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I think the real problem with the nukes have always been their activation time. They need to trigger a little faster to work as that last ditch effort to save yourself.
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This is part of what I was saying about the nukes. We don't exactly know what they are for (and Castle is implying they might not have been for anything at all specifically). But if they are meant to be alpha strike weapons, they should have enough damage potential to get the job done all by themselves, because their crash precludes finishing off crippled targets. If they are meant to be last-ditch finishing blows, they don't need to necessarily have as much damage to one-shot things, but they should activate very fast.
Which is the dillema regarding them. In my opinion, they are too slow to be finishing blows, and they are too weak to be alpha strike killers given their crash. Which means the combination of attributes makes them poorly designed.
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Not necessarily. Maybe they're not a "open-up-the-fight-with-it" or a "last-ditch-oh-crap" power. Maybe they're more of a "use-it-while-you -still-can" power. As such, I tend to use nukes on my blasters and defenders not as an alphastrike but after I've softened the mobs up a bit though certainly not when I'm a hair's width from defeat.
50 Fire/Dev | 50 AR/Dev | 50 Ninjas/FF MM | 50 Bots/Dark | 50 Kin/Rad |
44 EM/Regen | 39 BS/Regen | 38 Kin/Elec | 27 Thugs/Pain
"Rare is the man so noble that he will always give thanks for that which is freely given." -Jock_Tamson
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital. 
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The human torch is an upper level hero like states or recluse, and . .. incarnate! that's the word.
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Not necessarily. Maybe they're not a "open-up-the-fight-with-it" or a "last-ditch-oh-crap" power. Maybe they're more of a "use-it-while-you -still-can" power. As such, I tend to use nukes on my blasters and defenders not as an alphastrike but after I've softened the mobs up a bit though certainly not when I'm a hair's width from defeat.
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That would make sense to me (and would be a good use) if the Nukes didn't have a 3 second animation time. When you soften things up, you tend to get aggro.
If you've been peppered by the whole spawn during the 3 second run up to your Nuke and you miss one or two mobs with your Nuke (or it doesn't kill the boss) then things aren't so pretty as you sit there with zero end giving them a big smile.
It's probably just my own personal taste, but once the action starts I prefer to use fast-activating attacks.
The ONLY thing I can say here.. as an Elec/Elec Blaster.. I have a Blue and Power Sink to fall back on...so it isnt a Kill all/ or die kinda a power... and most things wont live through
AIM/BU TB/blue/PS/SC... if htey are ALIVE.. they dont have END.. UNLESS they are AV or GM status.
Kurse Darkstone
PROUD MEMBER OF THE VIRTUE FAMILY!!
Station Manager for RadioFTW!
Member of the Legion Of Freedom!
Proud member of the Paragonian Knights
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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Yeah but The Human Torch would have started playing WoW after one month of owning everything in CoH with no chance of being pummeled.
You, however, will keep playing :P
This is also why they won't give me Superman's powersets....
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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First of all, you don't Form Blazing Sword or drop a Spirit Bomb until your enemy is properly softened up.
Besides, I saw that movie :P ...all theHuman Torch's Nova did by itself was cheese the AV off. It took teamwork to drop that AV.
Story Arcs I created:
Every Rose: (#17702) Villainous vs Legacy Chain. Forget Arachnos, join the CoT!
Cosplay Madness!: (#3643) Neutral vs Custom Foes. Heroes at a pop culture convention!
Kiss Hello Goodbye: (#156389) Heroic vs Custom Foes. Film Noir/Hardboiled detective adventure!
My usage is normally:
NOVA: stealth-bu-aim-nuke-blue-flee the survivors.
THUNDEROUS BLAST: [defender] aim-power build up- nuke- personal force field
INFERNO: Follow the tank, warn the team, bu/aim/nuke.
Yesterday, we aggroed four spawns, plus an AV, at once. ["Why Fire Controllers Are Not Necessarily Better than Fire Blasters", pt. xx ] I think a couple nukes went off in that fight- I was busy. It was certainly the time for it.
Mini-guides: Force Field Defenders, Blasters, Market Self-Defense, Frankenslotting.
So you think you're a hero, huh.
@Boltcutter in game.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yes, but they can only hit 16 foes now so, IMHO, the Torchy feel is gone.
Shouldn't they be changed to something more functional like AR's Full Auto or Archery's Rain of Arrows? I know when I play either of these Blasters I can contribute much more to teams than with the other Torch-styled Nukes.
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And when I say contribute more with AR/NRG or Archery/NRG I mean I am contributing something that no other AT or Blasters with standard Nukes can and that is rapidly respond to suppress large numbers of foes. True they are mostly minions, but both sets offer good single target attacks and cones for mopping up the remainder, but Bosses, AV's are the Scrapper and Tank targets and that is usually all my AR/NRG will leave behind. Blasters are supposed to be damage dealers without equal and the AR/NRG with Full Auto is, but the Blasters with 6 minute recharge, zero-endurance Nukes that only hit 16 foes (now) are easily over-shadowed on teams by Scrappers and Controllers for damage dealt/abilities, or so it seems to me sometimes.
Anyway, that's my 2 cents worth of insight.
Blasters I am playing...
lvl 41 Elec/Elec
lvl 37 AR/Nrg
lvl 39 Ice/Nrg
lvl 35 Archery/Nrg
lvl 33 Nrg/Nrg
lvl 30 Ice/Dev
lvl 29 Archery/Dev
lvl 21 Fire/Nrg
Quixotik
"I did not say this. I am not here." -Guild Navigator
Mr. XX...
As per the missions I ran last inght.. and I have to admit, it was with some of the most veteran players I know...
I was pretty much taking down bosses, AND it's lil minions.. and the scrappers and tanks were cleaning up my messes 
of course I have a mantra that I live by... You cant get hit, if your opponent cant lift thier arms.
Kurse Darkstone
PROUD MEMBER OF THE VIRTUE FAMILY!!
Station Manager for RadioFTW!
Member of the Legion Of Freedom!
Proud member of the Paragonian Knights
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meh to the above, i can't see Blizzard being an alpha to anything other than Rikti Monkies
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Um, my level 35 Ice/Ice routinely stomps +1's and +2's into the dirt with Blizzard. The ability to use Aim and BU with many Rain type powers has greatly increased their efficacy.
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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Does the nuke from En/En Nova leave the blaster disoriented? I ask because I have never had this happen after I fire off Nova, I pop a few blues and finish off whoever is left. I am also running CJ and Accrobatics so that maybe why I am not getting disoriented. My blaster is only lvl 32 so I don't know if it will disorient my blaster as she gets higher in lvl's and in power.
Thanx for the info.
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There's no disorient in Nova.
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Okay which nova power does disorient? I know I have seen players shoot off a tier 32 nova and then do the "Drunk Walk" due to the power of the nuke.
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Dreadful Wail in the sonic set.
Edit: Oh I thought you meant things that made the *mobs* disoriented :P
Just goes to show how few people play sonic that no one corrected me yet on a gamer forum, a place known for people being all-too-eager to correct you.
No, some nukes *used* to do that to the hero... no longer.
Man, it was rough, too -
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meh to the above, i can't see Blizzard being an alpha to anything other than Rikti Monkies
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!!!
Good lord mate you have to be a hold over from the pre-rain-buff days.
Ice Storm and Blizzard are MONEY now that they are buffable! MONEY!
Heck you can take out whole spawns without even stepping into sight... that's just sick.
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meh to the above, i can't see Blizzard being an alpha to anything other than Rikti Monkies
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!!!
Good lord mate you have to be a hold over from the pre-rain-buff days.
Ice Storm and Blizzard are MONEY now that they are buffable! MONEY!
Heck you can take out whole spawns without even stepping into sight... that's just sick.
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Nonsense, my friend, nonsense. Ashamed that a fellow Chicagoan would post such nonsense.
Blizzard is in firm need of a buff. It's gimp. Up the KD chance to 20% per .2 seconds. Admittedly, this is barely enough to make the power passable, but Ice Blasters are used to being the underdog. 
The City of Heroes Community is a special one and I will always look fondly on my times arguing, discussing and playing with you all. Thanks and thanks to the developers for a special experience.
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meh to the above, i can't see Blizzard being an alpha to anything other than Rikti Monkies
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!!!
Good lord mate you have to be a hold over from the pre-rain-buff days.
Ice Storm and Blizzard are MONEY now that they are buffable! MONEY!
Heck you can take out whole spawns without even stepping into sight... that's just sick.
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Nonsense, my friend, nonsense. Ashamed that a fellow Chicagoan would post such nonsense.
Blizzard is in firm need of a buff. It's gimp. Up the KD chance to 20% per .2 seconds. Admittedly, this is barely enough to make the power passable, but Ice Blasters are used to being the underdog.
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....
....
....
Are you serious?
Normally I know but this time I can't tell.
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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Are you serious?
Normally I know but this time I can't tell.
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your BSometer is seriously broken.
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Are you serious?
Normally I know but this time I can't tell.
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your BSometer is seriously broken.
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I blame Issue 8
Sign It : http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
I don't have experience with the nukes as a Blaster, but do as a Corruptor. Not sure if there's a difference there, but on my team, I duo with another Corruptor quite consistently. A simultaneous nuke from both of us usually clears out an entire spawn. Maybe y'all should pick up some teammates. :P
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meh to the above, i can't see Blizzard being an alpha to anything other than Rikti Monkies
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!!!
Good lord mate you have to be a hold over from the pre-rain-buff days.
Ice Storm and Blizzard are MONEY now that they are buffable! MONEY!
Heck you can take out whole spawns without even stepping into sight... that's just sick.
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Nonsense, my friend, nonsense. Ashamed that a fellow Chicagoan would post such nonsense.
Blizzard is in firm need of a buff. It's gimp. Up the KD chance to 20% per .2 seconds. Admittedly, this is barely enough to make the power passable, but Ice Blasters are used to being the underdog.
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I can't tell if you're serious or not....
All I know is what I do with it, fellow Windy Cityite.
And I doth pwn. I've had no trouble with this power since the buff... if it has any drawback at all, it is the extended time return fire is allowed vs. the other "instant" nukes... and the fact that I can place my nuke around corners MORE than makes up for that.
Why is it "gimp"? Great damage, a slow... when you combine it with any other AoE effect it is just SUPREME. (I happen to use mine with caltrops and blizzard... it may be the only reason I find Ice/Dev fun anymore now that I can't tote my AT around with me.)
Edit: OK so he was joking then....
Man I just can't tell on the forums any more....
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
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Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
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Yeah but The Human Torch would have started playing WoW after one month of owning everything in CoH with no chance of being pummeled.
You, however, will keep playing :P
This is also why they won't give me Superman's powersets....
[/ QUOTE ]I am getting pretty tired of people saying that making us weaker will keep us playing longer. I would like to see some data on this. If you can't back it then I simply don't belive you and will not count it as a valid argument.
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Dreadful Wail in the sonic set.
Edit: Oh I thought you meant things that made the *mobs* disoriented :P
Just goes to show how few people play sonic that no one corrected me yet on a gamer forum, a place known for people being all-too-eager to correct you.
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What you didn't see was me burning you in effigy.
Lest you think we're getting nice around here.
Life - a sexually transmitted terminal condition.
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Probably the best way to answer this is to refer to comics -- When The Human Torch 'goes nova' he puts everything he has into it and pretty much knocks himself out. That's the 'feel' these powers are meant to reflect.
As for MoG, no comment at this time.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yea but when the Human Torch goes nova, he can melt Ultron to slag.
When I go nova, there's still two remaining Devouring Earth bosses that chuckle and then proceed to introduce my hero's face to a radical pummeling and an opportunity to use my HMO copay on the teleport to the hospital.
[/ QUOTE ]
Yeah but The Human Torch would have started playing WoW after one month of owning everything in CoH with no chance of being pummeled.
You, however, will keep playing :P
This is also why they won't give me Superman's powersets....
[/ QUOTE ]I am getting pretty tired of people saying that making us weaker will keep us playing longer. I would like to see some data on this. If you can't back it then I simply don't belive you and will not count it as a valid argument.
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"Making us weaker...."? Heh.... whew the forums are hot today....
Anyway, people are fond of pointing out the incredibly powerful nature of comic book heroes as compared to our CoX heroes while in the process of finding flaw with the "heroes" in-game.
I am simply saying that actually possessing the power lvls of the true comic heroes would not be very interesting - you'd be able to kill anything, there'd be no challenge, etc. - Human Torch would have moved on to WoW by now, where at least a PvP specced warlock could give him a run for his money ;P Beyond that, no dev company could balance around such a thing as the power lvls of some of the comic heroes, just as D7D was loathe to build modules for epic lvl heroes for many years. You end of with "power inflation", which always ends ugly - just look at "The Beyonder".... a being specifically created by the writers because so many heroes existsed which seemed "beyond threat".
As far as "valid arguments"... man this place makes me sad today... I'll only go so far as to say 'challenge extends gameplay'. This is of course only true with respect to gamers who enjoy challenge, which are in turn the only gamers I respect.
Since this particular game still plays host to people who still violently react in favor of the old days of unstoppable zone-herding fire tanks and tank-for-teams-of-8 regen scrappers, I understand not everyone feels the same way.
That said, I promise it's ok that you don't "count it as a valid argument" since I'm not playing the forum-argument games today. I'm just weighing in. Everything doesn't have to be a bunsen burner debate.
Oh people could be yearning for something other than the tired old MMO dynamic that doesn't fit the comic superhero milieu very well at all. There's a new Superman game coming out where Superman doesn't have health or energy bars, but the city of Metropolis does. Superman cannot be defeated, but players can lose the game if Metropolis takes too much damage.
That's superhero-like. CoX's tired MMO formula comes from the old swords & sorcery trope that dates back to Dungeons and Dragons.
A solution does not have to be what the Superman game envisioned, but a solution that better fits the superhero source genre would have been apropos. Something will always feel "off" about this game, and sometimes people flail a little wildly in trying to put their fingers on it.
Life - a sexually transmitted terminal condition.
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Mr. XX...
As per the missions I ran last inght.. and I have to admit, it was with some of the most veteran players I know...
I was pretty much taking down bosses, AND it's lil minions.. and the scrappers and tanks were cleaning up my messes
of course I have a mantra that I live by... You cant get hit, if your opponent cant lift thier arms.
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I have an Elec/Elec too, lvl 41, and I am not saying it's bad, it has Thunderous Blast fully slotted and Powersink and Short Circuit slotted with End Mods for draining, which is a nice trick, but it could never keep up with the AR/Nrg. And only because of the difference between Full Auto and Thunderous Blast's recharge and endurance restrictions. Other than that, I'd have to say Electric's pre-32 powers are better than AR's.
I don't expect the Nukes will be changed, but I thought I would point this out since the AR/Nrg is so much more enjoyable to play in PvE, especially with a full team or on a TF.
Quixotik
"I did not say this. I am not here." -Guild Navigator
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As far as "valid arguments"... man this place makes me sad today... I'll only go so far as to say 'challenge extends gameplay'. This is of course only true with respect to gamers who enjoy challenge, which are in turn the only gamers I respect.
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This is true to a point.
I have great fun setting up difficult battles for myself in Dawn of War Dark Crusade (2 computer opponents or maybe a map not in my favor). Now, I am [censored] while I am playing, but I have a blast watching the replays and seeing what my opponents are doing while they fight me. It keeps me fresh for LAN nights as well, but that is a side benefit. Really, I just enjoy watching that really tough fight I had and what happened dureing it without haveing to worry about the outcome. Lets me watch a good battle without getting stressed out.
When I am relaxed and feeling pretty good, then I'll gear up for a challenge again.
What am I getting at? It is good to have challenge but it needs to be in moderation. When game developers stop putting the challenges in moderation, I start breaking out the cheats just to relieve my stress. Dawn of War is great. I can fight a really tough battle, then relax, then do it all again if I want.
Now, depending on what a players goal is every player will have a different challenge in this game. If your goal is to defeat the enemy, then the challenge doesn't exist in this game. If you are trying to hit 50 in 3 months then you have a different sort of challenge.
I realize this is a bit off topic, but several people have been talking about how difficult or not difficult some new games are and it has inspired me.
The great games I have come to find, mix challenges with relaxing moments in the game or give the player time to come down off of his edge and steel himself for the next challenge.
MMOs don't really do that though, unless they have crafting. Then the player basicaly takes a break from the grind and goes about crafting. Even crafting can be a form of a challenge though and eventually some players may view it as not so much as a break but a hinderance of their goal to the end game.
In CoH the breaks in the game are the Paragon Dance Party, and Travel time to contacts or missions.
I had a point to all of this, but I think I forgot it somewhere along the way. Maybe I am just hinting that if someone is challenged enough for too long, people just start getting burned out and looking for a new form of release.
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I would suggest that this would represent the *lower* limit of how much damage nova should do: since a solo heroic mission can spawn a +1 LT, nova should be guaranteed to kill such a critter, if its designed to incapacitate the blaster completely.
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/agree
I think their current design is left over from the days of 5-6 slotted damage.
PS: I also like the three design idea.
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There's a lot in this game that still hearkens back to the 5 & 6 slot days.
Virtue: multiple characters.
CoH/V: Woot! Maybe Fun is to be had once again.
Ack! RUN! Regen is glowing mean & green!
If it reduces you, it's a nerf.
If it buffs the mobs, it's challenge.
They are not the same.