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Oh, well played, Scarlet Shocker. Well played. *steeple fingers*
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Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker
And yet this game has a whole island of it!
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But I never found any there! The Arachnos Travel Brochure lied to me!
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Originally Posted by Scarlet Shocker
And yet this game has a whole island of it!
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Blood Widow Ricki * Tide Shifter * T-34 * Opposite Reaction * Shaolin Midnight * ChernobylCheerleader
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I was not commenting on the court documents or the specific case, but the point that "Losing a civil lawsuit doesn't make you guilty of fraud." (and technically you can be guilty of civil fraud without being guilty of criminal fraud, although I doubt that's the legalese speak for it.)|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Seeing as I know you commented on the documents that were presented.
I have to ask why are you misrepresenting the matter ? or Did you comment without actually reading them ? |
I think I noted twice in that post that I don't know enough about the case. I have read in various places that they took his community letter as a form of resignation, though, and that his lawsuit was over lost money due to having to execute or sell stock at a lower price than he otherwise would.
My list above is not a comment but taken from what is evaluated for US to consider if something is fraud and, with the bit I know of the case, see if it would have fit. If I'm wrong enough to make those things dont fit (under US law) then feel free to correct me.
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It was just the creative use of camera angles to make it look more merciful than it really is.|
Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon
But I never found any there! The Arachnos Travel Brochure lied to me!
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Kinda like when you find out that South Fork Ranch is wedged in between a Party City on one side and a Quick Lube on the other.
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So in other words you were trying to split hairs so people could remain comfortable slandering NCsoft. |
Originally Posted by Starsman
I was not commenting on the court documents or the specific case, but the point that "Losing a civil lawsuit doesn't make you guilty of fraud." (and technically you can be guilty of civil fraud without being guilty of criminal fraud, although I doubt that's the legalese speak for it.)
I think I noted twice in that post that I don't know enough about the case. I have read in various places that they took his community letter as a form of resignation, though, and that his lawsuit was over lost money due to having to execute or sell stock at a lower price than he otherwise would. My list above is not a comment but taken from what is evaluated for US to consider if something is fraud and, with the bit I know of the case, see if it would have fit. If I'm wrong enough to make those things dont fit (under US law) then feel free to correct me. |
You know I don't like NCsoft either I just don't feel the need to lie about why
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No, just correcting a blantly wrong statement |
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
So in other words you were trying to split hairs so people could remain comfortable slandering NCsoft.
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I don't think ANYONE needs more reasons to hate NCSoft. Garriot being defrauded or not is something that should only anger him and his family (maybe some close friends.) Tabula Rasa dying due to that whole thing MAY be something for some people to hate NCSoft but people already likely held that grudge with or without a verdict.
In the same way, anyone that loves NCSoft and defends them will not stop because something they did to some exec that designed an over budgeted failed game.
However, your statement was not even about the case, it was a blanket statement that, from all I know, is wrong since you can be found.
The entire thing is like presidential elections one week before election day: everyone has their minds made up already and there is no changing that. Does not mean we can't discuss side or related topics.
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| You know I don't like NCsoft either I just don't feel the need to lie about why |
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For me, Starsman's comments were more supposition and not facts about the Garriot case. I believe he was stating "here's how it could apply", not as "this is how it does/did apply". How does that translate into lying?
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Originally Posted by Another_Fan
So in other words you were trying to split hairs so people could remain comfortable slandering NCsoft.
You know I don't like NCsoft either I just don't feel the need to lie about why |
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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Certain people are attempting a rather impotent smear campaign against other players/forumites. Fortunately, it is entirely transparent... but arguing/discussing/debating with them won't accomplish much of anything.
Not telling anyone not to reply to them... just suggesting it. 
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
If someone bought the game, wouldn't it just be better to have everyone start from scratch, if it's shut down for a good length of time?
That way new players can come in and level up with the masses who are now leveling up?
BrandX Future Staff Fighter
The BrandX Collection
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Colour me ignorant, but what the hell does 'astroturf' mean in that context?|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Just how much were you paid to astroturf ? I mean it's not like the scoring system did much of anything about custom critters in AE (Looks at all the s/l and fire characters that were made)
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(My only frame of reference is it being an actual object that's used on a football field to artificially make it green, uniform, and playable-on.)
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
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Should the game be revived, I'd just be happy if I could retain my goofy Global Handle. Characters can be recreated. I have altitis anyway.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
If someone bought the game, wouldn't it just be better to have everyone start from scratch, if it's shut down for a good length of time?
That way new players can come in and level up with the masses who are now leveling up? |
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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If the plug is flipped, the game goes dark and it is acquired (doubt it), I would rather they take a bit of time before bringing it back up and address a few things they would not be able to do otherwise.|
Originally Posted by BrandX
If someone bought the game, wouldn't it just be better to have everyone start from scratch, if it's shut down for a good length of time?
That way new players can come in and level up with the masses who are now leveling up? |
Removing naming exclusivity is something I would love to see (I know about half the forum population is against the is but I think the split is not as big in-game) and potentially eliminating the idea of separate servers. Somehow cramping everyone in the same server with zone instantiating would go a HUGE way towards making the teaming experience at all levels much friendlier, but its something you can only pull off if you reset.
They may be able to redefine the core of the game without huge revamping. Getting rid of ATs is an example, just making you pick a primary attack and a secondary utility set, accompanied with an inherent power that also defines your "modifiers" in similar fashion to what we have now. This is another thing that can only be viable with a reset.
How to make Range/Armor balanced against Melee/Armor? My quickly idea would be all melee attacks boost your armor while your ranged attack lower your armor. There are many other ways, but not easy ones to push into the current game system.
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Being paid to browse the web and post positive feedback or dismiss negative coverage about your employer and/or his products.
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Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Colour me ignorant, but what the hell does 'astroturf' mean in that context?
(My only frame of reference is it being an actual object that's used on a football field to artificially make it green, uniform, and playable-on.) Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
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Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Colour me ignorant, but what the hell does 'astroturf' mean in that context?
(My only frame of reference is it being an actual object that's used on a football field to artificially make it green, uniform, and playable-on.) Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
A quick websearch showed up this Wiki page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing
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Astroturfing refers to political, advertising or public relations campaigns that are designed to mask the sponsors of the message to give the appearance of coming from a disinterested, grassroots participant. Astroturfing is intended to give the statements the credibility of an independent entity by withholding information about the source's financial connection. The term is a derivation of AstroTurf, a brand of synthetic carpeting designed to look like natural grass. Astroturfers use software to mask their identity. Sometimes one individual operates over seventy personas to give the impression of widespread support for their client's agenda. Some studies suggest astroturfing can alter public viewpoints and create enough doubt to inhibit action. |
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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Originally Posted by Starsman
Being paid to browse the web and post positive feedback or dismiss negative coverage about your employer and/or his products.
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Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
A quick websearch showed up this Wiki page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astroturfing
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Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
Yeah. I hadn't seen the slang Astroturfing applied before either.
Throwing darts at the board to see if something sticks.....
Come show your resolve and fight my brute!
Tanks: Gauntlet, the streak breaker and you!
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
Rangle's right....this is fun.
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Basically an insult several steps above "Fanboi" with an "i" (that in turn is a step above "Fanboy" with a "y")|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Uh-HUH. Okaaaayyyy...
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Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
Yeah. I hadn't seen the slang Astroturfing applied before either.
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If you however manage to be the first post and troll them with a 5000 word copy-pasted rant, you are just another guy in the pack. (Unless you insult their Google, with Google the logic goes the other way around.)
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I think to this point, you're making a lot of sense.|
Originally Posted by Starsman
Removing naming exclusivity is something I would love to see (I know about half the forum population is against the is but I think the split is not as big in-game) and potentially eliminating the idea of separate servers. Somehow cramping everyone in the same server with zone instantiating would go a HUGE way towards making the teaming experience at all levels much friendlier, but its something you can only pull off if you reset.
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They may be able to redefine the core of the game without huge revamping. Getting rid of ATs is an example, just making you pick a primary attack and a secondary utility set, accompanied with an inherent power that also defines your "modifiers" in similar fashion to what we have now. This is another thing that can only be viable with a reset. How to make Range/Armor balanced against Melee/Armor? My quickly idea would be all melee attacks boost your armor while your ranged attack lower your armor. There are many other ways, but not easy ones to push into the current game system. |
It would also insert dev work into the middle of standing the whole thing back up, and I think that every day the game is dark is a very bad thing.
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I can understand this notion and (as someone who doesn't use fancy IO builds and is rather casual) I'd be happy just to be able to play and recreating my characters is not an obstacle in my fun. I do think I'd rather have my characters (and bases and all that) as is, but I'd be okay with starting over.|
Originally Posted by BrandX
If someone bought the game, wouldn't it just be better to have everyone start from scratch, if it's shut down for a good length of time?
That way new players can come in and level up with the masses who are now leveling up? |
However, I don't honestly think it would be "best".
This game is amazing for playing with new characters because many people love to create new alts all the time and sidekicking/exemp'ing makes it all no problemo whatsoever.
Comparing those aspects against removing everything that anyone had attained in-game and I can't see it being better to start fresh.
We'd want as many people returning as possible and I don't think database wipes are on the side of that.
Make no mistake, we'd have a lot more returning players than new players no matter what. I really don't think a wipe would bring in more new players nor would it bring in more old players.
@Zethustra
"Now at midnight all the agents and the superhuman crew come out
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
and round up everyone that knows more than they do"-Dylan
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If it's the same game, I'll be very disappointed if the characters are wiped. Not saying I won't join again, but disappointed. And the loss of all my veteran rewards/paragon rewards would also reduce my enthusiasm.
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Originally Posted by BrandX
If someone bought the game, wouldn't it just be better to have everyone start from scratch, if it's shut down for a good length of time?
That way new players can come in and level up with the masses who are now leveling up? |
My arcs are constantly shifting, just search for GadgetDon for the latest.
The world beware! I've started a blog
GadgetMania Under Attack: The Digg Lockout
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I've mostly heard Astroturfing in politics, as a play on the idea of a "grassroots campaign". There's a lot of social media promotion for a cause or a group or a candidate, is it truly a bunch of people enthusiastic about it (a grassroots campaign) or is it all fake with people paid to promote it and using fake accounts (astroturf).|
Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
Colour me ignorant, but what the hell does 'astroturf' mean in that context?
(My only frame of reference is it being an actual object that's used on a football field to artificially make it green, uniform, and playable-on.) Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
The idea that anyone is being paid now to either badmouth or support NCSoft in this forum is laughable (and insulting). The only place where such a strategy would make any sense is "Hey I'm going to (fill in game)" "Yeah, me too, (game) has everything I liked from CoH".
And a big part of astroturfing is to look like there's a large amount of support behind it. One astroturfing account is a a contradiction in terms.
My arcs are constantly shifting, just search for GadgetDon for the latest.
The world beware! I've started a blog
GadgetMania Under Attack: The Digg Lockout
I loved Pigskin 621 A.D. It was my favorite computer-football-type game ever. I especially liked the Brian Colin art - see also Rampage, Xenophobe and Blasted - and how if your ball-carrier was tackled while carrying a weapon, there would be a brief scuffle and the tackler ended up with, e.g., a mace in his face.
This is my only comment on this thread.
My characters at Virtueverse
Faces of the City
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Wish list? Definitively. But I think only hardcore Controller and Blaster players may be disapointed (although keeping Manipulation sets as viable "utility" sets may be an option with sustainance.)|
Originally Posted by Brillig
However, I think this last part has drifted into wish-list territory that might tick off as many oldtimers as it makes happy.
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Utility/utility builds would no longer be possible.
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| It would also insert dev work into the middle of standing the whole thing back up, and I think that every day the game is dark is a very bad thing. |
I think it would be better if they took the time to make certain improvements that have held back the game forever.
OH ane thing the game definitively would need is a new GUI. The current one, SPECIALLY the power brower, SUCK.
even at the end, the drama continues. I'm really going to miss these forums.
If People can save the game, I wish them luck. If the game shuts down for good, so be it. I should never have taken that ride on the TORtanic.
Anyway, (can't believe that I am saying this) Thanks for the update, Winky . I wish you success in your efforts
Time to grab screenshots. I'm gonna see about getting Fatheads done of my characters.
I guess the Mayans were right about the year, just not the date. The "City" world ends in 2012
Continue.
"Sorry bucko, but CoH and CoV are the same game." -BackAlleyBrawler
"Silly villain, CoX is for Heroes!" -Saicho
The fact that he won the civil case pretty much makes them guilty of fraud at the civil level. Does not mean it's an automatic criminal win (no one goes to jail) but they ended up being guilty of it at a level where they had to compensate the affected party (Garriot.)
Not sure if they used the word fraud in the case, but even if the word was not used in the civil case you have to ignore the meaning of the word and the reason of the lawsuit to say NCSoft was not guilty of civil fraud.
In the United States, common law recognizes nine elements constituting fraud:
1. a representation of an existing fact (he was claimed to quit)
2. its materiality (he lost his job, had to execute options way too early)
3. its falsity (he didnt quit)
4. the speaker's knowledge of its falsity (they knew he did not quit)
5. the speaker's intent that it shall be acted upon by the plaintiff (deprive him of his options)
6. the plaintiff's ignorance of its falsity (here is where the PR letter comes into place, it was just for PR but NCSoft used it as a resignation letter)
7. the plaintiff's reliance on the truth of the representation (dont know enough of the case, guess the fact that he simply never quit in any way?)
8. the plaintiff's right to rely upon it; and (dont know enough of the case nor legal system to know how this fit, but I guess his right is the fact that it was the truth.)
9. consequent damages suffered by the plaintiff (lots of millions of dollars lost)
Seeing as I know you commented on the documents that were presented.
I have to ask why are you misrepresenting the matter ?
or Did you comment without actually reading them ?