Statesman's and Positron's 2nd Anniversary Address
By
8_Ball,
Posted on: 2006-04-28 08:03 in Developers' Corner
Since it will be almost a year if not a little more till I9 or whatever the $$expansion will be called, we have plenty of time to save our pennies. Is it that hard to put back $5.00 a month for 10 months? Also who are we to say that "the content better be for lvl 40- 50 or it won't be worth it." These updates aren't just for the diehards who have been playing since day one and have a server full of Keldians...they will be for the newbies and the lowbies as well. I'm sure there will be a fair balance of content for everyone, but even if it does lean toward the sub lvl 20 crowd, we all have to start our alts there. It's just amazing to me how fast in these threads we all went from praising the Devs for two great years (5 months for me I started in November) to [censored] and moaning about money we won't have to spend for another year! As someone said earlier "let's burn that bridge when we come to it" and worry about our FREE I7 and I8.
I'm reminded of Socrates when he said, "I drank what?"
Mr. Shane- lvl 50 eng/eng blaster (virtue)
Abatu- lvl 50 rad/therm corrupter (freedom)
Demon Outlaw- lvl 50 fire/eng blaster (virtue)
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I do have to admit though... it is somewhat distressing in that we've gone from 4 updates/year to 2/year and we are looking at Issue 9 possibly being the paid expansion. Looking at that, one could legitimately say that we are getting less and paying more for it.
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here here
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the fact that we got free expansions to date, doesn't make it inherently wrong that we will pay reasonable amounts in the future.
I for one don't mind, if this accelerates new content, powersets, etc by directly funding more dev resources. If it simply fattens their bottom line, that on the other hand isn't so amenable 
can you bring back the crew cut hair style that was there before I6?...
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Six solid issues - good, bad, or otherwise - of free content.
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How can it be bad or otherwise and still be solid? :-) I really don't count Issue 4 an 6 as updates. Issue 6 was literally CoV. If you downloaded Issue 6 you didn't even need to install your CoV DVD. All we got in I6 was prestige/salvage and bases, none of which can be accessed w/o buying CoV (well get prestige an salvage but can't use it yourself...) And issue 4 was a costume patch wrapped in the arena which is typically dead aside from the occasional fight night and now gladiator matches with their badge connection...
Still 4 good issues in 2 years isn't too bad. I don't think anyone is saying that they haven't done anything for us I didn't notice where Positron said they'd continue to provide free content alongside the retail box(es) though. So if you want to be doom an gloom you can assume Issue 9 will be the last free content update we ever get...
Though I think there are some things that a retail expansion simply must have.
-Atleast One distinct and inventive PvP zone, maybe a lowbie one for giggles...
-One new powerset for each AT. Unique and interesting possibly with some synergy with already existing powers.
-Atleast 2 unique zones or one new/unique zone and one revitalized zone in the case of CoH...
-A new gameplay feature such as Skills, etc.
-Costume parts out the wazoo for both sides.
-Some special feature like more advanced costume customization, Power Appearance Customization, etc
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If you have that much of a problem with retail box updates, then don't buy them. You'll still be able to play your Hero/Villain. It may sound harsh, and I don't mean for it to sound that way. But let's set aside wants/desires/expectations/whatever, and look at what's relevant here.
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See here's the catch though. They tend to get you in a position where you almost NEED to buy them CoV is the best example with the base access deal. For SG's bases are a major symbol of pride and useful for numerous things, w/o CoV you haven't got access to that. Doing things like that is how they convince people to buy them when they're on the fence or otherwise might not.
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Free issue updates can only do so much.
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I'd like to think these Free Updates were only hindered by the amount of time they had to get them out the door and not their desire to save the good stuff for a box that they can charge us for or that they didn't work as hard because they were free updates...
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I'd also NOT like to have anymore EATs that are locked into 1primary & 1 secondary.
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It was said under the last regime that you wouldn't have to unlock Epics anymore or atleast not by leveling. I dunno how Lord Positron will run things but assuming he holds that course and since he said the expansion will have an Epic AT I guess from now on we just buy ATs.
And how they design them or choose to is a mystery. One thing about giving them their own specific powersets is that they can then balance the AT's powers and any inherents a tad bit easier.
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Want new animations? Either wait forever and a day via the monthly subscription angle or put out a new expansion (which comes with funding) and hire some to take care of the animation needs.
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Why would they do that when they can use monthly fees to fund an expansion pack we have to pay 20 bucks for? They sell those and it might as well be free money. I seriously doubt they'd take much, if any, of the earnings and hire more people.
And Posi said they'll get Issue 9 out for free in his address I believe.
(Oh an Asheron's Call was released in 1999 though it seems like it was earlier)
As long as these expansions aren't more than 15-20 dollars I'll be fine with them.
I probably won't buy many of them but I'll be fine with them. I mean for crying out loud CoH an CoV are only 30 bucks each now...They can't charge more than that for an expansion...can they?
As long as we get more slots per server when the CoX-Box is realeased I'll be a happy pumpkin!
Creepy - Claws/WP Clown - 50 - August 10, 2008
Juniper's Daughter - Fire/Regen Scrapper - 50 - April 12, 2009
Fae Leigh - Grav/Kin Troller - 50 - May 30, 2010
I don't see us getting many more slots.
Maybe server transfer?
So does the new box expansion mean the end of free issues? Or will there continue to be free issues between the boxes?
@Arwen Darkblade
Proud Member of Hammer of the Gods and Sanguine Syndicate
Arc ID #86194 "Cry Havoc"
Arc ID #103934 "Dr. Thomas' First Day"
[URL="http://tobyfife.blogspot.com/"]Hero Girl[/URL] - my geek culture blog
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So does the new box expansion mean the end of free issues? Or will there continue to be free issues between the boxes?
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I assume things will continue as normal, with free Issues coming out regularly, and the occasional Retail CoX-Box (I wonder if anyone at Cryptic is beginning to regret the "City of" name 
).
Agua Man lvl 48 Water/Electric Blaster
"To die hating NCSoft for shutting down City of Heroes, that was Freedom."
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So does the new box expansion mean the end of free issues? Or will there continue to be free issues between the boxes?
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End of? Doubtful - the letter seems to say we'll have another normal Issue coming out after the box.
Damage to? I'd wager. I can't see these boxes making Cryptic enough money to reclaim the time and money they'll be putting into the content coming with 'em.
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So does the new box expansion mean the end of free issues? Or will there continue to be free issues between the boxes?
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My guess: the boxed expansions will have as much affect on the free Issues as the CoV expansion did.
In other words, resources will be dedicated to pursuing that payday, while the "maintenance" stuff gets backburnered.
Geesh. People used to call me a Dev apologist!
Wow, that's scary. I think I just agreed with Foo.
Ew...
I just wonder, though - the monthly fees we've all been paying, which used to give us 4 updates per year won't be going down, and they'll be paid expansions on top of the reduced number of free updates. So... uh... yeah...
Actually; you'd pay the same monthly fee anywhere else... and likely wouldn't get as many free updates (you'd still be paying for expansions; you just wouldn't get half the free stuff we get).
I hate to say it but; I think some of us have gotten a little spoiled on the free content thing... I mean; I love it; but remember that your 15 bucks a month does *all* of the following:
Server maintnence/hardware upgrades; stuff we never 'see' but the stuff that keeps the game from crashing into a fiery hell (like EQ used to back when I played)
Salary (for a whole lot more people that just the devs)
Content updates (which they never quite promised us a specific number... they've given us targets; and trust me; I want 4 per year as much as anyone... but I also have played MMOs for a very long time; 3 a year, 2 a year, we're still far better off than most games).
Frankly also; I believe that while the *number* of issues may slide down; the quality will increase.
Compare for example: Issue 1/2 vs Issue 3/5 (content wise)
Rikti Crash Site - I've heard nothing but complaints about it. And alot of people asking when it'll be redone. That tells me it wasn't a high quality zone.
Peregrine - I've been there a few times... and it's rather bland. The only thing interesting to me there has been the Malta groups that occasionally appear; but the backdrop itself is... boring. Though Portal Corp is kinda cool.
Neither of those zones is dynamic.
The Hollows - Decent place for XP; not very dynamic either; and *EXTREMELY* deadly for a fair number of low level characters. Again; has been complained about many times.
Strigia - Has been praised *many* times for being interesting and unique; the zone *is* interesting; things move; the Council patrols make sense; and the air battles you see going on are just plain awesome even if it is just a repeating animation. (Compared to the "alright, everyone line up 18th century style... with sniper rifles... 10 feet away" animation we see regularly in mob fights).
Croatoa - Easily imho the most interesting of all the PVE zones in CoH; not just the *type* of content; but the fact that the world feels immersive. Enemies *really* fight eachother; using powers and everything else at their disposal. The world is alive; the tuatha roam in packs; while the Fir Bolg turn themselves into trees and lie in wait. And the Cabal's whole Combat Air Patrol thing is just too cool imho. Combined with the ghosts comming out at night; it's a much in depth zone than the rest of CoH.
Most of CoV's zones follow the Croatoa mold; they *breathe*; things happen in them; there are gunfights, longbow patrols, mob executions... etc... things *happen*.
So yes; the number of issues has gone down; but the quality (judging by CoV; Strigia, and Croatoa) has improved *drastically*.
So I'd have to challenge you; which do you prefer? TONS of new content; which is just like the old content with new mob skins; but absolutely no new 'life'; or a smaller amount of content with some seriously *interesting* parts to it?
I myself far prefer the latter. Yes the wait is longer; but the payoff is outstanding. The retail boxes will definitely be in addition to issues; and I suspect they'll be 'super issues' in a sense... ie: instead of one or two zones; and maybe a few powersets; we'll see several zones, a few powersets, and maybe an EAT too.
Remember, they want the next several EATs to be very special; while Kheldians for many felt a bit hacked together. (Not that they aren't quite cool; but they weren't as well integrated into the CoX storyline as they could have been because there was *0* real build up; no.. the 5th Column/Council War doesn't count; we had no indication of anything about the Nictus involvement with the Council till post-issue)
Anyway; sorry for that but I'm really getting annoyed with the attitudes of some people here. Call me a fanboi if you want; you'd be wrong on it, but I suspect that's what'll come right about... now.
Flame away! <sigh> Damn kids.
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Hmmm. I don't remember that content poll...
I may have voted in it, or I may not have.
Now I feel bad.
Oh well.
Grats Pos, lookin forward to another year.
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I only saw one poll and it wasn't much of one. Basically, it only asked to pick two of a list of pre-generated environments [ie. Underwater, space station, moon, mars, etc.].
I really don't want to show disrepect for a great game, but someone has to say it.
I really don't wan to pay a monthly fee and have to buy a new "expansion" every two years. Maybe this is what it take to keep this game on-line. I don't know. I know that the last new box was $40+ and came with an increase in my monthly fee. Minor benefit that it was - the most benifit that I recieved was my additional character slots and Siren's Call (which I go to pretty infrequently because the balance is still terribly broken in my opinion - and it is still "tag your it" no matter what anyone says). I don't want to play a villian all the time. I'll play one infrequently - and even less so than I would if they were really villians.
CoV feels like I'm still a hero - I'm just doing sort-of bad things - if that makes any sense. I steal money, but I don't really get it. I steal weapons, but I don't get them - I turn them over to someone else? Anachros broke me out of jail, but their thugs attack me on the street. I kidnap people, but I don't hold them for ransom - I turn them over to someone else. But players seem to be enjoying it, and that's fine. I'd like to see how much player time has been spent in CoV versus CoH since CoV has been release though. I bet it is pulling players away from CoH - thus, lessening the ability to get on/gather a team - and it is a team based game....
I'd like to see more varied lower level content - new story lines. I have a 50 sure, but If it's just more missions at 50 - it seems kind of pointless to me. I like that rush of leveling and that new feeling of getting a new power, even if I've achieve it with another character.
What made me really upset was how CoV was made to appear to be a big new stand alone thing, well I guess CoV was stand alone. Get CoV and get the content. it's just CoH wasn't stand alone with out CoV - don't get CoV, dont' get the new content (superhero bases, access to the PvP zones.) You can still play it, but... you know what I'm saying.
- The bases and PvP access should have been given as a free expansion to CoH. We shouldnt' be required to have CoV to have access to CoH content.
Boxed expansion (I mean stand-alone game I guess) versus free expansion..free expansion? Well, I did pay for it or you wouldn't have made it. It's just that my monthly fees went to the new content versus paying for a box a the store. This new free content is mroe for the CoV players than its for the CoH players, and Once the next box set comes out, we can expect the new "free"c content to be for the new boxed set versus the CoH or CoV - of course, it looks like the New CoX will cap-ons for CoH and CoV, so that "stand alone game" will probably necessary to have complete content for both CoH and CoV, of course - you could just get it and get all the benefits of the new game...and quit playing CoH and CoV...it will just lure more people away from CoH...This new box set (expansion) will have to be pretty major to get me excited enough to buy it...and I'll tell you now, the only reason I bought CoV was pretty much the beta. If I hadn't had the chance to play the beta, I wouldn't have given it a chance - extra slots or no - PvP or no.
heck even PvP is getting to be a joke. Characters are standing on top of a building duelling in Siren's call on Champion server...why aren't they in the arena? Heroes and villians standing side by side? attack a villian and the heroes don't help you and the villians swarm you because you are disrupting them? what's that all about?
I don't even know what the gladiator thing was all about.
Free ideas are great to get, they are free and you can turn them around and make money off of them. That's great. You can even pick and choose which ones are "yours' and take credit for them. Great. There are alot of people posting. Lots of free content ideas.
I'm furstrated. I'm tired.
There are more fans that are excited. You can get back to one of their posts now....that seems to be most of them....
...I do really like the idea of CoH, and I love to play with people that want to be heroes...
I just don't see anyone saying that it ain't all sunny and roses...so here's this post. I've wasted enough of my free time.
I'd delete this, but I've already wasted my time writing it.
The developers also stated that while the free issues wouldn't be as frequent they would be much larger issues. So much larger issues that won't feel rushed or hacked together. I myself prefer this approach if it's going to bring higher quality additions and fixes with each issue.
As for the expansions, I believe the kind of content they intend to relase with the expansion is going to be a sort of a super-issue as mentioned in one of the above posts. I also think that for what they are intending to do that having the extra resources provided by the expansion will almost be a requirement. The additional draw of new players by having a product on the shelves is also something important to consider as has been mentioned previously as well.
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I really don't wan to pay a monthly fee and have to buy a new "expansion" every two years.
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Then don't play any other MMO. CoX is the one of the only ones, if not *the* only one, to have free issues. Paying extra for a big set of updates it not unusual for an MMO.
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I know that the last new box was $40+ and came with an increase in my monthly fee.
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If you have CoH and CoV as stand together games, there is no increase in the monthly fee. It's only if you have them as two separate games that the increase occurs.
@Arwen Darkblade
Proud Member of Hammer of the Gods and Sanguine Syndicate
Arc ID #86194 "Cry Havoc"
Arc ID #103934 "Dr. Thomas' First Day"
[URL="http://tobyfife.blogspot.com/"]Hero Girl[/URL] - my geek culture blog
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I really don't wan to pay a monthly fee and have to buy a new "expansion" every two years. Maybe this is what it take to keep this game on-line. I don't know. I know that the last new box was $40+ and came with an increase in my monthly fee.
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I guess I'm a rich [censored], but standardizing CoH's fee with the rest of NCSoft's stable of games, adding 4 pennies a month to the cost, isn't something I'm likely ever to get riled up about. That's my only niggle point.
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Actually; you'd pay the same monthly fee anywhere else... and likely wouldn't get as many free updates (you'd still be paying for expansions; you just wouldn't get half the free stuff we get).
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World of Warcraft got (before I left) a new dungeon and two new raid areas, in similar time as it has taken City of Villains to just get their last ten levels.
Guild Wars has no price.
There are certainly other options for us.
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The developers also stated that while the free issues wouldn't be as frequent they would be much larger issues. So much larger issues that won't feel rushed or hacked together.
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I remember the first part. I do not remember the last part, and I'm not confident that that's the reason.
Hi my name is Bob and I am an altitic
Guardian
Hot Alix 50 Fire/Kin/Psy:Main
Mora Victory Tri-Ice Tanker
Jasper Stone 50 Emp/ Elec:1st hero
Lady Courage 32 BS/SR
Cleo Cat 50 Ill/Kin
Max Multiplicity 35 MM Thug/Traps
Ripoffs are tacky and taboo. Be original!!
As long as the boxed expansion makes me feel left out for not having it, I'm going to get it. Peer pressure or something like that.
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This is a disturbing trend to start... if they're going to have additional content that you have to pay for,
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I think its inevitable that you're going to see regular paid expansions over the life of the CoX universe. New retail box expansions give the game presence on store-
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This is nothing new folks having 1 paid expansion a year with schedual free updates through out the year has been the stated model for how COH was going to grow years before the game even hit beta. They have always said that was their expectation (just like what happened last year).
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2 years and I still don't have a level 50 character, lol. Thank you alt-iholism!
Oh yeah, and Happy 2-years!
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Dont' feel bad, you are not alone. I've got ~30 or so toons (that doesnt include ones Ive deleted or re-rolled). My Infinity slots are filled up (see link in my sig). So far I've only gotten one up to 44, and I've been playing since the release. Now that I'm spending ~80% of my CoH time on him, however, I expect I'll get eventually get Vis Viva to 50. Having played since the release, the talk about I8 sounds like it will be fun. Let the villains have I7, Ill be looking forward to I8.
--- Ollie
Professionally certified pessimism expert
Statesman is someone who shouldn't rap ever, even if he's trying to help people out. -IolitePhoenix
Check out my Infinity toons at the Vis Viva family web page.
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Congratulations on the promotion Positron!!!
I can't wait for the Coh/v expansion! W00T!
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Oh yeah, for got to ask. For those of us who are SLOW levelers, will our existing toons work, or will we need to....gulp......start from scratch.
--- Ollie
Professionally certified pessimism expert
Statesman is someone who shouldn't rap ever, even if he's trying to help people out. -IolitePhoenix
Check out my Infinity toons at the Vis Viva family web page.
I hope that Positron isn't responsible for the bland and unexciting PPPs else I will be afraid for the future of CoX.
With CoV it looks like it was done in a low budget manner, maximizing reuse of the code while providing less a fresh experience to subscribers. The PPPs are just one example (of course we shall see what they actually turn out to be).
Veteran rewards? Whatup wit dat? These were silly in SWG and I don't see how they will be any more than fluff here either. If you give the vets something really impressive and powerful the new folks are always going to have a burr up their butt about it. And the vets will kick newbie butt in PvP. Unless it is fluff, of course, which I anticipate. In either case, vet rewards I do not see as a great idea or good use of developer time. How about fixing bugs and adding more content instead of adding spurious bits and bytes to the databases?
Total Focus is a hold, right?