Sweet, now i can develop tactics of defeating my enemies, before the battle was determined....Pvp is going to be just as static as normal play. BLAH
Awwww yea!! gimme gimme gimme.
(Would like further details on Rezzing, Noise the cameras will make and can we "broadcast" to say a viewing screan at the Dance party)
Once more for emphasis... Gimmee gimme gimme
Maybe the leader of one of the teams (or both leaders) could set the limit (within some range) on the number of spy-drones.
And, assuming such a limit, team leaders of high-profile matches could sell drone "tickets" for influence. 
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I'd suggest that the 'spydrones' (I assume they look similar to the policedrones) at least make a noise so you can hopefully get a little warning when in close proximaty.
One problem I see with this plan Positron, scrappers and tankers won't be able to really hit a spydrone which is floating outside of melee range thus it creates an imbalance. Technically they could be followed around without being able to stop them.
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*sharpens Shurikens and does squat thrusts to get his Super Jump in peak condition* Oh, sorry. Were you saying something about me not being able to hit cameras?
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Jesus, LaserJesus has Shurikens TOO!?!?!?
The floating aimable (and destroyable) cameras are cool, but as others have pointed out, it has problems when you have large numbers of observers. The Cross-server championship bout of the Martial Arts Scrappers tournament could literally have hundres of heroes wanting to view.
Here's my proposal, the ability to specify official cameramen when setting up a battle. A Cameraman has an indestructable cambot in the arena, either a static cambot that zooms and pans or a mobile cambot that zoom, pans, and moves. The Cameramen have their own chat channel for commentary (text if necessary, audio would be even better). Members of the audience can listen to that chat channel, and can switch from Camera to camera.
What could take that even farther would be the ability to have a Director. The Director switches between the different cameramen, and provide commentary for the battle (audio would be great for this.) The feed from the Director can be stored and available for visitors to the Arena to see at any time.
Most battles wouldn't have cameramen, to say nothing of a director. But if we get serious about tournaments, this could be great for big tournaments.
It also adds another use for the Arena...fanfilms. Yes, episodes of "As Atlas's Globe Turns" could be filmed in the Arena.
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The floating aimable (and destroyable) cameras are cool, but as others have pointed out, it has problems when you have large numbers of observers.
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Which is precisely why I think you won't be able to spectate unless you're actually in the battle. Nowhere in the original post does Positron say that non-combatants will be able to view a game. I think a lot of people risk being dissapointed if we jump to that conclusion.
Hmmm, the more I think about this, the less I'm liking it.
Why would I ever let an observer live, unless I know who that observer is? And, unless this observer has been agreed upon before the match, it seems likely that my opponent will want to get rid of any camera that I approve.
I think you're right, SpongeCake, I'm starting to believe these observers will be known right from the start.
I dont see why they just can't have a giant TV screen that shows selected matches in progress. Naturally you could have dozens of matches going on so why doesn't every instance of these matches have its own lobby with its own Gigant-O-Vision?
That would seem alot more immersive than taking control over a spydrone. Just have the camera follow certain hereos at certain times, only have it focus on heroes that are in combat.
Been a loooooong time since Ive been on the boards but now that the arena is coming I had to post again.
for what its worth.. if people are going to spy.. let them.. any good military commander knows that information about your enemy is vital.. besides, it will make for better overall tactics and strategies being formulated by the teams.
I also welcome the challenge to fight in that situation.. there are many here who I am sure feel the same way: the more difficult you make the situation the better I become.. to quote a certain senator from Massachusetts: "Bring it ON!" 
Ooo.. spybot swarm! That would be awesome! It'd definatly add a Smash TV feel to the SG that does it. ;'D
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The floating aimable (and destroyable) cameras are cool, but as others have pointed out, it has problems when you have large numbers of observers.
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Which is precisely why I think you won't be able to spectate unless you're actually in the battle. Nowhere in the original post does Positron say that non-combatants will be able to view a game. I think a lot of people risk being dissapointed if we jump to that conclusion.
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Actually he says it right here
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This tries to give everyone what they want. Voyeurs get to observe, defeated players get to still watch the action, "spies" can try to gather intel on opposing teams, and at the same time, opposing teams can shut down those spies easily if they so wish.
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That doesn't say "people who aren't in the battle get to observe" though. That could just as easily mean you can watch as long as you're in the battle.
Another possible compromise is to have observers able to access a 'viewing room' that is instanced for each battle. The viewing room will not only contain means to generate observer bots, but also several large-screen displays showing set camera angles from indestructible camera points in the arena. Battlers can simply avoid the known camera points to be sneaky... but if the displays showed most of the open areas they would probably still catch many of the major fights.
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I'm Doctor Why and I approved this message.
Edit: Never mind. Just saw Positron say elsewhere that there ain't no TV in Paragon City. Too bad.
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Can we watch heroes battle it out in the arena, a sort of public spectacle if you will? I'd love to just log in and watch people duke it out so to speak.
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(NOTE: Any or all of the following information may change by the time this makes it to Training Room or the Live servers).
Yes... to an extent.
You will be able to view the events in "Observer Mode", either when they are running, or if you are defeated and players on your side are still running around.
Observer Mode is cool. You look like a floating camera and can move around the arena map, watching the action.
Now, of course, some of you are right to point out that such a system is ripe for abuse... you can scout out enemy positions for your buddies and the like.
Thats why we made these Observer cameras targetable and easily destroyable. This is a very cool feature that adds another dimension to gameplay.
This tries to give everyone what they want. Voyeurs get to observe, defeated players get to still watch the action, "spies" can try to gather intel on opposing teams, and at the same time, opposing teams can shut down those spies easily if they so wish.
Again, this is all being tested, and may make it to the Live servers in a different manner than described here.
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I have'nt read this whole thread as it is quickly growing large, and if what I am mentioning has already been stated, again, apologies.
That being said, I think having destructible Drones only hinders the non "elite" gamers who just truly want to watch and not spy on a team, since as soon as they show up, boom!, they quickly get blasted. That doesnt sound like too much fun. My example being, imagine yourself sitting down to watch the season ending cliffhanger to your favorite TV series, then 5 minutes before the show ends, your cable goes out and you miss it !
I would be ripping mad, or at the least, very annoyed that I missed the end of the arena fight because someone blasted my drone only moments before some really cool event took place, especially if I was just a pure observer and not a "spy".
I do have a simple, and elegant solution.
If you want to be a spy, then the drones work as is, you watch the battle in real time as it happens and are able to be destroyed.
If you want to truly be a spectator, you get an indestructible drone, it can be invisible or not, depending on how the Devs prefer it to work. But the important part is you do NOT watch the fight in real time. You are on a 1-2 minute delay, so that by the time you see something, that event has long past and the information is useless to a "spy". From your perspective the fight seems perfectly normal.
Now, there may be technical reasons why this cannot be done, but if its doable, I think it is a simple and elegant solution to the problem of differenciating between "spys" and "spectators", without giving away which mode the drone is until you actually shoot at it if you are the one in the combat arena.
Also, one last thing, the actual combatants should have the option for a "closed" session, meaning that right from the begining they arent allowing "distractions" such as spectator drones OF ANY KIND.
Peace, and hug your mother once a week.
"All that crap is grey to me, no XP." - Positron 5/15/05 8:36am . . . The world stopped and silence ensued except for the sound of a crying infant off in the distance.
"Everyone needs to chill the hell out." - BackAlleyBrawler 11/13/08 3:26pm . . . Geeks around the world stopped and blinked.
You have stumbled upon a brilliant idea. I hope this is viable, since it solves pretty much every problem that people would have with observers, short of those 'elite' gamers who don't want anyone to see thier 'secret strats'
again the game designers pulls another ace from there sleaves. excelent work hope to see it up and running on test soon.
This sounds good, but I have a few suggestions from my previous experience in other PvP games.
1. Mute Observers:
When players are in the Arena, there should not be any way an active participant can receive any messages from, or in any way detect the Observers. If you add observers as a killable obstacle it will imbalance the gameplay and distract the participants. This will frustrate players more than it will bring enjoyment to the observers.
2. Observer Channel:
If you allow observers (a good idea IMHO), then limit their outgoing chat to SOLELY the Observer channel, so that they cannot spam overload the players playing. This allows for observers to interact with other observers without hampering the players.
3. Maximum Number of Observers:
Some players have systems that slow down when too many characters are in a zone. For these players it would be best to limit the number of observers somehow so that the low-end systems wouldn't suffer degredation from the Observers. Even if there is no degredation, players will incorrectly perceive any performance problems as being caused by the Observers, so setting maximums helps solve this problem.
4. Observer Mission and Chase-cam Replication:
If it is technically feasible (and I have no idea whether it is or not), it would be nice if the players spawned into one Instanced Mission, and all the observers spawened into a SECOND Instanced Mission. Thus, the second mission would be relayed with a mirror of the information from the first mission, without actually bing IN that mission. It would be simple enough to send the information from each participant player to not only the player, but also the Observer Mission, so observers could switch between various player's views while observing. Even if the Observer Mission (second instanced mission) were not quite instantaneous, it would convey the same usage for those who want to observe.
5. Teamplay:
PvP is far more complex than PvE, but the greatness of MMORPG's is their ability to convey teamwork among large teams. If possible, I think it would be great to have 8v8 combat with team goals, such as CTF. This becomes two different games if you institute various modes such as A) Single-Death, B) Instant-Respawn, and C) Penalized-Death [such as 30 seconds to respawn, etc.]. Chatty observers or physically intrusive observers would utterly destroy the beauty of teamplay IMHO.
Thanks for listening to our input, and I'm very eagerly looking forward to Team PvP. 
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1. Mute Observers:
When players are in the Arena, there should not be any way an active participant can receive any messages from, or in any way detect the Observers. If you add observers as a killable obstacle it will imbalance the gameplay and distract the participants. This will frustrate players more than it will bring enjoyment to the observers.
2. Observer Channel:
If you allow observers (a good idea IMHO), then limit their outgoing chat to SOLELY the Observer channel, so that they cannot spam overload the players playing. This allows for observers to interact with other observers without hampering the players.
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Without question, there should be a Channel for arena participants only, while observers are on Local/Broadcast. Much like SG's and team's channels, a participant can choose to view the Broadcast channel for morale boosters.
I was hoping for a lounge like area, like a skybox, where you can look down and see people duking it out. I guess I understand why that probably won't or can't happen, but I am a dreamer.
I think out side observation is critical. Bear in mind for a lot of people this will be important information to consider before ever choosing to participate in PvP.
Most people want to know how it is going to work before they risk it in CoV. Thats why outside observation is critical.
Second in CoV full observation will always exist in the streets which theroetically could conatin PvP and PvE players. Working out the technical kinks in mass viewing PvP will be helpful down the road.
Also, just an outside the box thought: If chat intel is a concern at least consider delayed feed observation. A lot of the value of observing others in PvP could be gained by watching a post match video so to speak. It does not need to be live to be enjoyed. Besides who would know?
Also after the match I would not mind reviewing the video tape to see how I could improve my skill set.
Remember for PvP to be good the loser is going to have to enjoy it as well as the winner. Otherwise, eventually all the losers will just quit PvP. If its not fun why play?
Posi I think teamspeak will become a very important comm tool with something like that. Reminds me of how we play Raven Shield.
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I am sorry but I think you people have it completely wrong.
I would believe there is only a LIMITED number of cameras.
I would imagine 8 - 10 of them in FIXED positions. You can use keys to scroll thru the cameras you like to watch the view you want to.
You won't have a fleet of hundreds of drones. You will have a few cameras that will various aspects of the arena. I would think 8 cameras or perhaps 9 for a center over-head.
I would lay them out like this:
X.........X..........X
X.........X..........X
X.........X..........X
This gives fair coverage and destroying one or 2 won't cause major issues with watching part of a battle but would allow some privacy for strategy.
Let's not forget that the not all arena maps are going to be open. If the camera positions are fixed, the fight might be behind a building. As for number of cameras, there has to be a limit, it is going to probably be fairly high.
Idealy, the devs will allow people to specify if they want a private match or not (meaning not observers).
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Observer Mode is cool. You look like a floating camera and can move around the arena map, watching the action.
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Doesn't sound like they're fixed.
I think observing is a staple of the ARENA. Arena competition has always been a public spectacle.
However there are problems I foresee with things like lag and overcrowding.
I beleive it's been suggested that observers not a part of the event be able to watch WITHOUT a physical form. As well as cutting off the competitors from outside chat.
The camera idea would still be cool for something like a LARGE SCREEN outside the arena somewhere, broadcasting the action live!! There is so much potential with the arena, keep up the good work devs!!!