Offline SG Members in Bases!

I seriously don't think it would be very hard to deal with the problem of having npc heroes in during a raid.

Just despawn them.

It really isn't that hard to figure out. It might not be the most amazing thing they could do, but I wouldn't complain.

YES,YES,YES!

I love this Idea.
I think you should get the option whenever you log out to go to your HQ,
if you don't when you log back in you are exactly where you loged off.
If you do your Hero becomes an Npc in the Base and will defened the HQ.

Great Idea.
It would add So much comic book feel to the game

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And the idea of a servant(s) protecting us as we slumber is a must! I don't know if any of you have ever seen the tv Anime series the Big O, but having my own Norman Burg (a mild-mannered butler with a BFG and whole belts full of grenades) protecting my base would rock!

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that show sukked....it was like batman meets voltron

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I have a better idea. Instead of offline SG mates, specific predetermined bad guys you've defeated. 'Working off their debt to society'

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Complete with ball-and-chain for those magic cave-bases, or modern ankle lowjacks for high-tech bases. It would be hilarious to watch a bad guy base prisoner run away in terror from a base attack hampered by his leg shackles, his running reduced to baby steps!

(I'm so amazed this thread is still here. I'm equally hopeful that we'll get servants of some kind, since the Head Spider himself liked that idea upthread. )

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I like the idea of supergroup members wandering arround, tinkering etc. I don't think the entire group should be there all the time. I don't like the idea of logged out characters fighting. I think that they should periodically get up and walk through a door and despawn. By the same token, every so often a door opens an a randomly selected logged off hero spawns and walks in. Just before a raid all of the non-player heroes would just "happen" to walk out. Same kind of thing if a player logs in. This way you don't have heroes fighting badly, a crowd of bots to keep track of, a base full of alts that is really tough to attack, and yet you get the ambiance of a base with a bunch of heroes in it.

Servants would be better than nothing though.

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Thankyou. Someone with a realistic goal!

The love the OP, although not the 'not logged in (NLI?) characters' fighting idea, I think everyone would get fed up with logging in and finding more debt, and even if PvP won't result in debt (i read somewhere) how many SG's will start insisting that every member makes an alt just to go towards base defense?

I like the idea of 'not logged in characters' being present, but as with the above post, don't see why they can't just instantly run off through 'emergency doors' upon base invasion - whether to support in other ways or to flee the battle.

Also to stop overcrowding of SG bases, your character might disappear after 12 hours of hanging around the base? Also if the Devs have an issue with Lag/Memory use, auras and capes could be ditched by such characters (i don't have any basis for knowing if this is an issue/solution btw)

Just my 1.5p

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I like the idea of 'not logged in characters' being present, but as with the above post, don't see why they can't just instantly run off through 'emergency doors' upon base invasion - whether to support in other ways or to flee the battle.

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I pretty much hate this idea, especially for my heroes -- they do not run!

If our characters are going to be present while we're offline, then during a base invasion they need 1) to stay and fight, and 2) not incur debt when they lose.

This is why I prefer base-centric servants and video monitors/crystal balls displaying offline heroes in other parts of the city -- it maintains game immersiveness and avoids all the attendant problems of having offline player characters present.

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And the idea of a servant(s) protecting us as we slumber is a must! I don't know if any of you have ever seen the tv Anime series the Big O, but having my own Norman Burg (a mild-mannered butler with a BFG and whole belts full of grenades) protecting my base would rock!

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I can agree to offline heroes/villains being local to a base under certain specific circumstances. Here are two among many options. One, offline characters can participate in any PvP raids of a headquarters that do not spell out debt loss but also do not accrue any sort of reward (no experience, influence, nor enhancements). Two, offline characters will be in a base made inaccessible during raids (in the same way it seems that we cannot drill holes through walls or the floor in enemy NPC bases).

Cryptic does not appear to notice that Sim-like games sell nor understand how to implement Simlike behaviors nor game portions. I might be wrong, and they might simply have not had the time, money, nor manpower to implement many secretly planned ideas.

I'm going against the grain here but,

If you want your Hero HQ populated, make sure your buddies are logged on the same time as you.

Seriously, how much time are you gonna spend in your HQ anyway ? A few minutes here and there banking enhancments or waiting for your pals before you go Hamidon hunting.

Why would anyone raid it ? There are NO destructable environments, and if they were your base would leveled 4am in the morning by a rival SG or VG. What's the point ?

I'm betting only SG members will be able to get into a base anyway, kinda like door missions. If you don't belong, your not getting in.

Alot of the ideas that are being thrown out cool, but I don't want to suffer lag just because your HQ has 30 armed guards or get a free trip to the hospital becasue I mistook your Giant Guard Spider for something I was suppossesd to shoot.

my two cents,

The idea of raidable SG bases sounds cool but, what's there to raid? I wouldn't want my vault of Hamidon enhancements camped by another SG. Something else should be implemented.

How about a capture the flag sort of thing? Being in possession of certain flags would give a small bonus to the whole SG, whether it be more endurance, power, etc.

That's exactly what's been proposed by the Devs. Relics and items of power. "Flags" in other words.

I believed they said, "Items of Cosmic importance." That leads me to believe them to be a bit more thatn flags. Perhaps certain ones offer certain buffs.

You know when you go in city hall they have the rooms that you cant go in but you still see NPCs walking around back there? well this would be the easiest way to do it. i mean just seeing your hero sitting back there reading or just walking aimlessly around would be enough. Enemies cant get back there and if the base was attacked then the (lets call it) "recreation area" where the npc heroes are would just go into lockdown mode. It would solve collision(spelling ?) problems so an npc doesnt walk through a player, and the enemy/base attack scenario wouldnt be a big problem for the npc heroes, and the devs wouldnt really HAVE to make new animations, just stick the hero model on the npc walking path. It would work for basically any character, they have the labs behind the science contacts in city hall, the library behind magic contacts, and so on....

just an idea.

A few things that come to mind:

No debt. PvP should never incur any debt. I can't believe this is even a debateable topic.

Allow choice of whether your character is visible while logged off, AND whether they will fight. Use any power listed in the Power Tray and/or Alt Power Tray for whatever distance you are from your foe. Targeting could be a pain, unless you just set them on 'closest' or 'random targets'. A default rule could be set in Options, allowing modification, or one method could be chosen. My question on this would be, "If your base is being raided, and you are offline while your character is fighting, what happens if you log in?" Are you immediately thrust into battle or does your lookalike vanish from the fight? Maybe you can receive a dialog stating you are in combat, allowing you to enter combat-in-progress. As far as my main is concerned, being En/En Blaster, he would never run from an attack on his base, he would shoot as soon as they are in snipe range, and he would fall in combat before letting villains ransack the place.

I like the idea of including a hobby or activity that your hero can do while logged off. Some activities can be opened up by specific room purchases. If you are using the Circle of Thorns cave / underground city base, you'll need to buy a room with a portal, in order to monkey around with portals. I also like the idea of having all of the emotes available for your character while offline, so maybe your mystic can have all those books hovering around him while he studies.

As far as purchases go, I like the idea of buying rooms and defenses. Placing the rooms isn't a huge desire for me, but it would definitely be cool. As far as guards / minions / servants go, if they are a purchase, I would rather see packages, instead of price-per-unit. Package 1 would be only enough guys for one room, probably with a Lt as the highest grade. Package 2 might have a Boss in the mix, while providing defenses for multiple rooms. The higher packages would include the packages before it, but add something to the mix, that helps cover more area. If you have price-per-unit costs, the really good bases will only have the high-end stuff. Why pay for mediocre help, if you don't have to? Either that, or set requirements for the purchases. In order to have 1 Wolfpack MkII Boss, you have to have 2 or more Lieutenants. In order to get 1 Lieutenant, you have to have 5 Minions. Stationary base defenses, such as turrets and gas traps should be classified in such a way that you can get the same type of defenses as you would with mobile defenses.

Summary: No debt. Offline combat option. Defensive packages.
-Jr

I know that this is a bad synopsis and is jumbled, but it is my first attempt at one so please bear with me and see it through.
As I say in my signature, I'm merely trying to get people to look at as many options as possible and to help people lesson disapointments.


PvP will be consensual(a waste in my opinion) and is likely intended to eventualy become an important part of the game being more "dynamic", as Statesman put it. Not having any risk of debt in PvP is what is ludicrous. People cry about debt way to often when it is merely a sign that they need to change their play style. If you get debt to often than it would be easier for you to change than it would be for the devs to change the game.

As far as protecting bases it could be done by having the abilty to hire and even personaly train guards. I said else where that base defence could be a use for CoVs player minions.

PvP zones them selves should not have consensual PvP. The idea of a PvP zone should be to give players areas with lvl ranges, so that those who want none restricted PvP can have it.

It would be rather pointless to not have the bases be upgradeble or they would all be the same. These up grades should be dependent on the lvl ranges and PvP success rates of the SGs/VGs that own the bases. By this I mean there should be tiers like a tech tree in an RTS. Bases should be one place where people should be able to have things that others don't. This would inspire people to be competetive and would be a real sense of reward.

The offline combat using player heroes idea couldn't work because the devs don't need another type of AI to deal with. The guard idea, on the other hand, would allow them to use what is available instead of trying to be over ambitious, as the arena so far seems to be.

The placement of rooms by the owners would be essential to ensure that one base isn't to much like the all the rest. The ability to rearange them would certain help with the "But it looked so good in my head" issue that often happens in home design.

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PvP will be consensual(a waste in my opinion) and is likely intended to eventualy become an important part of the game being more "dynamic", as Statesman put it. Not having any risk of debt in PvP is what is ludicrous. People cry about debt way to often when it is merely a sign that they need to change their play style. If you get debt to often than it would be easier for you to change than it would be for the devs to change the game.

[/ QUOTE ]I heartily disagree. Play style for the does not need to change. Not everyone likes PvP, and it isn't fair to those people to make it an 'all the time' feature. Even WoW's PvP servers allow some zones to be safe for lower levels. And just because you happened across a level 50 in Galaxy, while you're trying to kill Hellions, doesn't mean you should incur debt. In PvP, you will die. You will die a lot. Everyone would be permadebt, and there would be no way out. The reason for debt, at that point, would be worthless.

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PvP zones them selves should not have consensual PvP. The idea of a PvP zone should be to give players areas with lvl ranges, so that those who want none restricted PvP can have it.

[/ QUOTE ]I agree, and disagree. I don't think there should be specific zones where only the PvP crowd should enter. Either the entire server is PvP, or the whole server is consentual. There should be no middle ground between servers, where some zones are PvP and others aren't, because you then alienate the the non-PvPers from that zone. Go ahead and tell the game community that you've added new content, but that you HAVE to do something you don't like (but is optional) in order to get to it. This type of thing gets discussed all the time, and the answer is a resounding, "That's BS!"

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It would be rather pointless to not have the bases be upgradeble or they would all be the same. These up grades should be dependent on the lvl ranges and PvP success rates of the SGs/VGs that own the bases. By this I mean there should be tiers like a tech tree in an RTS. Bases should be one place where people should be able to have things that others don't. This would inspire people to be competetive and would be a real sense of reward.

[/ QUOTE ]Again, you can't rely on PvP for a reward that should go to everyone. People who do not PvP should have just as much right to make their base look exactly how they want, within their budget. If base rewards are based on PvP, then you're not promoting healthy competition, you're encouraging all SGs to become huge gank squads, so they can have the cool stuff.

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The offline combat using player heroes idea couldn't work because the devs don't need another type of AI to deal with. The guard idea, on the other hand, would allow them to use what is available instead of trying to be over ambitious, as the arena so far seems to be.

[/ QUOTE ]While I agree that they don't need to overcomplicate matters. The general MOB AI can probably handle offline members. Granted, they will not have the player's skills, and will likely not be as much of a threat as if the player was controlling them. However, in order for a base raid to be worthwhile, you have to have something. Guards are a good option, as well as servants and automated defenses. However, to tell a game developer to not push themselves, and come up with new ways to do things, is part of the staleness that many people complain about in the game industry. I say let them innovate more, try things that may or may not work, and let the R&D department come up with wild and crazy ideas. They don't have to run with any of them. I just want them to think ahead.

Summary: I don't hate the ideas. I just want to make sure that everyone is open to the fact that not everyone wants to PvP (I have personally enjoyed CoH mainly BECAUSE there is no loot or PvP). Some game mechanics will rely on PvP, while many others should not.

For whatever it's worth, my original idea was not especially meant to be incorporated into PvP at all. While I think it would be cool in a way to have my alts fight as bots while I was offline or playing another character (or attacking as a villain! OK, how cool would that be?), and while there are valid arguments against it as well, that is completely beside the point.

Offline heroes should hang around in bases to make bases look cool, and to create an inspiring sense of being a part of something great. Agents or servants or whatever would be cute, but will not play up the "comic book supergroup" aspect of SGs anywhere CLOSE to actually seeing your SG mates hanging out there.

There have been many and varied suggestions on how to deal with having one's characters in the hands of the computer during a base raid. For myself, if all the offline heroes simply vanished into thin air when my base was attacked, I would still be completely, utterly overjoyed to see them strolling around the rest of the time. This "bare minimum" solution WOULD STILL BE AWESOME. Many creative and much better (and harder to implement) ideas have been mentioned above, and I invite Lord_Recluse to peruse them. But even if he doesn't bother, and just implements the bare-bones, C- version, it will be fantastic.

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I believed they said, "Items of Cosmic importance." That leads me to believe them to be a bit more thatn flags. Perhaps certain ones offer certain buffs.

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I agree. Cosmic Importance more implies Infinity Gauntlets, Cosmic Cubes, or Universal Nullifiers than, say, the Rhode Island state flag, or even Old Glory herself. In other news, I like capitalizing Important Stuff.

How about, during an attack, offline SG members are in inaccessible rooms going through fighting motions? Y'know, like you can look through glass into the rec room and see an offline SG-mate firing blasts at oncoming waves of NPC villains. You can see them through the glass, but you can't interact. They're doing okay, you've got your own battle to fight. They don't actually take or deal any damage and don't affect the battle in any way, but you can still see them "participating" in fight, but not being a factor since they're not logged in.

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I believed they said, "Items of Cosmic importance." That leads me to believe them to be a bit more thatn flags. Perhaps certain ones offer certain buffs.

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I agree. Cosmic Importance more implies Infinity Gauntlets, Cosmic Cubes, or Universal Nullifiers than, say, the Rhode Island state flag, or even Old Glory herself. In other news, I like capitalizing Important Stuff.

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Disagree. Cosmic Cubes and universal nullifiers imply reshaping planets and starting monstrous PC villain run-TFs, not a +def for all your friends... not at all...

As for Offline SG members during base raids... having them dissappear/be teleported out would be decent... having them be ganked like low HP simple AI toons would be okay in my book... who cares if my toon is 'defeated' if I'm not there and it doesn't affect my use of the character at all... if I log on, I log onto where I last was (which does suck if I log into my base while it's being raided no matter what), with NO ill effects from my image being defeated in a base raid... and "my" attacker gets no points either..

(im not sure if this has been said... 10 pgs of posts already, i dont have that time to read them all)

Idea 1)
Offline SG members would appear as bosses, so that they still fight, obviously not as good as the real members, but still. using this system it would be easier to make it so that heroes arnt really defeated if they are offline in a baseraid.

2) Obviously, for villians, minions can protect the base. But what about guards protecting the SG bases? Say you design what the guard would look like (say, military style or SWAT Team) and you would place a certain number of crucial points were somewhere around 4 guards would be placed. this could slow the villian team down to allow for heroes to unite to protect their bases. it would work the same way for a villian base.

I hope SG bases will have lvls that other player can see. Just so that an SG of lvl 20s doesnt make the mistake of attacking a base full of lvl 50s. Im all for mass carnage but still.

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I said it before, and I'll say it again since the old thread vanished.

Fill up those empty corridors and rooms! What good is having a huge base if only one or two people in your SG are online and you're rattling around in it like two pebbles in a 50 gallon oil drum?

I want to see my offline SG mates sparring in the training hall, lounging in the rec room, tinkering with the defensive cannons, monitoring the security cameras and/or the citywide comm network, arguing in the conference room, watching TV, playing poker, and maybe even cooking up a little dinner for their hardworking (online) compatriots. Heck, how cool would it be to see two of your own alts working together in the crime lab?

I want this a lot. Please?

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Kick...[censored]...idea of the week. No! Month!

TERRIFIC idea. The only request I'd make is that there be an option somewhere to allow or dissalow this for your characters.

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The problem with off-line characters being present in the base is what happens if the base is raided (by players or possibly PvE, who knows)? Do you really want to come back on and find out your hero was defeated while you were away?

Servants on the other hand is an interesting idea.

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Personally, I would prefer that my hero valiantly defend the base, and be defeated, than have him be completely out to lunch and not show up when the base is under attack.

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I said it before, and I'll say it again since the old thread vanished.

Fill up those empty corridors and rooms! What good is having a huge base if only one or two people in your SG are online and you're rattling around in it like two pebbles in a 50 gallon oil drum?

I want to see my offline SG mates sparring in the training hall, lounging in the rec room, tinkering with the defensive cannons, monitoring the security cameras and/or the citywide comm network, arguing in the conference room, watching TV, playing poker, and maybe even cooking up a little dinner for their hardworking (online) compatriots. Heck, how cool would it be to see two of your own alts working together in the crime lab?

I want this a lot. Please?

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I think this would pose a major programming nightmare, yet it would be an extremely cool feature. I'd vote yes if the technical hurdles could be overcome.