Glad you started this up CB.. as I Respecced out of TB when I made my current PvP build. Will be switching back when I8 and Radio Missions come along to a more PvE build.
I have noticed that my HOs that I have in Thunderous blast doesn't SEEM as effective as before... but I am sure that is just me.
how do you have TB slotted? do you use BU/AIM +BL as a lead in?
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Arcanaville, you said you were having trouble killing even-level (yellow) lieutenants with Nova.
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I agree, this strikes me as odd also. I've got my Nova slotted 3 Damage / 3 recharge all 50++'s it takes out yellow LT's easily. I don't really know if it'll do it without Aim + Buildup since I never use it without Aim + Buildup.
So yeah Arcanaville, please let us know how you got it slotted and are you leading in with Aim + Buildup?
The thing about Nova is that the damage varies by mob. The 1st tick of smashing damage and 1st tick of energy damage are guaranteed. There is a 75% chance of a 2nd tick of energy damage, plus a 50% chance of a 3rd tick of energe damage (if the 2nd tick occurred). Based on my testing, these percentages are applied on a mob by mob basis - there is not a uniform test against all mobs in a spawn. It is quite possible for Nova to leave lieutenants alive if they only get hit by the initial ticks.
One thing to note about the 'nuke' powers is that they have multiple stages of damage. A bad series of die rolls could have a nuke doing only slightly more than a Snipe attack, albeit in an area of effect.
Nova is pretty typical for this. It has 4 damage components (in PvE):
- Smashing scale 1, 100% chance of activating
- Energy scale 2, 100% chance of activating
- Energy scale 1.75, 75% chance of activating
- Energy scale 1.75, 50% chance of activating.
Castle since you're lurking. What is the design intent behind the nukes draining power and stopping recovery? I know they are potent attacks, but it seems strange for them to have as many drawbacks as Elude.
(And a bonus question: What the thought behind MoG?)
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
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Makes sense.
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As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Ever the cagey answer. 
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
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Makes sense. Sometimes balance has to give way to the comics. I can dig it.
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As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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*Shaking and looking mean*
KKKKHHHHAAAAANNNN!!!!! KHAN!!!!!
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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LOL! 
TB 4 teh WIN!
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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That other discussion was heading for nuclear territory, so I'm spawning a new thread about the "nukes" alone.
Arcanaville, you said you were having trouble killing even-level (yellow) lieutenants with Nova. That strikes me as very odd and outside my own extensive personal experience with Thunderous Blast which should actually be doing less damage than Nova does, if City of Data is to be believed (though I'm not entirely convinced the numbers City of Data has for Thunderous Blast and/or Nova are correct).
I've had a handful of +2 level (red con) lieutenants survive a Thunderous Blast, but it is the exception to the rule rather than the rule itself.
How do you have it slotted? Are you using Aim and/or Build-Up first?
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What I said was, its not a guaranteed kill. The maximum damage potential of nova is enough to kill something like a red LT, but its not guaranteed. That was important to my point that if the power leaves you drained, but leaves a reasonable chance of leaving threats behind, its not really designed to be a very good alpha strike weapon.
And I've used nova as an alpha-strike weapon literally thousands of times. I'm not asking for help in maximizing its usefulness: I'm suggesting that nova and the other big blasts might be useful in spite of their design, instead of because of their design.
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In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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heh, heh.
Should have went Ice. I'm usually running the other way by the time the mobs realize who hit them with Blizzard.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
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I'm not questioning the conceptual validity of the crash, but rather whether they do enough damage given the crash.
I would suggest that this would represent the *lower* limit of how much damage nova should do: since a solo heroic mission can spawn a +1 LT, nova should be guaranteed to kill such a critter, if its designed to incapacitate the blaster completely.
Doesn't it seem reasonable, Castle, that if the big bangs are conceptually designed to incapacitate the blaster, at the very least they should be capable of delivering a *guaranteed* kill on a heroic solo spawn, assuming no extraordinary resistances? Extra damage beyond that would be extra damage beyond that: useful for people who run on invincible, for increasing the utility of the power in teams, etc.
Edit: assuming it hits at all: I'm not advocating for nova to be autohit
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
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Doesn't it seem reasonable, Castle, that if the big bangs are conceptually designed to incapacitate the blaster, at the very least they should be capable of delivering a *guaranteed* kill on a heroic solo spawn, assuming no extraordinary resistances?
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That does sound awfully reasonable. Solo, heroic, +1 lt, should be dead, considering the stiff penalty.
I think the real problem with the nukes have always been their activation time. They need to trigger a little faster to work as that last ditch effort to save yourself. As is, using them in this manner usually ends up with you hitting the floor with a dud nuke, which is double painful seeing as you now need to wait for it to recharge.
I agree with Arcanaville. Blizzard needs a much higher chance of knockdown to ensure this as well. Something like a 20% chance per .2 seconds as opposed to the 8% now. That way, it's at least statistically likely that each mob that's in the storm for 1 second will get knocked down.
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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I just had to laugh, I now know he plays a regen scrapper after a comment like that, thxs. FEEL my PAIN! 
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I think the real problem with the nukes have always been their activation time. They need to trigger a little faster to work as that last ditch effort to save yourself.
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This is part of what I was saying about the nukes. We don't exactly know what they are for (and Castle is implying they might not have been for anything at all specifically). But if they are meant to be alpha strike weapons, they should have enough damage potential to get the job done all by themselves, because their crash precludes finishing off crippled targets. If they are meant to be last-ditch finishing blows, they don't need to necessarily have as much damage to one-shot things, but they should activate very fast.
Which is the dillema regarding them. In my opinion, they are too slow to be finishing blows, and they are too weak to be alpha strike killers given their crash. Which means the combination of attributes makes them poorly designed.
If they were:
1. Really fast, so you could use them in an emergency
or
2. Strong enough to ensure there was almost no chance of something being left behind to fight you while you were crashed
or
3. Didn't crash endurance AND stop recovery (did one or the other, at worst), so you could continue to fight (albeit in a possibly degraded fashion) after the blast
They'd at least be *specifically* designed to function in a certain way, without players having to attempt to bypass the powers' restrictions in some way.
[Guide to Defense] [Scrapper Secondaries Comparison] [Archetype Popularity Analysis]
In one little corner of the universe, there's nothing more irritating than a misfile...
(Please support the best webcomic about a cosmic universal realignment by impaired angelic interference resulting in identity crisis angst. Or I release the pigmy water thieves.)
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If they were:
1. Really fast, so you could use them in an emergency
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Just out of curiousity, do you feel that Dreadful Wail is well-designed then, given its one-second activation time?
Life - a sexually transmitted terminal condition.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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heh, heh.
Should have went Ice. I'm usually running the other way by the time the mobs realize who hit them with Blizzard.
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Believe me, I would've went Ice if I'd known how this crazy game is actually played. Energy/Energy was my very first character. I was a newb and this is my very first MMO.
Energy looked cool. It had powers like Power Burst and Nova. It conjured up visions of Captain Atom, Starfire, Nova and Silver Surfer.
The only reference I had for Ice was a character that quit the X-men, got routinely shot down for a date by Firestar and played second banana to Spiderman.
Boy was I wrong.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not questioning the conceptual validity of the crash, but rather whether they do enough damage given the crash.
I would suggest that this would represent the *lower* limit of how much damage nova should do: since a solo heroic mission can spawn a +1 LT, nova should be guaranteed to kill such a critter, if its designed to incapacitate the blaster completely.
Doesn't it seem reasonable, Castle, that if the big bangs are conceptually designed to incapacitate the blaster, at the very least they should be capable of delivering a *guaranteed* kill on a heroic solo spawn, assuming no extraordinary resistances? Extra damage beyond that would be extra damage beyond that: useful for people who run on invincible, for increasing the utility of the power in teams, etc.
Edit: assuming it hits at all: I'm not advocating for nova to be autohit
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By my calculations, at lvl 50 Nova+BU+Aim will not defeat a +0 lieutenant if only the guaranteed ticks go off. A lvl 50 lieutenant has 860 hit points. The guaranteed damage of Nova is 166.83. Assuming 3 even SO's, BU & Aim (0.95+1.00+0.625), 166.83 x 3.575 = 596. If the 2nd energy tick goes off (which I believe is 1.5 DS, not 1.75), you would get an additional 298 dmg for 895 total, defeating the lieutenant.
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As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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I'm curious about all of the "suicide powers" in the Defensive sets (MoG, Elude, Overload, etc). The fact that most of them crash so hard means that, if you haven't finished the fight, you're dead when they crash (not unlike the "nuke" crash). I have a hard time seeing why that was implemented, when there's the relatively balanced "you can't attack for X amount of time" and hefty Endurance-penalty that Rage's crash has. Plus auto-killing toggle defenses is just harsh.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
[/ QUOTE ]
When the Human Torch goes nova, he's usually actually begun the fight and gotten a few hits in before he uses up everything he has in one final blow.
It's not an alpha strike. It's the omega strike. You gotta wound the bad guys first.
Snapshot
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I think the real problem with the nukes have always been their activation time. They need to trigger a little faster to work as that last ditch effort to save yourself.
[/ QUOTE ]
This is part of what I was saying about the nukes. We don't exactly know what they are for (and Castle is implying they might not have been for anything at all specifically). But if they are meant to be alpha strike weapons, they should have enough damage potential to get the job done all by themselves, because their crash precludes finishing off crippled targets. If they are meant to be last-ditch finishing blows, they don't need to necessarily have as much damage to one-shot things, but they should activate very fast.
Which is the dillema regarding them. In my opinion, they are too slow to be finishing blows, and they are too weak to be alpha strike killers given their crash. Which means the combination of attributes makes them poorly designed.
If they were:
1. Really fast, so you could use them in an emergency
or
2. Strong enough to ensure there was almost no chance of something being left behind to fight you while you were crashed
or
3. Didn't crash endurance AND stop recovery (did one or the other, at worst), so you could continue to fight (albeit in a possibly degraded fashion) after the blast
They'd at least be *specifically* designed to function in a certain way, without players having to attempt to bypass the powers' restrictions in some way.
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It would seem to me that if it was a "panic" button attack that may or may not eliminate a foe while draining the user it should perhaps have a "shellshock" component. With the exception of Ice, all of the Nukes I know are about are explosions, so it seem reasonable to me to have a short duration disorient.
"The only thing to crave is Immortality, and Death is the last rube to cheat."
They trained the Rikti to drop Fire on people, but they won't let them write (Censored) on their spaceships because it is obscene!
That other discussion was heading for nuclear territory, so I'm spawning a new thread about the "nukes" alone.
Arcanaville, you said you were having trouble killing even-level (yellow) lieutenants with Nova. That strikes me as very odd and outside my own extensive personal experience with Thunderous Blast which should actually be doing less damage than Nova does, if City of Data is to be believed (though I'm not entirely convinced the numbers City of Data has for Thunderous Blast and/or Nova are correct).
I've had a handful of +2 level (red con) lieutenants survive a Thunderous Blast, but it is the exception to the rule rather than the rule itself.
How do you have it slotted? Are you using Aim and/or Build-Up first?
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