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Ever notice how all the alternate-universe versions of Statesman are evil?
I kinda wonder if Paragon Earth might be an aberration. After all--if the criminal Marcus Cole is supposed to stay Evil, a dimension where he's 'good' would be the "evil parallel universe" for most. Especially since Paragon Earth set up massive walls to "protect" its citizens, and in Praetoria that wasn't necessary...
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States..... If not mistaken, there is a plaque some where in Grandville, claiming States tried to kill Lord Recluse.
Seems his only heroic choice was to kill 
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What do you mean 'alternate'? Statesman is a gigantic swaggering bully masquerading under a veneer of respectability because he's the least of a large group of dickheads.
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What do you base this judgement on aside from a handful of comics by writers who never played the game?
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What do you mean 'alternate'? Statesman is a gigantic swaggering bully masquerading under a veneer of respectability because he's the least of a large group of dickheads.
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What do you base this judgement on aside from a handful of comics by writers who never played the game?
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Uh... I'm pretty sure Troy Hickman plays the game.
Paragon Unleashed, Unleash Yourself!
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What do you mean 'alternate'? Statesman is a gigantic swaggering bully masquerading under a veneer of respectability because he's the least of a large group of dickheads.
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What do you base this judgement on aside from a handful of comics by writers who never played the game?
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Uh... I'm pretty sure Troy Hickman plays the game.
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Manticore too of course. Now that Hickman has been mentioned, the Hickman will appear as his name has been spoken thrice. Of course Hickman's version of Statesman was less of a dick than other writers managed to accomplish.
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Now that Hickman has been mentioned, the Hickman will appear as his name has been spoken thrice.
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"Ah yes. The Hickman. There is no finer companion! Just so!"
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Of course Hickman's version of Statesman was less of a dick than other writers managed to accomplish.
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He was likeable in the Web of Arachnos novel, but then he was in full-on-Golden-Age charming-hero mode.
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Ever notice how all the alternate-universe versions of Statesman are evil?
I kinda wonder if Paragon Earth might be an aberration. After all--if the criminal Marcus Cole is supposed to stay Evil, a dimension where he's 'good' would be the "evil parallel universe" for most. Especially since Paragon Earth set up massive walls to "protect" its citizens, and in Praetoria that wasn't necessary...
[/ QUOTE ]I have always attributed that to the bizarre polarizations of "alternate dimensions" most of which are poorly thought out contrivances to fit a specific writer's what if scenario. I mean really if they hadnt used praetoria as the setting for this, i really wouldnt mind, alternate dimensions rank second only to time travel in poorly thought out literary contrivances in my book.
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The problem is we don't have enough of a good faith in the writing team to believe they have the ability to conclude a plot at all, let alone conclude one well. It's especially frustrating since they have an amazing tool to do something relatively unprecedented in story-driven MMOs.
[/ QUOTE ]With the recent unclosed story arcs and the new tf/sf in i15, I don't have any faith in any of the writers to even pump out a half-good and finished storyline. I also think the new direction for storyline-driven content is absurd. It's just wall of texts to distract you from the next mission. All the story info I get is from the sight. If they want this to be a story driven game, they need to find a better way to deliver it.
[/ QUOTE ]Well, it's okay to use slabs of text - I'm fine with that, because it means the story is unobtrusive to those people who don't really care. I've seen a lot of people frustrated by cut scenes because they interrupt combat flow. On the other hand, for those of us who do read the text there's this feeling of Why Bother.
[/ QUOTE ]And I agree with you, but there mindset is to deliver story arcs, then us people who just want to play and have fun are being left out a bit. I'll take new zones, powers, costumes, and gameplay mechanics over stories in this game any day.
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The problem is we don't have enough of a good faith in the writing team to believe they have the ability to conclude a plot at all, let alone conclude one well. It's especially frustrating since they have an amazing tool to do something relatively unprecedented in story-driven MMOs.
[/ QUOTE ]With the recent unclosed story arcs and the new tf/sf in i15, I don't have any faith in any of the writers to even pump out a half-good and finished storyline. I also think the new direction for storyline-driven content is absurd. It's just wall of texts to distract you from the next mission. All the story info I get is from the sight. If they want this to be a story driven game, they need to find a better way to deliver it.
[/ QUOTE ]Well, it's okay to use slabs of text - I'm fine with that, because it means the story is unobtrusive to those people who don't really care. I've seen a lot of people frustrated by cut scenes because they interrupt combat flow. On the other hand, for those of us who do read the text there's this feeling of Why Bother.
[/ QUOTE ]And I agree with you, but there mindset is to deliver story arcs, then us people who just want to play and have fun are being left out a bit. I'll take new zones, powers, costumes, and gameplay mechanics over stories in this game any day.
[/ QUOTE ]That kind of presumes that people who want story progressing dont want to have fun. It is all a balance, and i dont think things have been too bad for the people you have mentioned. yeah zones have been lacking lately, but it appears that going rogue is where that work went(not to mention that we dont exactly have the population for having a huge number of zones and maintaining any real density) . meanwhile the story has pretty much floundered since issue 12, so balance, you got new things to play with, ma day job powers and accolades, the patrol exp, making alting even easier than ever, lets see some story stuff going on.
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The problem is we don't have enough of a good faith in the writing team to believe they have the ability to conclude a plot at all, let alone conclude one well. It's especially frustrating since they have an amazing tool to do something relatively unprecedented in story-driven MMOs.
[/ QUOTE ]With the recent unclosed story arcs and the new tf/sf in i15, I don't have any faith in any of the writers to even pump out a half-good and finished storyline. I also think the new direction for storyline-driven content is absurd. It's just wall of texts to distract you from the next mission. All the story info I get is from the sight. If they want this to be a story driven game, they need to find a better way to deliver it.
[/ QUOTE ]Well, it's okay to use slabs of text - I'm fine with that, because it means the story is unobtrusive to those people who don't really care. I've seen a lot of people frustrated by cut scenes because they interrupt combat flow. On the other hand, for those of us who do read the text there's this feeling of Why Bother.
[/ QUOTE ]And I agree with you, but there mindset is to deliver story arcs, then us people who just want to play and have fun are being left out a bit. I'll take new zones, powers, costumes, and gameplay mechanics over stories in this game any day.
[/ QUOTE ]That kind of presumes that people who want story progressing dont want to have fun. It is all a balance, and i dont think things have been too bad for the people you have mentioned. yeah zones have been lacking lately, but it appears that going rogue is where that work went(not to mention that we dont exactly have the population for having a huge number of zones and maintaining any real density) . meanwhile the story has pretty much floundered since issue 12, so balance, you got new things to play with, ma day job powers and accolades, the patrol exp, making alting even easier than ever, lets see some story stuff going on.
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actually. what it supposes is what so many story addicts dont eseem to realize.
Not everyone finds stories fun. Some people love reading the lore or player written stories or roleplaying.. some people love smashing through the hardest mobs they can find or make. some people like to be efficient.
none of them are wrong, no matter what some people may tell you >_>
Want comedy and lighthearted action? Between levels 1-14? Try Nuclear in 90 - The Fusionette Task Force!
Arc ID 58363!
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Uh... I'm pretty sure Troy Hickman plays the game.
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Troy never portrayed Statesman or the Phalanx as arseholes.
I'll grant that they were at their most likable during his tenure.
Paragon Unleashed, Unleash Yourself!
The devs read these threads and ask for feedback. They see what seems to be the most popular ideas and run with it. Dealing with thousands of ideas, something will be left out. Keep stating your opinion and hopefully soon you will be in the majority and your changes will come!
Personally i am fighting for what has been given to us to be fixed, i am not looking for new content, there is much to be reworked, but sadly i am in the minority.
I want base raiding, mission teleport, IoP's, ASN, and MA (dc'ing and lag problems) fixed! I want new base decore! Also not fond of the Hollows changes (first too many bad guys close together, now there are tons of different badguys and none of the ones needed for missions, heaven forbid 2 heroes should do the same missions at the same time or right after each other).
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actually. what it supposes is what so many story addicts dont eseem to realize.
Not everyone finds stories fun. Some people love reading the lore or player written stories or roleplaying.. some people love smashing through the hardest mobs they can find or make. some people like to be efficient.
none of them are wrong, no matter what some people may tell you >_>
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Actually, you're supposing that people can't and don't want both of those things. Its a bad idea to favor one over the other in any event.
A good game is driven forward by good storytelling AND good combat. I actually think that storytelling has taken a backseat in this game. Not because the devs don't attmpt to tell stories...but because the game world hasn't been built/redesigned to reflect those stories very well.
If all you REALLY want to do is smash through the toughest mobs with the least effort, why do you care what zone you're in or what setting you do it in. The story isn't what you're after right? I mean...the levels could simply be replaced with blank corridors and just have you steamroll your way through tons of mobs leveling quickly as you go.
You can't/shouldn't build an MMO on nothing but 'efficiency' and power gaming. The thing that I've always thought should happen is that the gameworld should reflect the story being told. It should do that in a way that has some level of interaction besides just smashing mob x or y.
All our missions are the same because they are ALL the same. There aren't any supporting game systems that truly draw you into the tasks that you're supposedly doing that have this great impact on the city you are trying to protect/exploit.
Lack of choices and branching story arcs, lack of any puzzle elements or environmental interaction apart from clicking a glowy. No one, not even the powergamers, should be able to ignore what's going on in the game's story arcs...because it should be so wrapped up in your objectives that just beating up all the enemies on the map isn't your only goal.
You tell the story ALONG with the mission...not before and after. That way, everyone get's something out of the game and feels more a part of the gameworld. It's not about liking storytelling vs. combat vs. RP...its about seamlessly combining compelling elements together to create something greater than just a single aspect of gameplay could provide.
CoX has yet to really do that. I'm not sure if its 2 upcoming competitors have managed to do it, but if they have, then CoX is at a disadvantage going forward. That's IF. I have no idea what Going Rogue will truly bring.
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Well, it's okay to use slabs of text - I'm fine with that, because it means the story is unobtrusive to those people who don't really care. I've seen a lot of people frustrated by cut scenes because they interrupt combat flow. On the other hand, for those of us who do read the text there's this feeling of Why Bother.
[/ QUOTE ]And I agree with you, but there mindset is to deliver story arcs, then us people who just want to play and have fun are being left out a bit. I'll take new zones, powers, costumes, and gameplay mechanics over stories in this game any day.
[/ QUOTE ]The good news is, these things are not exclusive. As far as I know, the new zones, costumes, powers, and gameplay mechanics are not handled by the writing staff. Which is understandable, because the writing staff is four chimpanzees throwing poop at a wall. If they had to suffer the oversight method of the rating system, or had any incentive to produce anything that was good rather than filling in a word-count, we might not have this problem. But as it stands, they don't, and we do.
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Uh... I'm pretty sure Troy Hickman plays the game.
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Troy never portrayed Statesman or the Phalanx as arseholes.
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No, I generally only make myself seem that way...
Like I have any choice.
Troy Hickman - So proud to have contributed to and played in this wonderful CoH universe
I'm conflicted.
I find myself wanting to defend the devs on these TFs because it looks as if they are trying to do better with them with every patch.
The writing isn't as bad as people are making it out to be and the aspects that I find offensive about the TFs (AVs as a whole making players inferior to the signature characters being one thing) aren't the fault of these two TFs and they can't be solved by them or the writers/designers of them. If you want something to complain about, complain for better AI and a retooling of the AV/TF/team challenge mechanics as a whole. The design mandate isn't set by the designers. It's set by Positron. Complain to him. The writers and designers are just doing their best to work within that mandate. It's not their call to change it, and frankly, that's what needs to be changed to fix the underlaying problem that goes well beyond cutscenes and flavour text as far as I'm concerned.
I don't see the point in flogging a guy who just got here in i13 when it's clear to me, one of the devs' most vitrol spewing critics, that the people in question are trying their best and are making some headway and improvements.
The TFs are unfinished content that's very much a work in progress that you got to see early. After seeing what I've seen so far, I'm willing to wait to see what goes live before lambasting anyone.
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The TFs are unfinished content that's very much a work in progress that you got to see early. After seeing what I've seen so far, I'm willing to wait to see what goes live before lambasting anyone.
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Who are you, and what have you done with Johnny Butane???
You know...The whole alternate-universe thing would be a great way to bring Hero 1 into the game. There is bound to be a alternate world where States went to the Rikti world instead of him.
dang, it is an alternate universe, well put johnny.
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The TFs are unfinished content that's very much a work in progress that you got to see early. After seeing what I've seen so far, I'm willing to wait to see what goes live before lambasting anyone.
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Who are you, and what have you done with Johnny Butane???
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This isn't a problem they promised to fix four years ago and didn't. This isn't shafting one AT's role and concept for the benefit of everyone else having a leveling crutch. And I'm pretty sure the writers and designers of this arc never came into a thread where I was working for improvements, pulled it off topic with frivolous comments, got it mod nuked and then laughed about it later.
It's not the same situation so I'm not going to treat it as being the same.
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I don't see the point in flogging a guy who just got here in i13 when it's clear to me, one of the devs' most vitrol spewing critics, that the people in question are trying their best and are making some headway and improvements.
The TFs are unfinished content that's very much a work in progress that you got to see early. After seeing what I've seen so far, I'm willing to wait to see what goes live before lambasting anyone.
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Those of us old enough to remember the original canon hack job changing all references to the 5th Column into the Council during I3 beta would also like to point out that the devs and writers do actually fix poor writing from time to time.
Butane's probably hit it on the head this time - whoever did the writing didn't have the kind of encyclopedic knowledge of game canon history that us obsessive players do, made a few assumptions based on the layout ("The 5th column is back, and they've liberated Reichsman") and went from there.
How many years has it been since someone last saw Axis Amerika, anyway?
My characters - all on Virtue.
Gabe's Internet [censored] Theory
RMT spammers WILL steal your credit card.
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You tell the story ALONG with the mission...not before and after. That way, everyone get's something out of the game and feels more a part of the gameworld. It's not about liking storytelling vs. combat vs. RP...its about seamlessly combining compelling elements together to create something greater than just a single aspect of gameplay could provide.
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That's actually one of the biggest things I've tried to work with in the Architect when making my own arc - never leave the player grinding enemies for more than a short while before something meaningful happens. It could be something as simple as a patrol making a comment or non-required clickie with a bit of background information, or it could be something as complicated as a boss fight or an NPC battle. For instance, I had a mission about going through a warehouse full of Freakshow and included a battle between them a some Security Guards for absolutely no reason that just to add something more to the mission. Not that it matters when it triggers so early.
It's also one place where so many Architect authors fail so miserably. I've had my fill of missions that have a short briefing followed by a Large map of NOTHING but grinding enemies and a boss fight, followed by a short debriefing, then rinse, repeat for four more. That's not the way to make an arc. That's not even the way to make a Diablo clone. That sort of thing bores even ME, and I enjoy clearing the Moth Cemetery map of all enemies.
True, the game doesn't have many subsystems to deliver storytelling in real time and interact with the environment, but what tools it does have CAN be used to create a much more immersive environment. Pity so many just click through them to fight more stuff faster.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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It's also one place where so many Architect authors fail so miserably. I've had my fill of missions that have a short briefing followed by a Large map of NOTHING but grinding enemies and a boss fight, followed by a short debriefing, then rinse, repeat for four more. That's not the way to make an arc. That's not even the way to make a Diablo clone. That sort of thing bores even ME, and I enjoy clearing the Moth Cemetery map of all enemies.
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I've tried my hardest to avoid that in my arc. Actually, you might accuse me of info overload...because I use clues liberally.
Still, there are some older dev created arcs where they make the same mistake and drag you through kill all after kill all just to get to some relevant information on what you're doing.
That aside, more types of objectives and interactions besides just glowies would be a welcome breath of fresh air for the content in this game. And I don't care if they get added to the MA or not...just add them to upcoming dev created content to make it more interesting overall.
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What do you mean 'alternate'? Statesman is a gigantic swaggering bully masquerading under a veneer of respectability because he's the least of a large group of dickheads.
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But he has a blue and red costume with a star on it.