Going from Level 9 to Level 16 Within 1 AE Mission
By
AncientSpirit_NA,
Posted on: 2009-07-06 07:58 in Mission Architect
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...AE just gives incentive for those interested in the numbers to play the game. If you really care about all the other stuff, I'm sure you would eventually leave the AE building and explore the rest of the game.
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In a sense, maybe that's actually a good thing. I mean, the Devs with one single sub-system that they've introduced, have struck RMT right where it hurts, by almost eliminating the reason to pay $$$ for INF or Power-Leveling, and at the same time, came up with a way to keep all those interested in the "number-game" locked-up inside their little AE-farms.
Maybe it's not such a bad thing that AE is exploitable, but the truly saddens me because that means the aspect of using AE to experience both making stories, and playing stories, may actually be the lesser goal in the Devs' plan. 
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
This "it affects us all" thing is [censored]. If you really want to avoid the effects of a noob population, its very easy - get some damn friends.
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This "it affects us all" thing is [censored]. If you really want to avoid the effects of a noob population, its very easy - get some damn friends.
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This line of thinking didn't work well at all when it came to PvP changes.
The nerfs that will come about because of the selected few will affect everyone, not just those selected few.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
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This "it affects us all" thing is [censored]. If you really want to avoid the effects of a noob population, its very easy - get some damn friends.
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I've got friends, thanks, and personally the n00b population isn't the effect I'm worried about and want to avoid. What I am worried about and wish to avoid in regards to AE, is the fact that the Devs' responses to exploits found in AE farms is affecting story-arcs written by authors.
Now granted, most of these exploits could have been avoided if the Devs had more time before publishing AE, but then again, if you don't listen to your beta-testers in Closed and Open betas, you end up listening to them when things go live.
I agree with you, and a lot of others, normal farming that does not use, nor exposes, any exploits affects only the farmers themselves. However, since a prime goal for AE is to allow players to share their content with the community, a Farmer who makes a farming-mission and uses exploits in it, essentially has produced a shining beacon that screams to people "come farm me for I give better rewards than anything else in the game"! Problem is, once that beacon is lit, the Devs will notice and take action, and these actions do affect us all to varying degrees.
So yeah, this isn't just about n00b players... sorry if I gave you that impression.
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Sorry, as far as the "affects us all" thing I was talking more about the argument that AE breeds a noob population that is hard to team with or something. I completely agree it brings about nerfs but usually just to the big exploits, which I thought would be a good thing for you guys.
Exploit extermination is a good thing, however, there are two things that are negative effects that come of it: a) the Devs sometimes have to completely remove things that were used in story-arcs that were not farms but just happened to use a removed entity/effect; b) the recent crackdown on power-leveled characters (we're talking Lv50 in less than 24 hours) isn't a good exercise in PR.
To top everything off, if the whole AE-is-the-game point of view that n00b could be exposed to, causes people to think of the game negatively and thus advertise CoX as nothing more than "I came, I 50'ed, I quit" kind of game, there will be people out there that may believe these rumors and not even get a 14-day trial at all... and I think we'll all agree on one thing: No New People is Bad!
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
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Exploit extermination is a good thing, however, there are two things that are negative effects that come of it: a) the Devs sometimes have to completely remove things that were used in story-arcs that were not farms but just happened to use a removed entity/effect; b) the recent crackdown on power-leveled characters (we're talking Lv50 in less than 24 hours) isn't a good exercise in PR.
To top everything off, if the whole AE-is-the-game point of view that n00b could be exposed to, causes people to think of the game negatively and thus advertise CoX as nothing more than "I came, I 50'ed, I quit" kind of game, there will be people out there that may believe these rumors and not even get a 14-day trial at all... and I think we'll all agree on one thing: No New People is Bad!
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There is nothing wrong with AE! and with x2 XP wkend coming they will get some new people & possibly a few renew's. The dev's & this game need more customer's because after they nerfed PVP into garbage a lot of people left the game.
AE is a good thing, like in life you have a freedom of CHOICE. So it might be possible you exercise your freedom of CHOICE & not farm. 
AE is fun if your farming or not. When I play a dev's choice mission it's just like playing a paper mission ect.. to me, the only difference someone put some time to create it which is cool.
If the dev's made AE no xp that would be a very bad move & would leave the AE building dead. It would anger most of COX population and they would lose more customer's, just like what happened when they nerfed pvp into garbage.
COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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"A coward dies many times before their death, the valiant taste death but once." - William Shakespeare
Learn it... OWN IT!
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COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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I have no problem finding teams to do anything I want to do redside or blueside on Infinity. I think this is a bit exaggerated.
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COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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I'll tell you something. This part of your post is pure BS. 
Sure, a lot of people left the game due to PvP changes. A lot of people left the game BEFORE the PvP changes too. More players have come since the release if i14. Some will stay, some will go for various reasons. The subscriber base has remained relatively constant over the past few years, so attempting to cry the game is dying is totally not true.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
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If the dev's made AE no xp that would be a very bad move & would leave the AE building dead. It would anger most of COX population and they would lose more customer's, just like what happened when they nerfed pvp into garbage.
COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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I can agree with most of this, but since I only know like 2 people out of 150 or so I play or have played with regularly who actually PVP'd consistently, I don't think "a lot" of people left over PVP.
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COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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I'll tell you you are full of crap. The few who left over PvP changes are no different than the few who left over ED and the GDN.
The Devs are going to nerf your farming missions. Stop whining about it already.
I give your post 0 stars for the trolling attempt failure.
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It is if I can custom tailor them so that my toon has much less of a risk against them than I would normally against non-custom NPCs.
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Here's one for you...
In the Maria Jenkins mission "Defeat Infernal and his Minions" the Devs put a repeatable mission into the game which has mobs that essentially do only Fire damage.
Technically, a Fire Tank, Fire Scrapper or even another AT with the Fire Shield Ancillary power and a few IO bonuses could run that mission repeatedly with almost zero risk for unlimited rewards.
And of course there is the popular "Battle Maiden" mission (from the same contact) which has mobs loaded with basically nothing but Smashing and Lethal damage types.
However by your logic, if I were to build basically those EXACT same missions in the AE then I would be creating blatant exploits and be certain to see the "Wrath of the Devs" for having built it.
If that is true then I guess whatever Dev designed the Maria Jenkins mission arcs is about to come into work and find his paycheck nerfed, right?
Or perhaps your interpretation of what is an "exploit" is a bit out of tune with the designers of the game?
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COX only has 2 populated server's now Freedom being #1. Not even a year ago other server's were thriving, but not anymore. So tell me something.
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I have no problem finding teams to do anything I want to do redside or blueside on Infinity. I think this is a bit exaggerated.
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Its more than exaggerated. Its outright bull.
If Infinity had no population then how the hell did we get a 5 team Mothership raid going on a WEDNESDAY ?
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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If Infinity had no population then how the hell did we get a 5 team Mothership raid going on a WEDNESDAY ?
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I missed out on a raid last night?
Ah, Infinity. Cap au Diable, broadcast:
nub: LF AE
nub: LF AE
a friend: The AE building is located near fateweaver.
nub: LF AE taem
me @ market: You'll find them generally in the AE building.
nub: LF AE taem plz
nub: I now wehre AE is. Im lokin 4 a taem!
That poor nub probably thinks Infinity is dead because he can't get on an AE team. Never mind the fact that he's a lowbie and has nothing to contribute to the team outside of brawl, spams broadcast, and has no clue how to even look at getting a 'taem'.
Perhaps if the nub was looking for a team, he might do better.
I apologize in advance for the stereotypical moron portrayed here. I just find them more memorable than others.
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If Infinity had no population then how the hell did we get a 5 team Mothership raid going on a WEDNESDAY ?
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I missed out on a raid last night?
Ah, Infinity. Cap au Diable, broadcast:
nub: LF AE
nub: LF AE
a friend: The AE building is located near fateweaver.
nub: LF AE taem
me @ market: You'll find them generally in the AE building.
nub: LF AE taem plz
nub: I now wehre AE is. Im lokin 4 a taem!
That poor nub probably thinks Infinity is dead because he can't get on an AE team. Never mind the fact that he's a lowbie and has nothing to contribute to the team outside of brawl, spams broadcast, and has no clue how to even look at getting a 'taem'.
Perhaps if the nub was looking for a team, he might do better.
I apologize in advance for the stereotypical moron portrayed here. I just find them more memorable than others.
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Yes. Yes you did miss it. It was glorious. New person leading it. she did great, and we got about 17+ minutes in the center to smash things.
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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If the dev's made AE no xp that would be a very bad move & would leave the AE building dead. It would anger most of COX population and they would lose more customer's, just like what happened when they nerfed pvp into garbage.
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PvP is a second banana. Those that left because of it were not really noticed.
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If the dev's made AE no xp that would be a very bad move & would leave the AE building dead. It would anger most of COX population and they would lose more customer's, just like what happened when they nerfed pvp into garbage.
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PvP is a second banana. Those that left because of it were not really noticed.
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And? AE isnt PVP. a lot more people use AE than ever used pvp. Sure its not proof they'd leave, but its certainly proof using pvp as an example is a bad idea.
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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And? AE isnt PVP. a lot more people use AE than ever used pvp. Sure its not proof they'd leave, but its certainly proof using pvp as an example is a bad idea.
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I agree. Thus why i mocked his analogy 
-Noticed my quote was edited too much, i can see why you misunderstood me.
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There is nothing wrong with AE!
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Like any technology, gadget or doctrine, AE itself isn't the thing that is wrong. What is wrong is that since AE enables players to setup missions any way they want to, the Human nature of wanting more *stuff* for less investment will cause a lot of people to seek out the *holes* in the system, i.e. exploits, and AE at its current state, still has many inherent exploits that will take quite some time to remove.
My interest in AE began even before those videos of Captain Dynamic were made, and when that wonderful video came out -- where Captain Dynamic asks a team of mission-writers to write him a mission where he saves a kitty from a tree and gets like awesome rewards -- I was laughing my head off, partly because I *knew* that people will be all over that if it were possible!
Coming here and telling us that there's nothing wrong with AE as a system, that's all good and fine, but don't you dare try to sell us the notion that setting up a map with critters that do not fight back yet give you even 1 point of XP and 1 INF is working as intended and isn't wrong! That's just insulting and if you don't know better, you truly deserve the name ChickenChaser!
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
By the way... I so wanted in on that Mothership Raid... dang, I even got two LoTG's into my build and wanted to see how'd they'd help me in battle!
I believe that a Kheldian Gold Standard should be based on SO's, and for anything above that... there's Platinum!
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
Save Ms. Liberty (#5349) � Augmenting Peacebringers � The Umbra Illuminati
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It is if I can custom tailor them so that my toon has much less of a risk against them than I would normally against non-custom NPCs.
[/ QUOTE ]
Here's one for you...
In the Maria Jenkins mission "Defeat Infernal and his Minions" the Devs put a repeatable mission into the game which has mobs that essentially do only Fire damage.
Technically, a Fire Tank, Fire Scrapper or even another AT with the Fire Shield Ancillary power and a few IO bonuses could run that mission repeatedly with almost zero risk for unlimited rewards.
And of course there is the popular "Battle Maiden" mission (from the same contact) which has mobs loaded with basically nothing but Smashing and Lethal damage types.
However by your logic, if I were to build basically those EXACT same missions in the AE then I would be creating blatant exploits and be certain to see the "Wrath of the Devs" for having built it.
If that is true then I guess whatever Dev designed the Maria Jenkins mission arcs is about to come into work and find his paycheck nerfed, right?
Or perhaps your interpretation of what is an "exploit" is a bit out of tune with the designers of the game?
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The Dreck mission and the Wolf farming one used to be non-timed and now they are due to over-farming. The Devs do change missions.
Also, if you're working a specific type of toon up to play one high-level mission arc for farming, more power to you.
Shard Warrior - 50 MA/Regen/BM Scrapper
Founding Member and Leader : Shadow-Force
Co-Leader: Council of Heroes
"Whatever evils come this way... we will be there to stop them."
[ QUOTE ]
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It is if I can custom tailor them so that my toon has much less of a risk against them than I would normally against non-custom NPCs.
[/ QUOTE ]
Here's one for you...
In the Maria Jenkins mission "Defeat Infernal and his Minions" the Devs put a repeatable mission into the game which has mobs that essentially do only Fire damage.
Technically, a Fire Tank, Fire Scrapper or even another AT with the Fire Shield Ancillary power and a few IO bonuses could run that mission repeatedly with almost zero risk for unlimited rewards.
And of course there is the popular "Battle Maiden" mission (from the same contact) which has mobs loaded with basically nothing but Smashing and Lethal damage types.
However by your logic, if I were to build basically those EXACT same missions in the AE then I would be creating blatant exploits and be certain to see the "Wrath of the Devs" for having built it.
If that is true then I guess whatever Dev designed the Maria Jenkins mission arcs is about to come into work and find his paycheck nerfed, right?
Or perhaps your interpretation of what is an "exploit" is a bit out of tune with the designers of the game?
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The Dreck mission and the Wolf farming one used to be non-timed and now they are due to over-farming. The Devs do change missions.
Also, if you're working a specific type of toon up to play one high-level mission arc for farming, more power to you.
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The Infernal and Battle Maiden missions have stayed unchanged for over three years so I don't think that they are planning any changes for them.
Also, my point was, that if those missions are not "exploits" then I don't see how an AE mission with identical mobs could be either.
I'm not saying that it's impossible to make missions that are abusive, just that the damage type that the mobs in the mission do or do not do cannot be the only criteria that a mission is judged upon.
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I have no problem finding teams to do anything I want to do redside or blueside on Infinity. I think this is a bit exaggerated.
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Freedom and Virtue are actually overpopulated servers. Most of the servers have a decent population at peak times without being overcrowded like those 2.
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The Infernal and Battle Maiden missions have stayed unchanged for over three years so I don't think that they are planning any changes for them.
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Given that it took three years to change Psychic Shockwave, I don't feel that this argument has much validity.
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Also, my point was, that if those missions are not "exploits" then I don't see how an AE mission with identical mobs could be either.
I'm not saying that it's impossible to make missions that are abusive, just that the damage type that the mobs in the mission do or do not do cannot be the only criteria that a mission is judged upon.
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You may be right there. Making a custom mob that has easily mitigated damage only really matters if you were otherwise going to be in danger of being defeated. For many farming characters, that's not necessary - you're already "survivable enough" even before damage type optimization is taken into account.
It does become a problem in the AE though when you combine it with the ability to scale the enemy difficulty upwards by making factions with no minions. In some cases, all-boss factions can be faced successfully only by also optimizing damage types.
And for a while things were cold,
They were scared down in their holes
The forest that once was green
Was colored black by those killing machines
Really, if people stick to the AE from 1 to 50 because you can get from 1 to 50 quick there, could we keep them in the game either way? If CoX is just a game of getting increasingly bigger numbers to you, then, outside of AE, CoX simply isn't the game for you.
What always perplexes me, though, is that CoX seems to be one of the MMOs where you can get to max level relatively quickly just by casual play, which is almost ironic given how most of the content is in the 1-45 range, anyway.
Even the newbies that don't know any better are obviously in it for a numbers game, or they would've dropped after what? Level 2? Close the AE, and we'd be back to the other farms.
I like the story and story arcs of CoX, and I have yet to experience them all, and for that reason I have also yet to try story arcs in the AE at all. If it weren't for the unique setting and a plot decent enough to keep me interested, I'd be outta here because then CoX would just any other MMO to me. "AE babies" won't care for the world outside of AE, because if they did, they would stop doing missions whose entire plot is "kill stfuf[sic]".
But I'm starting to repeat myself. AE just gives incentive for those interested in the numbers to play the game. If you really care about all the other stuff, I'm sure you would eventually leave the AE building and explore the rest of the game.