Consolidated Thread: Statesman's Task Force
By
abnormal_joe,
Posted on: 2007-04-03 08:09 in The Market and Inventions
It's a feature (aka: bug). Similar to Rise of the Phoenix sometimes allowing you to die. I believe that's the power I was thinking of, if not, I'm sure someone will correct me.
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I keep reading about people stacking multiple vengeances off what appears to be a single teammate. I thought this was stopped in either I7 or I8 (cant remember which one). What am I missing?
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Vengeance has a 1.1 second activation time. It checks for Vengeance being active on people at the beginning of this period, but doesn't set the flag that marks people as having Vengeance active until the end of this period. As such, Vengeances activated before the flag from the first one is set will all stack.
It's a quirk of timing. For example: A activates Vengeance first, so count that as the baseline, 0.0 seconds. B activates theirs at +0.3 seconds, or three tenths of a second after A. C activates theirs at +0.9 seconds, and D activates theirs at +1.3 seconds. A's Vengeance sets the flag at the 1.1 second mark, so B and C's Vengeances will get through, while D's won't. So in this example, the team will end up with triple-stacked Vengeance - one from A, one from B, and one from C.
In practice, this is extremely difficult to pull off normally, and would be a non-issue. The problem is pulling it off abnormally. Suppose a team of 8 people, one of whom goes off somewhere out of line of sight and dies, and turns on their teleport prompt. Everyone but one targets them and clicks Vengeance - they'll get a Target Blocked message, but the power will be queued. The person who didn't queue the power hits Recall Friend, and while the prompt is up, queues their own Vengeance. Once that's all set up, the dead guy clicks accept on the teleport prompt, warps in, and all seven Vengeances go off simultaneously. And so, all seven stack. It's quite brutal. Even unslotted from Blasters, that's 122.5% Defense, 183.75% ToHit, and 306.25% Damage. Damage cap, two slotted Eludes, and three slotted Aims for each of the survivors.
And that's how you do that.
Jerk 4 Life
In brightest day, in blackest night/No evil shall escape my sight/Let those who worship evil's might/Beware my power ... Green Lantern's light!/(Meowth, that's right!)
My Arcs: #4827: Earth For Humans. #6391: Young Love.
Most people wouldn't. Unless you're specifically trying to do it, you'll almost never find it out.
My SG was running lots of 8 corrupter teams, all with Vengeance, for a while. Eventually we stumbled across it just from having hundreds of opportunities.
Jerk 4 Life
In brightest day, in blackest night/No evil shall escape my sight/Let those who worship evil's might/Beware my power ... Green Lantern's light!/(Meowth, that's right!)
My Arcs: #4827: Earth For Humans. #6391: Young Love.
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Attempted this TF with a SG team. Make up was as Follows:
50 Inv/EM Tank (me)
50 Fire/Kin Troller
50 Ill/Kin Troller
50 DM/Inv Scrapper
50 Mind/Emp Troller
50 FF/Rad Defender
50 Kat/Regen Scrapper
49 Emp/Rad Defender
Sadly we lost our Bubbler in the RV mission, and lost the Scrapper for the Thorn Tree and Aeon mission, but he made it back in time to help us take out 3 of the AV's in the final mission.
I think the Fire/Kin forgot that he had the Anti-Aeon Power. I know I sure as shooting forgot he had it. I was wondering why I died 4 times fighting Aeon compared to the easy kill he was the previous times I fought him.
We were able to pull the AV's apart by having the Tank (me) taunt Mako then Fly away while he followed me. WE wailed on him for quite sometime without interference from the other AV's, until he hit MoG when Scirrocco arrived. WE focused on Mako and he went down as soon as MoG wore off, without Scirrocco doing too much damage to us. Scirroco went down like a chump pretty fast. We were able to pull BS the same way as Mako without any issues, and he stayed on me very easily with Auto Taunt. WE had the first 3 AV's down within a 1/2 hour, wthout the need for any Shivans, Nukes, or Rads. Sadly GW just was not the same. We did lose the Kat/Regen Scrapper sometime between Mako and BS though, which didn't hurt us too much for the first three AV's, but he was sorely missed on GW. We fought her for 1.5 hours before people started gettign too tired and frustrated. WE couldn't get her any lower than 3/4 health without her Holding the tank and scrapper through mez toggles (Which is just plain wrong!) or healing off of everyone with Dark Regen back to full every 10 seconds or so.
The tactic we finally devised before everyone decided to put it on hold until Thursday was to havbe 1 Kin and 1 Emp Target through each of our Meleers and have them keep ID and CM on the Meleers while casting holds and Tranfusions at the same time. Eventually the Emp/Rad started running in to cast Atomic Blast and the Kins would Transferrence while he stood next to GW to replenish his End. This seemed to help drop her HP much better. We'll be using this tactic when we reconvene on Thursday to try to finish the last mission.
"Me, I assume 99% of the world's population are full-blown *******. Humanity seldomly lets me down."--Eisregen
�Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.�
― George Carlin
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The tactic we finally devised before everyone decided to put it on hold until Thursday was to havbe 1 Kin and 1 Emp Target through each of our Meleers and have them keep ID and CM on the Meleers while casting holds and Tranfusions at the same time. ... We'll be using this tactic when we reconvene on Thursday to try to finish the last mission.
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Always keep ID/CM on at least the tank, if not also on everyone facing GW (her Fear cone can also be a problem for those not directly targeted by her Hold).
If your Fire/Kin is present, make sure he dismisses his Imps for GW. She loves to see Imps whenever Dark Regen recharges. It's not worth trying to defense-buff Imps, and the caster can't drop purples on them.
Please try MA arc ID 351455, "Shard Stories: Scavenger's Hunt." Originally created for the Dr. Aeon contest, it explores the wild potential of one of the City's most concept-rich but content-poor settings: the Shadow Shard.
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I'm expecting the STF to be at least marginally easier to do on Live than it is on Test even if there are no changes.
There is something happening on Test that causes loading times of over five minutes for certain people on our STF runs. Most of them have never had it before, so this is a bit suspicious (in terms of I9 code).
This also means that I've been on three STF runs (out of four) so far where the team had to stop (mostly at the Thorn Tree) because our numbers got cut in half thanks to disconnects. It's a bit hard to test the final AVs if we can't even get there, and through no fault of player skill either.
Sorry, just a bit ticked off at the last failed run.
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Schrodinger's Gun, Dual Pistols/Mental Blaster, Virtue
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...Always keep ID/CM on at least the tank, if not also on everyone facing GW (her Fear cone can also be a problem for those not directly targeted by her Hold)....
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GW's hold is Approximately Mag 20. (exact value unknown)
CM, ID, CL, ST = Mag 12.9 Defender
CM, ID, CL, ST = Mag 10.4 Controller
Tanker Protections = Mag 12.9
Scrappers Protections = Mag 10.4
That means 2 CM's on squishies, and 1 CM+Sheilds on scrappers and tanks.
She can Hold through Granite + Rooted. That's 33 mag of protection. It's got to be more than a mag 20 hold.
Jerk 4 Life
In brightest day, in blackest night/No evil shall escape my sight/Let those who worship evil's might/Beware my power ... Green Lantern's light!/(Meowth, that's right!)
My Arcs: #4827: Earth For Humans. #6391: Young Love.
is a all controller team possible to beat the STF??
is there any builds that are felt left out???
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is a all controller team possible to beat the STF??
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All Controller: Yes. Most standard superteam builds would manage.
All Defender: Yes. Most standard superteam builds would manage.
All Tanker: hmm, maybe ? With a special build. I'd have to chat with the all tanker superteam. (Ghost Widow, ouch.)
Scrapper: hmm, maybe ? With a special build. I'd have to chat with the all scrapper superteam. (Ghost Widow, ouch.)
All Blaster: That's a lot of inspirations .... I'm thinking probably not. But if we put our minds and debt bars to the test, someone would probably manage.
Yeah we had the Fire/Kin dismiss the Imps when Fighting GW. The Ill/Kin was using PA on occasion, but it seemed as if GW was healing off of them as well. So we had her stop using them. Has anyone else noticed this behavior? I know Hami and the Mitos can kill PA's now, but can GW possibly be healing off of them?
"Me, I assume 99% of the world's population are full-blown *******. Humanity seldomly lets me down."--Eisregen
�Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.�
― George Carlin
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Yeah we had the Fire/Kin dismiss the Imps when Fighting GW. The Ill/Kin was using PA on occasion, but it seemed as if GW was healing off of them as well. So we had her stop using them. Has anyone else noticed this behavior? I know Hami and the Mitos can kill PA's now, but can GW possibly be healing off of them?
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how can Hami kill PA's??
if anyone wants to try to do a all blaster STF im in. i got a Fire/Fire blaster. with a build for each epic on test. anyone interested??
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She can Hold through Granite + Rooted. That's 33 mag of protection. It's got to be more than a mag 20 hold.
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QFT, when I ran the TF our tanker got held immediately and he had 4 CM's on him.
Bump and Grind Bane/SoA
Kenja No Ishi Earth/Empathy Controller
Legendary Sannin Ninja/Pain Mastermind
Entoxicated Ninja/PSN Mastermind
Ninja Ryukenden Kat/WP Scrapper
Hellish Thoughts Fire/PSI Dominator
Thank You Devs for Merits!!!!
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how can Hami kill PA's??
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They're grey to him.
Please try MA arc ID 351455, "Shard Stories: Scavenger's Hunt." Originally created for the Dr. Aeon contest, it explores the wild potential of one of the City's most concept-rich but content-poor settings: the Shadow Shard.
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how can Hami kill PA's??
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They're grey to him.
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As much as that answer is funner, this is the actual one (AFAIK):
Phantom Armies, Phase shift, Detention Field, etc all have the attribute Untouchable. Mag 3 for phase shift/dimension shift/black hole, mag 6-7.5 for detention field and the like, and mag 100 for PA (not like it matters). This is completely ignored by Hamidon and pals.
These powers also can have other related attributes, such as Intangible (others can walk through them), -threatlevel (so pets/NPCs don't waste attacks; also +threatlevel for Phantom Army so they're effective decoys), OnlyAffectsSelf (self-explanatory), and Translucency (visual effect). Untouchable is the one Hami ignores and nothing else (AFAIK) does.
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She can Hold through Granite + Rooted. That's 33 mag of protection. It's got to be more than a mag 20 hold.
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QFT, when I ran the TF our tanker got held immediately and he had 4 CM's on him.
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O.O That would be mag 65+
Gah, that puts a lot bigger emphasis on buffers, pets, and defense. Almost forcing team to NOT use tanks. Tanks are already the "red headed stepchild" of CoH, why make it worse and force us to take along even more defenders to babysit them, or controllers pets to make them obsolete.
At mag 65, I would consider that excessive emphasis on anti-melee anti-tank ability. Her Dark Regeneration is enough of a anti-melee anti-tank weapon alone.
Well, when that happened, my tank died pretty quick. Then got Vengeanced. Then Fallouted. Then Mutationed. And was 50, so who cares about the debt.
Not so big a thing.
Jerk 4 Life
In brightest day, in blackest night/No evil shall escape my sight/Let those who worship evil's might/Beware my power ... Green Lantern's light!/(Meowth, that's right!)
My Arcs: #4827: Earth For Humans. #6391: Young Love.
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how can Hami kill PA's??
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They're grey to him.
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Awesome reply!
Find me ingame @Norlon
Winter ST
All Blaster STF anyone??
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She can Hold through Granite + Rooted. That's 33 mag of protection. It's got to be more than a mag 20 hold.
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QFT, when I ran the TF our tanker got held immediately and he had 4 CM's on him.
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O.O That would be mag 65+
Gah, that puts a lot bigger emphasis on buffers, pets, and defense. Almost forcing team to NOT use tanks. Tanks are already the "red headed stepchild" of CoH, why make it worse and force us to take along even more defenders to babysit them, or controllers pets to make them obsolete.
At mag 65, I would consider that excessive emphasis on anti-melee anti-tank ability. Her Dark Regeneration is enough of a anti-melee anti-tank weapon alone.
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I think tanks will still be important when dealing with Recluse. But I do agree that buffing/debuffing is something very much needed.
When I did the STF, it was Mako that gave us the most trouble. We could not touch him. After pounding on him for 20 minutes (literally), we took off to Bloody Bay to all get shivans. Only when we all had shivans out (I used two) were we able to defeat him. Ghost Widow was tough, but nowhere near as tough as Mako.
We ended up not completing it because we had no empath for the tank to aggro Recluse. The tank kept dying and then Recluse kept running over to us and one shotting us as we tried to take out the towers. The best we did was to get one tower down to where the repairman spawned and the tower got healed.
It was a PUG and I'm pretty sure we didn't have optimal AT balance.
Uber Talgrim - level 50 emp/dark defender
Uber Rod - level 50 dark melee/regen scrapper
Rod Valdr - level 50 invuln/SS tanker
Talgrim - level 50 ninja/dark mastermind
OMG!! Please add these costume designs now!
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Gah, that puts a lot bigger emphasis on buffers, pets, and defense. Almost forcing team to NOT use tanks. Tanks are already the "red headed stepchild" of CoH, why make it worse and force us to take along even more defenders to babysit them, or controllers pets to make them obsolete.
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Disagree, all in all. Nothing holds aggro like a tank, not even Phantoms. Since GW's Hold is single-target, it's generally better to be able to focus all that mez-protection buffing on the one character who you know will be her target. The STF can be done without a tank, but I'd usually much rather have one around.
I'm a bit confused by the stepchild argument. It was quite true in the long-ago, but to me Tanks seem quite well-integrated into the hero party structure these days. Well, except for the bad Tank players, who are more of a danger than an asset to their team. They've always existed.
Please try MA arc ID 351455, "Shard Stories: Scavenger's Hunt." Originally created for the Dr. Aeon contest, it explores the wild potential of one of the City's most concept-rich but content-poor settings: the Shadow Shard.
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I keep reading about people stacking multiple vengeances off what appears to be a single teammate. I thought this was stopped in either I7 or I8 (cant remember which one). What am I missing?
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