and all, but the retaliation really hamstrings it. We won't even go into plant/ and perma-SoC.

Mind/ has incredible flexibility though, I like always having something to overcome a mobs status protection, and "Notify Never" is a massive advantage in nasty situations (LRSF, I'm looking at you). When the going gets tough, mind's perks start to shine through! I'd disagree that it's underperforming at all.

Oh, as for sets that are *imo* underperforming:

Gravity, especially for doms! Can't see how to fix this one without breaking the cottage rule though. Propel is completely redundant to a dom.
Devices, lost a lot of utility to IOs and needs "something" to mitigate the loss of build up while teaming.
Defender Secondaries, /sonic excepted!

[ QUOTE ]
Stone Armor for Tanks: Survivability is thrown around like confetti hero side, and Stoners basically take crippling buff in exchange guaranteed survivability. Considering how frequently the extra survivability is overkill, I feel sorry for the non-irl stoners.

Mind Control: The lack of an AoE immobolize/stun means it's pain to set domination for AoE attacks. Furthermore when purple out your mind troll, you can stop groups every minute with Total Domination and Mass Confusion. Fire Control on the other hand can stop groups nearly as well with Flashfire and cages about every 45 seconds using just SO's. Mind Control really just seems to suffer in the post-io world.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

Hey guys, I have a neat idea for buffing Propel in Gravity. We all know it's a long-activation attack with so-so damage.

Well, I've always thought that it's neat to pick up random things and throw them at the critters. What bothers me the most is that all the Objects deal the same damage. Are you telling a Chair does the same damage as a Car?!

I think it will be an even more fun power if some objects in Propel can deal more damage so it becomes a "gamble" power. What do you guys think? Is this possible? I would set it as: Weak, Heavy and Extreme damage. All the objects are classified under these 3 types in terms of Size. Of course most of the time you would only see Weak and Heavy damage but rarely you would see a big Truck that does Extreme damage.

[ QUOTE ]
Hey guys, I have a neat idea for buffing Propel in Gravity. We all know it's a long-activation attack with so-so damage.

Well, I've always thought that it's neat to pick up random things and throw them at the critters. What bothers me the most is that all the Objects deal the same damage. Are you telling a Chair does the same damage as a Car?!

I think it will be an even more fun power if some objects in Propel can deal more damage so it becomes a "gamble" power. What do you guys think? Is this possible? I would set it as: Weak, Heavy and Extreme damage. All the objects are classified under these 3 types in terms of Size. Of course most of the time you would only see Weak and Heavy damage but rarely you would see a big Truck that does Extreme damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not possible (unfortunately). The object that gets thrown is purely a graphical decision made by your game client. The server doesn't even know what got thrown and everybody on your team will see a different object.

[ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?

Especially because an endgame fire controller with much of a brain (regardless of secondary) will follow that flashfire up with a sizable helping of hot death and burning monkey violation. Which the mind controller has few ways of replicating.

In fact... the mind controller has no reliable AOE containment method. If you use mass hypnosis for containment, throwing your fireball or psinado... wakes everything up and aggros them If you use total dom for AOE containment, it's only up once in a blue moon. And mind has nothing else that will set up AOE containment.

It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hey guys, I have a neat idea for buffing Propel in Gravity. We all know it's a long-activation attack with so-so damage.

Well, I've always thought that it's neat to pick up random things and throw them at the critters. What bothers me the most is that all the Objects deal the same damage. Are you telling a Chair does the same damage as a Car?!

I think it will be an even more fun power if some objects in Propel can deal more damage so it becomes a "gamble" power. What do you guys think? Is this possible? I would set it as: Weak, Heavy and Extreme damage. All the objects are classified under these 3 types in terms of Size. Of course most of the time you would only see Weak and Heavy damage but rarely you would see a big Truck that does Extreme damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not possible (unfortunately). The object that gets thrown is purely a graphical decision made by your game client. The server doesn't even know what got thrown and everybody on your team will see a different object.

[/ QUOTE ]

That sucks, because thats an awesome idea. I would even increase then range from minor, medium, high, superior, and the very rare Extreme, like inferno damage.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?

Especially because an endgame fire controller with much of a brain (regardless of secondary) will follow that flashfire up with a sizable helping of hot death and burning monkey violation. Which the mind controller has few ways of replicating.

In fact... the mind controller has no reliable AOE containment method. If you use mass hypnosis for containment, throwing your fireball or psinado... wakes everything up and aggros them If you use total dom for AOE containment, it's only up once in a blue moon. And mind has nothing else that will set up AOE containment.

It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Terrify is supposed to be considered the equivalent to Flashfire + cages.. Buts its not. Each set is supposed to have a lock down power for every grp. Ice slick, Flashfire, Earth disorient(cant remember name), and even lolwormhole. Although wormhole isn't nearly as good as the others, I would say terrify isn't either. And mass hypnosis doesn't even compare.. As a control set, mind cant compete with fire.

Not exactly sure mind is underperforming in all areas, but I dont think it beats fire for control/dmg.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?



[/ QUOTE ]

Okay in a MoRSF the AoE sleep (w/ domination) can sleep all the lvl 53 Heroes in the final mission perma this allows villains to pick them off one by one instead of attacking them all together for MoRSF runs. (Note* most Heroes and AVs are weak to Sleep).

[ QUOTE ]

It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please understand when you make this comment that you have to look at "ALL" the AT's that it would affect. Being that it does no damage actually helps Dominators (see above it works that way when soloing too). Your view seems to be soley on controllers (hereoes). In order to fix the set you have to consider both AT's (Villains AND heroes) and how it affects them.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?



[/ QUOTE ]

Okay in a MoRSF the AoE sleep (w/ domination) can sleep all the lvl 53 Heroes in the final mission perma this allows villains to pick them off one by one instead of attacking them all together for MoRSF runs. (Note* most Heroes and AVs are weak to Sleep).

[/ QUOTE ]

One corner-case application of one power in content only available to one side, doesn't justify an entire powerset being substandard to its peers in the majority of situations on both sides. Furthermore it's far from required, it just makes it a bit easier.

That's like saying stone armor is fine because granite makes doing the STF easier.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Please understand when you make this comment that you have to look at "ALL" the AT's that it would affect. Being that it does no damage actually helps Dominators (see above it works that way when soloing too). Your view seems to be soley on controllers (hereoes). In order to fix the set you have to consider both AT's (Villains AND heroes) and how it affects them.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't say anything about fixing the set or suggest improvements for it. I just said it underperforms, and gave an example of why in the same context as the poster I was replying to.

Though something similar would apply to doms - the fire dom's going to have the flaming monkeys, though cages/hotfeet won't be nearly so egregiously damaging without containment.

Mind for doms still suffers from the lack of frequently available AOE hard control. Terrify's pretty awesome, but things still get to shoot back (if on a very limited basis) when terrified, making it more like ice slick or earthquake than flashfire or stalagmites. Mass confusion's on a long timer and is a tier 9... seeds of confusion is sitting over in plant control laughing at it.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Mass Hypnosis Hello??

L2P your Mind Controller/Dominator.

What does the Fire Controller use to AoE mez WITHOUT DRAWING AGGRO???

Oh, that's right, HE CAN'T, ONLY MIND CAN DO THAT.

What IOs are you gonna slot to make Flashfire not alert the mobs?

What IOs are you gonna slot to mez Hold resistant mobs?

[/ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?

Especially because an endgame fire controller with much of a brain (regardless of secondary) will follow that flashfire up with a sizable helping of hot death and burning monkey violation. Which the mind controller has few ways of replicating.

In fact... the mind controller has no reliable AOE containment method. If you use mass hypnosis for containment, throwing your fireball or psinado... wakes everything up and aggros them If you use total dom for AOE containment, it's only up once in a blue moon. And mind has nothing else that will set up AOE containment.

It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ive seen lot of fire controllers being badly beaten by Arachnos, Malta and Crey troops while Mind troller could pick them all apart one by one while remaining 100% safe.

Thing is, are you playing your troller/dominator with a team? If that is the case then Mind is not underperforming at all. Doing damage is not the controller's job anyway. Other players on the team will do the killing. If your fire controller can kill stuff fast by himself then good for him but i would bet alot money that he has to cherrypick his enemy groups before he can enjoy fireballing and imping them to death. Like i said earlyer, does not work so well when bane executionners, toxic tarantulas, malta titans, sappers and gunslingers suddenly show up for the fight. You get left with Char as a solid hold while mind has alot more tools to deal with bosses. Flashfire+Firecage+Fireball is great for farming but that's all.

You're foolish in the extreme if you think that Non aggro mezzes are worthless.

You're also foolish in the extreme if you think a CONTROL set is Underperforming because it doesn't do as much DAMAGE as another CONTROL set.

Foolish.

In the extreme.



FIRE is OVERPERFORMING, if anything.

Please don't continue to participate in this discussion of Mind Control, since you clearly have a flea's (not Bionic Flea's) understanding of the set.

[ QUOTE ]
As a control set, mind cant compete with fire.

[/ QUOTE ]


Credibility, meet out the window.



As a CONTROL set FIRE can't compete with MIND.

As a DAMAGE set FIRE pulls way ahead, obviously.

I'm gonna state this again, in clearer terms.


If you are using how much Damage is done by Fire Control as your baseline for what a control set should be capable of, you are misunderstanding the purpose of Controllers on teams.

If you think that Mind Control is Weak at *controlling* things, then you really just haven't examined what the powers in the set are actually capable of, or you are ignoring some aspect of those powers.

If you think that Fire is better at *control* than Mind, you again have some critical misunderstanding of what Mind is capable of.



Just what is Fire gonna do when a second group shows up and you've already used Flashfires and Cinders (if you even took Cinders)?

Meanwhile Mind has FOUR AoE mezzes. To argue that the sleep and fear are somehow weak, when compared directly to Flashfires (itself out of context), out of the context of the set as a whole, just strikes me as silly.

Maybe these arguments are true IN THE FARM MISSIONS WHERE FIRE/KINS SHINE SO WELL. Go try some REAL missions and come back and tell me how great Fire is at controlling mobs.

[ QUOTE ]
I'm gonna state this again, in clearer terms.


If you are using how much Damage is done by Fire Control as your baseline for what a control set should be capable of, you are misunderstanding the purpose of Controllers on teams.

If you think that Mind Control is Weak at *controlling* things, then you really just haven't examined what the powers in the set are actually capable of, or you are ignoring some aspect of those powers.

If you think that Fire is better at *control* than Mind, you again have some critical misunderstanding of what Mind is capable of.



Just what is Fire gonna do when a second group shows up and you've already used Flashfires and Cinders (if you even took Cinders)?

Meanwhile Mind has FOUR AoE mezzes. To argue that the sleep and fear are somehow weak, when compared directly to Flashfires (itself out of context), out of the context of the set as a whole, just strikes me as silly.

Maybe these arguments are true IN THE FARM MISSIONS WHERE FIRE/KINS SHINE SO WELL. Go try some REAL missions and come back and tell me how great Fire is at controlling mobs.

[/ QUOTE ]

This. Big time! Wavicle hit the nail just right. Again.

[ QUOTE ]

Uh, who cares? Serious question: if it's stunned who cares if it's aggroed?

[/ QUOTE ]

When it's a boss and you don't have the requisite magnitude to stun it, you do -in fact- care about agro.

[ QUOTE ]
Especially because an endgame fire controller with much of a brain (regardless of secondary) will follow that flashfire up with a sizable helping of hot death and burning monkey violation. Which the mind controller has few ways of replicating.

[/ QUOTE ]

Step 1: Confuse Boss.
Step 2: Confuse Boss again.
Step 3: ?????
Step 4: Profit

Same amount of crazy, but accomplished almost 20 levels earlier.

[ QUOTE ]
In fact... the mind controller has no reliable AOE containment method. If you use mass hypnosis for containment, throwing your fireball or psinado... wakes everything up and aggros them

[/ QUOTE ]

1) Doms don't Containment.
2) Doms don't Containment.
3) DOMS DO NOT CONTAINMENT.

4) TK into corner, Dominate Bosses, Terrify, AoEs away.

Tho, to be fair, Mind is better with single-target death dealing, in which case you still do the above but with Dominate in your ST attack chain, causing every mob to die swiftly, safely, and efficiently.

[ QUOTE ]
If you use total dom for AOE containment, it's only up once in a blue moon. And mind has nothing else that will set up AOE containment.

[/ QUOTE ]

Mind has only Terrify to work with AOE Containment, so that's hardly a major problem with the set.

[ QUOTE ]
It definitely belongs in the underperforming category. Unless your measure of performance is "not killing things effectively" - in which case Mind's great, sleep your enemies for hours, they'll be well-rested when the fire controller comes by and kicks their butts.

[/ QUOTE ]

A benchmark for a well performing set shouldn't have 'Once you hit level 32' as proof. The other eight powers should be the basis of performance, and Mind is -very- dominant for both Doms and Controllers in terms of ability to lock down mobs quickly and efficiently. Controllers have no problems milking and using Containment, and Dominators don't need containment to function.

If you fail at TK, however, you might find the set underperforming. If you succeed at TK, however, you know the argument 'Nothing AoE' is a pile of nonsense.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hey guys, I have a neat idea for buffing Propel in Gravity. We all know it's a long-activation attack with so-so damage.

Well, I've always thought that it's neat to pick up random things and throw them at the critters. What bothers me the most is that all the Objects deal the same damage. Are you telling a Chair does the same damage as a Car?!

I think it will be an even more fun power if some objects in Propel can deal more damage so it becomes a "gamble" power. What do you guys think? Is this possible? I would set it as: Weak, Heavy and Extreme damage. All the objects are classified under these 3 types in terms of Size. Of course most of the time you would only see Weak and Heavy damage but rarely you would see a big Truck that does Extreme damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not possible (unfortunately). The object that gets thrown is purely a graphical decision made by your game client. The server doesn't even know what got thrown and everybody on your team will see a different object.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bummer... I kinda figured that, although I thought with the additional of "proc" damage, maybe the power can have a built-in proc so bigger objects can proc more damage or something like that.

I would totally take Propel if different objects do different damage. It fits the theme so well. Oh well...

[ QUOTE ]
Meanwhile Mind has FOUR AoE mezzes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Correction. Five. Five AoE Mezzes.

Mass Hypnosis.
Telekinesis.
Total Domination.
Terrify.
Mass Confusion.

Five AoE Mezzes. Ah-hah-hah-hah! *Thunderclap*

/TheCount

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Meanwhile Mind has FOUR AoE mezzes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Correction. Five. Five AoE Mezzes.

Mass Hypnosis.
Telekinesis.
Total Domination.
Terrify.
Mass Confusion.

Five AoE Mezzes. Ah-hah-hah-hah! *Thunderclap*

/TheCount

[/ QUOTE ]

Yea, I didn't mention TK because I didn't want to push it too far. TK definitely isn't usable for the same purposes as those other mezzes. It is enormously useful however, for being autohit, for being a toggle, and for having a repel effect.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Hey guys, I have a neat idea for buffing Propel in Gravity. We all know it's a long-activation attack with so-so damage.

Well, I've always thought that it's neat to pick up random things and throw them at the critters. What bothers me the most is that all the Objects deal the same damage. Are you telling a Chair does the same damage as a Car?!

I think it will be an even more fun power if some objects in Propel can deal more damage so it becomes a "gamble" power. What do you guys think? Is this possible? I would set it as: Weak, Heavy and Extreme damage. All the objects are classified under these 3 types in terms of Size. Of course most of the time you would only see Weak and Heavy damage but rarely you would see a big Truck that does Extreme damage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not possible (unfortunately). The object that gets thrown is purely a graphical decision made by your game client. The server doesn't even know what got thrown and everybody on your team will see a different object.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bummer... I kinda figured that, although I thought with the additional of "proc" damage, maybe the power can have a built-in proc so bigger objects can proc more damage or something like that.

I would totally take Propel if different objects do different damage. It fits the theme so well. Oh well...

[/ QUOTE ]

Now just a second...

Based off of my admittedly limited programming knowledge and bits and pieces I have gleaned from developer conversations over the years, it is quite possible. Theoretically It could be feasible to restructure the power to randomly select a Weak/Heavy/Extreme (though I would add Moderate in there too.) attack, and then launch an item from a separate list of objects created for each attack. But it is entirely possible that this could extend propels already long animation time. But maybe if it was a Weak/Moderate/Heavy/Extreme/Superior attack, that could even toss out ginormous objects of inordinate size... Though I digress.

OK, BAB's would be screaming my curses over having to copy/paste one whole list of objects into five separate ones, or maybe that is Castle's job? Castle would have to rewrite the power to randomly select the damage level for sure, but like propels list being ported into /e alakazamreact, I assume It would be the "Beguantleted One's" place to put in the objects. I don't know, I just play here.

TL;DR version. It COULD be done, of that I am sure of. But do the ends justify the means?


[EDIT] Broke my own protocol, and threadjacked a bit.

Under-performing sets based on MY playstyle:

Spines (Scrappers)
Anything/Stalker
Devices
Dark Armor
Thugs
Fighting

Huhmm...
Probably...

Energy Blast, Electric Blast, Martial Arts, Gravity Control, and Electric Armor. Note that this list is in no particular order.

(Dis)honorable mentions go to Battle Axe and War Mace, because they deserve to be awesome, but... well, they're just not.

I24 Proc Chance = (Enhanced Recharge + Activation Time) * (Current PPM * 1.25) / 60*(1 + .75*(.15*Radius - 0.011*Radius*(360-Arc)/30))
Single Target Radius = 0. AoE Non-Cone Arc = 360.

Can I mention Pets from Redside patron pool? Aside from the Mu gaurdian in the Scirocco Dom version the rest flat out suck no matter which AT it is.